Weekly Discussion 48: Dark Armor!

[Nanolathe]

10 minutes ago, Galaxy Brain said:

What mechanically makes DA fun that you dont get from other armors? I ask because that is what the set should be balanced around, it's fun factor. 

It doesn't have anything really. It claims to have something (the Debuff/Buff focus) but that "thing" was never really implemented. That's the problem in my opinion. (See my previous post for more detailed info)

 

Edit: I am specifically talking about mechanics. There are many other reasons to play DA, from a strong character theme or roleplay, to just trying something new.

But mechanically... it's a dud.

Edited April 28, 2020 by Nanolathe

[Naraka]

56 minutes ago, Galaxy Brain said:

Can I ask everyone this:

 

Why pick dark armor, specifically, over another armor set?

Variety.

 

Unlike some, I actually don't have that many characters as I don't powerlevel, I don't join teams merely to get exp so no radio mission repeats unless I'm aiming for the bank mission at the end, I turn exp off at times so I don't level up too fast doing TF/SF and I linger in "sweet spots" to finish out mission arcs.  That out of the way, the variety I seek usually involves playing powersets I haven't tried before or only played minimally also coupled with pools/epics that I haven't tried much of or only took a select power from.  Overall, I vary my power picks as often as possible given the limited amount of characters I usually roll and play.  Skipping some powers in a set for one reason or another keeps open an opportunity to make another character that does take those powers.  I don't really have that many SR characters primarily because the character I have that does take it has all the powers so running it again likely wouldn't change much...however, if there is a nominal difference between, say, a Scrapper SR character and a Sentinel SR character, that changes the replay opportunity a bit.

 

But it's not only variety, it's also theme and personal RP where I create heroes with rouges galleries or villains with targets of interests/henchmen/associates.

 

That being said, why I pick Dark Armor is purely dependent on the concept of the character that will develop from the power choices I've picked for him, specifically my Spines/DA/Weapons Stalker with teleport and presence.  Since Stalker DA is somewhat different from other melee's, I have been looking for an avenue for a new melee and it's likely going to hinge on leveraging Oppressive Gloom (and skip Cloak of Fear and Cloak of Darkness) since that was a skipped power on my Stalker and feel very different from my Stalker.

[Naraka]

27 minutes ago, SwitchFade said:

To be very clear, you are against an END reduction because "just fine"?

Glad you didn't bother reading the rest of the post.

[ArchVileTerror]

"Fun factor."
Ugh . . . there's a can of worms I don't have the time to unpack right now . . . 

 

Suffice it to say:  Fun is subjective.  

Having the visual and mechanical themes being cohesive in a single Set  is fun for some people.

 

More on this after I get home from work, if I'm not completely drained of energy.

 

[nihilii]

1 hour ago, Galaxy Brain said:

Why pick dark armor, specifically, over another armor set?

Strongest mitigation ingame, IMHO. Granite only surpasses it on the condition you don't need to move - the survivability of a Rooted+Granite Tanker in a stack of Apex blue patches is 0.

I'm not talking about IOed out to the gills and incarnates, either, but starting as soon as level 1. The combination of resistance to every damage type + mild defense + full heal on demand is such a strong base to stack defense on, whether from buffs or insps. No other powerset really compares. Pure defense like SR can be even more amazing earlier on, but then there's no damage aura in SR; and DA pulls ahead in the endgame anyway.

Caveat, obviously: I use inspirations as they drop. I also tend to buy 8 hours worth of amplifiers when I start a new character. I will also buy the Recovery Serum temp power and use it as needed. This is my standard operating protocol for just about any reroll, and I don't think it's an outrageous starting point as all it takes is a bankroll of ~1M influence. But YMMV.
 

[skoryy]

1 hour ago, Galaxy Brain said:

Can I ask everyone this:

 

Why pick dark armor, specifically, over another armor set?

Dechs sold me on it back on live.

 

Longer explanation: Dark Regen, Soul Transfer, high resists, just enough defense to get you to the cap, and a damage aura.  A well built DA is really really hard to send to the hospital.

[Yomo Kimyata]

1 hour ago, Galaxy Brain said:

Can I ask everyone this:

 

Why pick dark armor, specifically, over another armor set?

