Name Purge

[CrudeVileTerror]

I think there was a Dev/GM response a while ago along the lines of "that rule is there for your safety, since anything that another person says or does with your account is going to land in your lap when we hold you accountable for their actions."

Not sure if that was an -official- stance, but I do remember it popping up a month or two ago.

[AerialAssault]

Name hoarding absolutely does occur. Hence why a City Info Tracker would be useful, and would make it easier to see if the person you're seeking a name release from is active or not.

[MTeague]

35 minutes ago, CrudeVileTerror said:

I'm honestly kind of confused on the "name sitting" thing.

How are people so sure that's such a dramatic problem?  My perspective genuinely doesn't afford me the insight in to seeing that.  As far as I'm aware, any name sitters would need to personally be painting targets on their own backs by declaring "I took this name so no one else can use it."   Is that actually happening somewhere?

That's a question of perspective. I have seen a few people say, "I got this name on server X, and immediately grabbed the same name on servers, A, B, and C, so I can server transfer without fear of losing the name, and so that this name can be MINE across every server."

 

Now, if you actually PLAY different characters of the same name across each server, I have no bones with that. 

 

If you have a lvl 1 name-squatting on servers you generally don't play on just to be name "mules" so you can rename, server transfer, rename back, etc.... hey, okay. It's allowed by the current rules. I can't stay it's wrong as such. But it does strike me as kinda greedily hogging things instead of being content you have that name on one server.  But you know, that's just like, my opinion, man.

[OmegaOne]

On 11/5/2020 at 3:15 PM, Andreah said:

It would be cool, although I imagine very difficult if not practically impossible, to make displayed names not need to be unique.

I agree - I'd much prefer the "character@global" system that Cryptic moved to with their subsequent games. I played CO, STO and NW and never had any issue with bumping into players with the same character name (or ship name in the case of STO). I'd probably find it funny in fact.

 

It's probably not impossible to do - but then it would just be a matter of how difficult and time-consuming it would be to navigate that spaghetti. Kind of like the power FX changes (and other features implemented during live) - it was "impossible" until the devs decided they could spare the time and manpower it would take to re-work the powers system.

Edited November 8, 2020 by OmegaOne
clarity

[Apparition]

3 hours ago, Coyotedancer said:

I know a few people who have a couple of pages of names held between them, mostly on level 1 place-holders that have never been played "Because the name was cool and someday I may want to use it", VT.

 

I does happen.

 

 

 

I know of someone with tens of pages of that, made the first week of Homecoming.

[ShardWarrior]

3 hours ago, MTeague said:

Account sharing, IMO, would be if the other person actually played your characters for longer than just to login / logout, or if they had other characters on the same account designated "theirs" vs "yours".  I would not count it account sharing if it was just "hey, I'm going to be gone for a 18 months, just do me a favor, here's my account info, log in my characters for 2 seconds each on the first of each month while I'm gone.".

 

Perhaps the devs would see it differently though.

I do not disagree with you.  Again, this is something a GM would be able to answer.

 

3 hours ago, CrudeVileTerror said:

I think there was a Dev/GM response a while ago along the lines of "that rule is there for your safety, since anything that another person says or does with your account is going to land in your lap when we hold you accountable for their actions."

Not sure if that was an -official- stance, but I do remember it popping up a month or two ago.

This sounds right.

 

54 minutes ago, OmegaOne said:

I agree - I'd much prefer the "character@global" system that Cryptic moved to with their subsequent games. I played CO, STO and NW and never had any issue with bumping into players with the same character name (or ship name in the case of STO). I'd probably find it funny in fact.

 

It's probably not impossible to do - but then it is just a matter of how difficult and time-consuming it would be to navigate that spaghetti. Kind of like changing power FX (and other features) - it was impossible until the devs decided they could spare the time and manpower it would take to re-work the powers system.

I want to say that I recall this discussion coming up when the game was live and the answer was something to the effect of with the amount of work required, it would be easier to create a whole new engine.  This is what Cryptic did, hence what exists in CO, STO, NW and so on.

