What about a Redside week... month... whatever?

[Shenanigunner]

I see a lot of plaintive posts about the lack of players Redside, and I think it's a shame. CoV has some great maps, missions and lore. It's just sort of... abandoned in Live status.

 

So how about a Red week or month, where all the heroes hang up their capes for a vacation and as we get as much of the community as possible to get their Villain ya-yas out? Can we all pledge to go do a little harm? Contribute to the need for heroes and policing and Vanguard troops?

 

How about "Be Bad Week," from Miller time on Friday the 23rd until we all come to our senses Sunday night the 1st?

 

Or... hell with it... how about "August Is Evil Month"?

[Greycat]

Well... some people just don't *enjoy* redside. (or gold.) So...

[Sunsette]

48 minutes ago, Greycat said:

Well... some people just don't *enjoy* redside. (or gold.) So...

 

Ayup. A friend only recently convinced me to play red-side and I'm only tolerating it because she's doing all the missions. I just smash things while double XP is on and tune out the evil stuff for as long as I can. 

 

That said, having scheduled events to do red-side does sound like a really good plan to have targeted increases in community.

[Ghost]

I think people need to stop tying to find ways to drag others kicking and screaming to red side.

Those that want to play red side, will.  No incentive will make someone play it, and stick with it.

 

I tried it for about a month, and just didn’t like the idea behind being a villain.

 

if you enjoy it, play it and be happy the option is available.

[Shenanigunner]

2 hours ago, Greycat said:

Well... some people just don't *enjoy* redside. (or gold.) So...

 

I just kinda wonder how many players have never really tried it, because of all the trash talk and (talk about ouroboros) the low player population. But I'd sure hate to kick anyone out of their blue-tights comfort zone. 😄 😄 😄

[Techwright]

1 hour ago, Ghost said:

I think people need to stop tying to find ways to drag others kicking and screaming to red side.

Those that want to play red side, will.  No incentive will make someone play it, and stick with it.

 

 

I'm not sure this suggestion is about dragging unwilling people to the red side, though I'm sure there are those who would act that way.  Villains.   I'm thinking it is more about offering an organized event that encourages people who want to experience the red side via team play to come together at a recognized time. 

[Darmian]

4 hours ago, Greycat said:

Well... some people just don't *enjoy* redside. (or gold.) So...

GOLD!

 

So good.  Brought to you by the Cole Administration. (AND the Resistance, oddly enough)

[Take One]

This might be accomplished by having the WST fluctuate between Red-side and Blue-side with one neutral option each week, instead of what we have now.

So week one, we get a blue TF and a co-op one, week two we get a red SF and a co-op one. And so on.

[Sunsette]

I ... don't think that would be a well-received idea. I like the event planning! Call it, IDK, Monthly Megalomania

[Shenanigunner]

I am (as almost always) puzzled by the number of people who read a suggestion as some kind of enforced activity, as if I'd suggested shutting down Blueside for a week or month, or requiring players to play only Redside, or something. This is the third or fourth time I've posted something like, "Hey, why don't we..." as a suggestion and been severely taken to task for trying to tell players they have to do something they don't wanna.

 

As much as I love this community, some of its members have... reading comprehension as narrow as the phone screen they're probably reading it on.

[Darmian]

Oh all the old gods forbid that anything should be suggested, or changed, even if for the better!

[Triumphant]

1 hour ago, Shenanigunner said:

I am (as almost always) puzzled by the number of people who read a suggestion as some kind of enforced activity, as if I'd suggested shutting down Blueside for a week or month, or requiring players to play only Redside, or something. This is the third or fourth time I've posted something like, "Hey, why don't we..." as a suggestion and been severely taken to task for trying to tell players they have to do something they don't wanna.

 

As much as I love this community, some of its members have... reading comprehension as narrow as the phone screen they're probably reading it on.

 

I don't get it, either.  Perhaps they have the exact play environment that they desire and they're afraid that if players try something new, they might enjoy it, and that it will cause a shift in preference that will alter the play environment in a way that they find unsatisfying?