Theme trumps all for me, but I suspect you are looking for mechanics answers.  Sometimes you want a resistance set, but why dark over other sets?  I'd say Dark Regeneration is probably the best self-heal money can buy.  Cloak of Fear is great if you slot it for accuracy and is a soft control I don't think you can get from any other set.  And Oppressive Gloom is a fantastic "oh shit" button, especially teamed with Dark Regeneration.  So those three powers, in my eyes, make it unique and worthy of pursuit.

 

But coming back to theme, you rightfully mention that you can easily use another power and justify your theme by coloring flames or whatever.  I agree completely, which is why no one should ever feel they have to play Dark Armor for theme if they don't want to.  

13 hours ago, SwitchFade said:

I want to get clear answers from the dissenters:

 

Why, EXACTLY, are you objecting to a reduction in end consumption?

As you of all people know, economics is about allocation of scarce resources.  To take your question to an absurd extreme, why would anyone object to removing all endurance costs for toggles?  For me, part of the enjoyment of any game is figuring out how to best manage these scarce resources.  Yes, dark armor requires more attention to be paid to endurance management than most sets.  To me, that's a part of the game and frankly an enjoyable part.  I don't think that it makes the set fundamentally unplayable by a long shot.  It probably does make it harder to play than fire armor.  Then great, play fire armor if you don't want to have to worry about endurance!  I don't expect anyone else to have to enjoy managing endurance, and I don't expect anyone else to have to play dark armor.  It's always a choice.

 

By the way, I finally understand that when you are talking about set balance for SOs v. IOs you are talking about removing set bonuses, not about common IOs.  Personally, I don't think anyone should balance the playability of a set around SO performance since absolutely no one uses SOs unless it's a personal challenge, but I can understand balancing it around lvl 30 common IOs.  Dark Armor really lends itself to some innovative slotting choices other than 1x end red, 3x res dam; Cloak of Fear is a great example where your personal balance among accuracy, end reduction, fear, and to-hit debuff can provide a unique experience.

13 hours ago, ArchVileTerror said:

Guessing based on past posting history?
"Game's too easy already."

I don't mind providing optional tools to make the game easier.  I can't stand the idea of mandating an easier game.  I don't want to play chess on a 4x4 chessboard.  If someone else wants to only use those 16 squares, go right ahead.  But please don't shrink the board for all of us.

 

I guess my upshot is, if you don't like dark armor, don't play it.  It's no skin off anyone's nose.  The devs don't care; there aren't any power quotas.  I rarely notice the ATs of people I play with, much less worry about what power sets they have.

 

These are only my opinions, and I neither expect nor want to get anyone else to change their minds.  I also apologize if anything I say comes off as confrontational; that is certainly not my intent.  I do, however, want to raise my hand amidst a sea of complaints and go on record as saying I think this set is just fine as it is.  It could probably use some optional fx fixes though.

[SwitchFade]

46 minutes ago, Naraka said:

Glad you didn't bother reading the rest of the post.

Your snarky sarcasm aside, I DID and you waxed irrelevant.

 

Your only specific was "cuz just fine."

[Brutal Justice]

1 hour ago, Galaxy Brain said:

Can I ask everyone this:

 

Why pick dark armor, specifically, over another armor set?

I play dark armor specifically for the feel of the set.  The roller coaster of a ride going from the brink of death to riding strong.  The rush of having defeat knocking on the door.  “Is dark regen going to recharge in time, do I have enough end left to use it if it does?”  I play to find synergies with the utility of oppressive gloom and cloak of fear.  For the feeling of dying for your team and nuke rezing to save the team.  I try my best to avoid death but when it does happen I still get the last word.  

 

 These are also the reasons I don’t run IO builds until late game.  I don’t want to flatten out the experience.  I don’t want it to play like every other set.  I play a dm/fire/whirlwind brute I built specifically to run whirlwind.  I chose those powersets for consume and dark consumption.

 

Why do people gamble?   They gamble because they can and do lose.  It’s not gambling if you only ever win with no risk of losing.  People get addicted and lose everything because they are chasing the feeling of escaping defeat.  The better they get the higher they raise the stakes.  I run IOs for late game because late game has raised the stakes.  

