Looking for opinions on secondary for Illusion Control Dominator

[Ravenwulfe]

I know, the set is still only in beta right now but I am theorycrafting on what I want to build, but I have always wanted illusion dominator ever since dominators came out and never understood why this set wasn't apart of dominators since the most prolific illusionists in comic books were villains (like Mysterio and Scarecrow).

 

Currently I think I pretty much have the primary in lockdown on powers I want, but the problem is the secondary. Originally I thought sonic assault but after playing for a bit I found sonic really grates on my nerves after a while, much like Symphony, sadly. So I was considering Dark Assault, but not sure on that, and my other option I am considering is Radiation Assault.  And I think something can be said for fiery assault and maybe even energy assault so looking for some advice on that.

 

To help out, the concept of the character is basically a Ringmaster, hence original plans for Sonic Assault, but I think something that is flashy could work. I don't really want to do psi assault since I want the offset to avoid enemy types (like robots) that are resistant to psi (aka emotional) damage.

[TygerDarkstorm]

So far lots of the beta testers seem to be pairing it with Energy Assault. I went with Savage Assault myself both for a concept, and so far, it feels like they have some good synergy.

[Ravenwulfe]

I like savage assault, but my dark control dominator is already that. Conceptually a vampire. So wanting to try something different with the Ill Control.

[biostem]

48 minutes ago, Ravenwulfe said:

To help out, the concept of the character is basically a Ringmaster, hence original plans for Sonic Assault, but I think something that is flashy could work. I don't really want to do psi assault since I want the offset to avoid enemy types (like robots) that are resistant to psi (aka emotional) damage.

Sonic assault seems like a natural for illusion, since the -res is a way to indirectly increase the damage your phantom army will do.  Savage assault is great not just for the fitting attacks, but you also have a self heal and stacking end cost and recharge time reduction buffs.

[Arcadio]

I was thinking about using Elec. Could be pretty cool to have 6 pets blasting away, and some decent personal damage on top.

[Frosticus]

I think you will be good with any secondary you like as illusion is very good on doms.

honestly ill/x/ice can breeze through most encounters, so anything you add just speeds it up.

 

I think there are 4 secondaries that stand out most to me

/dark - self heal and -tohit to stack with spec terror

/energy - stuns to stack with gleam and PA's melee punches

/sonic - additional -res to boost PA

/sav - additional +rech to boost uptime of PA

 

/fire would have been unreal if PA still taunted, but it will still offer a ton of st damage.

 

I've tried out ill/fire, ill/son and ill/sav and the ill/sav/ice is just great and really fun. Teleporting around while your mirror images fight along side you is very iconic feeling. It will be my selection for live. 

[Ravenwulfe]

I guess I could do savage again. I have really liked it as a set as a whole. And with our power to skip the bees in this next update I will have better options, probably.

[biostem]

4 hours ago, Arcadio said:

I was thinking about using Elec. Could be pretty cool to have 6 pets blasting away, and some decent personal damage on top.

You'd get the sentinel, but it's more of a Gradius option the plinks away besides you.  Where's the 6th pet coming from?  Epics? Incarnates could give you 2 more.  Are you counting the decoy phantasm?

Edited October 12, 2022 by biostem

[Arcadio]

5 hours ago, biostem said:

You'd get the sentinel, but it's more of a Gradius option the plinks away besides you.  Where's the 6th pet coming from?  Epics? Incarnates could give you 2 more.  Are you counting the decoy phantasm?

Ya 3 PAs, Sentinel, Phantasm, and Decoy. Could get a patron pet too.

[Sovera]

I'm tempted at making an illusion Dom and play it like a ranged Sentinel (yes, fully ranged doms miss out, but, I mean, people do play petless MMS...).

 

After looking at the different choices logically it would be better to pick a secondary that allows for KBs in order to have FF procs to help PA return faster. This narrows things a great deal.

 

 

Savage was definitely something I felt had potential in terms of theme (ignore the name of the sets for a moment) with more constructs/illusions in the form of hawks, bees and ravens being that the Hawk power does KD. But only two ranged powers in Savage, but since Savage is (apparently) good this is still something to consider for those not gimping themselves.

 

There is Energy, but that KB tax... I mean, I did want KB, but too much is too much.

 

Thorn has the KB and enough ranged powers to stay at range. The cone animates faster than cones usually do and also recharges faster.

 

Icy Assault has no KBs but the ranged attacks are blistering fast and it can do a gatling gun build.

 

Fire is... fire. Still going to be the thing to go for in pure damage. The AoE is the crummy Fire Breath though and crummier Combustion (I don't think it even got the animation shaving that Fire Melee got).

 

 

I'm thinking that I will go with Dark though even despite not having any KB to its name. It has enough ranged attacks to be at range and the small heal helps with recouping HP lost even staying hovering.

[Voltak]

TOP tier dmg 
Dark assault and lots of utility , the melee and the range all hit hard. 
Fire dmg zero utility 
Energy (Stuns and Knocks)

Honor mention
Psi assault strong dmg and utility 
Earth assault strong dmg fast casting hold. that hits like a nuke and a power boost)

[laudwic]

6 hours ago, Sovera said:

 

There is Energy, but that KB tax... I mean, I did want KB, but too much is too much.