 

3 hours ago, Coyotedancer said:

I know a few people who have a couple of pages of names held between them, mostly on level 1 place-holders that have never been played "Because the name was cool and someday I may want to use it", VT.

 

I does happen.

No doubt, however I personally think this is the minority of cases.  Most names would get released by freeing up those on accounts not logged in in over a year.

[Outrider_01]

8 hours ago, Shadeknight said:

Because not everyone wants to have to look up some google translate name to make a character's name just to get around the name they desired not being available.

oh oh I got one.  I got one!  *raises hand* Pick me! Pick me!

 

Nightshade!

Dark Knight!

 

Hmm, about Lampshade? 🤔

 

Sorry, I looked at your forum handle it kind of popped out.  Like, what is the source of Shadeknight?   Did you get around a concept as an homage character ?

[Ruin Mage]

You're funny. I like you.

I have no clue where I got Shadeknight from, tbh. It just stuck. Though he was never a homage character. Not a straight only one character one at least.

 

[Player2]

Okay...  **deep breath**

  

On 11/5/2020 at 2:15 PM, MTeague said:

I ... am probably being contrarian. But I like that the names ARE unique. 

I get that it can be depressing when you cant' get the exact spelling you want, and that spelling MATTERS to you, either because of historical connections to live or character concept or both. 

But I'd be a little depressed to join a team of 5 players all names ShieldyMcPunchFace.  (or being less snarky, all named Firethorn, or all named Glacier Girl, etc).

I kind of like that people have to stretch a bit to think of something.

With the player note system, you can keep track of the [insert name you like here] by rating the player and/or adding a note about them.  In the real world, names aren't unique.  The government identifies us by social security numbers (in the U.S., anyhow).  And in the comics, even the most popular names can turn up on a number of people.  Spider-Man?  Which one, Peter Parker, Myles Morales, Miguel O'Hara, Ben Reilly... I'm sure there've been others.  Superman?  Not even taking alternate reality versions (which can also be a thing in COH with Primal Earth and Praetoria) into account, if someone asks if you like Superman, you can still legitimately ask, "Which one?"  Names aren't and shouldn't be unique.

 

6 hours ago, TheEmpyrean said:

I don't know if this idea has already been floated somewhere, but I always thought a name exchange and/or market could be awesome. 

 

...or they could keep globals unique and make names non-unique like some other games have.  I mean, how many Captain Marvels have there been, even just within Marvel Universe?

A name exchange is a great idea, and there are threads in the shard appropriate forum sections with just that kind of idea.  Unfortunately, it does not help if someone has walked away from the game for awhile or may never return.  Unique globals with non-unique character names is the best way to go, if only it could be worked out.  And how many Captain Marvels have there been?

 

Let's see...
 

1. Billy Batson  (Fawcett/DC Comics prior to giving up and just calling the character by his magic word of Shazam... which is actually the name of the wizard who grants his powers)
2. Roger Winkle  (MF Enterprises, an independent comic company...  so many ripped off ideas jammed into this character)
3. Mar-Vell  (Marvel Comics... swooped in and grabbed the name after DC sued Fawcett Comics into closing down Shazam... but before DC bought the character and started publishing it themselves)
4. Monica Rambeau  (Marvel Comics, later renamed a number of times to account for the next guy kept taking her names)
5. Genis-Vell  (Marvel Comics, Mar-Vell's son who was first introduced as Legacy)
6. Phyla-Vell  (Marvel Comics, Genis's sister... who went on to become Quasar)
7. Noh-Varr  (Marvel Comics, another Kree, unrelated to the Vell family)
8. Khn'nr  (Marvel Comics, a skrull that had been brainwashed into believing that it was actually the original Mar-Vell who had seemingly come back from the dead)
9. Carol Danvers  (Marvel Comics, because everyone figured she finally earned a promotion and it was about time a woman got to be Captain Marvel... conveniently forgetting about Monica)

That's 9 Captain Marvels.  Not very unique.  Even in the world of trademarked characters, trademarks expire and unique names fall into Public Domain.

 

7 hours ago, Shadeknight said:

Now that I took a moment to douse myself in water.

