Infinitum

yeah tankers dont sneak around anyway, i would agree with this.

good combo, are you looking for an endgame build?

well i honestly think you are right there - but i dont think there is a chance in hell it will sell that way. especially with the current perception of EA being OP - so if its buffed to tanker modifiers naturally it will become more OP based on that trend. Now i have played all EA on Scrapper Stalker and Brute and i dont think its any more OP than anything else top tier - in fact EA can get into trouble you have to work out of occassionally - lot of clicking to do that - that you arent attacking. Thats why my point to port the brute numbers to tanker - while allowing the HP increase and ATO to further bolster the resistance numbers - I still stand by that - because honestly it would be enough to make an EA tanker thrive under any circumstance. I would not like to see EA modified down just to port it to tankers - if thats the case just leave it be. Furthermore and again it really doesnt need the tanker modifiers to be any better. It would be fine as it is on Brute Scrapper or Stalker ported to tankers that way.

Again - looking at it the wrong way - think outside the box - tankers get a higher HP pool - tweak EA a little from the brute version - port it to tankers - that combined with the tanker ATO would be more than sufficient to make it viable for tankers without making it overpowered. But if the other three are nerfed just to make it work on tankers then it will no longer be viable on those ATs - in fact it would be pretty weak.

What character are you wanting to make?

Thats old thinking, you need to get past that. And the last two posts you made are completely missing the points I made - on purpose or not doesnt matter. At this point in going leave it here.

You are also missing 90% of the correlations I'm making, the acknowledgement of the tests ive ran with ICE that firmly places it in the top 5 in survivability - and none of it makes your point because EA actually has holes thats tricky to overcome - Ice doesn't. Newer T9s are actually useful btw they arent like unstoppable and T9s from that day.

When EA is identical across the board already between brutes scrappers and stalkers - yeah.

What? It's a really good power, one of the good T9s, sorry but no that doesn't support your points. No it won't, I thought so at first also, but Ice is good enough to stand on its on merits - there's nothing I've found yet to stress it that it can't overcome. Have you even ever played Ice? Either way - my point is with EA - just port the Brute version to tankers with the HP scaling increase and the ATO potential - Maybe a few other minor tweaks - it will perform fine then. EA is so similar at the end between Stalker, Scrapper, and Brute it would be fine to do that.

Scrapper and Stalker also have Icy Bastion - which is light years better than Hibernate - with really good recharge and agility and ageless you can have it back in roughly 60-70 seconds. With 30 seconds of runtime. Brute seems to get the worse of both EA and Ice now that i think about it. But i stand by my premise that there is precedent for a port to tankers based on how Ice armor performs - and extrapolating EA from the other three ATs - because its so similar in function.

No, it really doesn't - in my portfolio of tanker builds it actually surpasses SR in the tests I threw at it. You also have to take into account the vastly higher toxic psi, fire, and cold resistances - that if applied the tanker ATO wouldn't make up the gap even if the brute version had it. Ice also has slightly higher energy defense and drastically higher negative energy defense. So if you ported Brute EA over to tankers, even with minor changes ice would still have those advantages. But if you look - scrapper and stalker are similar to brute numbers on EA - that's just how the sets like this work - tanker has an advantage with resistance due to the ATO but thats about it - also being a tanker it should have that advantage IMO. My point is if you can make EA across the board essentially equal across 3 ATs - a very similar set in function like Ice Armor - doesnt matter that its close to the brute version of EA - because the tanker version of EA if it existed would be virtually identical to the brute version (just like the scrapper and stalker versions are roughly equal to the brute version) aside from having the tanker ATO and higher base HP. IMO toughness scale its Tanker Brute Scrapper Stalker With tanker and brute being tier 1 and fairly close together and scrapper stalker being tier 2. The main divider is the HP pool which matters a great deal when getting smacked by an AV like bobcat. Neither ice nor EA Will cap resistance but the trick is to balance either set on any AT by building where its strengths are closing the gaps in any holes it may have - that is what makes it close across all 3 ATs and even what makes brute EA and tanker Ice close - because thats where the balance point for building them is.

