Focused Feedback: Energy Melee for Scrappers

[ABlueThingy]

8 minutes ago, Gobbledegook said:

Whirling hands base damage on a scrapper

Average damage- 78.83

Dpa- 31.53

Activation- 2.5

Recharge- 14

8ft radius

 

Whirling Axe on a Scrapper

Average Damage- 62.56

Dpa- 23.43

Activation- 2.67

Recharge- 14

8ft radius 

 

Powercrash is a little less damage than say Sweeping cross but it has more range and a bigger arc and can hit more targets. If it gets more dps then the range, arc and number of targets would need to be adjusted.

 

Em AoE is not great but it is not bad. I don't see it being worse than some other sets. The single target damage is much better than some other sets though. My EM tanker destroys my DM tanker in single target damage and there is not a lot in it in AoE.

 

I was investigating the powers and I saw this:

 

...What is with the extra 5% on there?

 

For comparison:

 

...anyway that aside.

 

 

EM has one ok AoE and meh cone that goes up to "ok" if you combo it with a ST power.

That's just not going to compare to any set with halfway decent AoEs. I'm pretty sure even Axe can pull off better AoE than EM just by virtue of having Pendulum and Cleave. Even if Cleave only manages 1-3 targets per shot it's still doing very high damage.  And Axe should be better able to leverage Build Up for bonus damage.

 

But if it's even close that kind of is what I'm getting at.  Axe sucks.  If you compare it to any set that just has "Ok" AoE it falls apart quick.  I know Kat back to front. BS and Katana are basically better versions of Axe.  And they're not exactly what you call "AoE Heavy."   My Kat would leave any EM scrapper in the dust... AoE wise.

 

If all EM can do is be almost as good as Axe in the AoE dept... it has bad AoE.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[siolfir]

14 minutes ago, ABlueThingy said:

 

I was investigating the powers and I saw this:

 

...What is with the extra 5% on there?

 

For comparison:

 

...anyway that aside.

 

 

EM has one ok AoE and meh cone that goes up to "ok" if you combo it with a ST power.

That's just not going to compare to any set with halfway decent AoEs. I'm pretty sure even Axe can pull off better AoE than EM just by virtue of having Pendulum and Cleave. Even if Cleave only manages 1-3 targets per shot it's still doing very high damage.  And Axe should be better able to leverage Build Up for bonus damage.

 

But if it's even close that kind of is what I'm getting at.  Axe sucks.  If you compare it to any set that just has "Ok" AoE it falls apart quick.  I know Kat back to front. BS and Katana are basically better versions of Axe.  And they're not exactly what you call "AoE Heavy."   My Kat would leave any EM scrapper in the dust... AoE wise.

 

If all EM can do is be almost as good as Axe in the AoE dept... it has bad AoE.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The extra 5% might be the PvP damage? Sometimes the in-game numbers has a display error where PvP numbers show under PvE.

 

And yes, Whirling Axe is also bad and doesn't follow the formula, but as you say Battle Axe has more AoE attacks available; even with the changes EM goes from bottom-tier (below DM!) to low-end in AoE, but the single target performance increases a bit.

[Tsuko]

30 minutes ago, siolfir said:

The extra 5% might be the PvP damage? Sometimes the in-game numbers has a display error where PvP numbers show under PvE.

it's the chance to crit.

[siolfir]

Just now, Tsuko said:

it's the chance to crit.

I know that one of the lines is the 5% chance to crit, but it shows up twice. The power doesn't have two crits.

[Tsuko]

1 minute ago, siolfir said:

I know that one of the lines is the 5% chance to crit, but it shows up twice. The power doesn't have two crits.

ho you talk about whirwing hands, ok my bad 🙂

 

 

[siolfir]

6 minutes ago, Tsuko said:

ho you talk about whirwing hands, ok my bad 🙂

 

 

Yeah, I was responding to the part of the post that was in between the images: 

1 hour ago, ABlueThingy said:

...What is with the extra 5% on there?

...and left the other part in about Whirling Axe because I was using it as the example of another underperforming AoE that shouldn't be used as the basis for comparison - it also does not follow the design formulas and needed to either do more damage or have a larger area. I could have clarified specifically what I was talking about better, though, I guess.

[Gobbledigook]

2 hours ago, ABlueThingy said:

 

I was investigating the powers and I saw this:

 

...What is with the extra 5% on there?

 

For comparison:

 

...anyway that aside.

 

 

EM has one ok AoE and meh cone that goes up to "ok" if you combo it with a ST power.

That's just not going to compare to any set with halfway decent AoEs. I'm pretty sure even Axe can pull off better AoE than EM just by virtue of having Pendulum and Cleave. Even if Cleave only manages 1-3 targets per shot it's still doing very high damage.  And Axe should be better able to leverage Build Up for bonus damage.

 

But if it's even close that kind of is what I'm getting at.  Axe sucks.  If you compare it to any set that just has "Ok" AoE it falls apart quick.  I know Kat back to front. BS and Katana are basically better versions of Axe.  And they're not exactly what you call "AoE Heavy."   My Kat would leave any EM scrapper in the dust... AoE wise.

 

If all EM can do is be almost as good as Axe in the AoE dept... it has bad AoE.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Either way i do like the set. Maybe the AoE could go up slightly and the single target down slightly though.

