Most Team-Friendly Stalker

[00Troy00]

Is it possible to make a truly effective stalker that's also helpful to a team?

[Gulbasaur]

I think there's a good case for Shield Defence being the most team-friendly out of the box, just because Grant Cover provies allies with a ~8.5% defence buff in an AoE around the player. Shield Charge allows for some (sporadic) soft control with knockdown.

 

Dark has two mez auras, so taking either one of those will basically take minions out of the fight, which provides team-wide benefits. That's less relevant at 50 when everyone is overpowered, but while levelling or if you have sidekicked-up teammates it's actually quite helpful.  Dark Melee also has an AoE fear, so you can stack them to hold higher tier mobs. Actually, the Presence pool has a load of Fear powers, including an AoE, so control through Fear might be a path you could go down.

 

Radiation also has Ground Zero, which has a middling AOE heal among a load of other effects. It's an odd grab-bag of a power, but it's a nice little extra in an otherwise good powerset.

 

The Leadership powers are pretty weak on a stalker, but a little defence goes a long way and Radiation has very, very good endurance management as long as your health is high.

Edited March 28 by Gulbasaur

[Zect]

Yes.

 

😄

[honoroit]

spines/bio - fill things with -def splinters, do trash clear fast.

 

spine burst crits are fun, throw spines too.

 

savage/shield would hop about a lot between groups - as a melee you gotta close travel time to compete with / supplement  the ranged blast crew.

 

elec shield similarly, I prefer savage due to the built-in recharge boost on the blood stack buffs thats always ticking. (savage just has better powers - jacobs ladder vs shred as an example. tho you can argue on dmg type, practically you'll likely have more fun in savage)

 

savage / bio also works, because bio dmg buffs.   but shield is more team friendly >> grant cover.

 

[KC4800]

Ice Armor/SJ with Chilling Embrace as soft control is also  very team friendly.

[Groovy_Ghoul]

Stone Melee provides two AOE attacks with Knockdown. KD = damage mitigation for the entire team.

 

+1 for Shield Defense with Grant Cover

[MoonSheep]

i have an elec/shield i levelled to 50 in teams with @Xiddo and it was bloody good. my third proper lvl 50 in my 4 years of HC

 

phat juicy AoEs complimented with great ST damage - what’s not to like?

 

grab fold space and you’re laughing

[SeraphimKensai]

7 hours ago, honoroit said:

spines/bio - fill things with -def splinters, do trash clear fast.

spine burst crits are fun, throw spines too.

 

 

I personally like spines, but sadly spines doesn't do -def. It does -speed/-recharge. Thorns does -def instead. I've personally offered a suggestion before to make spines do -def instead, but it gained no traction.

 

Back to the OP about the most team friendly stalker....I think it has to to be Dark/SD, as the -tohitdebuff on each attack helps a whole team's survivability, which is synergistic with grant cover.

[honoroit]

1 hour ago, SeraphimKensai said:

Thorns does -def instead

mistooks! im dominating these days

[StriderIV]

10 hours ago, KC4800 said:

Ice Armor/SJ with Chilling Embrace as soft control is also  very team friendly.

This. My KM/Ice Stalker is great on teams. Between the soft control Chilling Embrace provides and the -Dmg KM provides, you bring some nice utility.

Edited March 28 by StriderIV

[biostem]

12 hours ago, 00Troy00 said:

Is it possible to make a truly effective stalker that's also helpful to a team?

A claws/radiation armor stalker would have the ability to "reach out" and get at those distant enemies, while also providing some PBAoE punch, debuffing, and healing.  A savage or electric melee stalker could instead move themselves to the enemy instead of the ranged attacks in claws.

[Yomo Kimyata]

13 hours ago, 00Troy00 said:

Is it possible to make a truly effective stalker that's also helpful to a team?

 

Your title and your question are two separate issues, in my eyes.

 

The answer to your question is:  of course!  If you are on a team as anything except a tanker then you are trying to help defeat enemies before they defeat your team.  Stalkers are great at defeating.

 

Your title makes me think about various debuffs available.  Like KM/Rad.  But it's all good.

[00Troy00]

19 minutes ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

 

Your title and your question are two separate issues, in my eyes.

 

The answer to your question is:  of course!  If you are on a team as anything except a tanker then you are trying to help defeat enemies before they defeat your team.  Stalkers are great at defeating.

 

Your title makes me think about various debuffs available.  Like KM/Rad.  But it's all good.

I asked because some have told me stalkers were useless on a team (and to be honest,, I don't see them on teams much).

[biostem]

20 minutes ago, 00Troy00 said:

some have told me stalkers were useless on a team

I would argue that those "some" are incorrect.

