Monos King

+1

Agreed.

Well you see, there's a curious relationship between Sonic sound fx files and it's encoded damage formula. The more effective its dps, the louder the powers are. You can see the dilemma.

Not quite. I suggest you look into the existing complaints about titan weapons before this recent issue - despite it's superior performance, there were quite a few...all repeating the same notes. These were not issues I personally found meaningful, but evidently I was not the majority. @Galaxy Brain is familiar with the dilemma if you find difficulty investigating.

Dismissing and resummoning is a bigger chore than putting equips on. Those are still one and done, and really aren't that bothersome compared to the activation time and endurance cost of resummoning your entire army to get past things. Pets right now automatically teleport to you after a certain distance, so no commands don't really address this issue. There was a proposal in galaxy and I's thread that would address this particular concern, but then there are still the others as well. A toggle would fix this issue immediately, and could cost some tiny amount of endurance if people think it should. If it costs no endurance, then it would be functionally the same as being auto. Equips in middle of fight are apart of what balances MMs though, so neither may end up occurring regardless. I can't say I'm entirely on board myself.

Oh yeah. But what if I want my pets to be deliberately lacking for something too. Like, demons auras are great for instance, but if I need them to not draw aggro or stealth through something, I need them to not have that upgrade that gives it. Heals are good too, but if I want ember to just focus on attacking, I might skip that, or if I don't want enemies to scatter from damage patches like fire and caltrops even though those are good, etc etc. I just think the choice needs to be retained in some way for situations like those.

That's definitely true. I try to go on general chat and discord more often than here (those are actually where I get feedback on my thread ideas before I post them). Forum people are definitely more vocal about nerfs though, as casual players are usually more indifferent to the development process. I disagree with your use of the term vanilla, as I feel it unjustly undermines the purpose behind balancing. I don't think you give the efforts enough credit. I assume you mean that unique qualities are dampened, but that really isn't the case. Take this update. For the pursuit of balance, a powerset was strengthened and proliferated, another was empowered to true greatness, and one was revised to lesser, but more intuitive, performance. Doing that isn't easy, and the pay-off for making iconic powers playable again goes a long way for retention and enjoyment. However... Would a new AT or power have captured hearts quicker? Yeah, probably. But only because I assume it would be in line with HCs philosophy. Otherwise the aforementioned maladies would transpire. The effort in revisiting old powersets, bug fixing, creating new Story Arcs, and maintaining balance is what separates HC from some other servers and differentiates it from what are essentially sandboxes. They add to the immersive factor of those who don't just want to play a game, but feel involved in it. RPers like more stories. There's also a level of professionalism in trying to improve so much what already was, simply because people requested it. I think you need to understand that you're getting both because of these philosophies: you can trust that what you like won't be forgotten, but you won't be seeing new things fuming about either. That being said, something we've agreed on from the start is that of course, new ATs and powers would be frisky, fun and surely done. If you have any ideas to make that a reality compatible with the process the devs have now, we'd be a step closer in the direction you want. I've already said just being more free with what they might throw on beta could be worthwhile trying, letting us sort of talk things into development, there might be some ways to facilitate the process further on our end.

This one is a net positive unless you want to have certain pets avoid gaining certain abilities. It would be the removal of choice in those instances, which is troubling. I've played on the server where this exact proposal is already installed, and it's very convenient, but it was terribly frustrating when I wanted a demon to not draw aggro or a pet to not flamethrow, or a knight to have broadsword instead of TW (they have knights). The toggle idea is the best way to deal with it really. Whether or not it would cost endurance I dunno.

That's a bit of a hot take (or at least something many don't like to acknowledge) but I actually agree completely. However, I'd be weary about acting too much with that in mind. Each server has it's own philosophy, with a resulting unique quality, that gives it it's appeal. Rebirth is purist, Cake is creatively libertine. There is even another server that's acting essentially exactly how you might want HC to adapt in Thunderspy, but you don't see many people there despite their admittedly awesome ideas. How HC relates to these servers is why @Infinitum called HC middle ground, because over here we have installed a great many qol and performance improvements that gently walks the line of power creep but still retains the traditional sense of balance. HC is an expansion of the original game through and through, and while certain things I consider too much, it is apparently still what people want. Even if it seems like adding a few new cool ATs would be a total plus, if it undermines existing options it'll just anger folks, who feel like their iconic characters have little role or, as in the case of TW, end up with a nerf which will make people playing the new powers angry as well. I believe you are saying that we should embrace that reality of high performance to some extent to avoid that, and shift philosophy, but the problem there is that if we did that it would just be an upwards spiral until we actually were at a cake-esque level of power. People would want their powers to be buffed to compete with newly buffed or newly released powers, because of the philosophy change that would be legitimate, and this would go on and on because there will always be new powers coming out and there will always have to be a weakest power. And, anyone who dislikes the surge of power we find ourselves with will not be retained, they will leave immediately. Except even now on HC people find the gathering of gods to be an extreme issue. It shows up on the forums every say, even in this very thread people are talking about nerfing incarnates. So, something to be weary of still. It seems I do agree with the basics of your ideas for retention, bases especially, but it'd need to be metered. I would love to see really experimental ideas consistently dumped on the test servers for us to shift through and perfect, even if some are pulled. I think that could work. But if they move in the direction of ignoring balance, it will not.

