I just don’t see it

[Diantane]

I’ve read about several builds that promise great rewards (the best combinations). This was curious to me so I  investigated. Not just by playing the identical combination, but by the power set itself. For example, bots and traps mm. Didn’t bother playing that set as it would take too long to see the secondary all the way through. I’ve already played bots/ many times and know what they are capable of. But didn’t know much about “Traps”. So I made a traps/ defender to see this “primary” at its very best. It had some nice utility, but how on earth was this going to make bots more damaging in combat? I just don’t see it.

 

Another one was Ninjas/Time. Again good utility, but the Ninja is a frail pet that fights in close melee combat. If it doesn’t have some sort of armor (being resistance and/or defense), it will die quickly. A weak heal won’t be enough in fierce combat. The “Time” power is just telling you how much of it you will spend re-summoning your dead pets. This was bad enough when I used “thermal” in combination. Even with the high resistance shields and the strong heals, I was re-summoning my ninjas constantly, let alone with “time.” There’s a “time” and place for this power set, but definitely not with ninjas.

 

As I first stated, “I just don’t see it.”

Edited October 14, 2021 by Diantane

[Carnifax]

56 minutes ago, Diantane said:

Didn’t bother playing that set as it would take too long to see the secondary all the way through

If only there was some Beta server available where you can auto-level to 50 and use Mids to generate a POPMENU to slot yourself out to see what you are like endgame......

[Triumphant]

Quote

 

but definitely not with ninjas.

 

As I first stated, “I just don’t see it.”

 

 

It's because ninjas are sneaky.  😄

[Omega Force]

You know that some powersets are different between ATs, right?

 

Bots/Traps are good for hard targets like AVs because Web Grenade immobilizes your target while Acid Mortar and Poison Trap debuff their defense, resistance, and regeneration; Triage Beacon and FFG help keep your pets alive while they grind down the bloated sacks of hp.

 

/Time gives your pets healing and buffs their defense and tohit.  Ninjas are shit, of course, but Time is basically an armor set.

 

Stronger combinations for general gameplay are the new primaries like Demons and Beasts.  Support them with buffs and heals from like Dark, Nature, Thermal or Time and you should have a pretty tough crew.  Cold and Storm lack group heals, but provide strong offense.

[Nyghtmaire]

It’s all on the synergy and “clever use of game mechanics.” @Redlynne explained it best in their guide: 

And @plainguy is soloing max difficulty petless with /traps. In fact (iicr, I’m on my phone so I can’t see), I believe Plainguy has links to everything one would want to know about defense softcap, ToHit, and other key topics in his signature file.

[plainguy]

48 minutes ago, Nyghtmaire said:

It’s all on the synergy and “clever use of game mechanics.” @Redlynne explained it best in their guide: 

And @plainguy is soloing max difficulty petless with /traps. In fact (iicr, I’m on my phone so I can’t see), I believe Plainguy has links to everything one would want to know about defense softcap, ToHit, and other key topics in his signature file.

 

Ping

[SmalltalkJava]

The Ninja/Time/Mace build v2.0 is a good one.  I've modified it for several primaries.  What makes it so powerful is that it almost perma holds/stuns the mobs when you jump into the middle of the pack and apply the pbaoe, and the two debuffs.  That makes the mobs practically not fight back.    It really doesn't matter what primary you pick with it.  You will just need to modify the build slightly for the primary attack slotting and also negate any knock-back that the pets do.   It actually plays a lot like my /nature builds that use Entangling Aura, you bring yourself and act as a pocket controller to cc the mobs.