That sounds like more of an issue with Brute SR. But those are two completely different sets - mainly positional defense vs hybrid (typed defense and resistance) ice and EA are similar enough and there is precedent with Brute vs Scrapper Vs stalker all being in the same zipcode to extrapolate how tanker EA could look - which would be very similar to ice. Not to mention ice has the dmg debuff also which is another form of mitigation you can't quantify in mids unfortunately. I get what you are saying but EA just doesnt work that way, which would make it incredibly easy to port to tankers and not be any more OP than the other 3 ATs. I think if you ported EA to tankers it wouldn't be as survivable as ice currently is but they would be close - well maybe if you add the tanker ATO to the Brute numbers it would surpass ICE then but still would be close.

Stalker and Scrapper have similar numbers to Brute EA also though - thats the point - the set has a sweet spot and if you hit it you are in good shape. But it still has weaknesses that Ice doesnt - Toxic is rough on EA - you really have to stay on your toes - but with ice its not nearly as noticeable. See drastically different ATs - same targets - all attainable - this shouldnt change with a tanker - the only difference with the tanker is the inherant HP being higher which is where the tanker advantage will lie with this set. Now take the comparison with Ice Armor again... Keeping in mind EA is static or can be made static across 3 different ATs - so Tanker should be no different from Brute aside from the HP area. Those numbers for both are with 1 enemy with energy drain or energy absorption cast on. Also Ice has -14% dmg from chilling embrace

I am guilty of it too, but a lot of people overlook just how good Tanker Ice Armor really is. Its top shelf stuff - better than an EA port would be too i believe - because there is no holes in ICE. and -dmg -recharge is valid across all types.

Energy Absorption does that for Ice too - its based on number hit. Its identical to EA just with more resists in a few areas where its defense on EA - same effect though - it mitigates just as good. Port Brute EA over to tankers as is with the larger HP pool its a done deal. Doesnt matter what AT you have - that comparison chart i posted is the sweet spot regardless of AT.

Its like someone else said, hasten isn't required its a min max thing. I usually end up with nothing else worth taking so why not take hasten at that point but I have 5 builds that don't take hasten. Not really a fan of the whole idea of tinkering with recharge good or bad. Tinkering with this has a problem both ways. At the end you would either end up where we are, nerfed so bad it's not functional, or creeped so bad it's not fun either. Just leave that one alone. Endurance on the other hand... That's one you really have to go out of your way to fix on some builds. Which I'm ok with it being that way, but if tinkeration is going to occur tinker with that. lol

I think this idea no matter how much its modified will always be too close to kinetic melee and maybe a few attributes from a few other sets. Not a bad idea though if kinetic melee didn't already exist - let KM get fixed and you have force melee then. I wouldnt be opposed to it, but its addition IMO wouldn't really add enough unique to warrant the expense in time to create it. But If someone else thought otherwise I would play it.

What gymnastics school did Rambo go to? lol I/k That's a cool build/idea similar to my mastermind A Team theme.

Energy absorption works similarly to energy drain - they both do + def You also cannot discount the -speed, -dmg, and -recharge ice armor does. I've had enemies completely floored - +4\8 full with debuffers multiple groups - walked away for 20 min came back and they had no end and was throwing half hearted attacks every few seconds.... lol Before I took a deep dive into that set I thought it was weak - now its one of my strongest tanker sets and thats saying something with some of the bonkers sets ive built. Energy armor I think is more dynamic because more can hurt you faster - that's why it's heal is on a short recharge. But the point is - there is already precedent for a set almost identical to EA on tankers - just extrapolate the scalar from brute to tanker and you have functional tanker Energy Aura. Either way you will still be building for the same mitigation targets you did on the current 3 ATs - that's what my comparison was trying to show.

You should be able to do it with the one crowd control type. A couple other techniques is slotting blistering cold in a fast spamming attack - that set has a hold proc. Plasmatic taser can hold also - spamming that could work. There may be a couple other tricks I haven't heard of.

Had to make sure i wasnt delusional lol i just logged back in to check - you can use both at the same time and you get both bonuses also. I use hover a good bit too - its reliable in certain annoying situations where you have to fight in the air - or where you may need that extra oomph of defense.

They arent actually - you can use both at the same time. Nah especially if you get ageless radial - but for the most part i am normally double stacked on active defense with just one rech enh. yeah for the most part thats true, and on content like that i slot up Musc and Assault - but if you are running anything +4 in the shard, or praetorian content, or anything with debuffers or heavy energy/psi/toxic it gets hairy without having resilient or sometimes Melee core. You are right though probably 80 percent of the rest of the game you are unkillable.

Energy Aura is not like the rest of the sets though. Its slightly different in how you get to these numbers - but you can literally do this on Every AT that has it, as long as you chase the right set bonuses. Check out this comparison - similar slotting, style, performance, etc.

