Focused Feedback: Blast Power Set Updates

[Sovera]

26 minutes ago, Booper said:

That's an interesting suggestion. Similar to Sentinel's Super Reflexes. I don't think we're interested in expanding on that mechanic, but I'll make sure the idea gets discussed either way.

 

Unrelated, but not sure if it just me or what, but your signature is 20x the size of your posts.

[WindDemon21]

3 minutes ago, Booper said:

That's an interesting suggestion. Similar to Sentinel's Super Reflexes. I don't think we're interested in expanding on that mechanic, but I'll make sure the idea gets discussed either way.

Personally, this is one of the BEST mechanics that would help solve a lot of player conflicts between powers, that i think should be MORE implemented.

[Gobbledigook]

Don't forget to update the Epic powers for AT's also. I think this may have been over looked in the past. Otherwise Scrappers for example will still be using a much slower Fire Blast (not very Epic at all!).

[Mezmera]

55 minutes ago, Astralock said:

 

If turning a power into a standard attack nerfs its damage output "big time," then it sounds like it was doing too much damage procced out.

 

DP lacks any major ST dpa attack like some of the other better assaults like fire and ice blast.  Ice lacks a snipe which it makes up for with major ST damage along with a few highly procable powers a few of which are holds (one with more ideal recharge rate).  Fire has raw damage output through fast animating high damage attacks in Blaze and its snipe.  

 

DP sacrifices fast animations with raw damage and snipes to have some neat proc'ing powers.  If we're going to remove the best powers to proc then the ST damage is very lackluster and its aoe is just okay.  

[MechaMarshmallow]

I won't belabour the point in Incinerator, but ~71dpa is extremely low for a single target power at tier 8 of a blast set. Blaze is 170, bitter ice blast is 133 with hefty debuffs attached. Even disregarding the top dog damage sets, water jet is 85dpa with the benefit of getting to use it twice - and it just got buffed. Even Sonic has Screech at 95, with a hold and debuff attached.

 

I could go on but I won't. I've complained about boring ST damage nature of Incinerator, but please understand: It is, on its own merits, a bad power.

[WindDemon21]

4 minutes ago, MechaMarshmallow said:

I won't belabour the point in Incinerator, but ~71dpa is extremely low for a single target power at tier 8 of a blast set. Blaze is 170, bitter ice blast is 133 with hefty debuffs attached. Even disregarding the top dog damage sets, water jet is 85dpa with the benefit of getting to use it twice - and it just got buffed. Even Sonic has Screech at 95, with a hold and debuff attached.

 

I could go on but I won't. I've complained about boring ST damage nature of Incinerator, but please understand: It is, on its own merits, a bad power.

Yes this, the same reason it's also underwhelming on sentinels even though it's a "little" better (sent version needs its cast time reduced to 1.67s)

[Booper]

Just a reminder for everybody. Focused Feedback threads are intended for feedback from testing the changes on Brainstorm. Not interested in patch note feedback or speculation of what performance is like based on reading of those patch notes. If you want to have that discussion, make a post in the Homecoming Beta sub-forum. Otherwise, that sort of discussion in the Focused Feedback threads will be deemed off-topic and hidden.

[FupDup]

Incinerator's base stats aren't impressive, I admit, but from a mechanical/design standpoint it is at least more workable and doesn't have anti-synergy with its own set like Ignite does. Incinerator just needs some numeric adjustments. Ignite would need almost a complete redesign to work. 

[Dispari]

Having done some testing on the psi blast stuff, it's all pretty neat. Gives the set a new flavor and the chain power helps add to the AoE of the set as it seems to chain very well. I'm not ENTIRELY sure why we have psychic darts instead of just psychic scream which already existed, but the VFX of a bunch of darts showering enemies is pretty cool.

I am hopeful that the cast time changes for psychic powers make it to VEATs though.

[Vanden]

Just now, Dispari said:

I'm not ENTIRELY sure why we have psychic darts instead of just psychic scream which already existed,

 

It's because Psychic Scream is in Mental Manipulation.

[WindDemon21]

18 minutes ago, FupDup said:

Incinerator's base stats aren't impressive, I admit, but from a mechanical/design standpoint it is at least more workable and doesn't have anti-synergy with its own set like Ignite does. Incinerator just needs some numeric adjustments. Ignite would need almost a complete redesign to work. 

Actually it would just need a radius increase. If you put kb-kd into buckshot and m30, they actually HELP to keep enemies in ignite.

[Dispari]

Ah Vanden you're right. Makes sense. I guess that would've been the culprit for gutting the set in the first place when it went to blasters (they both got ported in i12). Psi blast on blasters has been an AoE-light this whole time and it's a lot beefier now.

[Mezmera]

Just as an fyi my point is not off topic if there's an insinuation directed the way of being critical of an attack chain nerf to DP. 

 

I logged onto my Trick Arrow / Dual Pistols Defender on Beta first before coming to speak in this topic so I am giving focused feedback. 

 

I alted to my 2nd build with Standard Ammo that has Suppressive Fire and Piercing Rounds.  I wanted to see how the weapon redraw would now affect both pistols and the bow running together along with what I surmised would be a lowering of performance for the DP powers adjusted.  The animations being more fluid is nice but I'll never alt to my 2nd build with those powers ever.  The output was noticeably less. 

