Changes to Fly, Hover, Afterburner, etc.

[Sonarr]

Having played CoH for over a dozen years, and being quite familiar with how all of the power within the Fly power set function, and interact with one another, the recent changes to these powers are… not good.

 

Fly and Hover should be mutually exclusive.  Afterburner should be a toggle, and NOT shut down when flying halfway across a large zone.  If I wanted Evasive Maneuvers, I'd have taken the power set that offered that power -- and I'm fairly certain Hover had that handled anyway.

 

This new setup makes the powers more complicated than they need to be.

 

Basically… restore them to their original functions?  Please?

 

-S

[Glacier Peak]

I like them the way they are. I'm going to vote no on this suggestion. 

[Wavicle]

I like the changes, though I completely understand wanting the old way.

 

You can have them work basically the old way by making a keybind that switches between them such as /bind f "powexectoggleon hover$$powexectoggleon fly".

[TombTyrant]

Disagree. The changes are really great for getting around faster and spending less time switching flight modes. Also, because the base fly speed was made so much faster, even if you do run out of Afterburner, you will still arrive at your mission hella quicker than ever before. And I don't find that Afterburner is even needed most of the time.

[ZacKing]

2 hours ago, TombTyrant said:

The changes are really great for getting around faster and spending less time switching flight modes. 

 

How long does it take to click between Fly and Hover?  LOL

 

OP, I couldn't agree more but that ship has sailed.  You'll find no one here wants feedback that goes against anything they do.  People just want affirmation, not criticism of any kind.  Agree this made the travel pools more complicated than they needed to be. 

[arcane]

Most people like the changes a lot because 

 

Things we didn’t have available before:

Defense and good fly speed are no longer mutually exclusive

Flight control in combat and good fly speed are no longer mutually exclusive

(!) -Fly protection

(!) An alternative to Leaping for immobilize/kb protections

No need to switch toggles, fire and forget

 

Things we don’t have available anymore:

Toggle Afterburner

 

So, sorry, no vote to going backwards on this.

Edited August 4, 2021 by arcane

[Aurora_Girl]

12 hours ago, Sonarr said:

Having played CoH for over a dozen years, and being quite familiar with how all of the power within the Fly power set function, and interact with one another, the recent changes to these powers are… not good.

 

Fly and Hover should be mutually exclusive.  Afterburner should be a toggle, and NOT shut down when flying halfway across a large zone.  If I wanted Evasive Maneuvers, I'd have taken the power set that offered that power -- and I'm fairly certain Hover had that handled anyway.

 

This new setup makes the powers more complicated than they need to be.

 

Basically… restore them to their original functions?  Please?

 

-S

 

Do you know how any of these powers actually work, or are you legitimately just trolling?

[Outrider_01]

Aside from a slight endurance consumption increase running fly/hover at the same time; its an improvement.  Afterburner is a booster, you don't need it 24/7.  Evasive Maneuvers is the power that sold flight with a speed boost, mobility, and-fly protection. 

 

only downside is 3 picks where 2 are identical with different speeds.  Flight and hover should be 1 power, hover is replaced as something else, evasive Maneuvers as a tier 3 like acrobatics.

[Sonarr]

12 hours ago, Aurora_Girl said:

 

Do you know how any of these powers actually work, or are you legitimately just trolling?

Every other person who responded did so respectfully and politely.

 

You came in throwing sticks.  I don't have time for you.

 

Go chase your own sticks.

 

-S

[Aurora_Girl]

It was a legitimate question. 

[lemming]

I like the changes.  The only negative is that Afterburner is only for 30 seconds, but on the other hand, I'm not spending another power slot for it.  (Though Evasive is nice enough to spend it)

And everything is faster now.

[Sakura Tenshi]

On 8/3/2021 at 8:40 PM, Sonarr said:

Fly and Hover should be mutually exclusive.

