Accolade for doing all TFs and SFs

[Seed22]

On 7/7/2023 at 4:57 AM, Rudra said:

Brace for it, because you know it's coming. My response to things like this. Two words: Power Creep.

Heheheh...No.

 

Besides that, I don't think more accolades will be great, as that could clutter the UI/trays. Maybe increase RM gains from these activities instead

 

*Seriously though yall stop with this power creep BS. Use it so much and yet a lot of y'all have no idea what it looks like or means, please...please stop.

**Before anyone gives an unga bunga  response, tell me in actual numbers how 1% is powercreep. Give me an honest to goodness breakdown of how and why, and I'll leave it be. Bonus points if you get a dev to agree with your math.

Edited July 8, 2023 by Seed22

[lemming]

I think most badges for "ALL" of a type of badge is a constantly changing target.

 

Heck, we have a few badges that are for doing all of some missions for some areas which is unclear what happens if the devs add more content.

[Rudra]

4 hours ago, Seed22 said:

Heheheh...No.

 

Besides that, I don't think more accolades will be great, as that could clutter the UI/trays. Maybe increase RM gains from these activities instead

 

*Seriously though yall stop with this power creep BS. Use it so much and yet a lot of y'all have no idea what it looks like or means, please...please stop.

**Before anyone gives an unga bunga  response, tell me in actual numbers how 1% is powercreep. Give me an honest to goodness breakdown of how and why, and I'll leave it be. Bonus points if you get a dev to agree with your math.

The request was 5%, not 1%. And here's some easy math:

 

Base accuracy 75%. (Typical power accuracy, I believe.)

Accolade ToHit bonus 5%. (Just the requested accolade power.)

Character accuracy 50%. (A very low accuracy buff for the character to get.)

 

Base for comparison:

75 x 1.5 (for the very low accuracy buff players can build into their characters) is 112.5%.

 

ACC increase for comparison:

75 x 1.05 (if it was ACC rather than ToHit, with no other ACC bonuses) is 78.75%.

75 x 1.55 (because it is an ACC instead of ToHit boost for the base line) is 116.25%

 

ToHit increase for comparison:

75 + 5 (for +5% ToHit) is 80%.

80% x +1.5 (for +50% character accuracy) is 186.6375%.

 

Now you take that 112.5%, 116.25% chance, and 186.6375% chance and modify them by the target's defense and any differences in level. And then the final roll is capped at 95%.

 

If Defense works like ToHit, except opposite, like the wiki says, then you would reduce those percentages by an equal number. Let's go with a 20% defense foe because it is a nice number and I don't know the defense values of the various mobs in the game.

 

If applied before ACC:

75 - 20 is 55, 55 x 1.5 is 82.5% chance to hit.

75 - 20 is 55, 55 x 1.55 is 85.25% chance to hit.

75 + 5 - 20 is 60, 60 x 1.5 is 90% chance to hit.

 

If applied after ACC:

112.5-20 is 92.5% chance to hit.

116.25 - 20 is 96.25% chance to hit. (Capped at 95% if no other variables need to be accounted for.)

186.75 - 20 is 166.75% chance to hit. (Capped at 95% if no other variables need to be accounted for.)

 

Then you get into the level differences. We'll say a +7 target. So base accuracy becomes 8%.

8 x 1.5 is 12% chance to hit. (Base number from example.)

8 x 1.55 is 12.4% chance to hit.

(8 + 5) x 1.5 is 19.5% chance to hit.

 

And this is a bonus to the character that requires no enhancement slots, which even set bonuses still require. This isn't a power that takes up a character power slot choice. This isn't a level limited effect that goes away because you leveled too far down to maintain any more like set bonuses do and power access does. (Edit: Neither is it a consumable or otherwise temporary bonus such as an inspiration or crafted power.) It is a constant bonus. That makes it easier for the character to fight with no matching increase in difficulty to offset it. That is called power creep. And that is before you even get into the post(s?) in this thread asking for the OP to be expanded for more accolades granting even more powers that grant direct combat benefits.

 

(Edit again: And if I'm reading @Akisan's post right, that request isn't +1% ToHit. That request is +1% maximum to hit, which I am translating as a power that increases the 95% cap to 96% cap. If I'm wrong, then I apologize to @Akisan for misreading the post.)

 

Edited July 8, 2023 by Rudra
Edited for spelling.

[Akisan]

3 hours ago, Rudra said:

And if I'm reading @Akisan's post right, that request isn't +1% ToHit. That request is +1% maximum to hit, which I am translating as a power that increases the 95% cap to 96% cap. If I'm wrong, then I apologize to @Akisan for misreading the post.

 

Yes, that was my counter-proposal, unrealistic as it may be (seeing as it reduces the chance of a miss by 20%, if you're overcapped).  I also like @JasperStone's Perc. buff, especially if it's just enough to still see the CoT ghosts and Tsoo Ancestor Spirits for a few feet as they're starting to flee.

 

And yes, Defense works just like negative to-hit, and is always applied before accuracy multipliers (which is why +4 mobs still have a very small chance to hit someone at the 45% softcap). Most mobs don't have any though, and since we get Accuracy enhancements, in addition to our set bonuses, it doesn't really have an impact until they have a LOT of it (even a mob with 30% defense will still have a 90% chance to be hit with a 2x accuracy attack).