 

 

For example here is Beasts version:

 

Spoiler

 

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.0.6.0
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Seasons Change: Level 49 Magic Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Beast Mastery
Secondary Power Set: Time Manipulation
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Summon Wolves

• (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage
• (3) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
• (3) Overwhelming Force - Accuracy/Damage
• (5) Overwhelming Force - Damage/Chance for Knockdown/Knockback to Knockdown
• (5) Soulbound Allegiance - Chance for Build Up
• (7) Call to Arms - Defense Bonus Aura for Pets

Level 1: Time Crawl

• (A) Impeded Swiftness - Accuracy/Endurance
• (7) Impeded Swiftness - Chance of Damage(Smashing)
• (9) Pacing of the Turtle - Chance of -Recharge

Level 2: Call Swarm

• (A) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage
• (13) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
• (15) Impeded Swiftness - Chance of Damage(Smashing)
• (15) Gladiator's Javelin - Chance of Damage(Toxic)
• (17) Touch of Lady Grey - Chance for Negative Damage

Level 4: Temporal Mending

• (A) Panacea - Heal
• (17) Panacea - Heal/Endurance
• (19) Panacea - Endurance/Recharge
• (19) Panacea - Heal/Endurance/Recharge
• (21) Panacea - Heal/Recharge

Level 6: Train Beasts

• (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 8: Call Hawk

• (A) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage
• (21) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
• (23) Explosive Strike - Chance for Smashing Damage
• (23) Gladiator's Javelin - Chance of Damage(Toxic)
• (25) Apocalypse - Chance of Damage(Negative)

Level 10: Call Ravens

• (A) HamiO:Centriole Exposure
• (25) HamiO:Centriole Exposure
• (27) Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage
• (27) Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
• (29) Annihilation - Chance for Res Debuff

Level 12: Summon Lions

• (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage
• (29) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage/Endurance
• (31) Sovereign Right - Accuracy/Damage
• (31) Sovereign Right - Accuracy/Endurance
• (31) Sovereign Right - Accuracy
• (33) Edict of the Master - Defense Bonus

Level 14: Time's Juncture

• (A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff
• (33) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge/Endurance
• (33) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance
• (34) Dark Watcher's Despair - Chance for Recharge Slow

Level 16: Temporal Selection

• (A) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb
• (34) Preventive Medicine - Heal
• (34) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
• (36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
• (36) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime
• (36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance

Level 18: Fortify Pack

• (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 20: Distortion Field

• (A) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge/Hold
• (37) Basilisk's Gaze - Endurance/Recharge/Hold
• (37) Basilisk's Gaze - Recharge/Hold
• (37) Basilisk's Gaze - Chance for Recharge Slow

Level 22: Time Stop

• (A) Neuronic Shutdown - Accuracy/Hold/Recharge
• (39) Neuronic Shutdown - Chance of Damage(Psionic)
• (39) Gladiator's Net - Chance of Damage(Lethal)
• (39) Ghost Widow's Embrace - Chance of Damage(Psionic)
• (40) Unbreakable Constraint - Chance for Smashing Damage

Level 24: Maneuvers

• (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• (40) Red Fortune - Defense
• (40) Red Fortune - Defense/Endurance
• (42) Red Fortune - Endurance/Recharge
• (42) Red Fortune - Defense/Recharge
• (42) Red Fortune - Endurance

Level 26: Summon Dire Wolf

• (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Endurance
• (43) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Endurance/Pet +Resist +Regen
• (43) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage
• (43) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance
• (45) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
• (45) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance/Recharge

Level 28: Farsight

• (A) HamiO:Cytoskeleton Exposure
• (45) HamiO:Cytoskeleton Exposure
• (46) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• (46) Karma - Knockback Protection

Level 30: Hasten

• (A) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 32: Tame Beasts

• (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 35: Slowed Response

• (A) Analyze Weakness - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
• (46) Shield Breaker - Accuracy/Recharge
• (47) Shield Breaker - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
• (47) Achilles' Heel - Chance for Res Debuff
• (47) Shield Breaker - Chance for Lethal Damage
• (48) Touch of Lady Grey - Chance for Negative Damage

Level 38: Chrono Shift

• (A) Performance Shifter - EndMod/Recharge
• (48) Efficacy Adaptor - EndMod/Recharge
• (48) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Recharge

Level 41: Assault

• (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 44: Tactics

• (A) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Chance for Build Up

Level 47: Scorpion Shield

• (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 49: Power Boost

• (A) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 1: Supremacy

Level 1: Brawl

 

 

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Edited October 14, 2021 by SmalltalkJava

[Maelwys]

5 hours ago, Diantane said:

how on earth was this going to make bots more damaging in combat? I just don’t see it.