 

I wish people could be more open-minded and less paranoid, and not have knee-jerk reactions to a simple suggestion, but this is perhaps too much to wish for from the human species in the 21st century.  🤷‍♂️

 

 

[Greycat]

1 hour ago, Shenanigunner said:

I am (as almost always) puzzled by the number of people who read a suggestion as some kind of enforced activity, as if I'd suggested shutting down Blueside for a week or month, or requiring players to play only Redside, or something. This is the third or fourth time I've posted something like, "Hey, why don't we..." as a suggestion and been severely taken to task for trying to tell players they have to do something they don't wanna.

 

As much as I love this community, some of its members have... reading comprehension as narrow as the phone screen they're probably reading it on.

 

 

.... interesting that you see responses that say flat out "tried it, didn't like it" as "taking you to task." Closest I see to what you describe is Ghost's reply with the "kicking and screaming" line, and even there they say "I tried it for a month and didn't like it."

 

(And yes, alternating the WST to be strictly red/coop one week, blue/coop, would immediately have people complaining about being "forced" to play redside. Having the PVP warzone contact you used to have to see being just inside the warzone gate had people complaining loud and long about being "forced" to PVP, eventually getting them moved out of the zone, and that was a total of a few seconds and a click. People consider the oddest things to be 'forced.')

 

There's nothing wrong with an event. But you have to understand there's a lot about redside people do *not* like - and while yes, people would probably give it a try ... you may end up with more of a backlash of "Ugh, I tried redside and don't like it" at the end. I don't think the end result would be much of a population boost. Possibly a few more people going Rogue or Vig to do both sides.

 

As for why people don't like redside? That's been asked since - well, probably the single-digit issues on live. People don't like the environment, they don't like the "better written" storylines for various reasons, they don't like being beholden to Recluse or Arachnos or treated like a lackey (even if the original devs started trying non-lackey-izing dialog, like Mr. G - who still sounds like he's leading you along, IMHO.)

 

Honestly, I figured AE would be a boon to redside because of one specific complaint - tied to the last line of that last paragraph. Heroes tend to be reactive - something happens, they prevent it, rescue it, fix it or throw it in jail. Villains tend to be *pro*active - they scheme, they plot, run heists, plots, etc. and there's just not much chance to *do* that (again, most of the writing makes you do someone else's bidding, you're hired muscle, etc.) outside of AE. Plus you can be your own type of villainy - from "redside antihero" to "I murder kittens and babies for fun."

 

 

In the end? If you want to do this I'd say:

1. More lead time. Because you'll need the planning (and advertising) time. Last week of September to not interfere with halloween stuff, for instance. Still close, but it gives time.

2. Find out who does things redside on each server. Coordinate. Get backup people to run whatever you want to run, as well, because life happens.

3. Advertise. Here, yes (and not as a "what if we..." but "Hey, we're doing this!") and on each server board.

4. With #2 and #3, get in touch with the GMs both for help getting the word out (GMOTD, official messages it's coming out) and possibly for help with server events. ("Deathsurge vs Scrapyard, who will win? Neither, we're going to gank them both!")

5. Run it.

 

... After all, you're a villain. Be proactive and plot. Just - like I said, don't expect a permanent population uptick of much, because there *are* reasons that have been hashed over for years of why people don't play (or stay) redside. Ongoing redside interest means ongoing redside events, similiar to Tanker Tuesday ("Villainous Vednesday" maybe?) and strong, interesting redside VGs to do that. (And I still suspect, just because of the side imbalance, you'll still mostly get people shifting grey versus red-only characters at best.)

[PsiBug]

Hi,

Players who are not interested in doing redside content for its own sake might be lured over to the red side by:

1) a weekly scheduled event with an active VG or coalition that does not conflict with other regularly scheduled events like Hami, MSR etc

2) a weekly event immediately following or preceding the weekly redside  Hami on any server that has such a thing.

3) a weekly themed event such as "all Mastermind", "all Storm", "all Rad" (one of my absolute favorites from live), "all Defender/Corruptor"...

4) Giant Monster hunts, possibly supplemented with the running of a related story arc

5) a league that starts at level 1 and proceeds together, possibly with one or more tough high level players to ensure successful progress.

6) any reliable team that runs on a regular schedule during a convenient time slot

7) Tip and alignment missions for merit earning

8 ) Weekly Strike Target

 

Possibly, if you can connect yourself with one or more active VGs, you can help organize something that will draw more people to red side. But it'll probably require you (or someone) to do a lot of planning, advertising and coordinating.

Edited July 13, 2021 by PsiBug

[Shenanigunner]

All very reasonable, 'Cat.

