Can diversification reasonably extend to control/support powersets with weapons?

[DougGraves]

Can you imagine an axe/axe controller?

 

Or a dual pistols/war mace controller?

 

While I love the visuals of the weapon sets and like the idea for design and theme - I just cannot imagine how those sets could be designed.

[MistressOhm]

Controller sets typically perform "at a distance" with a few PBAoE effects thrown in.

 

So while one could theoretically have a stun-heavy "nightstick" controller set for up close, it'd be hard to extrapolate that to anything out of melee.  

 

Ranged weaponry is more do-able, such as a beam-rifle based control set that projected energy barriers, sapper effects (Ah! Sapper!), and so on.  Possibly a lasso or bullwhip set, or gadgets (bolos, boomerangs, smoke bombs, and the like).  Since we've seen 'chaining' attacks with some sets (effect jumps from primary target to secondary targets and then back to caster), I'm sure one could use that logic to throw a boomerang and have it hit multiple targets before returning to the thrower.

Edited November 26, 2022 by MistressOhm

[Spaghetti Betty]

Well, maybe in a sort of broad "Weapon Control" aspect, like controlling floating weaponry, but nothing really "in your face" like the respective martial weapon sets.

 

I think a support set could also work in a vague sense. Like a "Battle Captain" type of thing where your weapon would be used as more of an idol than for combat. You would fortify your team's strengths through shouts and battle tactics. That would be pretty cool.

[biostem]

16 minutes ago, DougGraves said:

While I love the visuals of the weapon sets and like the idea for design and theme - I just cannot imagine how those sets could be designed.

Well, a lot depends upon how you envision these weapons being used.  For instance, a character could simply raise their chosen weapon, and have the effect emanate from it, (like a traditional wizard's wand or staff).

 

Another option is the high-tech or gadget approach - you have what looks like an axe, and you throw it at your enemy or at the ground near them, then it generates the desired effect.

 

You could also try to take a more "realistic" approach - for instance, maybe you wield a mace with a focus on inflicting debilitating effects instead of damage.  For instance, a precise strike to your opponent's head to disorient them, or a blow to their knee to cripple/immobilize them.  Maybe you can deliver a blow so precisely to their back that you can temporarily paralyze (read: hold) them...

Edited November 26, 2022 by biostem

[DougGraves]

30 minutes ago, biostem said:

You could also try to take a more "realistic" approach - for instance, maybe you wield a mace with a focus on inflicting debilitating effects instead of damage.  For instance, a precise strike to your opponent's head to disorient them, or a blow to their knee to cripple/immobilize them.  Maybe you can deliver a blow so precisely to their back that you can temporarily paralyze (read: hold) them...

 

I could see mace as a control power with stuns and such.  WoW had a rogue build based on stunning with a mace.

 

 

[Major_Decoy]

Just for clarity, what you're describing is proliferation, not diversification.

 

And, hypothetically, it could, but someone would need to design the power sets and, from what I understand, they can't make new animations so it'd have to use existing resources.

[biostem]

39 minutes ago, Major_Decoy said:

they can't make new animations

The black wand animation could easily be modified to use other weapon models.  Whether they could speed it up or slow it down to add some alternate options is also worth considering.  There are also several weapon taunt animations where you hold out the weapon, which, if the tip of said weapon could be set as the emanation point, could also be utilized...

[Clave Dark 5]

7 hours ago, biostem said:

Whether they could speed it up or slow it down to add some alternate options is also worth considering.

I believe I heard they can (and have), but it's not easy, and it doesn't always end up 'looking right', so it's kind of "sometimes yes, sometimes no."

[Snarky]

Giant frost o matic hand cannon.  Ice trollers dream

[Yaliw]

Bullet control: best control set. Puts enemy's hp to zero. There is no mez protection from that.

