Empathy 2.0: A Suggested Revamp of an Old Classic

[EmptyStar]

Hi all! I've recently had some inspiration in regards to the Empathy powerset and how I would improve it. After putting some thought and imagination into it, I finally have a vision to share.

 

I did my best to preserve the original feel and playstyle of the powerset while adding to it some more interesting mechanics and thematic flair. The result is a powerset that will look very familiar but will hopefully surprise you with the changes I've introduced. In particular...

 

• Familiar
  • A very "clicky" powerset that requires frequent target switching and attention to buffs and health bars
  • Powers mostly accept the same enhancements and enhancement sets as their existing counterparts
  • Benefits greatly from recharge enhancement
• New
  • Power design focuses on smaller, cumulative effects rather than big single-target effects
  • Heals serve a more dynamic purpose beyond simple healing
  • Player positioning in relation to their allies is more important
  • Grants more direct benefits to the caster and not just allies

 

The powerset is presented below power by power with a description of each power in addition to my commentary. You best strap in because it's a long post with a lot of text! Thanks in advance for reading.

 

Empathy

Empathy grants you the ability to support yourself and your allies with a powerful array of heals and buffs. It also allows you to amplify your presence by bonding with an ally.

 

T1: Healing Aura

PBAoE, Ally +Heal, +Absorb Special

15' radius, 16s recharge

 

Heals you and nearby allies for a small amount. Overhealing with this power is converted to an absorb shield up to 25% of an ally's maximum HP. Bonded ally echoes this power at their location.

 

The standard PBAoE heal with a little extra dazzle. While it remains good for its original purpose of being auto cast with the tank on follow, it now gives players a reason to use it before the going gets tough. Granting your allies absorption at key moments can allow them to absorb hits before their HP plummets, and enhancing the heal into the stratosphere has benefits in regards to overhealing.

 

Also mentioned is the mechanic of being "echoed by a bonded ally" which is explained more in this set's T3 power, Emotional Bond. In this case, this power will also cast at the bonded ally's location. Given this mechanic, the heal may need to be reduced slightly from its current output for balance reasons. I've also lengthened its recharge and made its radius slightly smaller.

 

T2: Heal Other

Ranged, Ally +Heal, +Absorb Special

80' range, 10s recharge

 

Heals a targeted ally for a moderate amount. Overhealing with this power is converted to an absorb shield up to 25% of an ally's maximum HP. Bonded ally echoes this power on themselves.

 

The standard targeted heal, again with a little extra in the same vein as Healing Aura. This power would probably also need to come down a hair in potency and will also recharge more slowly. Its echoed effect can allow for a bigger surge in healing if an ally really needs it, or it can allow its heal/absorb effect to be more efficiently distributed to multiple allies.

 

T3: Emotional Bond

Toggle: Ranged, Ally Special

80' range, 4s recharge

 

Forms an emotional bond with a targeted ally. Bonded ally will echo your other Empathy powers at no additional endurance cost; see other Empathy powers for their effects when echoed. Additionally, a portion of the damage that the bonded ally receives will be redirected to you based on their current HP; the lower their HP, the greater the portion of damage you will receive.

 

This power replaces Absorb Pain as the powerset's new cornerstone. It's a targeted toggle not unlike Darkest Night or other debuff toggles, but it targets an ally instead of an enemy. The targeted ally is bonded to you such that your other Empathy powers will be duplicated on them. It also causes you to share their suffering in terms of damage though I'm not sure what scaling is appropriate here.

 

This power allows for a variety of strategic choices. Do you keep it on an aggressive ally as they tackle the front lines? Do you move it around as allies need additional support? Do you stay near to or far from your bonded ally?

 

The other powers of this set have been adjusted with the expectation of interacting with this power. Rather than focusing on big single-target heals and buffs, this shifts the set's focus slightly to repeated, widespread power applications.

 

T4: Revitalize

Close, Ally Resurrect, +Heal, +Endurance

15' range, 240s recharge

 

Resurrects an ally if they are defeated and heals them in the amount of your current HP and infuses them with endurance in the amount of your current endurance. Can be used on allies who are not defeated. Bonded ally echoes this power on themselves at 50% of the health and endurance restored to the target.

 

This power can revive a faceplanted ally similar to Resurrect, but the HP and endurance it restores are dependent on your own. Not only can it rez, but it also functions as an extraordinary emergency heal/endurance panic button. This makes the power useful beyond just putting your allies back on their feet. Its echoed effect is icing on the cake. Note that it does not carry the same overhealing benefits as Healing Aura and Heal Other; this power is straight up HP/end.

