Siege Perilous Server Ideas

[KaizenSoze]

To be clear, I am no way suggested any of these ideas should be implemented on the regular servers.

 

Back in the days of Ultima Online, it's still running by the way, they had a Siege Perilous server.

https://uo.com/wiki/ultima-online-wiki/gameplay/siege-perilous/

 

It was a high difficultly server, resources were scare or expensive. Skill gain was slow past a point.

 

While not changing any major mechanics. What would you change to make the server very challenging? 

 

Some ideas:

Disable incarnates or limit level shift to only +1

Make all enhancement much more expensive to buy

Make SG prestige needed again

[GraspingVileTerror]

An interesting mental exercise.

Although . . . how quickly will it get twisted in to a debate?

Think we can run a little contest and see how long folks can keep this thread on-topic?

 

---

 

A challenging server, I think, would need to do away with the player-market entirely and smooth the Inf-gain curve across all levels.  Perhaps put a daily Inf-gain cap in place on a per-character basis, which has the added benefit of further incentivizing creation of Alts.

Oo!  Or a per-ARCHETYPE Inf limit.  That could be interesting.  Got a tonne of "farmin' broots" on your account?  Sorry, Brutes can only gain X amount of Inf.  Time to move on to another Archetype.

 

Not necessarily a -good- idea, mind you.  Just an idea.

[Techwright]

Wait.  Just for clarification, is a "Siege Perilous" supposed to be "difficult" or "dangerous"?  Because they're not always the same thing.

 

"Difficult" could be that we remove any XP bonuses and increase costs, making it a slog to get anything accomplished.

 

"Dangerous" would be that we remove battle advantages, such as incarnate status, or perhaps do something like make all street thugs everywhere function within several levels of the player, regardless of the hero/villain security rank.

 

 

If the answer is "dangerous": find a way for villain mobs to send a runner for help to nearby mobs.  No more stand-around mobs.  The potential for a hero or team to be overwhelmed goes up, especially if more than one mob is found and summoned.  It then become necessary to spot the runner and end him before he can make things worse.

[oedipus_tex]

Interesting idea. Here's a salad bar of random things, with little consideration of what's realistic vs not.

 

• Tanker, Scrapper, Stalker, Brute more vulnerable to mezz than currently, have to rely on T9 to achieve current levels of immunity
• All classes: IO bonuses shut off when mezzed, like armors do
• No emailing inspirations
• Incarnate: Destiny only affects self and pets
• Incarnate: Judgment toned back or given stricter requirements (e.g. given longer recharge and a Snipe cast time)
• Inspirations of same tier replace rather than stack
• Enemies randomly carry inspirations for themselves
• Hero AoE attacks have a chance to injure rescue targets, need to use restraint
• Villain players depart to jail rather than a hospital
• Farming too much of a single enemy type draws attention from elites within the group
• Enemy bases have alarm systems
• Heals from certain sources are less pure, temporarily reduce max HP
• Enemies can use incarnate powers
• Some enemies have the abilities to "catch" nukes and fire them back at you

[Player2]

10 hours ago, Techwright said:

Wait.  Just for clarification, is a "Siege Perilous" supposed to be "difficult" or "dangerous"?  Because they're not always the same thing.

 

Difficult:  Any number of proposed changes, from limiting incarnate abilities to removing P2W Vendors.

 

Dangerous:  Remove XP debt and actually suffer XP losses when defeated, taking levels away when you die.  If that's not possible, then you only get so many "lives" as determined by how much XP debt you "earn" over time and set a maximum number that equals real, permanent character death when you exceed it.  The flag atop City Hall will not fly half mast for your losses.

[oedipus_tex]

Here's another one for thought: One way a hard-ish core server could add implicit difficulty without enforcing it would be to publicly display a character's Debt Ever Earned.