Look again. Bot/Traps is all about powerset synergy:

+ Caltrops keeping things from fleeing out of your Assault Bot's Incendiary Missile patches.
+ Triage Beacon providing top-up healing for you and your entire team of henchmen.
+ Forcefield Generator stacking with your Protector Bot Bubbles, and providing Mez protection (again, for you and all your henchmen).
+ Acid Mortar buffing the damage of you and all your henchmen.
+ Poison Trap causing everything to be mezzed and have their Regeneration rate halted. To combine with Acid Mortar, Incendiary Missiles, Bot's inherent -Regen blasts, etc.
+ Toebombing things with Trip Mines, whilst at the Defence softcap and stealthed and/or your henchmen are taking the aggro.
+ Web Grenade can immobilise and inflict -fly on AVs.
+ You can even tank in Bodyguard mode.

It was one of the premium soloing powerset combinations well before Inventions/Incarnates; and I can attest to its effectiveness personally.

The only thing it needs is Aid Self/Other plus a means of preventing knockback on big groups of foes (since cycling Web Grenade on each enemy in a big mob whilst your henchmen are laser-blasting and launching missiles at them gets old fast) but Inventions and/or the Mu Patron pool's AoE Immobilise have that covered.
 

Edited October 14, 2021 by Maelwys

[The_Warpact]

34 minutes ago, Maelwys said:

Look again. Bot/Traps is all about powerset synergy:

+ Caltrops keeping things from fleeing out of your Assault Bot's Incendiary Missile patches.
+ Triage Beacon providing top-up healing for you and your entire team of henchmen.
+ Forcefield Generator stacking with your Protector Bot Bubbles, and providing Mez protection (again, for you and all your henchmen).
+ Acid Mortar buffing the damage of you and all your henchmen.
+ Poison Trap causing everything to be mezzed and have their Regeneration rate halted. To combine with Acid Mortar, Incendiary Missiles, Bot's inherent -Regen blasts, etc.
+ Toebombing things with Trip Mines, whilst at the Defence softcap and stealthed and/or your henchmen are taking the aggro.
+ Web Grenade can immobilise and inflict -fly on AVs.
+ You can even tank in Bodyguard mode.

It was one of the premium soloing powerset combinations well before Inventions/Incarnates; and I can attest to its effectiveness personally.

The only thing it needs is Aid Self/Other plus a means of preventing knockback on big groups of foes (since cycling Web Grenade on each enemy in a big mob whilst your henchmen are laser-blasting and launching missiles at them gets old fast) but Inventions and/or the Mu Patron pool's AoE Immobilise have that covered.
 

Plus slotting for rech you can stack multiple acid mortars which is great, other than that excellent write up.

[kelika2]

Masterminds are definitely a bloom at 50 kinda archetype.  While any level 50 with everything will outperform someone leveling, i noticed it more as a mastermind.

I love my bot/traps because with all my slots, access to hami enhancements and some IOs that can only be slotted at 47 or 50 it shines because I can exemp down with it all.

 

The pet buff IOs are gigantic, the +def ones are huge alone and the resist ones also tend to help

Fitting your prot bots with acc/dmg nucs and def/end cytos to maximize their acc/dmg/end spending/their bubble def.  huge

 

At 30+, FFG, maneuvers and both prot bubbles my pets can get into the 45-50% def to all range, meanwhile each prot bot is in the 40%~ def to all range since they cant bubble themselves.

 

As for your Ninja/Time, i have no personal experience with it but Foresight/farsight/whatever its called a level 28 and being in melee range with your pets for that -tohit time aura might be key.  getting those +def pet aura IOs slotted will also push it more.  At 50 you can slot Farsight up with 3 Membranes for maximum recharge/def/tohit.  get mace mastery for [power boost] and bam.  Stacking +def and mixing it with -tohit is what makes my Ninja/Dark mastermind fun.