 

I just don't think the discussion went (1) where originally directed or (2) in any useful direction.

 

You tried Redside and don't like it? Fine. No one's going to force you over there (and that's kinda-sorta implied in some of the other posts).

 

You hate Redside so much nothing can drag you back there?  Fine.

 

You tried Redside, didn't like it because of the low player population, or it didn't grab you, or you didn't find any reason to like it, or you've just listened to all the trash talk and never tried it at all? So gosh, golly and holey rusted metal, Batman... how about we mob the place and give it a mass shot, so that maybe some players will find they do like it, or at least rummage around in some different missions for a change, or just spend a session or two confirming why you really, really don't like the Redside vibe?

 

But naah, just spend the same amount of time and effort explaining why it's a stupid idea not just for you, but for any player who's not you.

 

Sigh.

 

And for the record, I'm totally meh about Redside. Run around it occasionally with a Villain or Rogue, like some of it, tend to leave partly because it's so deserted, like those years of using Icon to run around the deserted maps. But I'd like to roll up a pop and a few teams for all the reasons I first listed.

 

 

Edited July 13, 2021 by Shenanigunner

[Xiddo]

I’m always a little confused by these “get more people redside!” posts. I play at a not hugely populated time on excelsior, as I’m in the UK, and there’s usually people about who wanna be troublesome.

It’s been happening so frequently I’ve swapped my PB over to rogue so that if and when there isn’t a team running, I can start one (also I think the 45-50 contacts for redside are more engaging and varied).

 

Don’t get me wrong, I think it’s a solid shout that people are thinking of ways to entice people over to check out the gameplay there. But I’m not sure people need that much of push? If more people try to run content there, then over time it’ll just become less alien or a chore to jump over.

As an example, this week Ive teamed with someone called Fortuna Webb a few times (not sure of global). I joined them at lvl 14, did some missions, and got the Shivan badge in the mission where they’re in a lab. About 3 of the 8 of us all said “I didn’t know this was here, I’m going to run this on other toons”.

Yesterday, when Webb was about 33ish, we did Piecemeal’s arc and everyone who hadn’t done it before said “that was great fun, I had no idea it existed!”.

 

I don’t think redside will ever be a thriving metropolis, but those who want more people there can help sow the seeds for people to see why it can be fun by running the content and shouting about why they love it.

[Ukase]

2 hours ago, Shenanigunner said:

As much as I love this community, some of its members have... reading comprehension as narrow as the phone screen they're probably reading it on.

This made me laugh, because I am continuously amazed when my daughters use their phone ...to text me. They don't call, they text. And when they text, I call them. And then I say, you have a phone, why are you texting? TALK on the phone. That's what it's for and why it was invented. 

But, to your point, reading comprehension is a skill that is lost on many. The longer it is, the less likely someone will read the entire thing, and the less likely they'll grasp what you're trying to say. 

[Dazl]

I played the game at launch, so when CoV came out some friends and I jumped red side. At the time it was cool because of the new AT’s and different setting. However once we got it out of our systems we wandered back to the blue side.
 

One way you could draw more people red and gold side is to up the rewards over blue side. More influence, merits and experience  might incentivize more people to play there.

[Shenanigunner]

1 minute ago, Dazl said:

I played the game at launch, so when CoV came out some friends and I jumped red side. At the time it was cool because of the new AT’s and different setting. However once we got it out of our systems we wandered back to the blue side.

 

This, more or less. Now that all ATs are available in all alignments, there's less draw to play Redside just to get a Brute or Stalker.

 

I have always had and maintained a few reds/crossovers in my lineup but I still tend to spend most time over in the Blue zones...

[Greycat]

1 hour ago, Shenanigunner said:

But naah, just spend the same amount of time and effort explaining why it's a stupid idea not just for you, but for any player who's not you.

 

Given you started with me specifically, I'm taking all the "you"s as being me. So let me set a few things straight.

 

1. I'm being realistic given player feedback about redside since live. An effort like this shouldn't be made expecting a sudden, sustained redside explosion. You'll have a few more people, yes. And possibly - more likely - others who take their blueside characters grey so they can cross over on occasion. But you're not going to see - say - a steady 60/40 or so split, blue vs red. And just a one time thing on short notice... I'd be surprised if you saw much of a blip.

