ppm Procs Per Minute (PPM) Information Guide

[Number Six]

11 minutes ago, Bopper said:

I was unaware of this, so thank you. That's good info to have.

That only applies to powers with the kChain area type. That wasn't a thing prior to i25, so this does not apply to Electric Melee's Chain Induction or things like Ion Judgment, which use the old pseudopet method of chaining. The i25+ chaining doesn't require manually defining a bunch of different pets and can do things pseudopets can't like hit all the chain targets in a single combat tick. I think the only powers that currently use it are Sentinels' Refractor Beam and Chain Heal from the epic pool.

 

11 minutes ago, Bopper said:

I am completely unaware of this, but I think I saw some source code that made reference to it (I believe it was the code to ChanceModAccumulate, but I didn't understand the code at that time either). Could you elaborate on how this game mechanic works (or would work)? If there are no powers in the game that utilize it, I wonder why the code would be developed. But if you can think of any powers, please let us know.

It's another post-shutdown development. It was created as part of a big powers system revamp that introduced a bunch of new features intended to streamline power creation and make it easier for power designers to do cool and interesting things. However development of new powers stalled for a while after that, and the powers developers tended to use existing old-style powers as a sample template rather than experimenting with the new features.

 

ExecutePower is an effect that allows a power designer to directly call one power from another, allowing for more flexible targeting. The primary two use cases it's designed for are:

• Fulcrum Shift
  Instead of a targeted AoE that spawns a bunch of pesuedopets (some at the target and some at the caster) which all have autopowers that deliver an AoE damage buff, then immediately die...
  Fulcrum Shift could be redesigned as a targeted AoE that executes AoE damage buff powers on the target and the caster, making it less complex, less resource intensive on the server, and easier to design similar powers.
   
• Tanker Gauntlet
  Gauntlet is a massive hack. They made every single-target tanker attack power actually a spherical AoE, but with the damage attrib having a radius override of 0. This wreaks havoc with real numbers and the streakbreaker, and things like PPM all need special-case hacks for it. It also doesn't work with cones at all; only the targets directly hit by the cone get taunted because there's no way to make the hack work in that case.
  
  With ExecutePower, Gauntlet could be redesigned as a global boost granted by an inherent, that simply adds an ExecutePower to every tanker attack. The attack powers stay single-target, but when they connect they fire off a second power that does a spherical AoE taunt (which could even have a subtle visual fx if desired). For Cones and AoEs, this actually shows off the power of this technique, because every target hit by the cone would then have a spherical region around it affected by the taunt. That's the exact circumstance in which area factors would be combined, say if you had a perfect zinger proc slotted in a cone.

Neither of those were implemented, though there is a partially finished Gauntlet rework in the tree that might be resurrected at some point.

11 minutes ago, Bopper said:

 

How does this work for powers (pseudopets or toggles) that have ActivatePeriods that are far less than 10 seconds? Are the procs penalized by using the smaller ActivatePeriod, or does the formula treat the ActivatePeriod as 10 seconds for the proc? For example, let's say it is a 3 PPM power and the ActivatePeriod of the toggle is 2 seconds, is the probability to proc 3x2/(60xAreaFactor), or would it be 3x10/(60xAreaFactor)?

The PPM code uses the ActivatePeriod of the proc rather than the power. So it always uses 10 seconds for the calculation. That actually penalizes toggles that have an ActivatePeriod longer than 10 seconds, but I don't know if any actually exist that do.

 

[Number Six]

7 minutes ago, Redlynne said:

Would the source code be able to verify for us the (true?) PPM setting for each of the enhancements that can proc?

That's not in the source code. It's in the powers data, which is part of the client and can be decoded from the bin file, but I don't believe anyone has created a parser that can read the format that the i25+ powers.bin file uses.

[Number Six]

@BopperLooks like there are a couple powers that use ExecutePower after all.

 

Savage Leap from Savage Melee uses it to deliver the AoE Damage after teleporting to the target. This is actually a really good use of the tech - dropping a pseudopet is problematic due to the teleport, and getting it in the right place would be tricky to do without introducing a noticeable delay on the damage.