 

 

 

I've just soloed a Syn/Energy to 50 and I've been testing an Ill/Energy, if your concern with Energy is Knockback, honestly, you'll learn to manage, it isn't too bad anyways, and, frankly, it is a heck of an asset.  I five slot both Sniper Blas and Power Burst with sets for recharge bonuses, then put a Force Feedback chance for recharge in both.  I don't bother to put in more because you can't have many proc at once.  

 

Note, the set is good but when you have Total Focus and Power Burst the set really takes off.

 

In play, Total Focus can defeat minions in one hit, then you get Energy Focus and can either take the damage bonus with Power Burst or use Bone Smasher with it's great additional effects like harming their regeneration.  (especially if you take the Power Up bonus)

 

My Illusion/Energy on test is nice.  Not as good as my Symphony/Energy (Confounding Chant is just that good, and they need to fix Phantom Army and Phantasm - I do not understand why they are currently worse at both damage and control when compared to the Controller version.  Hopefully they'll fix it.)

 

Energy is a really really good set.  Don't let knockback concern you.  You will find it to be an asset, or manage it if you have to.  You won't need Kb->Kd unless you want to put it in Phants.

Edited October 13, 2022 by laudwic
Wanted to emphasis that this is a late blooming set

[Ravenwulfe]

Yea, starting to lean more towards fiery myself at this point. Since we won't have a need to take the tier 1 anymore that opens up better options for picks going down the line, of course. And going that route I might go with the fire epic pool for rain of fire and of course melt armor to.

 

If Earth had the ability to make the stone mallet look like the carnie mallet I would have easily gone that route but I don't think, thematically, I can make it work with either the lava or crystal. Just not into knockback from energy pom poms. And I don't want to double up on psi damage since well the enemies that are resistant to psi are really resistant to it. I would do savage but I already have a dark/savage dom. Dark sounds interesting but I dunno. I had fiery on live and I know I liked that set a lot.

 

So my question, how does combustion work for proc damage? I know in heart of darkness that turns that into a mini nuke which is my plan for gleam as a targeted mini nuke, so just curious if combustion would work similarly?

Edited October 13, 2022 by Ravenwulfe

[QuiJon]

The last few dominators i have really had fun with were doms that locked down everything and then did AOE damage.  So like my Plant/earth, Plant/Psi, and the one i really liked was Fire/dark. It was so fun that by the time even if my holds slipped with dark they were so debuffed on accuracy that even against non-capped defense they really couldnt hit anything.

 

So right now i am leaning to dark or Psi honestly. My main issue is until i play it, i am not sure how the knock about crap in the pets is going to effect my ability to maintain a control and have enemies stay within range of the PBAOEs in the sets. But i guess dont be surprised if one of those two are not my starting point but i might pivot when i play it more. 

[Lazarillo]

I've done some testing with /Dark and /Savage because I'm trying to come up with a good combo as well.  /Dark feels right thematically but I haven't been able to put together a build I like for it.  /Savage seems a very solid combo, but for me, unfortunately, is /Savage and I really hate the janky frenzy/exhausted mechanics.

 

Other stuff I'm looking at:

/Thorns - Looks great on paper.  Redraw might get annoying though.  Spines and Thorns needs the No Redraw option, stat.

/Elec - Might be fun, but has more KB than I'd like.

/Psi - Good, thematic, and solid, but I worry a little about pairing two Psi-based sets due to enemy defense/resistance issues.

[Mezmera]

There's lots of good assaults that would mesh well with Illusion.  It does tend to play more in melee what with that pbaoe hold so you might want to consider a complimentary set with good melee and range.  

 

Energy is top tier ST damage, likely the king if you like to play melee/range hybrid.  Dark is also a great assault with nice damage and lots of utility with that -tohitt and the heal.  Fire is great damage as well but plays better at range.  I think Psi would do well with Illusion thanks to some good pbaoe damage and utility in the +regen.  Earth might be okay, I just don't like Earth assault because there's too many good powers and not many consolidated great ones like you find in other assaults.  Savage might be fun with that teleport attack and good pbaoe damage.  

 

Lots of choices but the new t2 secondary power structure will certainly benefit all the assaults.  Illusion doms are certainly going to be fun though.  

Edited October 14, 2022 by Mezmera

[Ravenwulfe]

Yea another thing I m considering is the option of a secondary proc master power to go with Gleam. Mud pots sticks out to me, of course but thematically the stone stuff just won't work. I can imagine psi, but again doubling up on psi will be a slog against psi resistant enemies that especially appear in late game. Whirling Hands in energy is a joke so not even a consideration, even with procs, though I have looked at radioactive assaults AoE attack... problem is the rest of the set leaves a lot to be desired from my understanding. Fiery I loved on live because it was a great jousting set, but that was back when dominator damage was low until they were in domination. I can see making use of combustion as a proc master power but again not sure.

 

I am fairly certain I am going to be taking fire mastery though just for rain of fire and melt armor for sure just to make the deal even more devastating. I will have to figure something out though, eventually.

