Combat Teleport should be a bonus popup of Teleport, not its own skill

[Kaelit]

It's all in the name. Not only would this increase the popularity of Teleport (the least used travel power), it'd also even the field with Jaunt and Mystic flight - both of which recieve what is basically the same power for free (at a somewhat higher End cost and no +Hit, which, I would say, is still worth less than a power slot). Also, it would balance out the fact that teleport is the only TP with no bonus power.

 

Hit me with your cons!

[Zect]

The biggest con would be that further buffing teleport powers adds to power creep in the game, which is already one of the most serious issues the game faces. Teleport only recently received a buff by having TP friend and foe consolidated into one power, and an excellent new power added - fold space. It is currently very balanced.

 

That said, your suggestion also contains two ill-informed assumptions that are worth taking a further look at:

1. The low popularity of teleport powers is a problem that must be solved. On the contrary, it is beneficial for the game to offer situational powers, or powers that appeal to a minority of players with different playstyles. This increases the diversity of gameplay and hence, the fun and replay value of the game. Making teleport as popular as the other pools would inevitably entail some degree of homogenization, which is a loss for all involved.
2. Combat teleport being a separate power from teleport is the main cause of this low popularity. The main reason why teleport is disfavored in the current meta is the lack of a +def power to help softcap and mule lotg's. That's why the default pool setup is speed, fighting, and any 2 of leaping/flight/leadership. Adding +def to any of Teleport's powers would in turn run into the two issues I have already mentioned, i.e. power creep and homogenization.

All told, a terrible suggestion.

[Kaelit]

I'm not suggesting that Combat Teleport is the reason of Teleport's low popularity, however, I do think that it would somewhat soften the gap between teleport and the other TPs. I'm also vehemently against adding +def to TP's powers, not sure where that came from.

I agree that Fold space and Teleport target are excellent additions, however, they don't solve the problems of the actual Teleport power itself, only buff the pool. I'd argue that people who take Teleport Target and Fold Space don't really overlap with people who use Teleport for travel.

 

The fact is, two powers that are NOT Teleport-based (Speed of Sound and Mystic Flight) have an objectively better TP power due to the fact they don't waste a power slot on it! 

Hell, Translocation even offers the same distance for 25% less END! + you get Flight! - Yes, TP does have the 50% discount while its hover is active, but you can cross entire maps with both powers before you run out of END.

 

Powercreep can be a problem, so can homogenization, but I fail to see how bringing a power up to Speed (pardon the pun) with the others pushes the creep further.

Edited December 26, 2022 by Kaelit

[InvaderStych]

No thanks.

 

Losing the ability to slot Combat Teleport is a non-starter. Pop-up "bonus" powers cannot be slotted.

 

 

Edit:

 

Remember, the auto-hover period of time when using Teleport *is* Teleport's "bonus" ability.

 

Edited December 26, 2022 by InvaderStych

[Rudra]

3 hours ago, InvaderStych said:

Remember, the auto-hover period of time when using Teleport *is* Teleport's "bonus" ability.

I hadn't realized the pop-up teleports lacked the hover period. I usually only use them to get past a group of mobs in a mission I don't want to bother with. However, I just checked Speed of Sound's teleport, and sure enough, as soon as you arrive at your teleport location, you immediately start falling if not on the ground. So advantage: Teleport.

 

 

3 hours ago, Kaelit said:

The fact is, two powers that are NOT Teleport-based (Speed of Sound and Mystic Flight) have an objectively better TP power due to the fact they don't waste a power slot on it! 

Another advantage of Teleport? I don't have to make a bind or macro to speed spam it to get across zones/maps. Since it is a slotted power, it has its own spot on my power trays, I can just keep tapping the number key and click. Makes for very fast zone teleporting without needing a macro or bind. Another advantage of Teleport? You can slot it since it is a power slot choice. Why is that an advantage? You can use the enhancement sets Warp, Time & Space Manipulation, and Jaunt. Why is that an advantage? Because you slot improve Teleport's range and endurance cost, something you can't do with Translocation or Jaunt. Hells, Warp has a proc that increases your perception too. (Edit: Warp: Range/ Increased Perception)

 

The reason why most people don't take teleport as a power choice to the best of my knowledge is that it is a clunky power to use as compared to just turning on your flight or ground speed toggle. You have to click the power, place the cursor for destination (at correct angle or you can end up teleporting in place depending on where you are), and then click the desired location. The individuals I spoke with that don't like teleport find that unnecessarily troubling. When you get the hang of it though? Teleport is insanely fast and easy to use. And it even makes you untouchable briefly when you teleport in. So you not only have a window where you hover in place to re-align the character and teleport again, you are also briefly untouchable. I'd say that means Teleport has extra bonuses to match the other travel powers.