 

Since the top-level power affects kCharacter (a single target), it has an area factor of 1.0. The area factor combining does technically happen, but results in the same area factor that the AoE would have if it were a standalone power.

 

Feral Charge from Savage Assault works the same way.

[Bopper]

Thanks a million, Number Six. That is all really excellent info.

 

Some additional info Number Six passed along that is pertinent to the thread, the PPM formula should use the correct cast time of a snipe (if regular, use regular cast; if quick, use quick cast).

 

Also, there is no funny business with the purple procs, it is in fact 4.5 PPM (I did an 800 sample test tonight that also confirmed this).

Edited August 2, 2019 by Bopper

[_NOPE_]

7 hours ago, Number Six said:

That's not in the source code. It's in the powers data, which is part of the client and can be decoded from the bin file, but I don't believe anyone has created a parser that can read the format that the i25+ powers.bin file uses.

 

6 hours ago, Bopper said:

Thanks a million, Number Six. That is all really excellent info.

 

Some additional info Number Six passed along that is pertinent to the thread, the PPM formula should use the correct cast time of a snipe (if regular, use regular cast; if quick, use quick cast).

 

Also, there is no funny business with the purple procs, it is in fact 4.5 PPM (I did an 800 sample test tonight that also confirmed this).

Unless this release was full of s***, I think you can find the information at OuroDev in the magnet links page, in a file named "Paragon Data Directory Dump", or Faptastic.7z. At least that's where I found what looks like the information in an Excel sheet in the Defs\powers\src directory in a file just called Boosts.xls, which might be the powers data that @Number Six is referencing, in the AdditionalPowerAttribs field that appears to confirm a 4.5 ProcPerMinute, at least for this power:

 

I seem to recall vaguely Castle at one point mentioning on the forums that he didn't code, that instead he used Excel sheets. This seems to suggest that these are in fact what Castle used to "make" the power balancing act happen, as that folder is FILLED with different spreadsheets, and if you look at the code of the .powers files that you can find in the Defs\powers\directory, the very first line of each references a tool named "XLStoPowerDef":

 

That is, at least, unless that release was all full of s***, as I said... regardless, I can't find the tool itself in that release, but if I had more Time™, I'm sure I could recreate it, as I did with my Powers Checker Parser before I realized that directory existed tonight... 😮

 

Edited August 2, 2019 by The Philotic Knight

[SmalltalkJava]

On 7/27/2019 at 11:40 PM, Redlynne said:

Bopper ... I have a curiosity that you might be able to satisfy ... AND ... which would seem to be pertinent to some of your other research on this topic since this might make for a useful test case.

 

Behold ... ENFLAME ... from the Sorcery Pool.

Common Enhancement types accepted: Accuracy, Damage, Endurance Reduction, Range, Recharge Reduction

Set types accepted: Target AoE, Universal Damage

 

Procs that can be slotted:

Positron's chance for Energy damage

Ragnarok chance for Knockdown

Javelin Volley chance for Lethal damage

Annihilation chance for Resistance debuff

Frozen Blast chance for Immobilize

Overwhelming Force chance for Knockdown plus Knockback to Knockdown

Personal note: it would seem to me that slotting both the Ragnarok AND Overwhelming Force procs together in this power would be an example of unnecessary redundancy.

 

This power seems to have all the markers you'd expect from a "toggle that isn't actually a toggle" in that it instead cues up a collection of successively time delayed clicks that spawn pseudo-pet flame patches in the location that the $Target happens to be at at the time (so as to "leave a trail" of them (at 88 mph?)).

 

 

Now, in the context of this thread about PPM on Set IOs, I have to wonder how the PPM would "work" for Enflame, and if there's a particularly "good fit" for the power from any of the procs that can be slotted into it ... particularly given the fact that the 5s duration on the 3s delays means that you can potentially have multi-stack chances for procs going on ... or it could be a "check once, use repeatedly" kind of multiplier situation, due to how the power is coded to function under the hood (resolve first, animate after).  Also, that long recharge time of 90 seconds for the base power, coupled with a 5+15=20 second overall duration for the effects which can be repositioned after casting (!) would seem to me to be something of a prime research opportunity for PPM monsterification of an otherwise somewhat lackluster power.

