MASSIVELY: Has Homecoming torched the plans of City of Heroes successors?

[PeregrineFalcon]

54 minutes ago, Hyperstrike said:

At this rate, we MIGHT see an early Alpha release some time in the mid 2030's.

I hope you're wrong, Hyperstrike. I was hopping to get a chance to play this game before I die in 2030.

[Bill Z Bubba]

1 minute ago, PeregrineFalcon said:

I hope you're wrong, Hyperstrike. I was hopping to get a chance to play this game before I die in 2030.

 

That when you hit 75? I don't get to check out until 2047.

[Hyperstrike]

12 minutes ago, Without_Pause said:

Which also means dealing with multiple generations of the Unreal engine. I believe they did one upgrade. What happens if they decide to do more?

Ostensibly, you SHOULD be able to open the project in the new version and it'll upgrade.

What PROBLEMS the conversion will cause...

[PeregrineFalcon]

13 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

That when you hit 75? I don't get to check out until 2047.

Nah. I'm only a couple of years older than you. I just don't believe that I'll make it to 75. My health isn't great and I'm already half blind. Not saying that for sympathy or anything, it just is what it is. We're all going to go sometime.

 

Although, given the way I annoy people IRL I was honestly shocked when I made it to 30.

[Marine X]

18 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Any chance HC can be patched on to this?

Not sure, I know they have a separate i25 install, which has all of the SCoRE upgrades, but which does not use the Self Install process, but I suppose it's possible but would require access to the i27 code which OuroDev does not show among their offerings at this time.

[voyager2001dl]

On 10/21/2021 at 11:18 AM, Without_Pause said:

+1. As much as I think SoH has a chance of coming out, the narrative was it was a game already being built, and they were going to reskin it into a superhero game. Ok fine, but why is a dev studio taking this long to not actually hit going live? What does that tell us about said studio? At this point, what is coming out first? Winds of Winter, The Doors of Stone, or a CoH spiritual successor? Because Lordy, it has been some time.

So far as I know, City of Titans and Ship of Heroes were both originally CoH spiritual successors.  There were a few others that failed as well, but that is beside the point.

 

As far as a reskin, I think your thinking of Valiance Online.  This one was originally being developed as a different game.  I have not checked in awhile, but I think it's still being developed as well.  And the only one with a playable alpha.  (If you donate).

[Without_Pause]

Been too long but that does sound familiar. As mentioned a few back, I looked at VO, and couldn't run away fast enough.

[CloudMouse]

On 11/1/2021 at 1:41 PM, Without_Pause said:

Which still doesn't mean much. I feel like videos they have shared across the years really haven't advanced. While a mission was shown early, 2015, there really hasn't been advancements in that direction. and that far more than a hero creator should be the focus. 

whats awesome about CoT is that you since its all volunteers you can volunteer to help develop the project. just like HC. 

[CloudMouse]

On 11/1/2021 at 2:01 PM, Hyperstrike said:

An avatar creator's easy (relatively).
It's just building out from the Unreal Engine's pre-existing tools.

Zooming through a bare test zone isn't particularly noteworthy.

Writing content isn't impressive either.  Because they haven't actually implemented a mission building system.

Again, this has been going on 8 years.  Through several versions of the Unreal Engine.

The main drag is they've had to teach themselves EVERYTHING, from "You've installed the software.  GO!"

At this rate, we MIGHT see an early Alpha release some time in the mid 2030's.

it really sounds like you have lots of skills that the CoT (and even HC) team could use to build out a full game from scratch as a volunteer. 

[Hyperstrike]

17 minutes ago, CloudMouse said:

it really sounds like you have lots of skills that the CoT (and even HC) team could use to build out a full game from scratch as a volunteer. 

Unfortunately, what I do NOT have is TIME.

And simply adding one person, no matter how industrious, would fix nothing.

[Luminara]

3 minutes ago, Hyperstrike said:

Unfortunately, what I do NOT have is TIME.

 

That flux capacitor was on loan, not a gift, and you broke it?  Again?  If the universe folds in on itself, I'm telling everyone it was your fault.

[Without_Pause]

36 minutes ago, CloudMouse said:

whats awesome about CoT is that you since its all volunteers you can volunteer to help develop the project. just like HC. 

I have zero desire to work with the Unity engine, and yes, I work in software development.

[OmegaOne]

2 hours ago, Without_Pause said:

I have zero desire to work with the Unity engine, and yes, I work in software development.

CoT is Unreal if I recall correctly.

[Hyperstrike]

2 hours ago, OmegaOne said:

CoT is Unreal if I recall correctly.

Yep.  They're on current version Unreal.

[Clave Dark 5]

7 hours ago, CloudMouse said:

whats awesome about CoT is that you since its all volunteers you can volunteer to help develop the project. just like HC. 

I was working for them and I didn't see them doing much to recruit new folks, tbh - just the opposite, at least for the group I was working in.  But hey, that was years ago, maybe they've gotten better.

[Without_Pause]

4 hours ago, OmegaOne said:

CoT is Unreal if I recall correctly.

Well, then I stand by that even more so.

[voyager2001dl]

FYI, I just checked websites for all three of these (most popular) spiritual successors of City of Heroes, as they have come to be called by those few who follow them.  All three have updates of some kind within the last two weeks, and fairly consistent updates every 1-2 months before that.  The valiance ones are admittedly difficult to find since they moved from their own updates section to a single running thread on their forum a few years ago.  Anyhow, slow I will admit (to a degree, being as some games funded by large teams such as Blizzard and EA have taken in excess of 10 years from their initial start of development to launch, guild wars 2 and starcraft 2 are good examples).  But going back to the initial question of this thread, I see no evidence at least on the surface that homecoming has "Torched" any of these potential new games.