[SwitchFade]

6 minutes ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

Theme trumps all for me, but I suspect you are looking for mechanics answers.  Sometimes you want a resistance set, but why dark over other sets?  I'd say Dark Regeneration is probably the best self-heal money can buy.  Cloak of Fear is great if you slot it for accuracy and is a soft control I don't think you can get from any other set.  And Oppressive Gloom is a fantastic "oh shit" button, especially teamed with Dark Regeneration.  So those three powers, in my eyes, make it unique and worthy of pursuit.

 

But coming back to theme, you rightfully mention that you can easily use another power and justify your theme by coloring flames or whatever.  I agree completely, which is why no one should ever feel they have to play Dark Armor for theme if they don't want to.  

As you of all people know, economics is about allocation of scarce resources.  To take your question to an absurd extreme, why would anyone object to removing all endurance costs for toggles?  For me, part of the enjoyment of any game is figuring out how to best manage these scarce resources.  Yes, dark armor requires more attention to be paid to endurance management than most sets.  To me, that's a part of the game and frankly an enjoyable part.  I don't think that it makes the set fundamentally unplayable by a long shot.  It probably does make it harder to play than fire armor.  Then great, play fire armor if you don't want to have to worry about endurance!  I don't expect anyone else to have to enjoy managing endurance, and I don't expect anyone else to have to play dark armor.  It's always a choice.

 

By the way, I finally understand that when you are talking about set balance for SOs v. IOs you are talking about removing set bonuses, not about common IOs.  Personally, I don't think anyone should balance the playability of a set around SO performance since absolutely no one uses SOs unless it's a personal challenge, but I can understand balancing it around lvl 30 common IOs.  Dark Armor really lends itself to some innovative slotting choices other than 1x end red, 3x res dam; Cloak of Fear is a great example where your personal balance among accuracy, end reduction, fear, and to-hit debuff can provide a unique experience.

I don't mind providing optional tools to make the game easier.  I can't stand the idea of mandating an easier game.  I don't want to play chess on a 4x4 chessboard.  If someone else wants to only use those 16 squares, go right ahead.  But please don't shrink the board for all of us.

 

I guess my upshot is, if you don't like dark armor, don't play it.  It's no skin off anyone's nose.  The devs don't care; there aren't any power quotas.  I rarely notice the ATs of people I play with, much less worry about what power sets they have.

 

These are only my opinions, and I neither expect nor want to get anyone else to change their minds.  I also apologize if anything I say comes off as confrontational; that is certainly not my intent.  I do, however, want to raise my hand amidst a sea of complaints and go on record as saying I think this set is just fine as it is.  It could probably use some optional fx fixes though.

Ok, so, enjoy the balance challenge is the objection to end redux, that's respectable.

 

Before we make the assumption that no one uses SOs, we should get data. Perhaps a Dev can post data of all toons that use SOs, stratified by lvl range?

[Troo]

Dark Armour I have found is very utility oriented. It can specialize very easily.

If we try and do too much that's when the endurance issue needs to be solved with our build (not by devs).

[Galaxy Brain]

37 minutes ago, SwitchFade said:

Ok, so, enjoy the balance challenge is the objection to end redux, that's respectable.

 

Before we make the assumption that no one uses SOs, we should get data. Perhaps a Dev can post data of all toons that use SOs, stratified by lvl range?

(That specific stat is something I've asked for a while... and something I suspect they do keep track of but is kind of hard to showcase without the internet sploding)

 

Also, thank you all for the responses 🙂

 

Dark Armor providing some res/def to all types, a damage aura, and uniquely mez auras (oh, and Dark Regen) definitely seem to be the draw, but everyone sort of laments on how the mez auras work. Si?

[Naraka]

53 minutes ago, SwitchFade said:

Your snarky sarcasm aside, I DID and you waxed irrelevant.

 

Your only specific was "cuz just fine."

Then read the second damned paragraph.

[Ruby Rocket]

Dark/Dark Scrapper is still my main, and it has been my favorite set since way back when Cloak of Fear was a Mag3, didn't bankrupt your endurance bar, and could actually hit targets (before the Nerf on live).  As much as I love Dark Armor, its mostly for the nostalgia at this point.  The "soft controls" have been nerf'd into oblivion, the animations are pretty cheesy compared to other sets, the endurance issues are painfully apparent and limiting to effective power combinations, and its defensive/resistance niche is pretty much readily available to every power set with IO bonus'.