 

T5: Clear Mind

Self +Special, Ally +Mez Protection, +Perception

120s recharge

 

Your next few heals each grant a stack of Clear Mind to affected allies which grants them a small amount of mez protection and perception. You and your bonded ally immediately receive one stack of this buff when it is cast. Your echoed heals also grant this buff to affected allies.

 

This is where this set's buffs really go off the rails. Unlike its existing incarnation, this version of Clear Mind is more like a "Build Up" for your heals where the bonus effect is mez protection and perception. This adds another dimension of value to the set's heals as they can be used to free allies from mez.

 

This power now comes with a lengthy recharge as it's intended more as a carefully chosen boost when needed. The player's heals would only be enhanced for a short time, probably 10s or so, and the Clear Mind buff that the heals apply would last around 30s. The power's potency would be reduced in favor of spreading it around and building stacks of it.

 

T6: Fortitude

Self +Special, Ally +DEF(All), +DMG, +ToHit

120s recharge

 

Your next few heals each grant a stack of Fortitude to affected allies which grants them a small boost to their defense, damage, and chance to hit. You and your bonded ally immediately receive one stack of this buff when it is cast. Your echoed heals also grant this buff to affected allies.

 

Similar to Clear Mind, this power is also a short burst of buffed up goodness for your heals. The values of the buffs would need to be drastically reduced considering multiple stacks from both the caster and their bonded ally, but it will now spread and stack nicely. Single-target heals could build quite a few stacks of this buff to turn a couple select allies into juggernauts while still giving other allies a little love. The granted buff would probably be fair at either 30s or 60s; I'm not 100% sure what might be best given its potency and recharge.

 

T7: Regeneration Aura

Toggle: PBAoE, Ally +Heal Over Time, +Res(-Regen)

25' radius, 4s recharge

 

You and nearby allies receive a minor heal every few seconds and resist regeneration debuffs. Bonded ally echoes this power. Heals from this power can grant stacks of Clear Mind and Fortitude.

 

Pretty straightforward change from a click to a toggle with a nice radius and bonus regen debuff resistance. Its heal would be very minor and would tick every 4s or 5s, but it is echoed and grants buff stacks, so it will still pack plenty of utility.

 

T8: Recovery Aura

Toggle: PBAoE, Ally +Endurance Over Time, +Res(End Drain)

25' radius, 4s recharge

 

You and nearby allies receive a small infusion of endurance every few seconds and resist endurance drains. Bonded ally echoes this power.

 

Another simple change. I'm not sure how its end cost (and the end cost of this powerset's other powers) should stack up against its effect, but its benefits are obvious.

 

T9: Adrenaline Surge

PBAoE, Ally +Recovery, +Regeneration, +Recharge, +DMG, +Res(Slow)

15' radius, 360s recharge

 

You and nearby allies receive a large buff to your recovery, regeneration, recharge, damage, and resistance to slow effects. Bonded ally echoes this power.

 

Meet Empathy's Chrono Shift, albeit with a few caveats. This power grants the same effects as its existing counterpart in addition to damage, but the buff values can't be quite as awesome now that it's an AoE. The radius is also fairly small, so positioning of you and your bonded ally are very important considerations when activating this power. It also doesn't stack and has a long recharge for what I would give a 60s duration. It's still fairly in line with its original design as a short-lived rush.

[Zeraphia]

I'm going to say this just looking at the particular change to Regeneration Aura... there are going to be a LOT of people who will not like that you're playing around with the huge regeneration part that makes Empathy very unique and would turn it more into looking like a weaker version of Nature. 

 

Also, many will not like the new Adrenaline either... I do not care for click AoE buffs because herding people is already tedious as is...

 

This is also changing a classic game set that I think would stir up a hornet's nest... I agree in the current state, it isn't the strongest, but I think the ship has sort of sailed with this set to break cottage rules on powers.

[Lines]

I really like the ideas here. Your proposal is a set I'd enjoy.

[Razor Cure]

Some decent ideas here..but it still comes across as a very 'clicky' set. I like the overheal +absorbs..but think that would encourage idiot auto heal bots, which seem to make up a good whack of Emps as is it.