 

For example, the chance for Immobilize in a "burn patches" power would seem to make for a pretty decent starting point ... particularly if coupled with chance for a Resistance Debuff ... particularly if the chance of getting those procs on the initial casting is high (approaching 90%?) and thereby helping to maximize the damage throughput onto the $Target(s) affected by the Enflame patches.  And that's before tossing a chance for Energy and/or Lethal damage into the mix (let alone a chance for Knockdown).

 

 

 

Your thought(s) on the potential for clever use of game mechanics ...?

 

So if i take Enflame and slot it for procs.   Does it need any Accuracy IOs?      As a /kin MM, would i put in all procs?    I may have missed some posts regarding enflame but I'd appreciate some suggestions on what to slot in there regarding number of procs and if any supporting io's are needed like accuracy.

 

[Redlynne]

Tactics    
Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - To Hit Buff
Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - To Hit Buff/Recharge
Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - To Hit Buff/Recharge/Endurance
Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Recharge/Endurance
Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - To Hit Buff/Endurance
Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Chance for Build Up

 

Set Bonuses: Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control
(Tactics)
7.5% SpeedJumping, 7.5% JumpHeight, 7.5% SpeedFlying, 7.5% SpeedRunning
19.08 HP (1.88%) HitPoints
2.5% (0.04 End/sec) Recovery
2.5% DamageBuff(All)
2.5% Defense(Melee), 1.25% Defense(Lethal), 1.25% Defense(Smashing), 2.5% Defense(Ranged), 1.25% Defense(Energy), 1.25% Defense(Negative), 2.5% Defense(AoE), 1.25% Defense(Fire), 1.25% Defense(Cold)

 

Using Level 27+21 Proc IOs:
Endurance Discount: 58.98%
Recharge Time: 58.98%
ToHit: 52.89%

 

Using Level 50+21 Proc IOs:
Endurance Discount: 73.78% (Pre-ED: 74.20%)
Recharge Time:  73.78% (Pre-ED: 74.20%)
ToHit: 57.52% (Pre-ED: 70.13%)

 

Prob = PPM x ActivatePeriod / (60 x AreaMod)
AreaMod = 1 + Radius x (11 x Arc + 540) / 40,000

 

Gaussians proc PPM = 1
Minimum probability is confirmed at 5% + PPM x 1.5% = 6.5%
Radius: 60
Activation period: 2s for Tactics, but the activation period used in a toggle is set to 10s
Max Targets: 255

 

PPM * ActivatePeriod / (60 * (1 + Radius * (11 * Arc + 540) / 40000))
1 * 10 / (60 * (1 + 60 * (11 * 360 + 540) / 40000))
= 2.15% (!)

 

Due to minimum proc chance clamping, the chance to proc Gaussian's in Tactics is 6.5% every 10 seconds.

With 6 chances to proc every minute this results in a 1 - (1 - 0.065)^6 = 33.18% chance to proc (at least) once per minute.

 

Congratulations!
By putting a 1 PPM proc into Tactics you've turned it into what amounts to a 1 PP3M …!!

 

This then explains why a PPM governed Tactics is kind of terrible(!) … for a soloist.

I'm reasonably sure that when Gaussian's procs, it only buffs the caster and doesn't proc "for" every Ally within the radius.

However, this brings up the intriguing prospect that Gaussian's proc might receive 1 proc chance per Ally within 60 ft of the caster, which then benefits the caster if it does proc (limit 1 proc per 10 seconds, so it doesn't stack).  In that case you're looking at the following matrix of possibilities …

 

Team-1: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^1 = 06.5% chance to proc every 10 seconds
Team-2: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^2 = 12.5% chance to proc every 10 seconds
Team-3: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^3 = 18.2% chance to proc every 10 seconds
Team-4: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^4 = 23.5% chance to proc every 10 seconds
Team-5: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^5 = 28.5% chance to proc every 10 seconds
Team-6: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^6 = 33.1% chance to proc every 10 seconds
Team-7: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^7 = 37.5% chance to proc every 10 seconds
Team-8: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^8 = 41.5% chance to proc every 10 seconds

