How to ruin it for your teammates in one easy power

[Snarky]

1 hour ago, Techwright said:

The character I was using was a level 50 Sentinel Energy Blast/Energy Aura.  The powers that all dropped simultaneously were:

Kinetic Shield

Entropy Shield

Power Shield

Maneuvers (from Leadership pool)

 

Nothing else dropped at the same time.  For example, I use hover a lot on this character, and it remained functioning.  I keep tabs on my endurance at all times and it was not discharged.  In fact, I was watching every control like a hawk the last half of the TF trying to figure out if I could match the power shut-off to some visual of a teammate's power being activated.  This problem occurred only when standing next to the team (I'd moved far away towards the end), and occurred in areas where no Freaks were, such as the Council sections of the task force. 

There is literally nothing in the game that will do this, aside from endurance hitting zero. You have emphatically ruled that out and I believe you.  I think you found a glitch.  Good luck getting the bug hunter badge.

[Luminara]

6 hours ago, Techwright said:

Yin TF.

 

Council Attendant Detention Field followed by Super Stunner rez endurance drain.

[JasperStone]

This is why I started having combat logs open in a separate tab.

When weird stuff happens, I can find out.

 

I think @Luminara nailed it.

 

[Snarky]

6 hours ago, Luminara said:

 

Council Attendant Detention Field followed by Super Stunner rez endurance drain.

but he said it happened multiplr rimes.  There is just one council a in that arc hat can do that?  Or are there more? Plus the super stunners are not where the council are.  and...

[lemming]

Weird.   There still isn't anything a teammate can do to drop your toggles.

And yea, combat logs may help.

I save all mine to file and tend to check those when something happens that I would like to disbelieve.  usually it's "Wow, that was a lot of damage in that attack..."

[cranebump]

Ran into something versus Crey today during a Manticore TF. Some sort of Taunt/Placate, but there would be significant periods of time where my melee brute couldn’t target anything. I assume one of the protectors had it, but holy moley-I didn’t have great AoEs, so there was a lot of tabbing and hoping.

[ZemX]

45 minutes ago, cranebump said:

Ran into something versus Crey today during a Manticore TF. Some sort of Taunt/Placate, but there would be significant periods of time where my melee brute couldn’t target anything. I assume one of the protectors had it, but holy moley-I didn’t have great AoEs, so there was a lot of tabbing and hoping.

 

Crey Crisis Units have an AoE confuse grenade.  Crey Juggernauts have an AoE Taunt.

 

If you can't target anything, it was probably the confuse.  If you are taunted, you see the red Taunted text under your health bars but you can still target the enemy that taunted you (and only that enemy).  Another way to get taunted is if someone on your team with an AoE taunt aura is confused.    Then you get taunted by your confused teammate.   

 

I do this all the time to my teammates with my Rad Armor tankers since RadA has no Confuse protection and little (if any) defense to deflect incoming Confuse powers.

[cranebump]

Oh, man...I figured on Crey having something, but I'm pretty sure it was the confused teammate. I've never had targeting issues like that before. And seeing as how one of my attacks seemed to hit my ally tank, that would explain it. Happened a LOT, including when I was trying to finish off some purps.

[Luminara]

3 hours ago, Snarky said:

but he said it happened multiplr rimes.  There is just one council a in that arc hat can do that?

 

Don't know.  Never done Penelope's task force.  But there is at least one Ascendant Archon, and all boss rank Ascendants (Archons or named) have Detention Field (now... don't remember when that was added, but it wasn't in their repertoire when the game was on the original servers).  Dimension Shift allows players to enter the shifted area and continue fighting, so it couldn't have been that power.  It's possible that it was a player using Black Hole, but if that had been the case, @Techwright wouldn't have been the only one speaking up, since that tends to piss off teammates en masse.

 

That exhausts the possible options for time-out powers, and between Black Hole and an enemy Detention Field, the evidence points to Detention Field.