Here's all that I, personally, aim for in asking for a naming policy;

Fairness
It doesn't need to be a full year, but something with months still.

No Exemptions
No one is above anyone else. Not even for getting to 50.
 

The system proposed by the Homecoming team with more time as levels go up is quite fair.  And I'm going to outright disagree with you on the no exemptions for 50s.

 

5 hours ago, Greycat said:

Second, RPer-wise, I do have characters that are still under level 10. They serve - well, *roles,* but they aren't main-combat characters (and I've had some that would have no business being near a fight, much less making it to 50.) I highly doubt their names would be at risk (any more than my eternal-low-level base builders,) but that *is* someone who can stay low level for quite some time where the name is integral. They may not be on monthly or whatever frequency is chosen.

 

(I know, "well, PL them up." Then what has been accomplished other than wasting some of my time?)

 

Third, I have 100-ish characters. I do play them all. Some more frequently (Hami raid!) than others. If we're doing this *by character,* as suggested, rather than account, I want the option to sort by days offline and level.

 

Last but not least, doing this by character? What's to keep someone from taking a character name you've just not been on for a bit and actively name-squatting on it? Isn't that just defeating the purpose, and in fact making the situation worse? "Wow, between the SG's arcs, base building and everything else keeping me busy, I haven't played Favouriteguy for a while. Need to finish getting them to 50... what's this generic1232098745?"

Your second point:  If the name is as integral as you claim, put in a little extra time and get to level 6 for a 3-month period of safety... or level 21 for a whole year.  If someone has a hundred level 1's sitting and all of their names are that integral, that person might have a unique problem.  I would, however, suggest that it's their problem and thus they should have to log in and show some activity to maintain them.  It's a choice you make.

 

Your third point:  An option to sort by days offline and/or level would be great.  I would love to see that, too.

 

Your last point:  Nothing is to keep someone from taking a character name if you haven't played it within the allotted time of the suggested name purge by level.  That's the whole point... if you snooze, you lose... because it's not up to the Homecoming team or anyone else to keep track of what you play and when to determine if you've been busy with other characters or base building or just standing around RPing in Pocket D with other characters... or not playing them because you've been away from the game for awhile and may not be coming back.  The name purge suggested works for individual characters by level and how many days since they were last used because it would be easier than trying to ascertain play habits and have someone make judgement calls about whether or not a character might be used again any time soon.  But it's a heck of a lot more fair than judging by activity on the account as a whole, because one person could feasibly hoard 5000 character names (1000 on each server) and just play one character exclusively and just often enough to keep them all on lockdown.

 

5 hours ago, ShardWarrior said:

For sure people name sitting is a part of the problem, but again with those you can still get in contact with the owner of the name you are after to negotiate with them for releasing it.   There are several threads already on the forums for name releases.  People are willing to give them up.

 

Yup.  I have done this with a character twice now.  Started on Torch and traded with someone on Excelsior because we both expected to play on the respective shards... and then found ourselves gravitating back to where we started because of where our friends were playing, so we traded back.  It was all very amicable and easy, and my Halloween Girl is happily pursuing her incarnate levels on TB now.  Thanks 'other Halloween Girl' player!

 

4 hours ago, Coyotedancer said:

I know a few people who have a couple of pages of names held between them, mostly on level 1 place-holders that have never been played "Because the name was cool and someday I may want to use it", VT.

 

I does happen.

 

 

I'm guilty, too.  I picked up a couple of names on TB in anticipation of Issue 27 having Sonic Manipulation for blasters, and I won't be using the names until I27 goes Live.

 

4 hours ago, Shadeknight said:

It's not really a dramatic problem, but people don't exactly vocalize they have a specific name.

It's just that some names people do /getglobalname of and...well, it eventually becomes fruitless for one reason or another.
Some names just haven't been seen for half a year to a full year or so.

Some people have bragged about holding onto names, or some variant of the word brag.

