Yomo Kimyata

So far, my most masochistic is my TW/Stone Armor brute. No, I'm not going to teleport. I'll get there ... eventually ...

Was he bitten by a radioactive bat?

Sakai got robbed!

I agree 100% and am so incredibly puzzled. I don't understand why people are losing their shit over this. It's like Apple refusing to make and sell any new $800 iPhones because one tiny component's cost went from 1/100 of a cent to 1/10 of a cent. People REALLY hate change, is my takeaway so far.

Thanks for biting the bullet on this one. This reinforces what I already knew: there are no quality bids. There is so much inf in the system that you either buy what you want right now at whatever price, or you lowball your bids and make a profit if you want to trade out of it. sub 5mm ATOs on average sounds really low to me, but I mostly got out of that market as a seller a while ago.

I don't even do that. I buy at $2, witness your bids at $12, and offer at $12.05... Or possibly then I'll put in bids at $12.01. The point being in order for flipping to work, there is a race towards the middle. Bids creep higher, offers creep lower. However, the real way to make inf is to rely on human nature. In your example, the person who is paying $20 is only doing so because it's a round number. No one is drawing a line in the sand and saying yellow salvage is worth x and not one inf more. Those bands have been set by the devs.

The one thing I've learned from ATOs and Winter-Os: never ever ever post more than 9 at a time.

Are your bids still up? I'm sure I could track down a few hundred of these.

Very well spoken, and great analysis. i would like to point out that a difference in our game v. your example is that in game, there is either directly or indirectly an infinite amount of goods. Want yellow salvage? You can play or farm for drops, exchange AE tickets. Too much work? There are 10mm of them for sale. Too expensive? Then you’re in a pickle and somethings got to give. Want LOTG 7.5%? Plenty on the market. Too expensive? Buy a Serendipity and convert. Still too expensive? Buy or craft any lvl 25+ enhancement and convert. Too much work? Another pickle. This game has limitless supply. Except maybe Hammy is.

Stop it...

A few months ago I bought many thousand rare salvage over a few weeks time (almost all at 5 inf higher than the previous low bidder) and dumped them on the market. Lost many billions, but got prices down to 100k and 10,000 bids. At that point I stopped. Prices came back up.

The thing I've noticed is that the bidding handles are different, which implies to me that it's a number of people rather than one. Example: my "fist" is 5. I tend to buy things at levels like 15,005, or 4,005,000. There are definitely block bids, but some of them have different fists.

Ok, AH lesson number one. You place bids and offers at different levels. If PK bids x100 at 1mm, and you bid x1 at 1,000,001, you don't have a 1% chance of getting the next item placed for sale at that price or lower. You have 100% chance. And if 100 offers come in after that, all less than 1mm, that's when he gets filled. There is no random factor in buying or selling unless more than one person is either buying or selling at the exact same price. I'm not sure if trades are assigned then based on FIFO, or random allocation, or some other factor.

I'm going to offer one more time to explain how the AH works. I think PM might be a better venue, but I'll be happy to post a really simple primer on the forums if that's better for you. You clearly don't understand how bidding and offering works. As to your example, I'm not buying toilet paper at $10 a package and selling it at $40. I'm buying tp at $1 a package because somebody wanted to dump it on the market and didn't know or care that the market price was higher, and I'm selling it at $8 a package, which is still below market price. Please don't call me names. Devs don't like that and I'm not too fond of it either.

Dude, you really don't understand how the AH works, do you? Drop me a PM and I'll put together a basic primer for you.

I think you are looking for ghosts here, to be honest. I'm buying Unbreakable Guards at prices well below the going rate and selling them also at below the going rate. There is a big difference between providing liquidity and manipulating markets, and as PK has noted, it's virtually impossible to manipulate markets in HC due to converters, seeding, and fungibility.

Oh no, I flip in the true sense of the word. Converters make things and dump them on the market at whatever price they can get. Buyers want things and pay whatever they want. Example: I put in bids for large amounts of Unbreakable Guards for under 1mm. Sooner or later I buy a large number of them. Presumably, the sellers could post at a higher number. I repost them at over 4mm. Sooner or later I sell them. Presumably, the buyers could bid at a lower number. Am I driving the market up or down? Don't be silly. I'm buying things that people want to sell, and I'm selling things that people want to buy. Don't get me wrong, I convert plenty too, but buying underpriced assets and selling them for fair market value is how I've made a lot of my imaginary money.

And yet I have a hundred of them sitting in inventory.

No farmer ever got a brute ATO to drop. Not one.

I do want to say that as a long-time flipper, first-time caller, I'm a little hurt by this. I can't speak for WoW, but flippers are the unheralded saviors of a player-based economy. You can buy a near infinite amount of rare salvage at 1mm and you can sell an infinite amount at 5k. But who is enabling you to buy it cheaper or sell it for a better price? Flippers. You have too many Brute ATOs and you want to make room in your inventory so you want to sell them right away. And ten minutes later you realize that you need one for your new alt. Who is providing you liquidity and supply? Flippers. If everything in this game were bought and sold at fixed prices in infinite numbers (and there are plenty of people who want that, I'm not one though!), then there would be no role for flippers and no point in flipping. In a player-based economy though, they are providing bids and offers that retail doesn't want to have to deal with.

Starting new post after the one on General got derailed. Your thoughts?

I, for one, don't think we need new ATO sets. They currently provide so much value, at low cost. I get that everyone wants more and to solo Hami, but I really hope the devs don't provide it.

BRING BACK PRESTIGE!!! But keep bases free. Then you can rank members by how much prestige they have generated by burning their ill-gotten goods.

Sounds familiar! My character was named Potlatch.

All seven! Obsidian Wrath -- SS/WP brute Obsidian Pride -- Mind/Psionic Assault dominator Obsidian Sloth -- TW/Stone Armor brute Obsidian Envy -- Beam Rifle/Poison corruptor Obsidian Gluttony -- Electric/Kinetic corruptor Obsidian Lust -- Archery/Pain corruptor Obsidian Greed -- Gravity/Energy dominator Some of them are a lot more fun to play than others...