 

And, a side note for fighting very high defense mobs: Accuracy is nice in that it also affects your tohit floor - it's clamped at 5% before multipliers, so an attack with 3x accuracy will still have a minimum 15% chance to hit, even if the target has hard-capped defenses (or you have a negative to-hit value, which happens sometimes.  The CoT ghosts got me down to a -15% base to-hit chance the last time I ran a Posi 1)

[Doomguide2005]

Lots of solid information.  I'd add a few thoughts:

• The majority of foes have no +defense, especially older mob types.  Some later and or upgraded mobs do or did get some defenses.  Cimerorans being a fine example.  Rikti Drones, PP and Vengeance using Nemesis being examples of early game mobs that do.
• It is vastly easier to gain +Accuracy (in large amounts) via set bonuses than To Hit.  There are extremely few ways to gain To Hit via set bonuses.  Kismet is the only way coming to mind via sets.
• To Hit is much more powerful than Accuracy in helping builds reach 95% final hit chance specially when fighting up level foes (i.e. +4 mobs).  This is because of how readily the build costs associated with gaining To Hit vs Accuracy work combined with the math Rudra was detailing above.  

[MJABBAR88]

6 hours ago, Rudra said:

The request was 5%, not 1%. And here's some easy math:

 

Base accuracy 75%. (Typical power accuracy, I believe.)

Accolade ToHit bonus 5%. (Just the requested accolade power.)

Character accuracy 50%. (A very low accuracy buff for the character to get.)

 

Base for comparison:

75 x 1.5 (for the very low accuracy buff players can build into their characters) is 112.5%.

 

ACC increase for comparison:

75 x 1.05 (if it was ACC rather than ToHit, with no other ACC bonuses) is 78.75%.

75 x 1.55 (because it is an ACC instead of ToHit boost for the base line) is 116.25%

 

ToHit increase for comparison:

75 + 5 (for +5% ToHit) is 80%.

80% x +1.5 (for +50% character accuracy) is 186.6375%.

 

Now you take that 112.5%, 116.25% chance, and 186.6375% chance and modify them by the target's defense and any differences in level. And then the final roll is capped at 95%.

 

If Defense works like ToHit, except opposite, like the wiki says, then you would reduce those percentages by an equal number. Let's go with a 20% defense foe because it is a nice number and I don't know the defense values of the various mobs in the game.

 

If applied before ACC:

75 - 20 is 55, 55 x 1.5 is 82.5% chance to hit.

75 - 20 is 55, 55 x 1.55 is 85.25% chance to hit.

75 + 5 - 20 is 60, 60 x 1.5 is 90% chance to hit.

 

If applied after ACC:

112.5-20 is 92.5% chance to hit.

116.25 - 20 is 96.25% chance to hit. (Capped at 95% if no other variables need to be accounted for.)

186.75 - 20 is 166.75% chance to hit. (Capped at 95% if no other variables need to be accounted for.)

 

Then you get into the level differences. We'll say a +7 target. So base accuracy becomes 8%.

8 x 1.5 is 12% chance to hit. (Base number from example.)

8 x 1.55 is 12.4% chance to hit.

(8 + 5) x 1.5 is 19.5% chance to hit.

 

And this is a bonus to the character that requires no enhancement slots, which even set bonuses still require. This isn't a power that takes up a character power slot choice. This isn't a level limited effect that goes away because you leveled too far down to maintain any more like set bonuses do and power access does. (Edit: Neither is it a consumable or otherwise temporary bonus such as an inspiration or crafted power.) It is a constant bonus. That makes it easier for the character to fight with no matching increase in difficulty to offset it. That is called power creep. And that is before you even get into the post(s?) in this thread asking for the OP to be expanded for more accolades granting even more powers that grant direct combat benefits.

 

(Edit again: And if I'm reading @Akisan's post right, that request isn't +1% ToHit. That request is +1% maximum to hit, which I am translating as a power that increases the 95% cap to 96% cap. If I'm wrong, then I apologize to @Akisan for misreading the post.)

 

I could pick up tactics on any AT for a higher buff and I wouldn’t have to go through 40h + of tfs. 
 

at the end of the day, doing every single TF and SF is a major achievement and deserves and accolade and bragging rights. I want everyone I team with to be able to see that accolade. It should

be more powerful than all the other accolades as it is harder to obtain.

 

 

[SwitchFade]

11 minutes ago, MJABBAR88 said:

I could pick up tactics on any AT for a higher buff and I wouldn’t have to go through 40h + of tfs. 
 

at the end of the day, doing every single TF and SF is a major achievement and deserves and accolade and bragging rights. I want everyone I team with to be able to see that accolade. It should

be more powerful than all the other accolades as it is harder to obtain.

 

 

So, the 1337 Entitlement accolade?