 

Maneuvers with a generic Def set of your choice, I use red fortune 5/6

Shadowfall with 3 Ribosomes and 3 random def pieces.  I use: 1 LOTG 7.5% and Gift of the Ancients: Defense and Defense/End

the 2 5% def to all pet IOs

Their inherent +def

that adds up to be roughly 25%~ def to all range.  Now lets slap Darkest Nights or Fearsome Stare's -tohit in that

And later on taking advantage of Team Teleport or the 'newly' instant Recall Friend and abuse the hell out of the Dark Servants gigantic -20%(base) autohit tohit debuff aura

 

[Carnifax]

12 minutes ago, kelika2 said:

Masterminds are definitely a bloom at 50 kinda archetype

Weirdly I feel the opposite with MMs. Powerhouses up to 40s, then Malta & Nemises show up and AOE you to death. 

 

Not to mention how bad your Tier 1s fare against the +4s a 40+ team tends to face. Having your henchies facing +6s is lethal. 

[arcane]

Diantane, did we get to 50 and slot IO’s before passing on powersets this time? 

[Without_Pause]

39 minutes ago, arcane said:

Diantane, did we get to 50 and slot IO’s before passing on powersets this time? 

Another point, they seem to have given up in trying to have an actual conversation about what is going. Just a one shot "This sucks" and nothing more. I have them ignored here and in-game.

Edited October 14, 2021 by Without_Pause

[arcane]

5 minutes ago, Without_Pause said:

Another point, they seem to have given up in trying to have an actual conversation about what is going. Just a one shot "This sucks" and nothing more. I have them ignored here and in-game.

I’ve been trying to be helpful to this person because all their posted problems are so obviously fixable by just getting further into the game, but yeah, starting to feel like I’m talking to a wall.

[The_Warpact]

1 hour ago, Without_Pause said:

Another point, they seem to have given up in trying to have an actual conversation about what is going. Just a one shot "This sucks" and nothing more. I have them ignored here and in-game.

Yeah when I'm seeing multiple posts in every direction, multiple AT threads, same caliber of post I'm thinking you're correct.

[Apparition]

1 hour ago, Without_Pause said:

Another point, they seem to have given up in trying to have an actual conversation about what is going. Just a one shot "This sucks" and nothing more. I have them ignored here and in-game.

 

 

1 hour ago, arcane said:

I’ve been trying to be helpful to this person because all their posted problems are so obviously fixable by just getting further into the game, but yeah, starting to feel like I’m talking to a wall.

 

 

Some people are incapable of realizing that City of Heroes is not like any other MMOG.  It's not World of Warcraft, it's not The Lord of the Rings Online, it's not Final Fantasy XIV.  It's City of Heroes.  They will play CoH and attempt to play it like a WoW-clone, struggle, give up, and ultimately move on.  It happened A LOT the first few months of Homecoming.  So, so many completely and utterly clueless level 50 Empathy Defenders with only the tier one from their secondary and the full Medicine power pool.  They tried to play CoH like a WoW-clone, struggled, were completely incapable of realizing that CoH is not a WoW-clone, gave up, and ultimately moved on.  I see the same thing happening here.

[plainguy]

14 hours ago, SmalltalkJava said:

The Ninja/Time/Mace build v2.0 is a good one.  I've modified it for several primaries.  What makes it so powerful is that it almost perma holds/stuns the mobs when you jump into the middle of the pack and apply the pbaoe, and the two debuffs.  That makes the mobs practically not fight back.    It really doesn't matter what primary you pick with it.  You will just need to modify the build slightly for the primary attack slotting and also negate any knock-back that the pets do.   It actually plays a lot like my /nature builds that use Entangling Aura, you bring yourself and act as a pocket controller to cc the mobs.

 

 

For example here is Beasts version:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

This Hero build was built using Mids Reborn 3.0.6.0
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Seasons Change: Level 49 Magic Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Beast Mastery
Secondary Power Set: Time Manipulation
Power Pool: Leadership
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Summon Wolves

• (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage
• (3) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
• (3) Overwhelming Force - Accuracy/Damage
• (5) Overwhelming Force - Damage/Chance for Knockdown/Knockback to Knockdown
• (5) Soulbound Allegiance - Chance for Build Up
• (7) Call to Arms - Defense Bonus Aura for Pets

Level 1: Time Crawl

• (A) Impeded Swiftness - Accuracy/Endurance
• (7) Impeded Swiftness - Chance of Damage(Smashing)
• (9) Pacing of the Turtle - Chance of -Recharge