 

Cloak of Fear is pretty much (to me) the staple of the set.  I mean, what's dark without a fear?  I think they nerf'd it a bit hard due to PvP issues back in the day.  I would love to see it's accuracy come back up.  It's not really worth the endurance cost and will barely hit reliably when you have buildup active and 3 slot it with accuracy.  I can't complain about the Mag 2 fear, because the mobs will attack anyway if Death Shroud is going; fear is only effective as long as nobody attacks them.  However, with Death Shroud on, most minions that might get hit with fear are going to die so fast that the fear status effect is nearly pointless.  The -to hit effect of Cloak of Fear is the real gem of the power.  However, it's all a mute point when it can just barely hit even level minions.

 

The ridiculously strong heal is pretty much par for the course.  All dark sets have a crazy heal, but they are all slow and all have a to-hit check.  So it's a tradeoff.  Granted it rarely misses, but you'll fall every time it does.  I think its a fair power due to the fact that it's not a guaranteed hit, and you need active combatants to make it work.  It's more of an Oh Crap! power (if you have enough endurance to run that hog) than a heal to keep you topped off like most of the other Resistance based armor sets.

 

I would love to see an animation change option on Cloak of Darkness.  It's always been bit too generic for me.  I love what they did for it with Stalkers, and the one from Mu Mastery.  The big black cloud is just a bit too much.  Its a bit sad when Dark Servant has a better silhouette.  I wonder if they did it that way so that nobody in PvP could see what your attack powers were.  🤷🏻‍♀️   I will say, that it does look pretty cool when you leap into a mob and fire off soul drain with Cloak of Darkness and Cloak of Fear on... You turn into a little glowing cloud of death.

 

I don't mind the lack of KB protection.  Its a terrible hole in the set to be sure.  If you don't fill that one you're as good as dead; since KB/KD is so prevalent, your inherent defense is minimal, and the -to hit debuffs don't ever hit on Dark Armor.  However, it is one that's easily fixed.  I think that's why they invented Acrobatics...  Now with IOs, you don't even have to mess with that 15 toggle endurance nightmare.

 

The last real benefit of the Dark Armor set is a bit overshadowed by IOs anymore.  Now everyone can have crazy levels of Psi/Toxic resistance/defense, which used to be Dark's bread an butter.  If you wanted to be the last one standing in a Carnie Mob, run Dark Armor... However, on the up side... the resistance to endurance drain is a god send... with how fast your endurance drains under the stress of toggles (and the power hungry heal), you don't need any help to hit zero in a fight.

[Greycat]

4 hours ago, ArchVileTerror said:

And to nip it in the bud:  Why does it matter how Dark Armour performs if you're just playing for theme? 

 

It depends. If you have a theme you love but the set hits *that point* of frustration or difficulty (not really saying DA is difficult, just different,) it makes the "theme" less fun to play.

 

I don't think it's ever hit that point for me, personally, but still.

[SwitchFade]

1 hour ago, Naraka said:

Then read the second damned paragraph.

Again, snide comments aside, you only stated one objection to END redux: "it's fine."

 

You have given no other direct objections to END redux, you have given other information, which I respect.

 

Regardless, none of that is a reason you OBJECT to END redux.

 

I suggest you review it.

[Heraclea]

3 hours ago, Nanolathe said:

It doesn't have anything really. It claims to have something (the Debuff/Buff focus) but that "thing" was never really implemented. That's the problem in my opinion. (See my previous post for more detailed info)

 

Edit: I am specifically talking about mechanics. There are many other reasons to play DA, from a strong character theme or roleplay, to just trying something new.

But mechanically... it's a dud.

The fears and stuns of the set would appear to me to allow slotting of many exotic procs and sets, but far better if you weren't compelled to focus so exclusively on recovery. 

[Naraka]

23 minutes ago, SwitchFade said:

Again, snide comments aside, you only stated one objection to END redux: "it's fine."

 

You have given no other direct objections to END redux, you have given other information, which I respect.

 

Regardless, none of that is a reason you OBJECT to END redux.

 

I suggest you review it.

Well you didn't even bother to quote the portion I just told you to go read which tells me you either didn't bother to read it or you're trying to weasel a specific type of response out of people by being disingenuous.  I'm surprised you bothered to waste your time like that because you're not going to get me to waste mine.