 

League-16: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^16 = 65.8% chance to proc every 10 seconds
League-24: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^24 = 80.0% chance to proc every 10 seconds
League-32: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^32 = 88.3% chance to proc every 10 seconds
League-34: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^34 = 89.8% chance to proc every 10 seconds

League-35: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^35 = 90.0% (90.4%) chance to proc every 10 seconds

 

Needless to say, you won't see this kind of performance profile while trying to solo a Pylon for testing purposes … provided this assumption about how multiple Allies receiving the Tactics buff will increase the quantity of proc chances every 10 seconds when the proc is "allowed" to check for a successful proc.  Also, this is assuming that Gaussian's is coded to proc off Allies the same way that Force Feedback is coded to proc off Enemies (it may not be).

 

Tested?
No … not yet.  This is pure theorycrafting, but with predictions like these ought to be relatively easy to test.  Part of this may depend on how Tactics is coded to handle procs like Gaussian's (since there might be extra "nerfing" going on in there we don't know about).

Edited August 3, 2019 by Redlynne

[Bopper]

17 minutes ago, Redlynne said:

Tested?
No … not yet.  This is pure theorycrafting, but with predictions like these ought to be relatively easy to test.  Part of this may depend on how Tactics is coded to handle procs like Gaussian's (since there might be extra "nerfing" going on in there we don't know about).

You had me excited for a minute, I thought you had tested it too. If you do, please post your findings. It would be interesting to find out how the Gaussian Proc works with teammates (well technically, I guess any friendly in your bubble). I suppose we could find a friendly who will stand close by and see if they ever get hit with a random build up. If so, that would be cool to know. However, I suspect the proc is self-only, and I would suspect the radius of Tactics would not matter. You're right, easy enough to test. Would be good to find out. 

 

22 minutes ago, Redlynne said:

Activation period: 2s for Tactics, but the activation period used in a toggle is set to 10s

Is this the case for all toggles? I assumed the 10 second period only applied to damage procs. That might be worth testing too, to see if the proc rolls only happen every 10 seconds or 2 seconds.

[Redlynne]

2 minutes ago, Bopper said:

You're right, easy enough to test.

Hmm.

According to City of Data the buff effect only counts Teammates ... so it might not be as easy as just going to Atlas Park and using the cluster around Ms Liberty for "testing purposes" without them knowing/noticing.

 

Conversely, standing around a TF NPC waiting to fill up a team ought to provide an almost ideal opportunity to test this, where you've got 2-7 people idling within range of your Tactics Aura for "a while" ...

[Unknown Magi]

Did some initial testing of the Tactics discussion this morning. 

 

Running Tactics with 117.28% total slotted recharge and the Build-up piece, alone

Calculated Chance to Proc: 3.64%

 

Results:

See spreadsheet below, tab "Tactics Testing", so I don't have to keep updating this post with each test run.

 

This is interesting, since the expected procs per minute (based on clamped values) in Redlynne's post above was only .33

 

If we plug in the .5 PPM seen and solve for proc chance, I was seeing ~10.91% chance to proc.  Very curious.

 

Doing more testing, will update.

 

Edit: 

In case someone wants to verify my math, I'm using a modified version of the previous PPM Formula sheet, which now factors in Area.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VqzWk_KQkVHCZmEVVY2xa-JwAYWSIZ-PYKTql96X4Ic/edit?usp=sharing

 

Edit 2:

Moved test result listings to linked spreadsheet.  Observations so far:

Test 1 showed an approximate proc rate of 0.5/minute, far above expectations.

Test 2, removed all recharge from power.  Approximate proc rate of 0.34/minute, which matches expectations

Unsure if sample size too small, or odd behavior discovered.  Testing ongoing.

Also enabled commenting on Spreadsheet link.  May need to refresh for commenting.

Edited August 4, 2019 by Unknown Magi

[Bopper]

1 hour ago, Unknown Magi said:

In case someone wants to verify my math, I'm using a modified version of the previous PPM Formula sheet, which now factors in Area.