[VashNKnives]

I think it would be a low-pop server if you make it too much of a chore to buy I/Os and build characters. But I think it would be a great place to play and team if it wasn't treated like a test server. It would be aggravating to play hard mode if purple enemies suddenly fill the area because of untested bugs. Going through a couple team wipes due to unknown "features" if death is quicker or penalties are harsher would likely send folks away (old school PVP frustration flashbacks....).

 

Also, we should consider if another server further splinters the live server populations - creating teaming droughts for those servers. Also, cost of adding another server may be an issue.

[KaizenSoze]

21 minutes ago, VashNKnives said:

I think it would be a low-pop server if you make it too much of a chore to buy I/Os and build characters. But I think it would be a great place to play and team if it wasn't treated like a test server. It would be aggravating to play hard mode if purple enemies suddenly fill the area because of untested bugs. Going through a couple team wipes due to unknown "features" if death is quicker or penalties are harsher would likely send folks away (old school PVP frustration flashbacks....).

 

Also, we should consider if another server further splinters the live server populations - creating teaming droughts for those servers. Also, cost of adding another server may be an issue.

This is all just a thought experiment.  I doubt that a server like this would exist under Homecoming.

 

Some other group might do it though.

[VashNKnives]

It would be good fun though and spice things up for us without being goofy. I also would enjoy some sort of bounty system to make being a vig and rogue more engaging on this type of server, more incentives to go grey on alignment as well as more pain.

Edited July 10, 2021 by VashNKnives

[Coyotedancer]

If I were going to design City of Dark Souls...

 

One game, one setting... Everyone can go everywhere. Paragon, the Isles or whatever. 

Faction-based open-world PvP with resource looting... If you're out there, you're potential prey. Because people want your stuff.

No player marketplace... You want gear? You grind for it or you loot for it, and you hope you get lucky.

Obviously no P2W goodies or buyable temps... Though there might be regular vendors for basic SOs and such.

No XP or drop bonuses... You wanted to "earn" everything the hard way, right? 

The "players debuffed/enemies buffed" Ouro challenge settings are basically Always On. The goons are out to eat your face. 

 

I'm not sure I'd ever actually play that game. My feelings on PvP are mixed and If I want a Seriously Frustrating Game experience plenty of those already exist. But hey, it might be interesting to tinker with once in awhile. Something like a Cuphead in spandex.

[stonehd]

4 hours ago, VashNKnives said:

4 hours ago, KaizenSoze said:

This is all just a thought experiment.  I doubt that a server like this would exist under Homecoming.

 

Some other group might do it though.

 

It's an interesting thought experiment, though.  An issue with something like this on Homecoming may be server transfers.  Would this be a server where your whole progression is challenging?  Then no transfers allowed.  But a server where people can pop in and out when they want challenging content?  Transfer whenever you want.  Each have merits, and each would serve a similar, yet different service. 

 

I agree this would be challenging on Homecoming.  Questions would be whether HC has the ability to set different rules for different servers within HC?  Could they restrict transfers to one of those servers?  Or would it have to be set up like Beta - completely walled off from everyone else?  

 

D

[JasperStone]

No rez. You go down ... game reboots to character creation.

Incarnate timers increased to 1 hour. (Think renewal of light timer)

Level shift of +1

 

[Eva Destruction]

If you defeat X number of enemies from a faction, they start to see you as a threat and make a tactical retreat when they hear you're coming.  No more running Council radios until your eyeballs bleed; after you've run a couple of them you'll walk into an empty warehouse.   Once you enter a mission it won't reset for 24 hours, so you can't farm Battlemaiden either.

 

AE obviously gives no rewards, although it's still there and can be used as a danger room, to test builds and tactics without any consequences.  (Since I'm assuming the real game would have actual consequences for defeat.)

[Cobalt Arachne]

No Trammel! Oh wait...