I really wouldnt say weaker honestly - I thought so before i took a deep dive into Ice - no pun intended - but its all but identical with a couple of types being switched between resistance and defense. Those are similarily built - similar sets - strategys - styles etc. And they play identical with the tanker being more durable because of the increased HP pool.

Star Slammer - Tanker (Invulnerability - Energy Melee) - Moar Defenses.mxd Hero Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 3.0.0.0 https://github.com/Reborn-Team/Hero-Designer Click this DataLink to open the build! Star Slammer: Level 50 Science Tanker Primary Power Set: Invulnerability Secondary Power Set: Energy Melee Power Pool: Leaping Power Pool: Speed Power Pool: Fighting Power Pool: Concealment Ancillary Pool: Energy Mastery Hero Profile: Level 1: Temp Invulnerability -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(3), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(3), UnbGrd-EndRdx/Rchg(5), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(5), ImpArm-ResPsi(7) Level 1: Barrage -- Mk'Bit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(A) Level 2: Dull Pain -- Prv-Heal(A), Prv-Heal/EndRdx(7), Prv-EndRdx/Rchg(9), Prv-Absorb%(9), Prv-Heal/Rchg(11), Prv-Heal/Rchg/EndRdx(11) Level 4: [Empty] Level 6: Combat Jumping -- Rct-ResDam%(A) Level 8: Unyielding -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(15), UnbGrd-EndRdx/Rchg(15), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(17), UnbGrd-Max HP%(17), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(19) Level 10: Resist Elements -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(19), UnbGrd-EndRdx/Rchg(21), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(21), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(23), ImpArm-ResPsi(23) Level 12: Resist Energies -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(25), UnbGrd-EndRdx/Rchg(25), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(27), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(27), ImpArm-ResPsi(29) Level 14: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(29) Level 16: Bone Smasher -- SprGntFis-Rchg/+Absorb(A), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), SprGntFis-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(31), SprGntFis-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), SprGntFis-Dmg/Rchg(33), SprMghoft-Rchg/Res%(33) Level 18: Invincibility -- GssSynFr--Build%(A), ShlWal-Def(33), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(34), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(34), ShlWal-Def/Rchg(34) Level 20: Total Focus -- SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg(A), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx(36), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(36), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(36), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(37), SprBlsCol-Rchg/HoldProc(37) Level 22: Whirling Hands -- SprAvl-Acc/Dmg(A), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(37), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(39), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(39), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(39), SprAvl-Rchg/KDProc(40) Level 24: Boxing -- Empty(A) Level 26: Resist Physical Damage -- GldArm-3defTpProc(A), StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(40), ImpArm-ResPsi(40) Level 28: Build Up -- GssSynFr--ToHit/Rchg(A) Level 30: Tough -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-EndRdx/Rchg(42), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(42), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(42), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(43), ImpArm-ResPsi(43) Level 32: Tough Hide -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A) Level 35: Weave -- ShlWal-Def/EndRdx(A), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(43), ShlWal-Def(45), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(45) Level 38: Energy Transfer -- Hct-Dam%(A), Hct-Dmg(45), Hct-Dmg/Rchg(46), TchofDth-Dam%(46), TchofDth-Dmg/Rchg(46), TchofDth-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(47) Level 41: Power Crash -- Arm-Dmg(A), Arm-Dmg/Rchg(47), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), Arm-Acc/Rchg(48), Arm-Dmg/EndRdx(48), Arm-Dam%(49) Level 44: Focused Accuracy -- GssSynFr--ToHit/EndRdx(A) Level 47: Physical Perfection -- PrfShf-End%(A) Level 49: Stealth -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A) Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A) Level 1: Gauntlet Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A) Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A) Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A) Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A) Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A) Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I(A) Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A) Level 4: Ninja Run Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A) Level 2: Health -- Pnc-Heal/+End(A), Mrc-Rcvry+(13), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(13) Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A) Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A) Level 0: Freedom Phalanx Reserve Level 0: Portal Jockey Level 0: Task Force Commander Level 0: The Atlas Medallion Level 50: Mighty Radial Final Judgement Level 50: Ageless Radial Epiphany Level 50: Melee Core Embodiment Level 50: Degenerative Core Flawless Interface Level 50: Agility Core Paragon Level 50: Longbow Core Superior Ally Level 1: Energy Focus ------------