Bragged, boasted, or maybe even arrogantly laughed about...  it happens.  Sometimes players are jerks.  Or maybe they're being protective because they have the name on a character they play regularly on one shard and jealously guard the name from being used by anyone else on any other shards.  Who knows, it might even be because they swap the character between shards from time to time and want to ensure they have the name available where they're heading to... as well as making sure they'll have it on the previous server when they want to go back again.

 

4 hours ago, MTeague said:

That's a question of perspective. I have seen a few people say, "I got this name on server X, and immediately grabbed the same name on servers, A, B, and C, so I can server transfer without fear of losing the name, and so that this name can be MINE across every server."

 

Now, if you actually PLAY different characters of the same name across each server, I have no bones with that. 

 

If you have a lvl 1 name-squatting on servers you generally don't play on just to be name "mules" so you can rename, server transfer, rename back, etc.... hey, okay. It's allowed by the current rules. I can't stay it's wrong as such. But it does strike me as kinda greedily hogging things instead of being content you have that name on one server.  But you know, that's just like, my opinion, man.

The name purge would make it harder for people to hold on to those that are being held on to to maintain the same name on different shards for shard hopping.  But if they want to put in the effort to show a minimum activity on those name mules every 30 days, that'll be on them.

 

2 hours ago, OmegaOne said:

I agree - I'd much prefer the "character@global" system that Cryptic moved to with their subsequent games. I played CO, STO and NW and never had any issue with bumping into players with the same character name (or ship name in the case of STO). I'd probably find it funny in fact.

 

It's probably not impossible to do - but then it is just a matter of how difficult and time-consuming it would be to navigate that spaghetti. Kind of like changing power FX (and other features) - it was impossible until the devs decided they could spare the time and manpower it would take to re-work the powers system.

And therein lies the true difficulty... resources like time and manpower to overhaul something like the unique name system could be cost-prohibitive and even if accomplished there will still be people who will complain about it.

 

 

 

[Hyperstrike]

9 hours ago, Shadeknight said:

Again, for some people - a name matters.

 

Yes.  For some people it does.
This is why I find your arguments for stealing names from them self-serving.

Your argument boils down to "I want it *MORE*".

Why not just spin up a Rocket Raccoon and go PL it?

[Hyperstrike]

9 hours ago, Shadeknight said:

Let me put it like this:

Names matter to people. If its a generic name akin to Blue Avenger, well that's asking for it. However, there are likely several names not-so generic that are sitting for 6+ months without activity. For some people, names matter because xXSephirothXx was one of the only things available for their controller. A unique naming method is harmful in some way, especially when some people do not want to pull out a dictionary to make a name.

The HC team does not need to give us anything in regards to "oh hey let me email this person because x name they have is up for grabs." - You are unironically asking for the team to do more work just because you don't have any better ideas. This is not a live service game run by professional developers. This is a private server for a game that got shut down in 2012. They do not and should not follow the same ideals as live service MMOs that are actively run by companies.
 

And, so long as you get what YOU want, it's all butterflies and roses.

Understood.

[Hyperstrike]

6 hours ago, CrudeVileTerror said:

I'm honestly kind of confused on the "name sitting" thing.

How are people so sure that's such a dramatic problem?  My perspective genuinely doesn't afford me the insight in to seeing that.  As far as I'm aware, any name sitters would need to personally be painting targets on their own backs by declaring "I took this name so no one else can use it."   Is that actually happening somewhere?

Basically people want an EXACT name.
GOTTA have it.
They can't do something like open a thesaurus.
Too much trouble.
So, screw the person who was lucky enough to get it.
THEY want it MORE!

[Ruin Mage]

Hilarious.

[Starforge]

I don't know man, I just read the TC wanting the GM's previously talked about name policy to go into effect. You're the one that took it as self-serving and wanting to steal names. I need a citation for that if you're going to be using that as an attack on the idea of the thread.

Edited November 8, 2020 by Starforge

[Ruin Mage]

These attacks on the thread are both sad and hilarious.

But yes, what Starforge is saying is correct.

[GM Vayek]

Hey folks, 

 

Please keep posts respectful. 

[Panthonca7034]

13 hours ago, Shadeknight said:

i really kicked the hornet's nest when i made this thread.