Level 2: Call Swarm

• (A) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage
• (13) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
• (15) Impeded Swiftness - Chance of Damage(Smashing)
• (15) Gladiator's Javelin - Chance of Damage(Toxic)
• (17) Touch of Lady Grey - Chance for Negative Damage

Level 4: Temporal Mending

• (A) Panacea - Heal
• (17) Panacea - Heal/Endurance
• (19) Panacea - Endurance/Recharge
• (19) Panacea - Heal/Endurance/Recharge
• (21) Panacea - Heal/Recharge

Level 6: Train Beasts

• (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 8: Call Hawk

• (A) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage
• (21) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
• (23) Explosive Strike - Chance for Smashing Damage
• (23) Gladiator's Javelin - Chance of Damage(Toxic)
• (25) Apocalypse - Chance of Damage(Negative)

Level 10: Call Ravens

• (A) HamiO:Centriole Exposure
• (25) HamiO:Centriole Exposure
• (27) Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage
• (27) Annihilation - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance
• (29) Annihilation - Chance for Res Debuff

Level 12: Summon Lions

• (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage
• (29) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Damage/Endurance
• (31) Sovereign Right - Accuracy/Damage
• (31) Sovereign Right - Accuracy/Endurance
• (31) Sovereign Right - Accuracy
• (33) Edict of the Master - Defense Bonus

Level 14: Time's Juncture

• (A) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff
• (33) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Recharge/Endurance
• (33) Dark Watcher's Despair - To Hit Debuff/Endurance
• (34) Dark Watcher's Despair - Chance for Recharge Slow

Level 16: Temporal Selection

• (A) Preventive Medicine - Chance for +Absorb
• (34) Preventive Medicine - Heal
• (34) Preventive Medicine - Heal/Endurance
• (36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime
• (36) Preventive Medicine - Endurance/RechargeTime
• (36) Preventive Medicine - Heal/RechargeTime/Endurance

Level 18: Fortify Pack

• (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 20: Distortion Field

• (A) Basilisk's Gaze - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge/Hold
• (37) Basilisk's Gaze - Endurance/Recharge/Hold
• (37) Basilisk's Gaze - Recharge/Hold
• (37) Basilisk's Gaze - Chance for Recharge Slow

Level 22: Time Stop

• (A) Neuronic Shutdown - Accuracy/Hold/Recharge
• (39) Neuronic Shutdown - Chance of Damage(Psionic)
• (39) Gladiator's Net - Chance of Damage(Lethal)
• (39) Ghost Widow's Embrace - Chance of Damage(Psionic)
• (40) Unbreakable Constraint - Chance for Smashing Damage

Level 24: Maneuvers

• (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• (40) Red Fortune - Defense
• (40) Red Fortune - Defense/Endurance
• (42) Red Fortune - Endurance/Recharge
• (42) Red Fortune - Defense/Recharge
• (42) Red Fortune - Endurance

Level 26: Summon Dire Wolf

• (A) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Accuracy/Endurance
• (43) Superior Mark of Supremacy - Endurance/Pet +Resist +Regen
• (43) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage
• (43) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance
• (45) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance/Recharge
• (45) Superior Command of the Mastermind - Damage/Endurance/Recharge

Level 28: Farsight

• (A) HamiO:Cytoskeleton Exposure
• (45) HamiO:Cytoskeleton Exposure
• (46) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed
• (46) Karma - Knockback Protection

Level 30: Hasten

• (A) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 32: Tame Beasts

• (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 35: Slowed Response

• (A) Analyze Weakness - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
• (46) Shield Breaker - Accuracy/Recharge
• (47) Shield Breaker - Accuracy/Endurance/Recharge
• (47) Achilles' Heel - Chance for Res Debuff
• (47) Shield Breaker - Chance for Lethal Damage
• (48) Touch of Lady Grey - Chance for Negative Damage

Level 38: Chrono Shift

• (A) Performance Shifter - EndMod/Recharge
• (48) Efficacy Adaptor - EndMod/Recharge
• (48) Doctored Wounds - Heal/Recharge

Level 41: Assault

• (A) Endurance Reduction IO

Level 44: Tactics

• (A) Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control - Chance for Build Up

Level 47: Scorpion Shield

• (A) Luck of the Gambler - Defense/Increased Global Recharge Speed

Level 49: Power Boost

• (A) Recharge Reduction IO

Level 1: Supremacy

Level 1: Brawl

 

 

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What is the game setting if I can ask.  Meaning group and level. 1/8, 3/8 ETC

I need to keep reading the Redlynne post. I am so big on defense that when I look at it and don't see any defenses I wonder about survivability.  I get there are hit debuffs and such..  
I understand its a new concept to some degree, so I just need to wrap my head around it.