 

I'll never take the hold on DP again with that low dpa and I guess I will work in Piercing Rounds into my Chem Ammo build since I'm on a debuffer anywho, although that animation is atrociously long.  

 

It's working as intended is the feedback given although I'm not sure that's all a good thing.  

[Dispari]

Oh I will also add I did some testing of AR as well and it makes it feel like a more coherent set, closer to the Sentinel version actually, with fewer AoEs (it had a few too many) and more ST powers (which it was lacking in). Though I do understand some people won't enjoy the changes to Incinerate. The addition of Aim is useful, not that every set needs one, though it does come at the cost of some mez in the set, so pros and cons there. Of course the main pure buff the set got is the nuke having a much wider cone which made it much easier to aim and land.

I'm skeptical this will put AR in a competitive spot in the meta; most of its effects are just -DEF and it has KB that has to be reigned in. But it does feel like a more playable set now so it might've moved up a couple slots. The lack of ST was pretty painful before IME. Also weapon sets in general are a bit more playable with the redraw changes.

Edited April 6, 2023 by Dispari

[psylum1]

I wass under the impression that this was incinerator's actual base damage. This would be worth giving up ignite for. As it stands however this number is very wrong. It's actual DPA is less than half of this. 

63-79 DPA is not even close to worth the loss of ignite for. Ignite could work in teams with a tank taunting or some kind immobilize. Losing that tactical flexability isn't worth it.

 

[WindDemon21]

4 minutes ago, psylum1 said:

I wass under the impression that this was incinerator's actual base damage. This would be worth giving up ignite for. As it stands however this number is very wrong. It's actual DPA is less than half of this. 

63-79 DPA is not even close to worth the loss of ignite for. Ignite could work in teams with a tank taunting or some kind immobilize. Losing that tactical flexability isn't worth it.

 

Especially when with the fixes to slug and the quick snipe it isn't needed anyway.

 

Tbh, if anything, if we're losing ignite, this is where aim should go instead of incinerator and keep the utility of beanbag (which could be given damage too)

 

But yeah keep ignite, increase its radius to 10ft.

[psylum1]

1 minute ago, WindDemon21 said:

Especially when with the fixes to slug and the quick snipe it isn't needed anyway.

 

Tbh, if anything, if we're losing ignite, this is where aim should go instead of incinerator and keep the utility of beanbag (which could be given damage too)

 

But yeah keep ignite, increase its radius to 10ft.

No beanbag can get and stay gone. Aim is actually a good power. Why stun an LT when you can aim and snipe it into the next life, and arrest them.

[Draeth Darkstar]

I really, really, really love the changes to Psychic Blast. I desperately wish that Blaster /Mental Manipulation got the improved animation time on Psychic Scream, though. That change wouldn't do much to change Mental Manipulation in the stack ranking of Blaster secondaries, but it would make that one very cool and iconic power feel so much better to use. It feels so nice to hit that button on a Corruptor now that I'm seriously considering a reroll of my psychic blaster, but losing Psychic Shockwave would make me very, very sad.

 

I will also add, since it's being discussed: I haven't personally tested the AR changes yet (I will ASAP but I can't right now), but I super duper hate dealing with Ignite and Beanbag is useless, so - good riddance to both.

Edited April 6, 2023 by Draeth Darkstar

[WindDemon21]

Just now, psylum1 said:

No beanbag can get and stay gone. Aim is actually a good power. Why stun an LT when you can aim and snipe it into the next life, and arrest them.

I get that, and I for one would prefer aim over beanbag. What I was saying is if ignite changes to incinerator, I'd rather have beanbag, than incinerator. So please just keep ignite and just increase its radius.

[ScarySai]

Incinerator underperforms, but it wouldn't take much to buff it to where it should be, as I've said before.

 

Ignite is a truly trash power and it can rot with beanbag for all I care.

[psylum1]

4 minutes ago, ScarySai said:

Incinerator underperforms, but it wouldn't take much to buff it to where it should be, as I've said before.

 

Ignite is a truly trash power and it can rot with beanbag for all I care.

Give Incinerator ignite's DPA. It's a single target attack it shouldn't break anything.

[WindDemon21]

10 minutes ago, psylum1 said:

Give Incinerator ignite's DPA. It's a single target attack it shouldn't break anything.

Or, keep ignite, and increase its radius. It's useful with sets with slows even if it had a larger radius to have its damage applied before they exit it. It's also key to my ar/ice and ar/tactical combos.

 

Again another place that would benefit from the "master brawler" treatment.

 

But as is I would take aim, incinerate, and beanbag over incinerator in its current form.

[WindDemon21]

19 minutes ago, ScarySai said:

Incinerator underperforms, but it wouldn't take much to buff it to where it should be, as I've said before.

 

Ignite is a truly trash power and it can rot with beanbag for all I care.

It's also dumb, because since it's dot, it should have MORE DPA than an instant hit attack. Something that truly baffles me on the sentinel version.

[InflamedPassions]

There appears to be an issue with Psionic Darts at the moment which causes it to consume much more endurance than usual when hitting multiple targets. On the build I created for Brainstorm, it's supposed to cost around 8.5 endurance, but when I hit several targets, it winds up eating half of my endurance bar.

[Crasical]

Worth noting that Beanbag is not Disorienting Shot, so it doesn't seem there are any changes to the Sentinel version of that power.