[Troo]

2 hours ago, Galaxy Brain said:

laments on how the mez auras work. Si?

I liked that there were different mez auras that could layer with another set. Pairing Stuns with say War Mace or Martial arts. Fear with Dark Melee.

 

 

Side note: Congrats GB (you may not even care about the 1,000 but thanks for your contributions!)

  

 

 

[Parabola]

2 hours ago, Galaxy Brain said:

Dark Armor providing some res/def to all types, a damage aura, and uniquely mez auras (oh, and Dark Regen) definitely seem to be the draw, but everyone sort of laments on how the mez auras work. Si?

Yeah that's pretty much the size of it. Dark armor is an exotic toolkit but one that only really functions with IO's. Using them it can be one of the strongest armor powersets but without it's got to be somewhere close to the worst. I'm struggling to think of another set with such a disparity between its SO and IO performance.

 

On the mez auras i think opressive gloom is fine. It's a one slot wonder that provides some mitigation at the expense of wander. Take it but only run it when you need to. Cloak of fear just doesn't function though.

[Nanolathe]

13 minutes ago, Heraclea said:

The fears and stuns of the set would appear to me to allow slotting of many exotic procs and sets, but far better if you weren't compelled to focus so exclusively on recovery. 

I wouldn't call that a mechanic of the set, but a by-product of IO slotting.

For clarity's sake,

• Opressive Gloom can slot Stun Sets. A 4.5ppm chance of... an amount of -tohit*, a 3.5ppm chance of Knockback, and 3.5ppm chance of immobilise (Mag2) on Opressive Gloom's Stun sets. The effects here are either very weak, actively detrimental to keeping the mob in your AOE, or very slightly increase your effective defences for a few moments. Again, I don't have exact numbers for [Absolute Amazement], but my experience with secondary effect procs is that they're very weak, and only last for 8 seconds, giving it at best about 50% uptime.
• Cloak of Fear can slot Fear, and both -Tohit and -Accurate Tohit sets. A 3.5ppm chance for Psi Damage, a 3.5ppm chance for Neg Energy Damage, a 3.5ppm chance to disorient (Mag2), a 3.5ppm chance for 25% recovery debuff (lol), a chance for recharge slow** (unconfirmed amount), and a 2ppm chance for 10 seconds of +tohit (20%). I don't know about you, but the damage procs and the stun proc are the only things that stand out here, and the damage procs actively stop the fear effect from working as you want it to. Although dead is the best debuff, it's still going against the intent of the power. Stacking stun with Oppressive Gloom is a nice upside, I will admit. Maybe [Dark Watcher's Despair] is worth it? but without the numbers I couldn't comment.

But that is your lot. If you see a set-defining build within those limitations, then more power to you. But I'm not seeing it. Again, These are IO specific "advantages" for playing Dark Armour and are happy coincidences if you have the cash to spare. I wouldn't say these 8 procs elevate the set in any meaningful way, but your mileage may vary. 

 

* I don't know the strength of the -tohit debuff from [Absolute Amazement]. Can anyone illuminate?

** Likewise I don't know the effect strength for [Dark Watcher's Despair]. Any info?

[SwitchFade]

10 hours ago, Naraka said:

Because the set can perform just fine with the costs it has. (Clipped to your ACTUAL objection, because this is relavent).

 

Which then feeds into my other reason: I'd rather be given a reason to run all/more toggles than to just have it made cheaper to do.  I've read some pretty interesting ideas and arguments for buffing the mez toggles to provide extra utility to deepen the differences of the set vs checking off another set that, with IOs, completely circumvents another avenue of team assistance and build synergy

 

Ok so, SECOND paragraph snip, since you're clearly focused on it (none of this is an objection, it's an alternative suggestion).

Thanks for the blatant, brash disrespect. I would recommend against it in the future.

 

As you seem acutely focused on not acknowledging a fact that you posted 2 pages back above is your paragraph clipped your first objection and your full second paragraph with NO objection....

 

None of that is an objection in the SECOND PARAGRAPH you keep lamenting. It's called an ALTERNATIVE proposal. You literally said you want a reason to run them all vs cheaper.

 

AGAIN, your only objection is "cuz it's ok."

 

Fine, it's ok, TO YOU. Super, I respect that.

 

It's clearly not ok to the majority, so now ..