 

[MrPengy]

Ya know, a melee range "control" set actually sounds super awesome, along with a secondary assault set that's mostly melee, for Dominators. I don't see it making sense for controllers. Imagine like staff melee, but the "control" set has you smacking enemies in the ankles to make them unable to walk for a minute, or hit them in the head real good to stun them. Maybe a cone attack that hits all the enemies in front of you in the knees, and causes a "slow" effect. Pair that with staff melee, and you've got a character that can debilitate enemies and take them down all in melee range, with the same weapon.

[Tiger Shadow]

1 hour ago, Yaliw said:

Bullet control: best control set. Puts enemy's hp to zero. There is no mez protection from that.

 

 

The Freakshow would disagree.

[High_Beam]

On 11/26/2022 at 4:03 PM, Spaghetti Betty said:

I think a support set could also work in a vague sense. Like a "Battle Captain" type of thing where your weapon would be used as more of an idol than for combat. You would fortify your team's strengths through shouts and battle tactics. That would be pretty cool.

Rally around the flag as it were.  It was why people gave their lives to keep the flag flying in a battle in the old days of war because it acted as not just a positional beacon for the force but a motivator to fight.

 

Flag-Fu Melee Set

[OmegaOne]

There is already a melee controller - it's called a Tank. 😉

 

 

Edited November 28, 2022 by OmegaOne

[cranebump]

Don't you know  by now that we of the intrawebs cannot do anything reasonably?🙂

 

My wish list is DP/Arrows and MA/SJ. I can simulate it a bit with Fighting/Sands (maybe even adding flurry from SS), but (sigh) full on slap/tickle (with sharp, ranged, pointy things), isn't yet a thing.

 

That aside, I think I agree with the comment that a melee controller is basically a tank.

Edited November 28, 2022 by cranebump

[Verfall]

I've always wanted a Sentinel like AT, where the primary is ranged/melee, i.e. pistol in one hand, sword in the other; and the secondary is control/armor. Basically dominator meets stalker and sentinel in a consensual relationship...

[MistressOhm]

5 hours ago, Verfall said:

Basically dominator meets stalker and sentinel in a consensual relationship...

 

Dude, keep your inter-archetypical purple prose out of this!  😛

 

Seriously, a Swashbuckler ranged/melee hybrid would be fun.  Gimped to hell having a few tools from many disciplines and no specialization, but still fun.  

[Player2]

A Wand-themed control set would give some kind of "weapon" to use.  I suggested it on another thread in the Suggestions section, but basically use existing animations that point (like the Blackwand and Nemesis Staff attacks) along with some melee attacks to simulate waving the "wand" thematically.  I suggested an elementalist approach with a generic attacks option and then a power like Dual Pistols -> Ammo that would let you choose one of the four elements to apply additional thematic effects (and damage change) to the base powers.

 

"Wand" can be anything from actual wands (like the one from the Lost Cure to the Blackwand prestige power) or staff or any melee weapon ("screw you, this ornate sword is for magic not hacking people apart!") or technological devices (such as the Medicine pool scanner).

 

Then supply additional related powersets for support (Defender primary, Controller/Corruptor/Mastermind secondary), blast (Blaster/Corruptor primary, Defender secondary), manipulation (Blaster secondary), and assault (Dominator secondary) and you'll get a major boost to the non-melee ATs that can let them have a "weapon" for primary and secondary powersets... except for masterminds who will only get it as a secondary.

 

What the hell, make an Elemental pets powerset for masterminds and reuse some of the powers from the above sets for wand attacks, and everyone gets a "wand" primary!

Tier 1 pets:  2 fire imps, 1 jack frost

Tier 2 pets:  2 air elementals  (use the CoT ghosts, and maybe make them a little more transparent)

Tier 3 pet:  1 stone elemental

[Grouchybeast]

For the past couple of days I randomly keep thinking about a control set that consists of variations on the character just walking up behind NPCs and whacking them on the back of the head with a heavy object, and laughing to myself.  It would be the most fun control set ever.  You could call it Cranial Control.