 

Real question: can you explain the logic behind this? From my standpoint, stacking the two works well because

• You can now fly fast and have good control (as a basebuilder this is kind of a godsend)
• You can have some extra defense while in transit, handy for Peregrine and Founders' where snipers abound.
• The two together would be too end costly to keep them going through combat, so you'll still probably want to toggle off fly once a fight formally starts. (that and travel suppression)

[Wavicle]

Also, Fitness should be a power pool again, IOs and Incarnate powers should be removed from the game, and you should have to go to Icon to change your costume and to Wentworth's to use the market.

/s

 

Change is difficult, but these changes were good ones.

Edited August 7, 2021 by Wavicle

[Sovera]

On 8/4/2021 at 4:40 AM, Sonarr said:

Having played CoH for over a dozen years, and being quite familiar with how all of the power within the Fly power set function, and interact with one another, the recent changes to these powers are… not good.

 

Fly and Hover should be mutually exclusive.  Afterburner should be a toggle, and NOT shut down when flying halfway across a large zone.  If I wanted Evasive Maneuvers, I'd have taken the power set that offered that power -- and I'm fairly certain Hover had that handled anyway.

 

This new setup makes the powers more complicated than they need to be.

 

Basically… restore them to their original functions?  Please?

 

-S

 

 

You come a bit late. There was a month(s) old period of testing and feedback where things got changed (Evasive Maneuvers started with an absurd 0.56 cost). You are perfectly entitled to your opinion and not liking the changes, but it's both late and a minority I fear.

 

As others mentioned the changes were all positive. We now fly faster than before and straight up at level 4 if we want to, instead of flying super slowly at 4 until eventually flying at the maximum speed at level 50. Fly + Hover also got rid of Fly's annoying drift. Evasive Maneuvers added -more- knockback protection, and makes Hover go so much faster now that is very welcome and useful while in missions. On top of it Evasive Maneuvers is perfectly optional unlike Afterburner. Taking Flight but not Afterburner made Fly too slow to be of use as a travel power.

 

Timed tests were done during the feedback period and pre-changes Flight + Afterburner did not turn to be superior to post-changes despite Afterburner having been turned into a clickie.

 

 

Now I'm sure this is all nice and good but that it won't change your mind. You dislike it and that's your prerogative.

 

P.S. You can have keybinds to turn off Hover and turn on Fly and viceversa with a single button.

Edited August 8, 2021 by Sovera

[ZacKing]

On 8/6/2021 at 2:06 AM, Sakura Tenshi said:

You can have some extra defense while in transit, handy for Peregrine and Founders' where snipers abound.

 

I think in all my years playing this game I've been shot maybe twice in PI and FF by a sniper.  I don't think saying extra defense is a plus in this scenario. lol

[Rathulfr]

1 hour ago, ZacKing said:

I think in all my years playing this game I've been shot maybe twice in PI and FF by a sniper.  I don't think saying extra defense is a plus in this scenario. lol

 

Interesting, because in all my years playing this game, I'm shot by snipers in FF or PI at least once or twice a week.  They never do me much harm, but it's pretty common/routine.  I guess that either they like me more than you, or I travel more dangerous routes than you.  😄

 

[Glacier Peak]

I get shot by Snipers when I am within their level range. Even with +120ft of stealth from a distance. They got that mad perception to overcome it. When I am over their level range, they ignore me. I tend to get hit by them the most when I jump in to an Ouro mission that takes me to Founders Falls.

[srmalloy]

2 hours ago, Rathulfr said:

Interesting, because in all my years playing this game, I'm shot by snipers in FF or PI at least once or twice a week. 

It's rare for me to get shot at by a sniper in PI, probably because I don't spend much time in the area where they normally spawn. FF, however, is another story. Atop the buildings in the SE, on the awnings between the two E/W rows of buildings in the west, the Nemesis sniper on the east side of the N/S building west of that corridor, another on the roof WSW of Peter Stemitz, and more on the awnings on the N/S road south of the hospital -- there are snipers across much of the zone.

[ZacKing]

1 hour ago, Glacier Peak said:

I get shot by Snipers when I am within their level range. Even with +120ft of stealth from a distance. They got that mad perception to overcome it. When I am over their level range, they ignore me. I tend to get hit by them the most when I jump in to an Ouro mission that takes me to Founders Falls.