 

Do you have any factual objections to an end redux? Because, you know, it would still be OKAY if it was cheaper.

 

There you go. Facts.

Edited April 28, 2020 by SwitchFade

[XaoGarrent]

There's always been two objectively crippling problems with this set:

 

-Endurance costs are absolutely ridiculous. This is by far the biggest thing holding the set back.

 

-CC Auras being Mag 2 mezz (instead of something like mag 2 with a good chance of +1) renders one of the set's main gimmicks almost pointless unless you pick your other set based entirely off stacking something with the aura. They also require accuracy slotting and CoF in particular has horrible accuracy, while a lot of comparable powers other ATs get not only are more powerful and come at less of a cost (At least relative to the AT they exist on), but have high accuracy assuming they aren't autohit powers. When Whirlwind with -KB is better than a T7 or T8 power, something is wrong.

 

This raises the very real question of "why pick DA to try and help with CC when I could pick Rad Armor, let a Controller handle all the CC needs, and have less holes, more damage." Or WP. Or Bio. Or Energy, Ice, Elec, etc... Most of the sets in the game do what DA does but also do something more, because DA's "something more," those toggles, just kinda drags the whole set down. As a general rule of thumb, if you're going to make a special gimmick, a special niche for a set, it needs to do whatever that niche is well. Especially if you're dedicating more than one power to it.

 

There's a few other less severe problems, but still problems none the less:

 

-DA's moderate weakness to Energy damage. So, normally, I'd shrug and just accept this, because the damage hole is much, much smaller than most other set's holes. In addition to this, energy is something you do run into frequently, but it's usually spread out among an enemy group. Whereas something like Psi, when you run into it, you run into an absolutely insane amount of it, and it's not being delivered with anything else (I. E. smashing).

 

The problem is, paired with the lack of KB protection, the high endurance costs, the weak mezz toggles, etc... There's really no excuse for it, no reason why the set needs yet another problem to contend with. Especially in an era where so many other sets now exist that do what DA does well, but don't have DA's problems. If most or all of the other problems with DA get addressed, this can stay. But *something* has to give.

 

-On Sentinels specifically the set is also weird if you're not using a Blast set with lots of PBAoE, because of the aforementioned aura toggles. If you ARE using a set with lots of PBAoE it's weird in another way due to the removal of the damage aura. It's like this set doesn't really know what it wants to be. Obscure Sustenance is also a cone with a target cap of one? It's weird, but interestingly enough, this is the only version of DA with any kind of built in end management due to this power.

 

-Why is the set's immob protection on its invis power? lol 

 

Even putting the +perception in there is weird, maybe just move everything but the stealth out of the stealth power.

 

...That's everything off the top of my head. Please don't make a bunch of good changes on the test server, get cold feet, and then walk them back this time.

Edited April 28, 2020 by XaoGarrent

[QuiJon]

On 4/26/2020 at 2:07 AM, Gulbasaur said:

The lack of knockback protection can be mitigated with things like Hover and I think it is a fair payoff. I don't think it should be part of the set itself - all the sets should have some downside to prevent them from feeling too generic. 

Most sets do have some type of weakness, but it normally comes into play with being like resistance vs defense based, or elemental like being weak to energy damage or whatever. There is no viable reason hy a melee toon should not be provided knockback protection within their power choices. And if this was the case why is this "leaving something off status protection" only limited it seems to knockback and only on a few sets. I mean there is knockback, stuns, holds, confuse, fear, and Immbl, why do none of those other sets that get knockback protection then have a glowing hole for being stunned, or immobilized that has to be overcome? I mean if you want to say its a trade off and all sets have weaknesses then fine, lets see weaknesses in the status protections of other sets.  Cause they don't exist. 

[Cutter]

Jumping back in with a comparative exercise. May or may not be relevant, but eh, I've got some time.

 

First up is a basic-IO (at L50 mind you) Dark Armour / Psionic Melee tanker (so no endredux from the secondary). It uses exactly ZERO specials or uniques. This represents performance above the "balanced around SOs" baseline that gets thrown around, but far below an IO'd-to-the-gills approach.

 

10 Toggles: Death Shroud, Dark Embrace, Obsidian Shield, Murky Cloud, Cloak of Darkness, Combat Jumping, Tough, Acrobatics, Weave, Maneuvers. (Notably, NOT using Cloak of Fear or Oppressive Gloom.)