The changes to clear mind..are..well..bad. I like you are trying to come up with new ideas, and ways to make the set LESS click spammy. But no. 120 sec rech, so 60ish, when slotted. With say..10? seconds of heals giving +CM stacks, each stack being Mag2-3. At most you are gonna get 3 healing auras in that 10 seconds, giving almost exactly the same mez prot as current CM.

The same problem with Fort. As is, Fort is SO easy to keep on at least 3 or 4 allies. The fact almost emps dont, is because, see above, most emps play like twits. I have no trouble keeping fort on an entire team, and power booster fort on 3. Exchanging that for mirco managing and less uptime? No thanks.

Recovery aura..with a 4 sec rech? That is basically just copying Spores from Nature, meaning it would be much less effective.

The idea for AdrenBoost..well..it seems like trying to throw almost every buff out, just cause. Not everything needs to be AoE.

 

Points from trying. But the changes are too much.

 

[Icecomet]

I'd just be happy when I play a support toon that I didn't have to rebuff everybody every 60-120 seconds, I mean, seriously, what's wrong with making the buffs from buff classes last 15 minutes or more?  Just don't allow the buffs to persist when you zone, that's all.  When I play my kinetics, its a constant refresh of speed boost and density.  It gets really old just refreshing buffs all the time.  While I realize that this, as a general topic should probably have it's own thread, with the aforementioned buffs above, giving a LONG duration would be grand and really make these classes more enjoyable as a whole.

 

Just my 2 influence...

 

Icecomet

[Blastit]

I do like the emotional bonding idea, because the Empathy set could do with a bigger chunk of empathy mechanics. Connecting people so that damage is split between them or damage is reflected to enemies are also things to look into.

 

 

I have no personal opinion on the RA's other than that I did selfishly think that turning them into toggles would be great fun, so I agree with at least that. Empathy wanting to be close to people makes sense. I also thought that I would enjoy Clear Mind as a PBAoE but that might be a bit greedy.

[Psyonico]

/jranger

 

Empathy is one of the most powerful sets in the game and other than the over heal effect you've gutted it.

[Greycat]

5 hours ago, Icecomet said:

I'd just be happy when I play a support toon that I didn't have to rebuff everybody every 60-120 seconds,

Here's the thing....

 

You don't have to.

 

Why are you CMing a tank, barring some extreme situation? They don't need it. Most melees don't. Save it for other squishies - and even all of *them* won't need it. Most of my teams, I'm seeing... 3-4 people, max, that need that. Fort? Be picky. *Especially* in the current IO-heavy game.  I combat buff the auras (no "Everyone stop what you're doing and gather around!" breaking the flow of a mission) and that's generally fine.

 

Pay attention to your team and you'll save yourself some work.

 

 

As for the OP, I'm not particularly fond of the 'bonding' thing. I can make a judgement of the moment with the current absorb pain - is it worth the cost and risk to me right now and for the next few moments, yes or no. (I will say it would be an interesting mechanic... elsewhere. Bodyguard, basically. I don't know how technically tough or game-wise desirable it would be to echo auras like that.) That said, AP is *not* a cornerstone power in Empathy. It's easily skippable. I'm also not fond of the auras becoming toggles, quite frankly. The recovery aura seems especially like it would be fighting itself - especially solo (I tend to do two builds, one team, one solo.)

 

About the only change I'd honestly go with is the ability to "heal" a bit of absorb onto people, within limits.

 

Revitalize being a buff as well as heal would be... interesting. It would partially solve the issue of "wasted" rezzes - though I'd still like a fast recharge if the target ignores it or hits the base/hospital instead. (That's just an annoyance...)

 

Other than that... in part it sounds like you really want Pain Domination with tweaks. I, personally, don't think I'd want my emps' playstyles to change as drastically as some of this would do. But again, I wouldn't object to some of the changes being looked at, as mentioned above.

[SwitchFade]

I'm gonna have to say...

 

No.

 

Sorry.

[Naraka]

I do enjoy reading write-ups of people's ideas for new powersets or powerset reworks.  I tend to hold contrarian talking points as well to spark discussion more often than not.

 

On this topic, I'd like to outline some rules I like to follow when creating new powersets or reworks.

 

With regards to new mechanics, it's important to describe them in full detail or in enough detail that you can filter through different variations of a specific idea to get people understanding where you're coming from.  I think you did that well with regards to the bonded ally mechanic.