 

2. I play redside as well. Not as often, no. But I have dedicated red characters. Mostly because it fits the characters. I'm very much a *character* player, not a min/maxer, not a "go for the most rewards" sort.

 

3. Nowhere in there did I say it was a stupid idea, or I wouldn't  have laid out an example roadmap to try to get more impact. Something more than one post that, if I might be blunt, is a very wishy-washy "hey, why don't people do this" sounding post. You want impact, make a solid plan, get people on board on more than one server and do the work. Events that *are* recurring or have been in the past took that. You want a lasting impact, a lasting redside boost, get ready to put the work in, including crafting something you can hand over when you're not around for someone else to pick up. Make it something people go to, and want to keep coming back to.

 

I do however have to mention that I find it somewhat amusing that someone complaining about reading comprehension complains that people are calling this a stupid idea when *nowhere in any post made in response* has anybody said that. Said it's not for them, yes. Said to do things differently, yes. "This is a stupid idea?" Or "Not just not for me, but for anybody else?" Nothing that can even be remotely taken that way without some severe folding, spindling and mutilating.

 

 

[DoctorDitko]

"This is a stupid idea."

 

Everyone happy now?

 

OK, on to suggestions: What you need is a charismatic team leader who knows Redside backwards and forwards. Advertise the event well in advance, and in LFG on the day. Offer to buy temp powers or P2W travel powers for anyone lacking, so there's always a quick path to the next mish. Depart from Pocket D so Null is handy.

 

Then at the end of a great arc, or TF, or whatever, come back here and rave about how much fun it was (if it was...).

Bring pictures!
 

This is not original with me. This is the formula RoboTechMaster used to use to run the infamous Doctor Q TF in the Shadow Shard.

 

On Live, this was an arduous 8-to-10 hour slogfest. (It got ever slower as folks bailed.) The way he ran it, it was a 2-hour freewheeling mayhem party. On WTF week, you grabbed 288 merits for running the damn thing. Amazing.

 

All the worlds lost a great talent and a great person with his passing. But we can learn from him!

(And his damn cat pun characters!)

 

 

Edited July 14, 2021 by DoctorDitko
cat puns

[Ghost]

I know that I never said it was a stupid idea

What I was/am trying to say is - stop putting so much effort into trying to trick/entice/beg/plead/threaten/trick/convince players into joining redside. (and Im saying it this way to cover EVERYONE who does it, not just you OP) 

How much fun would you be having on red if everyone put this much effort into organizing what villains there are onto one shard?  Or one huge event, on one shard on a regular basis (without an agenda)?

 

Sorry if people think I misunderstood the OPs intent - but going by the sentence "where all the heroes hang up their capes for a vacation and as we get as much of the community as possible to get their Villain ya-yas out" sure as heck sounds to me like another way of saying "where we convince blueside players to come play redside"

 

Instead, redside players have this firm belief that if they could just get everyone else to try it, they would fall in love with it - you know, like how vegans/vegetarians always push their agenda.  Meat eaters push theirs.  It just does not work.  It ends up having the opposite effect, and pushes people even further away to the point of refusing to try - which I think is the case with some people.  

 

You aren't being taken to task Shenanigunner - you used the phrase "How about".  In other words, you wanted opinions.

If you don't, then next time say "Only respond if you agree with me"

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 14, 2021 by Ghost

[Greycat]

56 minutes ago, Ghost said:

If you don't, then next time say "Only respond if you agree with me"

 

 

... well, no. Doing that just brings out the 50+4, fully IO'd smartass in people like me to say some variation of "you can't make me." :)

[Shenanigunner]

4 hours ago, Greycat said:

Given you started with me specifically, I'm taking all the "you"s as being me. So let me set a few things straight.

 

The English, she lack a good general second-person pronoun.

 

NOT targeted at you-you.

[Shenanigunner]

2 hours ago, Ghost said:

You aren't being taken to task Shenanigunner - you used the phrase "How about".  In other words, you wanted opinions.

If you don't, then next time say "Only respond if you agree with me"

 

"How about a beer?" does not invite a long discourse about how you're allergic to gluten.

 

Most of the responses were not to my "How's about" but to why Red side sucks or why they can't be dragged there again.

 

I'm sure the difference will be apparent with a few moment's thought, or a beer.

Edited July 14, 2021 by Shenanigunner