 

Honestly I think there is no point in continuing this discussion, or modifying ANYTHING... The rules are set, and its time to simply just accept the factors as they are and move on about your gaming experience... Nuff said...

 

13 hours ago, AerialAssault said:

To be honest all of this is a good argument for the creation of a new City Info Tracker.

That is not a good idea, from a security/privacy point of view and there are MANY who will REFUSE to Opt in, mandating anything is NEVER a good idea... (if you're suggesting that this be mandatory of course...), one should always be given a choice, not have something foisted upon them...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 8, 2020 by Panthonca7034
adding additional sticking points

[AerialAssault]

1 minute ago, Panthonca7034 said:

 

Honestly I think there is no point in continuing this discussion, or modifying ANYTHING... The rules are set, and its time to simply just accept the factors as they are and move on about your gaming experience... Nuff said...

 

That is not a good idea, from a security/privacy point of view and there are MANY who will REFUSE to Opt in, mandating anything is NEVER a good idea... (if you're suggesting that this be mandatory of course...)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In what way would it not be a good idea? The City Info Tracker existed during Live, and during the Secret Server years. It's a valuable & convenient tool.

[Panthonca7034]

19 minutes ago, AerialAssault said:

The City Info Tracker existed during Live, and during the Secret Server years. It's a valuable & convenient tool.

 

Again... Players need to be given a choice on that, and if this is such a good idea, give people a choice to OPT-IN or OPT-OUT that's all I got on that... I wouldn't know squat about the secret server years (I'm guessing you're referring to January 2013-March 2019), because all there was for everyone else (including me) at that time was "PARAGON CHAT"

  

19 minutes ago, AerialAssault said:

In what way would it not be a good idea?

Security/Privacy concerns.... Depending on what kind of information you will make people provide

Edited November 8, 2020 by Panthonca7034
Addressing another part of the quote

[AerialAssault]

11 minutes ago, Panthonca7034 said:

 

Again... Players need to be given a choice on that, and if this is such a good idea, give people a choice to OPT-IN or OPT-OUT that's all I got on that... I wouldn't know squat about the secret server years (I'm guessing you're referring to January 2013-March 2019), because all there was for everyone else (including me) at that time was "PARAGON CHAT"

  

Security/Privacy concerns.... Depending on what kind of information you will make people provide

It's literally just a character repository. People can only see your characters, at most. 

 

You can also check your own inventories across all your characters, a lot more convenient than logging on to each character individually.

 

I mean, I think an opt-in system would be good! I agree on that. But I don't think the principle is inherently bad or invalid.

[Panthonca7034]

15 minutes ago, AerialAssault said:

It's literally just a character repository. People can only see your characters, at most. 

 

You can also check your own inventories across all your characters, a lot more convenient than logging on to each character individually.

 

I mean, I think an opt-in system would be good! I agree on that. But I don't think the principle is inherently bad or invalid.

Sounds reasonable, This City Tracker idea needs its own separate thread though if it doesn't already have one

[CrudeVileTerror]

Here you go!

https://forums.homecomingservers.com/topic/15710-online-character-build-browser/

[Greycat]

So Pantonca can see, since they don't sound familiar with what CIT was like:

City info tracker from live

My old (public) live listing

Sample listing for Dreamon

 

Edited November 8, 2020 by Greycat

[Ruin Mage]

Oh hey this thread is still going.

But yeah, the CIT would be a major help towards figuring out names and activity.

[Indystruck]

On 11/6/2020 at 8:58 PM, ShardWarrior said:

You mean other than risking their lives in service of their country so you are afforded the privilege to sit at home safe and play video games?  They are gone for long periods of time and are unable to login.

 

 

Dude, I'm a veteran, we don't deserve additional special treatment on top of all the special treatment we already get. I'll begrudgingly take the free appetizers once a year, but carte blanche on name registrations for a fan-run server of an ancient game is excessive.

 

Edit: Also, in regards to this not working as well on Live, Live also did not give you infinite character slots.

Edited November 9, 2020 by Indystruck