 

Edit: Untouchable reference:

+100000% Untouchable (self only) for 1s

https://cod.uberguy.net/html/power.html?power=redirects.pool_teleportation.teleport&at=blaster

Edited December 26, 2022 by Rudra

[lemming]

I've been using TP a lot more since the hang time got improved.  And working Fold Space in has been an advantage, plus TP Target is just very useful in teams.  For the most part, I rarely take Combat TP.  For those chars that need to stealth thru, TP works really well, especially past spots that break stealth like red crystals

[Rudra]

3 hours ago, Kaelit said:

Hell, Translocation even offers the same distance for 25% less END! + you get Flight!

Something you aren't factoring in with this statement? When you have Mystic Flight active and use Translocation, you are paying the END cost of both. You can't just pay the END cost of Translocation because it is not an available power unless Mystic Flight is on. As compared to Teleport's END cost which has no other travel power costs required for use. So it is not actually 25% less END cost to use Translocation as compared to Teleport. Teleport has a base END cost of 13. Translocation has a base END cost of 9.75 + .455/s. And while you can reduce the 13 cost for Teleport, you can't reduce the 9.75 for Translocation. Just slotting Warp's Endurance/Range enhancement into your free slot gives Teleport a 9.11 END cost and a 405.8 ft. range. Which again, you can't do with Translocation. So just 1 enhancement into your free slot gives Teleport better range and endurance cost even before you add in the endurance cost requirement of Mystic Flight.

[Glacier Peak]

I'm not convinced, so no.

 

[Yomo Kimyata]

Combat Teleport is a great power!

 

Automatically adds 7% to hit out of the box.  That's more than Focused Accuracy or Targeting Drone and there's no endurance drain.  Use powexeclocation 0:2 combat teleport and you are basically popping an Insight.

 

With just the basic slot, you can put in a 50+5 to hit IO to get over 9% to hit.  You can mule a stealth, or a +4 knockback protection, or a 20% slow resist.  You can even get an 11% chance to trigger a Gaussians proc, which is good for 100% damage and +40% to hit for 5 1/4 seconds.

 

It's good stuff.

 

What does this have to do with the original post?  Dunno.  But it's a great power if you have one slot and one power pool open.

[biostem]

9 hours ago, Kaelit said:

teleport is the only TP with no bonus power.

That hover you get after each TP *is* the bonus power.  Clearly other forms of TP do not include this hover period...

[Luminara]

What would be Combat Teleport's replacement?

How would all of the people who selected Combat Teleport, and didn't take Teleport, be placated by the power's removal?

 

Unless both of those questions can be answered, I don't foresee the HC team going down this road.  Powers aren't removed without good reason, and "because Teleport doesn't have a popup power" isn't a good reason.

[Major_Decoy]

4 minutes ago, Krimson said:

Combat Teleport is analogous to Combat Jumping and Hover, though it is unable to be slotted with Defense sets and can't be an LOTG Mule like the others. However, Teleportation is a TRAVEL pool power, and not a variable special pool like Experimentation, Sorcery, or Force of Will. I can't mule LOTG but slotting a Gaussian is pretty nifty, especially when you remember to use Combat Teleport. 😄

It can be a mule for Rectified Reticule: Increased Perception (which, unlike Warp: Range/Increased Perception, is active when the power hasn't been used in the last two minutes)

[Rudra]

3 minutes ago, Major_Decoy said:

It can be a mule for Rectified Reticule: Increased Perception (which, unlike Warp: Range/Increased Perception, is active when the power hasn't been used in the last two minutes)

Which if folded into Teleport as a pop-up as per the OP, you would not be able to do any more.

[biostem]

3 hours ago, Major_Decoy said:

It can be a mule for Rectified Reticule: Increased Perception (which, unlike Warp: Range/Increased Perception, is active when the power hasn't been used in the last two minutes)

It also provides a tohit buff, and can take Gaussian's IIRC.

[Major_Decoy]

15 minutes ago, biostem said:

It also provides a tohit buff, and can take Gaussian's IIRC.

Yes, I'm just still salty about discovering that the Warp: Range/Increased Perception proc is a proc and not continuously active. I was so disappointed.

[biostem]

7 minutes ago, Major_Decoy said:

Yes, I'm just still salty about discovering that the Warp: Range/Increased Perception proc is a proc and not continuously active. I was so disappointed.