 

 

[Riverdusk]

On 10/14/2021 at 9:39 AM, Apparition said:

 

 

 

 

Some people are incapable of realizing that City of Heroes is not like any other MMOG.  It's not World of Warcraft, it's not The Lord of the Rings Online, it's not Final Fantasy XIV.  It's City of Heroes.  They will play CoH and attempt to play it like a WoW-clone, struggle, give up, and ultimately move on.  It happened A LOT the first few months of Homecoming.  So, so many completely and utterly clueless level 50 Empathy Defenders with only the tier one from their secondary and the full Medicine power pool.  They tried to play CoH like a WoW-clone, struggled, were completely incapable of realizing that CoH is not a WoW-clone, gave up, and ultimately moved on.  I see the same thing happening here.

 

Saw that exactly with my own brother.  Big WoW player, he tried CoH and gave up because he felt "it was too complicated" for him.  His exact quote.

 

As to when MM's bloom, I find the key for me while leveling up with a MM is to not join teams higher level than me.  Getting hit with being that -1 level to the team leader is more hurtful to MM's than any other AT.   Things go much smoother being even or exemping down a bit.

Edited October 15, 2021 by Riverdusk

[SmalltalkJava]

20 hours ago, plainguy said:

What is the game setting if I can ask.  Meaning group and level. 1/8, 3/8 ETC

I need to keep reading the Redlynne post. I am so big on defense that when I look at it and don't see any defenses I wonder about survivability.  I get there are hit debuffs and such..  
I understand its a new concept to some degree, so I just need to wrap my head around it.

When I solo I usually play at 3/8 before incarnate shifted, then 4/8.  Sometimes depending on enemy types then I will bump it down.    My baseline for all characters at level 50 that aren't Incarnated, is starting with 3/8 doing Unai Kemen's 2nd  "Close The Dimensional Portals" mission that has all of the Council mobs   If a fresh built 50 can do that comfortably then its a keeper.   They do knockback and stun so toggles will drop, and once your detoggled then your dead.   I usually on softie characters buy some P2W defense amplifiers to keep from getting stunned.  I don't always do it but sometimes.  Depends if i feel like spending the inf and the toon is fun.

 

My toon before the Farsight buff has S/L Def of 19.80, E 17.08.   with Power Boosted Farsight:  40.60 SL, and 37.88 E.   Add another 5 with Defense Amplifier or Barrier if you go that way.  I probably will go Clarion for CC protection.  If I get time I'l try to make a video.    But it may be a while. 

 

 

[Neiska]

A lot of this depends on several things too. 

-Incarnate level shifts. (very important for masterminds)

-solo vs team play.

-difficulty selected.

- how well slotted/invested the build is.

- what activity is being done - AoE damage, ST damage, Support role, healing, AV/GMs, etc. There is no single Mastermind build that will be 10/10 on all these activities. There is always give and take somewhere.

-and of course, personal preference for style, strengths, so on.

 

There is no magic X pet/X secondary that can "do it all" in a way everyone will like. My favorite secondary is electric, because for my style it really is an all in 1 package. But time is a strong contender too. But no teveryone feels the same. And thats perfectly fine and normal. Some people praise /Storm to the high heavens, when I have tried it 2 or 3 times now, and to this day I still don't see how it ranks so high among some players. But again, that's just preference and style. Even though I don't personally care for /Storm much, that isn't to say its a terrible set or anything of the sort.

 

Far as when Masterminds "bloom", to me it depends on the pet + power pairing. Some sets do well right out the gate, others are slow to start. But I have always felt a "lull" just after reaching 50 with a mastermind, until that first incarnate level is attained. So I usually mail myself a transcendent merit so that I can immediately get my level shift the moment I ding 50.