 

For powerset reworks or using existing powersets as a framework for a new set, I do believe keeping close to the original is as important as making the rework justified and a new set unique.  If a powers' mechanical function is going to drastically change, keep such changes to the absolute minimum.  This is something you kind of went overboard with.  The idea with Clear Mind being a modifier to your other powers is an interesting change, it could actually be a great shift for the set...but you've also changed several click powers into toggle powers (1 even having its function completely altered) which is going to get you into territory of disfavor with more and more readers.

 

If I were to try to combine some of your ideas with current Empathy, I'd use the bonded mechanic as a kind of add-on to some specific powers: Keep Absorb Pain but add onto it a "bonded" effect that lasts for 20sec, give Fortitude and Adrenalin Boost the same bonded effect that lasts for a longer duration (like 60sec) and limit the amount of bonds you can keep active to 3. Making a new bond will make the oldest bond expire.  Make it so that allies you don't have a bond with gain +absorb and ones that you do have bonded are just healed by your various heals with the exception of Absorb Pain which will always do both.  Allies that you have bonded will return a portion of the effect back to the user.  Healing bonded allies give the user +absorb, granting them clear mind will return some +mez protection and +perception to the user, granting fortitude to a bonded ally gives the user a portion of the defense, etc with the exceptions being Recovery Aura, Regeneration Aura and Resurrect.

 

All in all, the set would perform the same except it'd be a blend of +absorb and +healing and the user would get a moderate benefit if he's boosting all 3 of his bonded allies.

[Auroxis]

Obvious cottage rule breaking aside (and a nerf to Regeneration Aura for some reason?), you managed to make Empathy even more clicky. Where-as before you could use just Fortitude at the end-game with the occasional heal, with your suggestion you'd have to use heals as well as Fortitude instead of getting to blast. You effectively turned Empathy into a heal spam set, with cottage rule breaking and nerfs on top of it.

[summers]

For any older sets that are having proposed revamps it's probably just easier to make a brand new set. This isn't because it's actually easier to make a new set, but to dramatically revamp sets that are ~15 years old you will wildly upset people and it will be much more trouble than its worth.

 

This also applies to Super Strength when we saw the Rage revamp 😜

[Greycat]

28 minutes ago, summers said:

For any older sets that are having proposed revamps it's probably just easier to make a brand new set. This isn't because it's actually easier to make a new set, but to dramatically revamp sets that are ~15 years old you will wildly upset people and it will be much more trouble than its worth.

 

Pfft. The sets don't have to be 15 years old for that. When the live devs wanted to revamp villain patron pools and we saw what they did on live (well, live beta) with replacing powers "that weren't popular" or "nobody took," the pitchforks and boiling tar came out.

 

Thus we got power pools with *five* powers instead of four.

Edited April 19, 2020 by Greycat

[Razor Cure]

On 4/18/2020 at 8:25 PM, Icecomet said:

I'd just be happy when I play a support toon that I didn't have to rebuff everybody every 60-120 seconds, I mean, seriously, what's wrong with making the buffs from buff classes last 15 minutes or more?

I get what you mean..but..

It is a support toon. You play support but dont wanna use support powers? Thats like playing a tank and saying you dont want to jump in first. Or playing a blaster and saying 'why cant i just have 8 damage toggles, so i dont have to keep using powers over and over.'

Play Support, so do the supporting.

 

On 4/19/2020 at 8:08 PM, Greycat said:

When the live devs wanted to revamp villain patron pools and we saw what they did on live (well, live beta) with replacing powers "that weren't popular" or "nobody took," the pitchforks and boiling tar came out.

I dont remember this. Or I forgot. Was it just before shutdown?

[SeraphimKensai]

Going to have to say no.

 

I used to main an empathy defender. In the PvP community, Empathy is absolutely vital. This is going to be a nonstarter.

 

That said you have some interesting ideas, hash it out to make a completely unique set, reskin it, and leave empathy alone.

[The_Warpact]

They need to start locking threads after a year...

[Greycat]

17 hours ago, Razor Cure said:

I dont remember this. Or I forgot. Was it just before shutdown?

 

It was well before shutdown. They wholesale replaced some powers in beta for ... whichever issue. Final result after *extremely* negative player feedback was having five powers in the pool instead of four.

14 hours ago, The_Warpact said:

They need to start locking threads after a year...

 

I agree.

[Doomguide2005]

I don't know about locking but maybe a big pop-up saying "ya know this thread is 'x' time old, start new with link? 

 

And the OP hasn't been back to the forums since they posted.