You are unfortunately using the wrong formula. Tactics is a toggle so the formula should be:

Probability = PPM x ActivatePeriod / (60 x AreaFactor)

 

Tactics has an Activation Period of 2 seconds (note, ActivatePeriod is not the same as ActivateTime. It is the time between ticks/pulses from the aura).

Tactics also has a radius of 60 feet.

Finally, I'm not sure if Build Up proc would act more as a self only boost or if it could go out to any friendly in your bubble. So I'm not sure of the mechanics involved here.

I also don't know if the proc is checking on every ActivatePeriod (pulse) of if its on every 10 seconds (which other auras, specifically damage auras, would do).

 

I'm looking at your numbers now and in 3 tests, you have covered 93 minutes but have only seen 41 procs. That's troubling, because auras should line up with the PPM (in this case, we should see 1 per minute). This makes me think the radius of tactics is playing a part in the numbers. If that is the case, the AreaFactor = 1 + 0.75x0.15 x 60 = 7.75. So for a test consisting of just monitoring yourself, the PPM would be 0.129.... unless we are hitting the minimum probability to proc (which I think we are).

 

The minimum probability to proc is PPM x 1.5% + 5%. So in this case, ours is 6.5%. If we are using an ActivatePeriod of 2 seconds, we would have 30 opportunities per minute. The probability of at least one proc within one minute would be 1 - (1 - 0.065)^30 = 86.7%. We are not seeing that in the slightest. So, what if the ActivatePeriod being used is 10 seconds? 

Prob = PPM x 10 / (60x7.75) = 2.15%... which is below the minimum, so we use 6.5% again. With only 6 opportunities for each minute, the probability of at least one proc is: 1 - (1 - 0.065)^6 = 33.2%.

 

That last result seems to line up more with your testing, so let's assume that is the correct case. That means in your 561 activations (from ~93 minutes of testing) you should expect to see 561 x 0.065 = 36.5 procs. You saw 41. That is pretty close, and I am not sure how accurate your number of activations were, but I'm guessing you're close. So good job, I think you helped solve a mystery with Tactics (and likely other auras?). It seems to use a 10 second period for its calculations as opposed to its 2 second activate period, and it seems to use the large radius in its calculations...which makes me think any friendly in your radius would have a chance at a Build Up proc.

 

Edit: It's worth examining the impact the impact the Gaussian Proc could have in an 8 person team. That would be 48 opportunities per minute, with an expectation of ~3 procs per minute. Still not world breaking, but it's something.

Edited August 4, 2019 by Bopper

[Unknown Magi]

The derived formulas in the spreadsheet should all have clamping built in to cover the 6.5% chance floor.  I believe we already knew the 10 second Activation Period pseudo-cooldown based on Number Six's previous sharing.  

 

Based on that, we should see *roughly* 33% PPM.  However, the data very much is not supporting that expectation.  Test 2 supported it almost exactly, but tests 1 and 3 fell outside expected ranges by 10-15%.  The small sample size may be skewing my results, so I'm running more testing right now.  

 

Once this oddity is resolved, I'm testing this on an MM so I can spawn pets in order to simulate multiple target testing for the latter half of the Tactics question.

Edited August 4, 2019 by Unknown Magi

[Bopper]

4 minutes ago, Unknown Magi said:

The derived formulas in the spreadsheet should all have clamping built in to cover the 6.5% chance floor.  I believe we already knew the 10 second Activation Period pseudo-cooldown based on Number Six's previous sharing.  

 

Based on that, we should see *roughly* 33% PPM.  However, the data very much is not supporting that expectation.  Test 2 supported it almost exactly, but tests 1 and 3 fell outside expected ranges by 10-15%.  The small sample size may be skewing my results, so I'm running more testing right now.  

 

Once this oddity is resolved, I'm testing this on an MM so I can spawn pets in order to simulate multiple target testing for the latter half of the Tactics question.

Definitely could be a sample size situation. I haven't done any binomial distribution analysis to try to figure out the variance of data that we might see, but I can do that if needed. 