Yeah I don't know about all that either, just something to keep in mind though.

So, actually, I'm not down with removing level shifts. At least not until MMs are fixed, to which then I would be more receptive. People forget how devastating playing upper content was for MMs back when pets could be facing up to +6 enemies...MMs were relegated to depleted corruptors. Alpha was a real life saver there.

Ohhhh I see. The challenge exists because 24+ people events might not be soloable. You, alone, will struggle to do what was intended to be impossible, so it's something we at HC are all good to draw inspiration from. I'm not even sure what you were trying to convey by acknowledging how insanely OP cake characters are, but if certain undertakings are even on the table, discussion of balance can be dismissed. My point is, cake philosophy is completely incompatible with any server that wants to maintain balance. If you want to say "we should crank out more unique powers and ATs" that I can get behind, but suggesting to any extent that the degree of performance over there is something that should be replicated here, which follows the format and principles of an MMO, is way over nonsense. When you are that powerful, it immediately becomes self-centric. People don't like not being able to solo, the adverse applies. They like to feel needed in groups. People already see incarnates to be contentious, what you're asking for won't float.

But you said "even with as OP as you can be" implying you were looking at the higher end potential. Which, hilariously enough, being Tyrant isn't even - not by cake standards. Cake is a City of Heroes Garys mod server and while fun, just has no business being compared to a server that wants to operate with balance and challenge. Or resemble a game at all.

Dude no. If you're dying on cake you objectively suck. You can become Tyrant.

I had that idea too previously. Mine was a Serum change that gave the henchmen additional super strength and heavy ammunition powers for a short time. I saw a throw grenade idea earlier as well. I think that all the temp upgrade type things are pretty cool.

The stealth is definitely great, but Jaunts added speed is particularly oppressive by comparison in other instances, so I guess it just depends on what you're doing and with what powerset. For instance, many characters are already completely invisible with just an added stealth IO. It certainly isn't better than SOS for PvP or herding. I myself usually pick the travels to, well, travel. My concern is really just that the designated speed pool is in fact slower than another, and has no means on it's own to change that. Agreed, though at least it can get afterburner and jump packed.

Ohh how did I miss you saying that. That changes things, and is good for SS. I just checked and I was running winters gift and not a different stealth IO on my character, Arctic Fog was on...it was a whole thing. Sorry about that. Regardless, in terms of raw travel ability Speed O Sound and Mighty Leap are undeservingly superior to their primary analogues, which is the point I was getting at.

Super Speeds additional element of stealth is overshadowed by just using Speed O Sound/Jaunt, which is already superior, with the two IOs. We were talking about how Jaunt is superior to the Super Speed. So the only advantage SS has over SOS is easily undermined by the IOs.

That's actually an awesome idea. The only issue is the lack of toggles in the pools. Maybe as a passive effect for owning the powers.

I'm not too concerned with what would go down if hasten received a "buff" like this; the reasons we get hasten now have nothing to do with travel, and you'd be lying if you said you get flurry over it. If not in hasten, super speed should get something like a Max Speed Increase somewhere else regardless. It would be great for the theme of the powerset, and allow you to be more swifty even without running super speed as an additional element. I chose hasten because it would start adding a travel increase element similar to hover and combat jumping right out the gate, so that precedent is there, but I'm all ears for other ideas too. Edit: The implication was whichever power ended up with the +Max Run Speed would also be like Jump Pack and give a minute power boost to run speed as well.

That is true. In terms of just transportation though, it certainly is...which is troublesome when the inferior pool is called "Speed". Also the stealth is undermined by just putting celerity + Unbound Leap, but that doesn't change that Super Speed has that going for it...though it's kind of useless with those IOs accessibility. Slightly unrelated, Mighty Leap is just entirely superior to Super Jump, and how the the actual speed factor of these two pools is revisited might be similar. Not that huge a concern though, just an idea. I'd love to see whirlwind get some kind of buff too, but my ideas with that end with "let me turn off the spin".

hmm...

Although Super Speed itself could just get amped so...in hindsight back to the drawing board.

lmao. It's to buff the speed pool itself. Someone brought up that it is silly that powers like Speed o' Sound and Mighty Leap are entirely superior to the main counterparts. That made sense when they were paid travels (somewhat) but that isn't the case anymore. I figure this is a smooth way to ensure the pool can be the prime speed pool, similar to what afterburner does.

Right?