 

As to how even a single Ascendant could keep doing it, Detention Field is on a 120s recharge, and Ascendants have that dickbag self-shield+regen+recovery move, so if the battle went on long enough, one Ascendant could use Detention Field several times, once every 2 minutes.  Pro tip: mez those fuckers.

 

But it's more likely that there was more than one.  Even if they're limited to one per spawn, my read on the situation suggests that there was chaos, multiple spawns pulled or aggroed, and several Ascendants would be possible in that scenario.  Our boy was on a melee archetype or sentinel (Energy Aura), so higher aggro modifier (2.5-4), which means more aggro.  Wouldn't be all that hard to piss off two or more Ascendants and find oneself playing "Who dropped the soap?" with them.

 

The toggle drop could only have been a result of Super Stunner rez.  @Techwright mentioned three Energy Aura powers, so it's a safe assumption that he was comparatively safe from Freakshow ranged attacks which drained endurance.  Even if he were doing the task force at native level, those toggles that he listed, by themselves, would've been sufficient to ensure that most of those attacks would've missed.  Maybe bad endurance management... but he's been around long enough to know how to take care of his blue bar, so I doubt that was the cause.  That leaves only Super Stunners.

[Snarky]

1 hour ago, Luminara said:

 

Don't know.  Never done Penelope's task force.  But there is at least one Ascendant Archon, and all boss rank Ascendants (Archons or named) have Detention Field (now... don't remember when that was added, but it wasn't in their repertoire when the game was on the original servers).  Dimension Shift allows players to enter the shifted area and continue fighting, so it couldn't have been that power.  It's possible that it was a player using Black Hole, but if that had been the case, @Techwright wouldn't have been the only one speaking up, since that tends to piss off teammates en masse.

 

That exhausts the possible options for time-out powers, and between Black Hole and an enemy Detention Field, the evidence points to Detention Field.

 

As to how even a single Ascendant could keep doing it, Detention Field is on a 120s recharge, and Ascendants have that dickbag self-shield+regen+recovery move, so if the battle went on long enough, one Ascendant could use Detention Field several times, once every 2 minutes.  Pro tip: mez those fuckers.

 

But it's more likely that there was more than one.  Even if they're limited to one per spawn, my read on the situation suggests that there was chaos, multiple spawns pulled or aggroed, and several Ascendants would be possible in that scenario.  Our boy was on a melee archetype or sentinel (Energy Aura), so higher aggro modifier (2.5-4), which means more aggro.  Wouldn't be all that hard to piss off two or more Ascendants and find oneself playing "Who dropped the soap?" with them.

 

The toggle drop could only have been a result of Super Stunner rez.  @Techwright mentioned three Energy Aura powers, so it's a safe assumption that he was comparatively safe from Freakshow ranged attacks which drained endurance.  Even if he were doing the task force at native level, those toggles that he listed, by themselves, would've been sufficient to ensure that most of those attacks would've missed.  Maybe bad endurance management... but he's been around long enough to know how to take care of his blue bar, so I doubt that was the cause.  That leaves only Super Stunners.

I love your reasoning.  But....  I have run this TF a Lot.  I mean a LOT.  Mostly on Brutes and Blasters, with some Tanks and Sentinels.  NEVER experienced this.  Never.

[Scarlet Shocker]

5 hours ago, Snarky said:

but he said it happened multiplr rimes.  There is just one council a in that arc hat can do that?  Or are there more? Plus the super stunners are not where the council are.  and...

 

I think there are many repeated spawns. The probable cause is when steamrollering one has to kill the bad bish first. It could be on a relatively inexperienced team (not their silence when asked what was going on? - yes that is a question) they didn't go for sappers. Most teams automagically know that sappers ruin your gaming experience so get them first. The rest pretty well takes care of itself, doubly so with so much power creep.

 

Personally I love the fact that a player was completely discombobulated by a game mechanic. That is actually a thing of beauty in a 20 year old game and should be celebrated

[biostem]

4 minutes ago, Snarky said:

I love your reasoning.  But....  I have run this TF a Lot.  I mean a LOT.  Mostly on Brutes and Blasters, with some Tanks and Sentinels.  NEVER experienced this.  Never.