[SmalltalkJava]

Hmm.  If that tactics Gaussian build up proc hits other players.  I wonder if that proc would hit Mastermind pets and other pets also. 

[Unknown Magi]

So, quick updates:

 

-After a fourth test, my statistical average is within 5% of the expected 33% so I'm chalking that up to sample size issues.  Tactics does indeed factor in radius and therefore have a crappy proc rate for Gaussian.

 

EXCEPT!!!!!!!!

 

New test:

Mastermind, all 6 pets deployed

Gaussian in Tactics (same slotting as before)

 

Results:

this thing won't.  Stop.  Proccing.  I'm still building the sample set, but during test 1 I'm already seeing a proc rate of 2-2.5 PPM.  Initial hypothesis is that Tactics checks Gaussian once per 10 seconds *per target you are buffing*.  No buildups have been observed on pets thus far, which leads me to believe the procs cannot be "granted", but this is still huge; Extrapolating these proc rates to a full group (let alone with with MMs or other buffable pets in the aura), I am going to have to start considering Tactics mandatory on all my group damage dealer builds if the full data continues to support this.

[Bopper]

7 minutes ago, Unknown Magi said:

Results:

this thing won't.  Stop.  Proccing.  I'm still building the sample set, but during test 1 I'm already seeing a proc rate of 2-2.5 PPM.  Initial hypothesis is that Tactics checks Gaussian once per 10 seconds *per target you are buffing*.  No buildups have been observed on pets thus far, which leads me to believe the procs cannot be "granted", but this is still huge; Extrapolating these proc rates to a full group (let alone with with MMs or other buffable pets in the aura), I am going to have to start considering Tactics mandatory on all my group damage dealer builds if the full data continues to support this.

So this is very interesting. It does fall in line with my calculations a few posts prior, where I figured a team of 8 would lead to 3 PPM. What is especially interesting is that the procs that are going off on your pets is going back to you as a buff (not sure if that also buffs your pets by extension, which makes this a very nice feature for MMs). The last test I'd like to see is how this does without pets. Can you go to Atlas Park with Tactics on and just stand near Ms Liberty? I don't think you'll need anyone on your team, so what I hope to see is you seeing a large proc rate with all the Heros in your area.

[Unknown Magi]

Leadership only buffs members of your team (including pets) IIRC.  I tested standing next to Ms. Lib on Justin Server, with a few people around, and observed no discernible difference in proc rate.  

 

I monitored pet combat attributes during testing, and saw no jumps in Tohit or Damage throughout, including during procs, leading me to believe that the bonus only applies to the original holder of tactics.

 

Currently working on two slightly different tests.  Please hold.

[Unknown Magi]

So, confirmed at this point, Tactics has a 6.5% per 10 seconds to proc Gaussian, but this is checked for each person receiving your buff.  

 

And now, because who can resist a good cheese plate, I present the following:

 

1. Thugs - Enforcers have Tactics.  They can slot Gaussian, and the procs apply to each Enforcer (each has their own proc check individually, both *can* proc at once.  At one point, a double proc was observed, although this may be just been a graphical glitch as I could not reproduce it.

2. Mastermind Pets only check Enhancements at summon time.  If you had a ton of influence and nothing better to do with it, you could carry some Enhancement Unslotters, summon your Enforcers, then steal their Gaussian and put it in your Tactics.  This results in you and both enforcers each getting procs at the full rate.  Tested and confirmed.  Note that this would be a minor headache to burn two unslotters shuffling your Gaussian every time you summon them, so YMMV.

3. Thugs - Gang War.  These guys receive Tactics buffs from both you and Enforcers, which means summoning a gang war *skyrockets* your proc rate by adding a whole team's worth of extra targets to your aura (and/or your enforcers' aura).  Observed proc rate for solo Thugs MM with all pets and 1 active gang war was 4-5 PPM for self, and ~3PPM per enforcer (10 self procs and 13 total enforcer procs in 13 activations).  