 

^ This.  Honestly, I don't think I've even seen one in PI in months, let alone get shot at.  FF too.

[arcane]

17 minutes ago, ZacKing said:

 

^ This.  Honestly, I don't think I've even seen one in PI in months, let alone get shot at.  FF too.

Good thing the defense is usable in combat so this sniper red herring is irrelevant.

[Bill Z Bubba]

5 hours ago, arcane said:

Good thing the defense is usable in combat so this sniper red herring is irrelevant.

 

Only until you attack, buff someone, give a pet command...

 

Only thing I find useful about evasive maneuvers is being a mule for a LotG+recharge.

 

At least when afterburner was a toggle I could fly all around IP with it on for badge hunting.

 

It was a bad change but whatever. Not important at all when we're all packing team teleports and the like.

[arcane]

12 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

Only until you attack, buff someone, give a pet command...

 

Only thing I find useful about evasive maneuvers is being a mule for a LotG+recharge.

 

At least when afterburner was a toggle I could fly all around IP with it on for badge hunting.

 

It was a bad change but whatever. Not important at all when we're all packing team teleports and the like.

I thought we were talking about Hover sorry. 
 

This change made Fly more than an LotG mule pool to me. If I pick the pool now, it’s all three toggles on all the time. Nice to have Hover’s defense feel usable (I don’t slow myself down for nobody).

Edited August 11, 2021 by arcane

[Bill Z Bubba]

2 hours ago, arcane said:

I thought we were talking about Hover sorry. 
 

This change made Fly more than an LotG mule pool to me. If I pick the pool now, it’s all three toggles on all the time. Nice to have Hover’s defense feel usable (I don’t slow myself down for nobody).

 

Nice. I'd have to change a lot to cover that end usage. As it stands, for my ranged characters, I'll leave on hover all the time and toggle fly on and off as needed.

 

For the meleers, I use powexecname binds for fly, hover and afterburner (H, J and K) so I can just click them again to turn them off.

[arcane]

24 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

Nice. I'd have to change a lot to cover that end usage. As it stands, for my ranged characters, I'll leave on hover all the time and toggle fly on and off as needed.

 

For the meleers, I use powexecname binds for fly, hover and afterburner (H, J and K) so I can just click them again to turn them off.

This has it’s pros and cons, but I just take Ageless Core without hesitation if I have to. This leaves me with small issues, like how my Shield/EM’s health bar moves a little more than yours, but it’s just a lot easier than worrying about endurance. Either that, or a lot of my proc monsters take Vigor Core. I’m just an aggressive/reckless player and only have Barrier/Rebirth/Clarion after end is clearly established as a non-issue.
 

Oh, and if I don’t have Ageless Core, I slot recovery powers more than most people because I can’t stand endurance problems. 2 Performance Shifter / 2 Power Transfer (+95.9% plus two procs) is normal for me for Stamina, Quick Recovery, Blaster sustains.

 

Though a large chunk of fliers would be Blasters who can handle their end just fine.

Edited August 11, 2021 by arcane

[Sovera]

Being shot by snipers is such a non thing. Yeah, sometimes one of them shoots me. Perhaps because I'm a tank but they take a small sliver of HP. But I doubt they are denting even a squishy's HP bar.

 

But ignoring the EvM defense aspect (which seems more flavor than anything actually useful) the extra KB protection it gives solidifies things for Fire Armor/Dark Armor where even a pylon can no longer KB in the presence of even just one -KB IO.

 

And EvM also increases the speed of Fly and of Hover. Permanently as long as toggled on. For missioning the extra speed boost is wonderful since Hover is so natively slow.

 

And since Fly no longer detoggles Hover and just increases it speed while keeping Hover's pinpoint turn-on-a-dime I find I just toggle Fly on and off when I want speed in a mission where before I would use a jump pack to increase Hover's speed.

 

 

The factual truth is that we are flying as fast now with Fly + EvM, permanently, as low as level 14 as we were with Fly + Afterburner (permanently, but unable to interact with anything) at level 50 (not even close to at level 14 since Fly used to be coded to be slow at such low levels), but then we now also get the new Afterburner pushing even faster, -still- at level 14!