Same here.  Perhaps because of the low-ish level of the TF or whatnot, but I've only ever seen them "turtle up" after taking a certain amount of damage...

Edited July 26, 2023 by biostem

[Snarky]

50 minutes ago, biostem said:

Same here.  Perhaps because of the low-ish level of the TF or whatnot, but I've only ever seen them "turtle up" after taking a certain amount of damage...

yeah, i have seen the turle thing happen.  i can get there first on a blaster, but i need to make sure i get a full snipe and attack chain to avoid letting them turtle

[lemming]

45 minutes ago, biostem said:

Same here.  Perhaps because of the low-ish level of the TF or whatnot, but I've only ever seen them "turtle up" after taking a certain amount of damage...

Yea, I have never seen that Ascendant bubble anyone, just turtle up.   Now, if it was the Marchand arc, those guys are annoying with it.

 

And he did mention it was that particular mission of the Yin, so no Super Stunners involved.

[Techwright]

14 hours ago, Luminara said:

 

Council Attendant Detention Field followed by Super Stunner rez endurance drain.

It's worth a look.  I think I'll run the character again through Yin TF a few times this week to see if I can duplicate the issue.  I'll watch the combat logs as @lemming suggested.  This discussion has actually made me quite curious if it was a single factor, or multiple just weirdly timed, and of course whether it's player or NPC related.  I accept from the discussion that if it is "player" created, it most likely was a bug.

[ZekeStenzland]

I’ve specifically been detained by the Ascendant in Yin TFs before. It’s a lot rarer than when they bubble themselves, but it happens. 
 

And Super Stunners can easily drain your endurance dry in a couple different ways. 
 

Thing is, the Yin missions are either all Council or all Freakshow. There are no missions that have both. And neither group has confuse powers. So I don’t see how it’s possible to have a Super Stunner drain your endurance at the same time an Ascendant detains you, while on a Yin TF. 
 

Is it possible you ran out of endurance because you left on some toggles? It’s happened more than once that I detoggled myself because I left Sprint, Athletic Run, and Super Jump running during combat…

 

[Snarky]

41 minutes ago, ZekeStenzland said:

I’ve specifically been detained by the Ascendant in Yin TFs before. It’s a lot rarer than when they bubble themselves, but it happens. 
 

And Super Stunners can easily drain your endurance dry in a couple different ways. 
 

Thing is, the Yin missions are either all Council or all Freakshow. There are no missions that have both. And neither group has confuse powers. So I don’t see how it’s possible to have a Super Stunner drain your endurance at the same time an Ascendant detains you, while on a Yin TF. 
 

Is it possible you ran out of endurance because you left on some toggles? It’s happened more than once that I detoggled myself because I left Sprint, Athletic Run, and Super Jump running during combat…

 

your experience in the Yin mirrors everyone elses.  the OP has been emphatic it happened multiple times and there were no endurance issues.

 

I suspect a glitch.  with no comp knowledge at all i randomly guess a server client communication error.

[kelika2]

On 7/25/2023 at 8:37 AM, Freedumbite said:

I really thought this was going to be about Hurricane.

I thought it was going to be about Fulcrum Shift.  Seeing an uptick of people complaining that its too strong, a single cast can allow one person to wipe out group after group effortlessly and the fact it trivializes everything else in its own set.

Being bored and whatnot as only one or two people lay waste to everything

[Sanguinesun]

12 minutes ago, kelika2 said:

I thought it was going to be about Fulcrum Shift.  Seeing an uptick of people complaining that its too strong, a single cast can allow one person to wipe out group after group effortlessly and the fact it trivializes everything else in its own set.

Being bored and whatnot as only one or two people lay waste to everything

 

Fulcrum shift is going to work for anyone who is in its aoe range not just "1-2 people" and its effectivity varies on the player/at/powers used from there.