[Shocktacular]

On 10/14/2022 at 1:27 PM, Ravenwulfe said:

 thematically the stone stuff just won't work

Use crystals.  Make a prism- or lens-themed character.  Maybe even a stained-glass window?

[Ravenwulfe]

2 minutes ago, Shocktacular said:

Use crystals.  Make a prism- or lens-themed character.  Maybe even a stained-glass window?

My theme was already a ringmaster so that was set. But I went with fiery I loved the set on live so ill/fiery for HC.

[honoroit]

earth assault. its close call against savage, but may work well with a less busy / quick anim except blind, powerset.  spectral, blind, and then a melee or combo therein. 

 

id really try to figure 'how can spectral wounds make this attack chain on secondary work)... theres many options in earth assault. skip mud pots / hot footbath / whatever its called.

 

play a bunch through 12 or so, get a feel. if it doesnt feel good by 12, it wont. and no, a lvl32 attack and nothing else on the way (elec melee) idn'nt'gonn'er'cut'it.

 

also backing recommendations for /savage. just dont look back. get something like combat jumping with good height and abuse the range bonus on the tp leap. 

 

and..... thorns, is good. it has toxic. it has the awful impale flip tho. too slow, bad cone.

 

sonic looks interesting, anything pbaoe, and same for the primary if you can swing it.

 

illu can dance with superior illusion, and, even if powers not wonderous, also has options for early / easy lotg slots.

 

whatever the hell, you just want dom style pa. tell me their mag gets boosted when you dom?? do they do it too if in clone mode (ultra blind!!!)

 

i have to dl homecoming again. you have no idea the space fing oddyssey 8ve been on... good to see people are alive and well.

 

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by honoroit
honoroit is fantastic

[Frosticus]

28 minutes ago, honoroit said:

 

id really try to figure 'how can spectral wounds make this attack chain on secondary work

 

whatever the hell, you just want dom style pa. tell me their mag gets boosted when you dom?? do they do it too if in clone mode (ultra blind!!!)

Unfortunately spec Wounds didn't make the trip over.

 

Dom PA is pretty heavily nerfed compared to troller version, they dont tank, but still a good supplemental damage power. 

 

Still a great set though and spec terror at lvl 6 is making early game play a breeze on my ill/sav

[noogens2]

I tried 3 general content end game builds on the test server. All the builds had fold space (my fave power) and skipped both flash and phantasm due to a tight build.  I fought 4/8 difficulty missions with and without bosses depending on the faction but mostly tested on CoT and Council maps.   

1. ill/energy/ice - I wasn't fan.  Energy's AOE is pretty lackluster and mobs tended to scatter because they didn't die quick enough.  Adding Flash back probably would've helped the scatter  but I probably still wouldn't have liked the combo.  This build would probably be better for content that prioritizes taking down single hard targets.
2. ill/sonic/ice - This combo is pretty nice and had decent clear times due all the  -res being thrown around allowing PA to hit harder.  Sonic is a also very solid all around assault set.
3. ill/martial/ice - My fave combo.  People poo poo on martial but it has good synergies with the right primaries and a decent build.  Mob scatter was greatly mitigated by the knockdown of dragon's tail with the slow of caltrops and sleet.  Dragon's tail's knockdown also helps with damage mitigation and frequently procs force feedback to help PA recharge faster.  Out of the three builds, this one was the quickest on average clearing missions.  If all you want to do is AV hunt then this would be the weakest of the three builds.  

 

 

[Major_Decoy]

Illusion is pretty chaotic. I say lean into it. Take energy, slot entirely for knock-back and disorient. Take teleport target and fold space to get everything back into clusters.

[honoroit]

4 hours ago, Frosticus said:

Unfortunately spec Wounds didn't make the trip over.

 

Dom PA is pretty heavily nerfed compared to troller version, they dont tank, but still a good supplemental damage power. 

 

Still a great set though and spec terror at lvl 6 is making early game play a breeze on my ill/sav

curses i misread quickscan like 'spectral wall', huh?

 

well, if it works, thats a way to form groups into clumps/patches for tanks, so thats kinda neat and save skinnish too.

 

that ranged disorient aoe better be mag 3 base. all in all it looks good and the damage scaling should be much better than controllers ?? think so, by a bunch.

 

so, savage then? it has the hop at 32, if i recall. swear they gave that to dom. 'jumpy bash' or something like that, its called.  doms get the eagle too on savage.

 

...that melts centurian man tf.....

 

so character theme ideas for any who give a shit at 0418 - port mafia, stray dogs, and noir so its monocrome sepias, black ink stained blood: 

((hint, dual blades has twin chainsaws))

 

[honoroit]

On 10/14/2022 at 3:48 PM, Lazarillo said:

/Thorns - Looks great on paper.  Redraw might get annoying though.  Spines and Thorns needs the No Redraw option, stat.

it is great. its annoying with redraw. it does need a pass. more annoying in the melee users, but thatd be a dom too. first at cov launch was a plant/thorn 'orphaned hope'.

 

its been a very long time to get illu to dom. tks homecoming servers.