 

I guess actually playing that content isn't a good use of time unless someone gives out a cookie 

[lemming]

11 minutes ago, MJABBAR88 said:

I could pick up tactics on any AT for a higher buff and I wouldn’t have to go through 40h + of tfs. 
 

at the end of the day, doing every single TF and SF is a major achievement and deserves and accolade and bragging rights. I want everyone I team with to be able to see that accolade. It should

be more powerful than all the other accolades as it is harder to obtain.

Constantly changing target though and they can just check your badge count

[Akisan]

14 minutes ago, MJABBAR88 said:

I could pick up tactics on any AT for a higher buff and I wouldn’t have to go through 40h + of tfs.

 

That's also a power pick, so not really comparable to a granted "free" power (2 really, since Tactics requires at least 1 other Leadership power), and usually will cost at least an endurance reduction (it's expensive, as a leadership toggle), if not several slots if you're putting a set in it.

 

17 minutes ago, MJABBAR88 said:

at the end of the day, doing every single TF and SF is a major achievement and deserves and accolade and bragging rights. I want everyone I team with to be able to see that accolade. It should

be more powerful than all the other accolades as it is harder to obtain.

 

So are "the really hard way" and "until the end of the world", but I don't think they should be worth extra power either - they're already really good for bragging rights, especially since I only rarely see them around the city.

[MJABBAR88]

5 minutes ago, SwitchFade said:

So, the 1337 Entitlement accolade?

 

I guess actually playing that content isn't a good use of time unless someone gives out a cookie 

Nope,  I’m an entitled millennial and need my accolades 

[Rudra]

21 minutes ago, MJABBAR88 said:

Nope,  I’m an entitled millennial and need my accolades 

At this point I'm more inclined to think you're trolling the forums.

[Luminara]

10 hours ago, MJABBAR88 said:

at the end of the day, doing every single TF and SF is a major achievement and deserves and accolade and bragging rights

 

Given that participation isn't mandatory, only presence (and only in the final mission), you're grossly over-inflating your estimation of this hypothetical badge's value.

[MJABBAR88]

Any update on this? I’ve almost completed all TFs and SFs. Can’t wait to get my accolade.

[Akisan]

50 minutes ago, MJABBAR88 said:

Any update on this? I’ve almost completed all TFs and SFs. Can’t wait to get my accolade.

 

Let's see... It appears to have died in sub-committee.  Fill out these forms (*hands @MJABBAR88 a couple inch thick packet*), and you'll be able to resubmit within about 6-8 months, sooner if HQ experiences a total solar eclipse.

 

Seriously though, we just get to chat back and forth about whether or not something may or may not be worth the dev's time.  They get to actually make that decision though, so you'll have to be patient.

 

 

Edited July 12, 2023 by Akisan
Spelling. Eventually, I will learn to check spelling before submitting.

[arcane]

His ideas may be non-starters but I sure like the way this guy talks.

[MJABBAR88]

On 7/9/2023 at 12:09 PM, Luminara said:

 

Given that participation isn't mandatory, only presence (and only in the final mission), you're grossly over-inflating your estimation of this hypothetical badge's value.

Such an interesting way to view things. When you look at the glass is it half empty or half full?

[srmalloy]

4 hours ago, MJABBAR88 said:

Any update on this? I’ve almost completed all TFs and SFs. Can’t wait to get my accolade.

If you're prepared to have your accolade revoked when another TF gets added to the game, certainly. Consider that TF Commander was the accolade you got for "doing all the TFs in the game", because those were all the TFs in the game. Any badge you create for doing "all" the TFs is either going to be a pretentiously-named badge that won't be accurate once the next major update is released, or it's going to be a moving target that will be earned and revoked as new TFs are released. If it has a static requirement, it will be a badge for doing all the TFs in the game at the time the badge was defined, and won't be current in six months to a year.

[TheZag]

A badge for every 5 TFs completed is appropriate in my book.  I wouldnt think there should be any accolade power attached though,  just another shiny for shiny collectors to collect.  Accolade powers,  especially ones that give passive bonuses,  need to be seriously considered for what it will do to player combat effectiveness.  Just the 2 bonuses of +5 endurance are absolutely massive since endurance recovery is a % of max endurance,  not a % of original endurance.  A few small bonuses can get out of hand very quickly.

 

[SwitchFade]

 "Badges? We don't need no stinking badges!"

 

I guess we're no longer heroes, we're politicians, we want accolades for hyperbole and disinformation.

[MJABBAR88]

Any update on this. Was disappointed not to see it in the next page.

[Rudra]

26 minutes ago, MJABBAR88 said:

Any update on this. Was disappointed not to see it in the next page.

Just because we post a suggestion on the forums does not mean it is going to be implemented. And even if it were going to be implemented, the devs won't just tell us.

[BrandX]

Why not go for a simple +5% to Health or simple but fancy +3% Resist?

[Greycat]

11 hours ago, MJABBAR88 said:

Any update on this. Was disappointed not to see it in the next page.

 

I'd say "prepare to be disappointed a lot" if you think putting something here means it's going in game.

[Cyclone Jack]

I think an Accolade for completing all TFs, SFs, Trials would be a pretty nice addition.  Give it a neat Title and maybe grant a one-time 10 Merit reward or something simple.  I wouldn't tie any powers (active or auto) to it, since you're already gaining these along the way.