 

But when it comes to any AT, but perhaps Masterminds especially, your mileage may vary, even with the exact same setup as someone else. And lets not forget, that 1 on 1 comparisons of masterminds vs other ATs isn't usually impressive. (at least on paper), in particular if the one comparing is tunnel visioning and regarding DPS as the end all-be all measuring stick. Masterminds will never shine when it comes to DPS (at least when alone.) But they can shine in nearly every other way if you build them correctly. They even have some extra features and mechanics that no other AT has that people sometimes forget about when comparing ATs, things like Bodyguard mode, or the Increased aggro capacity. These are things that no other AT can benifit from, no matter what powers they select or how much time and inf is spent on them.

 

So yes, Masterminds an certainly stand out, but I think that really is fair to say about any AT. But Masterminds are far from garbage.

 

Just my two cents.

Edited October 16, 2021 by Neiska
spelling

[plainguy]

4 hours ago, SmalltalkJava said:

When I solo I usually play at 3/8 before incarnate shifted, then 4/8.  Sometimes depending on enemy types then I will bump it down.    My baseline for all characters at level 50 that aren't Incarnated, is starting with 3/8 doing Unai Kemen's 2nd  "Close The Dimensional Portals" mission that has all of the Council mobs   If a fresh built 50 can do that comfortably then its a keeper.   They do knockback and stun so toggles will drop, and once your detoggled then your dead.   I usually on softie characters buy some P2W defense amplifiers to keep from getting stunned.  I don't always do it but sometimes.  Depends if i feel like spending the inf and the toon is fun.

 

My toon before the Farsight buff has S/L Def of 19.80, E 17.08.   with Power Boosted Farsight:  40.60 SL, and 37.88 E.   Add another 5 with Defense Amplifier or Barrier if you go that way.  I probably will go Clarion for CC protection.  If I get time I'l try to make a video.    But it may be a while. 

 

 

You know I forgot it was TIME !.. I'm retarded.. 

[plainguy]

On 10/14/2021 at 3:21 AM, Diantane said:

I’ve read about several builds that promise great rewards (the best combinations). This was curious to me so I  investigated. Not just by playing the identical combination, but by the power set itself. For example, bots and traps mm. Didn’t bother playing that set as it would take too long to see the secondary all the way through. I’ve already played bots/ many times and know what they are capable of. But didn’t know much about “Traps”. So I made a traps/ defender to see this “primary” at its very best. It had some nice utility, but how on earth was this going to make bots more damaging in combat? I just don’t see it.

 

Another one was Ninjas/Time. Again good utility, but the Ninja is a frail pet that fights in close melee combat. If it doesn’t have some sort of armor (being resistance and/or defense), it will die quickly. A weak heal won’t be enough in fierce combat. The “Time” power is just telling you how much of it you will spend re-summoning your dead pets. This was bad enough when I used “thermal” in combination. Even with the high resistance shields and the strong heals, I was re-summoning my ninjas constantly, let alone with “time.” There’s a “time” and place for this power set, but definitely not with ninjas.

 

As I first stated, “I just don’t see it.”

I play a lot of Petless and Semi Petless masterminds ( Last Pet )

 

If you go to my thread on Petless mastermind in my signature, you will see I killed an AV with Robot (Assault Bot) and Traps. 

Trick Arrow is good.. Oil Slick eats them up when ignited. 

The build I go for with Trick arrow which is obtainable is Range/Melee Defense cap and S/L Resistance cap with high recharge for Oil Slick. 

I just jump in drop everything from Trick Arrow, put pet on aggressive if it is a semi petless build or normal for full pet build. Then I just point them at a boss and keep fighting the boss until dead and move on to another boss.

 

I have many trick arrow Semi-petless masterminds. 

[Crysis]

On 10/14/2021 at 11:14 PM, plainguy said:

What is the game setting if I can ask.  Meaning group and level. 1/8, 3/8 ETC

I need to keep reading the Redlynne post. I am so big on defense that when I look at it and don't see any defenses I wonder about survivability.  I get there are hit debuffs and such..  
I understand its a new concept to some degree, so I just need to wrap my head around it.