 

I've never seen anyone complain about FS, more the opposite in thanks of it on teams for the team.

 

Im a bit skeptical concerning your claims of that but if you're on a leveling team that has some individual making such complaints besides yourself, if I was lead, I would say we can either up the difficulty if the team's consensus is that they want more of a challenge. Teams do that because until we all start fighting, we do not necessarily know whether the group's dynamics favor weaker or more difficult challenges. In other cases of speed runs where the time completion is more important and most who join such understand that.

 

If there isnt a consensus on upping the difficulty then its left as is.  If the complainer keeps at it, I'll privately suggest they may want to find another team to play on if they're so unhappy with it not matching them.  If they continue beyond that, they'd probably find themselves kicked if they're demoralizing the rest of the team with their antics because at that point its a player issue not a team one.

 

 

[kelika2]

52 minutes ago, Sanguinesun said:

Fulcrum shift is going to work for anyone who is in its aoe range not just "1-2 people" and its effectivity varies on the player/at/powers used from there.

This is a best case scenario when the caster waits.  most of the time the fire/kin just blows up and moves on.

 

When you really break down Fulcrum Shift it really is just too powerful and there is nothing that holds a candle to it.  there is not enough -resist from a single source that can come close to FS.  nothing else can cap damage from a single caster

[Bananiac]

I seem to remember that these phase shift powers deactivate any other powers that can affect teammates or enemies outside of the bubble?

Only self-affecting powers can be used (as long as you stay alone inside the bubble, of course).

[Techwright]

On 7/27/2023 at 3:33 PM, ZekeStenzland said:

Is it possible you ran out of endurance because you left on some toggles? It’s happened more than once that I detoggled myself because I left Sprint, Athletic Run, and Super Jump running during combat…

 

That's a reasonable question, but the answer is "no".  I thought of it during the TF, it was actually my first thought, so I was monitoring for it.  And there was the last time all the defenses dropped.  I'd become a bit paranoid by then.  We were in the reactor room, I'd moved closer to the team, enough to be under the bubble, but I deliberately only fired off a few shots.  Sure enough, the defensive toggles all dropped together, and my endurance was still there.

 

On 7/27/2023 at 4:16 PM, Snarky said:

I suspect a glitch.  with no comp knowledge at all i randomly guess a server client communication error.

 

Sadly, I think you're right, but hopefully, it was a one-session glitch.  I did take the character and run the Yin TF again (keeping the combat chat up) and nothing happened.  I also ran a Sister Psyche TF (lots more Freaks) and again nothing unusual happened.  I did have a Super Sapper take out my endurance once during the latter, but I saw it coming.  I was just too close to him in the crowd to move off quickly.  This I'm used to, and I always try to identify and keep my distance from the Super Saps, but sometimes it's just not possible due to the chaos.

 

There was no one with domes or bubbles on either team.

 

My thanks to all who contributed to this thread.  I tested what I could, and could not duplicate the issue beyond that one session's repeated events.  I've one other thing to try, and that involves getting a character with the requisite dome and bubble powers to team with me and see if any of them drop the toggles.  That's just dotting i's and crossing t's.  I think it must have been a glitch, like Snarky suggested.

[ZekeStenzland]

Moving away from a Super Stunner helps with the huge end drain when they self rez. They also have a Static Field power, a ranged location aoe that continuously drains end. This can be very hard to spot in busy areas, like the reactor room in Yin. 

[Solarverse]

On 7/26/2023 at 12:37 AM, Snarky said:

There is literally nothing in the game that will do this, aside from endurance hitting zero. You have emphatically ruled that out and I believe you.  I think you found a glitch.  Good luck getting the bug hunter badge.

 

I can attest to this, back during live, I found the single bug that negatively affected the game that this game has ever seen, a bug that crashed entire zones and could be repeated on command. I was told that I would be nominated for the Bug Finder Badge...I never got it. That badge is the hardest badge to get known to humankind.