 

While observation 2 is a hassle to play with, Observations 1 and 3 are...insane.  The enforcers are only Tier 2 pets, but have multiple AoE attacks with which to take advantage of buildups.  Total effect would require extensive DPS testing outside the scope of this test, and is left as an exercise for the MM forums.

Edit:  Crossposted these findings to the MM forums.  Let the games begin.

Edited August 4, 2019 by Unknown Magi

[Maxzero]

7 minutes ago, Unknown Magi said:

So, confirmed at this point, Tactics has a 6.5% per 10 seconds to proc Gaussian, but this is checked for each person receiving your buff.  

 

And now, because who can resist a good cheese plate, I present the following:

 

1. Thugs - Enforcers have Tactics.  They can slot Gaussian, and the procs apply to each Enforcer (each has their own proc check individually, both *can* proc at once.  At one point, a double proc was observed, although this may be just been a graphical glitch as I could not reproduce it.

2. Mastermind Pets only check Enhancements at summon time.  If you had a ton of influence and nothing better to do with it, you could carry some Enhancement Unslotters, summon your Enforcers, then steal their Gaussian and put it in your Tactics.  This results in you and both enforcers each getting procs at the full rate.  Tested and confirmed.  Note that this would be a minor headache to burn two unslotters shuffling your Gaussian every time you summon them, so YMMV.

3. Thugs - Gang War.  These guys receive Tactics buffs from both you and Enforcers, which means summoning a gang war *skyrockets* your proc rate by adding a whole team's worth of extra targets to your aura (and/or your enforcers' aura).  Observed proc rate for solo Thugs MM with all pets and 1 active gang war was 4-5 PPM for self, and ~3PPM per enforcer (10 self procs and 13 total enforcer procs in 13 activations).  

 

While observation 2 is a hassle to play with, Observations 1 and 3 are...insane.  The enforcers are only Tier 2 pets, but have multiple AoE attacks with which to take advantage of buildups.  Total effect would require extensive DPS testing outside the scope of this test, and is left as an exercise for the MM forums.

 

Awesome.

 

Now I just need to find a way to fit in Accuracy/Damage, Defence and 4 procs in my Enforcers.

 

Yeah I am not having much luck.

[Bopper]

7 minutes ago, Unknown Magi said:

So, confirmed at this point, Tactics has a 6.5% per 10 seconds to proc Gaussian, but this is checked for each person receiving your buff.  

 

And now, because who can resist a good cheese plate, I present the following:

 

1. Thugs - Enforcers have Tactics.  They can slot Gaussian, and the procs apply to each Enforcer (each has their own proc check individually, both *can* proc at once.  At one point, a double proc was observed, although this may be just been a graphical glitch as I could not reproduce it.

2. Mastermind Pets only check Enhancements at summon time.  If you had a ton of influence and nothing better to do with it, you could carry some Enhancement Unslotters, summon your Enforcers, then steal their Gaussian and put it in your Tactics.  This results in you and both enforcers each getting procs at the full rate.  Tested and confirmed.  Note that this would be a minor headache to burn two unslotters shuffling your Gaussian every time you summon them, so YMMV.

3. Thugs - Gang War.  These guys receive Tactics buffs from both you and Enforcers, which means summoning a gang war *skyrockets* your proc rate by adding a whole team's worth of extra targets to your aura (and/or your enforcers' aura).  Observed proc rate for solo Thugs MM with all pets and 1 active gang war was 4-5 PPM for self, and ~3PPM per enforcer (10 self procs and 13 total enforcer procs in 13 activations).  

 

While observation 2 is a hassle to play with, Observations 1 and 3 are...insane.  The enforcers are only Tier 2 pets, but have multiple AoE attacks with which to take advantage of buildups.  Total effect would require extensive DPS testing outside the scope of this test, and is left as an exercise for the MM forums.

Very cool findings, great job. That 3rd bullet will surely be intriguing for Thug MMs. Can you clarify how you slotted the unique Gaussian Proc for this bullet? Did you slot it in your Enforcers, then unslot and put it back into your tactics? Or did you just have it slotted in your tactics? Or just Enforcers? I am trying to wrap my head around you getting 4-5 PPM and your Enforcers getting 3 PPM at the same time.