Well, there's no teleport power that is either a toggle that you can keep on all the time, or is an auto-power.  I mean, do a combat tp once every 2 mins or so and you'll be covered... I usually bind such a power to lalt+lbutton for ease of use, and the tohit buff is nothing to sneeze at, either...

[InvaderStych]

There's a joke here about issues keeping one's Warp "up" being related to not hitting the button often enough, but I'm not caffeinated enough to find it.

[Uun]

Combat Teleport is a fantastic power. I have it on several characters that have no other teleport powers. Not only is it great for melee characters, but also for Kinetics. Also, Combat Teleport is decidedly NOT the same as Translocate or Jaunt.

[Mjolnerd]

Combat Teleport is something I want to be able to use quickly, during a fight, to reposition myself or get out of trouble. I don't want to have to toggle on "Teleport Mode" for it to work.

[TheZag]

I dont like adding slots to travel powers so its hard for me to take teleport because it gets so much better with some slots,  combat teleport as well.  I have a character planned that will use teleport exclusively for travel and combat but its not made yet.

 

But pretending combat teleport got added as a popup to teleport after recall friend and teleport foe got combined into teleport target to make room for it,  what would be put in its place?  What does teleport need that it doesnt have?  Long range teleport was given to everyone in the entire game to make room for fold space so it doesnt need that.  Should it get an attack?  Teleport limbs to leave your targets torso writhing in pain on the floor,  unable to do anything as they bleed out.  Im sure someone more creative than me could come up with something but as far as the teleport pool goes,  it seems like it has everything it needs.

 

[Yomo Kimyata]

1 hour ago, TheZag said:

 

 

Should it get an attack?  Teleport limbs to leave your targets torso writhing in pain on the floor,  unable to do anything as they bleed out.  Im sure someone more creative than me could come up with something but as far as the teleport pool goes,  it seems like it has everything it needs.

 

Teleport internal organs out of your enemy’s body.  Instant kill, but only for tanks.

[biostem]

1 hour ago, TheZag said:

Should it get an attack?

Not that I'm necessarily an advocate for adding an attack to the teleport pool, but they could do something like a single version of the vorpal judgement power, where a clone of yourself quickly appears near the enemy to deliver a kick or such....

[Rudra]

People are already complaining about existing attacks in the power pools as being subpar or a tax to get other powers in the pool. Teleport doesn't need to be roped into that as well. Especially just to fold Combat Teleport into Teleport which would hamstring Combat Teleport anyway.

 

Folding Recall Friend and Teleport Foe into the single power Teleport Other was fine because neither power effectively went away. You can still enhance them, except as a single power now, to improve their effects just as well as when they were separate powers. So those with both powers prior to merging (like me) didn't actually lose anything, we gained an extra power slot while retaining the functionality of both previous powers.

 

Folding Combat Teleport into Teleport would not allow that and would hamstring the players currently using it. They would no longer be able to enhance Combat Teleport or use it without somehow having a Teleport toggle active. (How would a teleport toggle even work anyway?) All for the sake of giving Teleport a pop-up power it doesn't need and can't effectively use for not being a toggle power. Especially since Teleport already has 2 supplemental effects to make it stand out: free hover (no END cost) and brief untouchability.

[JasperStone]

4 hours ago, Rudra said:

People are already complaining about existing attacks in the power pools as being subpar or a tax to get other powers in the pool. Teleport doesn't need to be roped into that as well. Especially just to fold Combat Teleport into Teleport which would hamstring Combat Teleport anyway.

 

Folding Recall Friend and Teleport Foe into the single power Teleport Other was fine because neither power effectively went away. You can still enhance them, except as a single power now, to improve their effects just as well as when they were separate powers. So those with both powers prior to merging (like me) didn't actually lose anything, we gained an extra power slot while retaining the functionality of both previous powers.

 

Folding Combat Teleport into Teleport would not allow that and would hamstring the players currently using it. They would no longer be able to enhance Combat Teleport or use it without somehow having a Teleport toggle active. (How would a teleport toggle even work anyway?) All for the sake of giving Teleport a pop-up power it doesn't need and can't effectively use for not being a toggle power. Especially since Teleport already has 2 supplemental effects to make it stand out: free hover (no END cost) and brief untouchability.

I agree with @Rudra

 

Because of the to-hit boost on CT I see these as two distinct powers

 

Edited December 28, 2022 by JasperStone
sentence structure

[srmalloy]

7 hours ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

Teleport internal organs out of your enemy’s body.  Instant kill, but only for tanks.

Why should tanks be the only AT that can be instantly killed by an NPC doing this?