 

 

 

Having now played @Redlynne’s Ninja/Time/Mace build to vet level 20+ something, I won’t say that it’s the most powerful MM in my stable, but it’s definitely the most sturdy/powerful Ninja/anything I’ve ever played.  

 

I always build a toon for +DEF softcap on something.  S/L/E/N typically, although Range sometimes, or M/R/AoE if playing a melee AT.  But the point of many builds is that they achieve effective +DEF softcap via -TOHIT Debuffing, which amounts to the same impact as +DEF.  Once I realized that, particularly on my /Time characters, achieving mathematic +DEF softcap isn’t quite as big of a deal and it allows me to chase other set bonuses since as long as I’ve got Times Juncture running and I’m in the middle of the target spawn, the entire attack sequence of pretty much everything is neutered.  Psi, Toxic, Ranged -DEFDEBUFF, Resistance Debuffs, etc…..all those nasty 40+ ‘ewwwwww’ debuffs that tear apart your well crafted build go buh-bye-bye because THEY CANT LAND A PUNCH on you or anyone else.  So your pets survivability goes through the roof, they don’t have to close to melee, etc.  -TOHIT debuffing is arguably even better than +DEF in the late game because it’s a blanket layer of protection against any an all attacks that aren’t auto-hit.  And usually by late game, everyone else has already built up some high +DEF so it’s value/utility goes up exponentially because nothing hurts if it can’t land, and unlike us, most of the critters/AV’s can’t pop a yellow inspiration.

[plainguy]

5 hours ago, Crysis said:

 

Having now played @Redlynne’s Ninja/Time/Mace build to vet level 20+ something, I won’t say that it’s the most powerful MM in my stable, but it’s definitely the most sturdy/powerful Ninja/anything I’ve ever played.  

 

I always build a toon for +DEF softcap on something.  S/L/E/N typically, although Range sometimes, or M/R/AoE if playing a melee AT.  But the point of many builds is that they achieve effective +DEF softcap via -TOHIT Debuffing, which amounts to the same impact as +DEF.  Once I realized that, particularly on my /Time characters, achieving mathematic +DEF softcap isn’t quite as big of a deal and it allows me to chase other set bonuses since as long as I’ve got Times Juncture running and I’m in the middle of the target spawn, the entire attack sequence of pretty much everything is neutered.  Psi, Toxic, Ranged -DEFDEBUFF, Resistance Debuffs, etc…..all those nasty 40+ ‘ewwwwww’ debuffs that tear apart your well crafted build go buh-bye-bye because THEY CANT LAND A PUNCH on you or anyone else.  So your pets survivability goes through the roof, they don’t have to close to melee, etc.  -TOHIT debuffing is arguably even better than +DEF in the late game because it’s a blanket layer of protection against any an all attacks that aren’t auto-hit.  And usually by late game, everyone else has already built up some high +DEF so it’s value/utility goes up exponentially because nothing hurts if it can’t land, and unlike us, most of the critters/AV’s can’t pop a yellow inspiration.

Yea.. My big mistake is for some crazy reason I didn't realize this was TIME.. I got caught up in the Proc math on the attacks that for some reason I just didn't catch the secondary.. 

Senior moment.. 

[Maelwys]

6 hours ago, Crysis said:

-TOHIT debuffing is arguably even better than +DEF in the late game

 

Whilst I completely agree that debuffs are great, the problem with using -Tohit in your defcap calculations is that its effectiveness differs greatly depending on what you're fighting.

 

+Defense is difficult to negate: very few foes have noteworthy +Tohit buffs or Autohit attacks (lategame it's mainly Nemesis, Rularuu and Incarnate content) so packing some Defense Debuff Resistance will be sufficient most of the time.

 

However -ToHit debuffs get affected by enemy debuff resistances and level difference. So all your powers that inflict -ToHit tend to operate between 30% and 65% effectiveness vs regular foes in endgame, and they become negligible against AVs and GMs (e.g. best case vs a Lv54 AV is 8.45% effectiveness!)

 

Edited October 16, 2021 by Maelwys