[Without_Pause]

On 11/7/2021 at 9:42 AM, voyager2001dl said:

FYI, I just checked websites for all three of these (most popular) spiritual successors of City of Heroes, as they have come to be called by those few who follow them.  All three have updates of some kind within the last two weeks, and fairly consistent updates every 1-2 months before that.  The valiance ones are admittedly difficult to find since they moved from their own updates section to a single running thread on their forum a few years ago.  Anyhow, slow I will admit (to a degree, being as some games funded by large teams such as Blizzard and EA have taken in excess of 10 years from their initial start of development to launch, guild wars 2 and starcraft 2 are good examples).  But going back to the initial question of this thread, I see no evidence at least on the surface that homecoming has "Torched" any of these potential new games.

The questions are how far have they come and how far do they have to go? From what I know of CoT, they have a long way to go. Also, GW2 and SC2 had at least something to build off of, see lore, art, etc. Technically the successors are starting from the ground up and no track record of quality. Blizzard can afford to take a decade to develop a game since they got WoW money. If something like CoT needs 20 years of development, are volunteers really going to be down for that?

[Andreah]

On 10/21/2021 at 12:30 PM, roleki said:

If anything, the existence and success of Homecoming should encourage successors, not deflate them.

And give them a breather, to make progress without fanatically impatient players pushing them to show premature evidence of progress. 

 

It's hard work, and should take a long time with a small, poorly funded team.

[Crysis]

The fundamental problem with any of these successors actually becoming a reality is what’s often referred to as the “MVP” (Minimum Viable Product) quandry.  To achieve any possible level of success as a competitor to Homecoming or it’s variants requires them to effectively MATCH the level of functionality and content currently available from the SCORE release.  That’s no small task.  Anything LESS in terms of functionality, scope and content will likely be met with a very large yawn from the admittedly already SMALL potential customer base that are currently playing on the SCORE variant servers. 

 

If after 8+ years they STILL haven’t achieved a level of parity with where COH sunsetted, it is delusional to think they will EVER catch up.  Better graphics/engine notwithstanding there’s just no way these projects have any chance of succeeding to commercial viability levels. As science projects/novelties….maybe.  As products….not a chance.

 

Think about it for a moment.  If the ORIGINAL COH development team tried, and largely failed, with Champions Online to create a successor to COH ‘classic’ what makes anyone think a bunch of amateurs have any chance whatsover?  Put a fork in these projects, turn the page, enjoy Homecoming or one of its of variants for what it is and that’s that.  What we have is all we are going to get until/unless a professional gaming dev company decides the superhero genre is ripe for a highly funded/marketed successor.  All this time and nothing more than basic demoware is proof we have limited talent working on these successors and nothing more than wishful thinking to show for it.

 

 

[voyager2001dl]

Ok, just a few weeks later, SoH Team has given the perfect argument.

 

https://www.shipofheroes.com/schedule/

Perfect timing guys.

 

Thank you immensely to all teams, Homecoming, CoT, SoH, Valiance and others for keeping the idea of such a world alive. 

 

[Without_Pause]

Well, this part has me putting it on hold since they seem to be down with the low damage healer trope.

Quote

And the right power combinations can create roles that you don’t often see in MMOs; there’s a lot more complexity than just being a low-damage tanker, a low-damage healer, or a damage-dealer.

 

I know I'm posting on a CoH forum, but SoH looks dated. I'll wait for reviews.

Edited December 4, 2021 by Without_Pause

[Parabola]

38 minutes ago, Without_Pause said:

Well, this part has me putting it on hold since they seem to be down with the low damage healer trope.

Quote

And the right power combinations can create roles that you don’t often see in MMOs; there’s a lot more complexity than just being a low-damage tanker, a low-damage healer, or a damage-dealer.

 

I know I'm posting on a CoH forum, but SoH looks dated. I'll wait for reviews.

I followed the development of SoH for a time while CoH was dark (and supported it). One of the things that drew me to it was that I got the feeling that the developers understood what made CoH a great game and were trying to capture the same essence for SoH. In particular it seemed that they specifically weren't following the trinity model and wanted CoH's looser and more interesting flexible roles. The statement you quote seems to be supporting this?

[Ironblade]

5 hours ago, voyager2001dl said:

Ok, just a few weeks later, SoH Team has given the perfect argument.

 

https://www.shipofheroes.com/schedule/

Perfect timing guys.

I am not reassured by that page.  If you click on the schedule tab for '2nd Half 2020' it says, "This is the second schedule of 2020, and it includes items we have not accomplished yet."

 

So I guess that page has not been updated since some time in the second half of 2020?  Ouch.

[Without_Pause]

8 hours ago, Parabola said:

I followed the development of SoH for a time while CoH was dark (and supported it). One of the things that drew me to it was that I got the feeling that the developers understood what made CoH a great game and were trying to capture the same essence for SoH. In particular it seemed that they specifically weren't following the trinity model and wanted CoH's looser and more interesting flexible roles. The statement you quote seems to be supporting this?

Healer is pretty much a forbidden word in CoH. That's the part I was really pointing out to. The game is REALLY trying hard to be CoH 2.0 though. Like I said, I'll wait for reviews.