3 Passives: Health, Stamina, Physical Perfection.

 

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		|-------------------------------------------------------------------|

 

By way of comparison, here's what the same basic loadout looks like with Ice Armour, since that set was brought up earlier.

 

9 Toggles: Frozen Armour, Wet Ice, Chilling Embrace, Icicles, Combat Jumping, Glacial Armour, Tough, Weave, Maneuvers.

4 Passives: Health, Stamina, Permafrost, Physical Perfection.

 

Data chunk:

Spoiler

| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer to view the build |
		|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
		|MxDz;1518;618;1236;HEX;|
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		|-------------------------------------------------------------------|

 

Very similar in terms of end consumption. BUT:

• The Dark build ignores two of the (arguably) more flavourful powers in its primary, while Ice takes all its toggles.
• Despite that, Ice still has one less toggle, AND an end recovery power in Energy Absorption which, as slotted in this build (2 rech, 1 endmod, 3 def) is up in a little over 32 seconds, and returns a touch over 21% end per enemy hit (plus its def buff).

Looking at the defensive side of things:

• Dark is running with respectably middling defense (but no DDR), and mediocre dropping to low-end resists.
• Dark's heal, Dark Regeneration, (slotted 1 acc, 2 end, 2 rech, 1 heal) is up in a bit over 16 seconds, heals almost 43% per target hit, and clocks in at over 18 end per use.
• Ice really only has the Fire and Psi res holes to deal with, as its 4 relevant typed defenses are solid (and further buffed by its end recovery power).
• Ice gets Hoarfrost, a +HP/heal power (slotted 3 rech, 3 heal) which is up every 180 seconds, provides almost +60% HP for 120 seconds, and a heal for almost 80%, with a cost of ~14.5 end per use.

 

 

For giggles, here's the same setup for another resist set, Electric Armour. Getting closer to apples to apples.

 

8 Toggles: Charged Armour, Lightning Field, Static Shield, Conductive Shield, Combat Jumping, Tough, Weave, Maneuvers.

5 Passives: Health, Stamina, Grounded, Lightning Reflexes, Physical Perfection.

 

Data chunk:

Spoiler

| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer to view the build |
		|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
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		|3A5F9FC873FBA70BEB7FE428DED0|
		|-------------------------------------------------------------------|

 

Now we're seeing something. End drain is notably lower (as would be expected from 8 toggles vs the 10 in the DA build). BUT:

• The Dark build continues to ignore two of the (arguably) more flavourful powers in its primary, while Elec takes all its toggles.
• Despite that, Elec still has two fewer toggles, AND an end recovery power in Power Sink which, as slotted in this build (3 rech, 2 endmod) is up in a little over 27 seconds, and returns a touch over 45% end per enemy hit, AND an endurance reduction+heal power in Energize which, as slotted in this build (3 rech, 1 heal) is up in just under 55 seconds, lasts for 30 seconds, and provides almost 60% endurance reduction to all powers, plus other goodies spoken to below. (Notably, NOT clicked on for the screenie above.)

Looking at the defensive side of things:

• Dark is running with respectably middling defense (but no DDR), and mediocre trending down to low-end resists.
• Dark's heal, Dark Regeneration, (slotted 1 acc, 2 end, 2 rech, 1 heal) is up in a bit over 16 seconds, heals almost 43% per target hit, and clocks in at over 18 end per use.
• Elec has lower defense. but outside of Psi and Negative, better (but still arguably mediocre) resists. Importantly, however, it overcaps resists to the most common "exotic" damage type, Energy.
• Elec gets a heal out of its endurance redux power, Energize, which per the above slotting is still coming back in about 55 seconds, and provides a 35% heal and an extra 140% regen, at a cost of a bit over 10 endurance.

 

 

So that's a lot of words and pictures and stuff hidden in spoiler tags. But what does it meeeeaaaan? Smarter people than me would prolly be able to tell you a lot. To me? It means that Dark Armour, at the cost of ignoring its two really unique powers, burns the same end as Ice and more than Elec, for overall lesser protection, no way to mitigate the drain, and no style points.

 

Aaaand, GO!

Edited April 28, 2020 by Cutter
Unborked the DA data chunk.