 

For the 1st bullet, when you slot the Gaussian into the Enforcer, do the Build Up show up on only the Enforcers, or you...or both?

[Unknown Magi]

Step 1. Put Gaussian in Enforcers

Step 2. Summon and upgrade Enforcers

Step 3. Unslot Gaussian from Enforcers, place in Tactics

Step 4. Turn on Tactics

Step 5. Profit

Edited August 4, 2019 by Unknown Magi

[Bopper]

12 minutes ago, Unknown Magi said:

Step 1. Put Gaussian in Enforcers

Step 2. Summon and upgrade Enforcers

Step 3. Unslot Gaussian from Enforcers, place in Tactics

Step 4. Turn on Tactics

Step 5. Profit

For those that won't want to use unslotters, what would be the optimal placement of Gaussian Proc? Self, or Enforcers? It still wasn't clear if you (self) was getting the Build Up benefits, or if it was just the Enforcers...or both.

 

On a complete side note, this is exactly why I started this thread. I hoped testers would dig into the PPM mechanics and discover things, and you just did that. Thank you for the service and please post any other findings you may come across in the future.

[Unknown Magi]

If the enforcers have the Gaussian, the proc applies to them.  They get the +dmg and +tohit.  This is checked individually for each Enforcer so at any given time either one of them may get it, or both.  I'm starting up some other tests right now, so I'll post anything interesting I find.  Huzzah theorycrafting!

 

As for which is better, probably the Enforcers.  As an MM, your personal damage is negligible.  For builds that are somehow MM-personal-damage-centric, putting it on yourself could be advantageous, but I'm not aware of any such builds.

 

For bonus points on "Adventures of MM Procland", Thugs have Empty Clips from DP in-set.  With their especially low damage coefficient, they are very well-suited to slotting it up as a proc monster in order to contribute at least a little actual damage to fights (still give Gaussian to your pets, since you're slotting this for procs rather than base damage).

Edited August 4, 2019 by Unknown Magi

[Maxzero]

3 minutes ago, Bopper said:

For those that won't want to use unslotters, what would be the optimal placement of Gaussian Proc? Self, or Enforcers? It still wasn't clear if you (self) was getting the Build Up benefits, or if it was just the Enforcers...or both.

 

On a complete side note, this is exactly why I started this thread. I hoped testers would dig into the PPM mechanics and discover things, and you just did that. Thank you for the service and please post any other findings you may come across in the future.

 

Depends.

 

For Storm MMs it's probably better in the MM. For all other cases it would be better in the Enforcers. Of course Enforcer slotting is already extremely hard. Maybe Defence buff secondaries (FF/Traps/Time) may be the only viable choice for Enforcer slotting (they can make up for the missing defence slotting).

[Unknown Magi]

So I've been doing a smattering of other testing since the find earlier.  I don't have huge data samples for any particular thing yet, but I wanted to share some early observations that I would appreciate some help verifying.  These can be found on my spreadsheet, on the Damage Aura Tab

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VqzWk_KQkVHCZmEVVY2xa-JwAYWSIZ-PYKTql96X4Ic/edit?usp=sharing

 

Observations:

• Standard damage auras seem to have a proc rate of 1.3-1.7 per minute for standard 3.5PPM procs, per target in aura, assuming constant exposure.  Tested with Blazing Aura.
  • My highest test was Blazing Aura (4 procs counting Armageddon) + Quills (3 procs), which achieved 40-42.6 combined PPM against 3 target.  I'm pondering trying to build more elaborate testing for higher mob counts  and factoring in movement to look at overall viability on this.
  • My numbers were a bit wobbly as I increased auras, procs, and targets.  Would appreciate some additional data gathering if anyone has the time and desire
• Burn patch displayed some impressive numbers.  With 3 3.5 PPMs slotted, it displayed 16.8-18.5 Procs Per Activation against 3 targets!
  • Would like to see this number compared against larger mobs, and with some global recharge to achieve Burn stacking.  Will try to find some time to do so soon, but if anyone can beat me to it then many thanks to you.