[oedipus_tex]

 

25 minutes ago, Eva Destruction said:

If you defeat X number of enemies from a faction, they start to see you as a threat and make a tactical retreat when they hear you're coming.  No more running Council radios until your eyeballs bleed; after you've run a couple of them you'll walk into an empty warehouse.   Once you enter a mission it won't reset for 24 hours, so you can't farm Battlemaiden either.

 

AE obviously gives no rewards, although it's still there and can be used as a danger room, to test builds and tactics without any consequences.  (Since I'm assuming the real game would have actual consequences for defeat.)

 

 

Related to this, I think it would be hilarious is if Masterminds had to worry about minion loyalty and wages.  

[JasperStone]

36 minutes ago, Eva Destruction said:

If you defeat X number of enemies from a faction, they start to see you as a threat and make a tactical retreat when they hear you're coming.  No more running Council radios until your eyeballs bleed; after you've run a couple of them you'll walk into an empty warehouse.   Once you enter a mission it won't reset for 24 hours, so you can't farm Battlemaiden either.

 

AE obviously gives no rewards, although it's still there and can be used as a danger room, to test builds and tactics without any consequences.  (Since I'm assuming the real game would have actual consequences for defeat.)

 

OR.....

You get put on a hit list and experience random ambushes of ever increasing difficulty...until maybe you face an AV ....

[Snarky]

You would (in my opinion) need to gate all resources per character.   You want a purple recipe?  Wait for a drop or farm merits.  On that character.  You want any recipe. Same.  In other words remove email and market and trades and prob one or two other things

 

that would solve 90% of power creep. Maybe 95%.  
 

oh. And no AE.  You want to farm something you better save a farm mission map. It would even be best if you could disable that.  Save a mission 7 days tops.  
 

this would FORCE all rewards to be earned per character and teaming would be GOLD

[Rahabina]

On 7/9/2021 at 6:39 PM, KaizenSoze said:

To be clear, I am no way suggested any of these ideas should be implemented on the regular servers.

 

Back in the days of Ultima Online, it's still running by the way, they had a Siege Perilous server.

https://uo.com/wiki/ultima-online-wiki/gameplay/siege-perilous/

 

It was a high difficultly server, resources were scare or expensive. Skill gain was slow past a point.

 

While not changing any major mechanics. What would you change to make the server very challenging? 

 

Some ideas:

Disable incarnates or limit level shift to only +1

Make all enhancement much more expensive to buy

Make SG prestige needed again

You'd also have to not let people move to the server because they can buy hancies elsewhere and move to that server

[Rahabina]

28 minutes ago, Snarky said:

You would (in my opinion) need to gate all resources per character.   You want a purple recipe?  Wait for a drop or farm merits.  On that character.  You want any recipe. Same.  In other words remove email and market and trades and prob one or two other things

 

that would solve 90% of power creep. Maybe 95%.  
 

oh. And no AE.  You want to farm something you better save a farm mission map. It would even be best if you could disable that.  Save a mission 7 days tops.  
 

this would FORCE all rewards to be earned per character and teaming would be GOLD

I would like this and make the server stand alone, everyone on par and you'd advance normally no AE

[Dazl]

It might be an interesting mental exercise, but it’s probably going to be a ghost town like red and gold side. The Rebirth private server has some of the old school mechanics, but every time I’ve logged into that server there is only one yellow bubble. It may seem like something interesting until people try it, then it might not have the ability to hold a significant player base to make it worthwhile.

[Rahabina]

3 hours ago, Dazl said:

it might not have the ability to hold a significant player base to make it worthwhile.

Good point

[Ghost]

No AE and figure out a way to stop farming

[Draeth Darkstar]

7 hours ago, Cobalt Arachne said:

No Trammel! Oh wait...

I understood that reference!

[golstat2003]

Interesting thought experiment. It wouldn't be popular enough to justify it's cost in terms of development time and resources.

[Linea]

Upgrade all mob groups into 801.6 rule-set mobs.

Limit the Incarnate boost to +1.