 

It might be lower AoE than some sets but not massively, a small tweak might be good. But it blows a lot of the other sets out of the water on single target. I made an EM/Invuln Tanker and i was under 4 minute Pylon with just a fast put together no proc build. With no idea of rotation and no debuff procs. I used the same build on a DM/invuln Tanker and 4 minutes later the Pylon was still at 50% health.

 

Perhaps other sets just need a buff.

Edited October 27, 2020 by Gobbledegook

[Gobbledigook]

1 hour ago, Gobbledegook said:

Either way i do like the set. Maybe the AoE could go up slightly and the single target down slightly though.

 

It might be lower AoE than some sets but not massively, a small tweak might be good. But it blows a lot of the other sets out of the water on single target. I made an EM/Invuln Tanker and i was under 4 minute Pylon with just a fast put together no proc build. With no idea of rotation and no debuff procs. I used the same build on a DM/invuln Tanker and 4 minutes later the Pylon was still at 50% health.

 

Perhaps other sets just need a buff. The more i think about it, this is probably the case. Some of the other sets just need a little love.

 

[Infinitum]

1 hour ago, Gobbledegook said:

Either way i do like the set. Maybe the AoE could go up slightly and the single target down slightly though.

 

It might be lower AoE than some sets but not massively, a small tweak might be good. But it blows a lot of the other sets out of the water on single target. I made an EM/Invuln Tanker and i was under 4 minute Pylon with just a fast put together no proc build. With no idea of rotation and no debuff procs. I used the same build on a DM/invuln Tanker and 4 minutes later the Pylon was still at 50% health.

 

Perhaps other sets just need a buff.

you are missing the point of EM if you want it to have more AOE and less ST.  I get what you are saying though, but you have to live or die by the ST with EM and thats how its been even in its golden age pre nerf - which i think we are about to have another golden age with this update.

[Gobbledigook]

Just now, Infinitum said:

you are missing the point of EM if you want it to have more AOE and less ST.  I get what you are saying though, but you have to live or die by the ST with EM and thats how its been even in its golden age pre nerf - which i think we are about to have another golden age with this update.

Yes i remember them days :). Either way EM is a lot better and that is the main thing.

 

Fire melee should be number one in my eyes though.

 

Just did a 3.04 min pylon on a semi built Rad/EM Tanker 🙂 

 

 

[Infinitum]

2 minutes ago, Gobbledegook said:

Yes i remember them days :). Either way EM is a lot better and that is the main thing.

 

Fire melee should be number one in my eyes though.

 

Just did a 3.04 min pylon on a semi built Rad/EM Tanker 🙂 

 

 

well here is a thought, what if fire melee updates made it the updated TW version of non weapon sets?  - without a mechanic like momentum also.

 

also off the rails here   ill stop now  lol

Edited October 27, 2020 by Infinitum

[Bill Z Bubba]

Cranked up an em/shield scrapper. Street hunted to lvl 10. Bumped to 20. Cruising through radio missions in Talos.

Being able to keep SOs green with a click of a button and start slotting them at lvl 2 may well kill my powerleveling days.

EM is still a great amount of fun for me in the lowbie levels. I really enjoy the sound and visuals of Barrage, EP and BS.

Having a minor cone on top of whirling hands is a nice buff for standard mission clearing.

At this level, though, I am noticing the increased recharge time on EP as it's stopping me from being able to Bar/EP/BS/EP/repeat.

[zenblack]

15 hours ago, ABlueThingy said:

 

...What is with the extra 5% on there?

That is the Scrapper ATO Scrapper's Strikes

[Bopper]

15 hours ago, ABlueThingy said:

What is with the extra 5% on there?

Thats a bug with the displays. Sometimes the displays show both PvE effects and PvP effects together. That 5% is the PvP crit chance you get against players. The the 2s stun that shows up beneath it is also the PvP stun.

[Safehouse]

I apologize that I fell off midway through testing EM for scrappers through the levels from 1-50. My wife and I lost our baby and have been wrestling with the fallout and heartbreak from the loss these last couple of weeks. That has had to take priority.

 

I likely will not be doing detailed posts about the leveling but I wanted to say at a high level: I love EM on scrappers. Combining EM/Energy Aura with Mu Mastery has made for a powerfully destructive force. I can't wait for this to go live.

 

Thank you devs for your hard work on this.

[Saikochoro]

7 hours ago, Safehouse said:

I apologize that I fell off midway through testing EM for scrappers through the levels from 1-50. My wife and I lost our baby and have been wrestling with the fallout and heartbreak from the loss these last couple of weeks. That has had to take priority.

 

I likely will not be doing detailed posts about the leveling but I wanted to say at a high level: I love EM on scrappers. Combining EM/Energy Aura with Mu Mastery has made for a powerfully destructive force. I can't wait for this to go live.

 

Thank you devs for your hard work on this.

I know it isn’t worth much from a stranger, but condolences for your loss. I can’t imagine how hard that must be. 

[Jimmy]

As the patch is nearing completion, we are no longer seeking feedback on this topic.

 

The latest patch notes can be found in the Beta Patch Notes forum.

 

If you encounter any bugs during this last phase of testing, please report them in the Beta Bug Reports forum.

 

Once the patch is live, feel free to post feedback in the Suggestions & Feedback forum. and bug reports in the Bug Reports forum.

 

Thank you!