 

21 minutes ago, 00Troy00 said:

I don't see them on teams much

This, IMHO, is more due to which ATs better lend themselves to the kind of steamroller play that is frequently encountered in PUGs or the like, vs the kind of methodical and surgical strikes Stalkers excel at...

[Yomo Kimyata]

29 minutes ago, 00Troy00 said:

I asked because some have told me stalkers were useless on a team (and to be honest,, I don't see them on teams much).

 

I'm sorry to hear that.  I'm guessing that has a lot more to do with the people putting the team together than the people making up the team.  I can imagine some teams (like a 4star or Master Of type team) would want to craft their team, but for the most part, we are all a bunch of rikti monkeys mashing buttons, and I suggest to you to be the type of monkey you want to be.  Personally, I don't team much, but when I do I expect to solo it.  Play what you want to play is my advice.

[honoroit]

stalkers are useful on teams. a well equipped on can almost tank and do stupid damage.

 

+3/+4 groups you can feel them more, as you can still delete bosses and lieutenants.  proper delete. 

 

you're right though, stalkers seem rarer.

Edited March 29 by honoroit

[UltraAlt]

19 hours ago, 00Troy00 said:

Is it possible to make a truly effective stalker that's also helpful to a team?

 

It seems to me you need a stalker-friendly team to get the best use out of stalker in team situations.

I can see a traps/devices/stalker team working well together.

 

Since you practically have to make a stalker a scrapper to team with a bulldozer team, I can't say that there really is a good team-build for them if you are running with a bulldozer team.

I mean, you're lucky to be able to run in and get an assassin strike off on a bulldozer team and the assassin strike the main reason to have a stalker. 

Edited March 29 by UltraAlt

[Greldek]

Stalkers are great, and always welcome on a team, except maybe for the people that only run at +0/-1 where even bosses die in the initial AOE wave from everyone else. And it's not that they aren't welcome on those teams, just their large single target damage isn't as useful on those teams that only run everything on ez-mode.

 

Spines, Staff, and Elec Melee all seem to have quite a bit of AoE still in them with stalkers, so that will help with the minion clearing. Ice armor, dark armor, have soft control to help lock things down. Shield defense has an AoE knockdown, and a team buff, but its very END intensive to run Shield Defense, so be prepared to mitigate that through hoarding blue insp, p2w recovery power, or IO's to grand end (or all 3).

 

I ran a manticore the other night and we had a stalker who was just deleting paragon protectors, that was very, very helpful to the speed of the run, cause when they can't get a MoG off and become impossible to kill, thats a great team mate putting in that work. Also a lot of TF's have AV's at the end, great ST damage is always wanted in those situations, and stalkers bring a ton of that.

[tidge]

On 3/28/2023 at 7:07 AM, honoroit said:

spines/bio - fill things with -def splinters, do trash clear fast.

 

As was mentioned, -def isn't part of the equation, but I Spines/Bio is a very team-friendly Stalker IMO, because it offers several AoE options in addition to typical single-target stabby-stabby:

• DNA Siphon is the real gem, as it plays nicely with %procs in addition to helping the Stalker... and it also grabs aggro
• Throw Spines is a ranged cone that takes many %procs... it's "only" 10 targets, yet boosting range makes it very helpful, especially when
• Ripper (a melee cone, don't %proc this!) sends enemies flying backwards

I'm not a huge fan of Spine Burst but it does take useful Enhancement Sets. Parasitic Aura is -DMG, which teams should appreciate (if used as an "alpha strike"). Impale is also not a favorite power of mine, but the -Fly and Immobilize effects bring utility.

 

The /Bio defense isn't directly helping the team, but /Bio Stalkers can be very difficult to insta-kill and the secondary has the tools to recover from incoming damage. This has some positives (my opinion!) for teams:

• If Stealthing/Hiding to a mission objective in a crowded room, a Spines/Bio Stalker can almost always survive and clear any nearby spawn faster than any other AT. The most problematic enemies will be those that have strong resists to the Stalker's damage... TBH, the enemy damage resistances are the most frustrating part of Spines/Bio.
• If simply grinding through x8 maps, a Spines/Bio Stalker can handle a lot of aggro, and since it can deliver some power AoE "alpha strikes" of its own, they really help to keep the team moving.
• With the ST attacks, they can switch up to Boss-murder as needed.

[InvaderStych]

On 3/28/2023 at 3:41 PM, 00Troy00 said:

some have told me stalkers were useless on a team

 

Rubbish.

 

Properly used Stalkers are great on teams. Especially after the introduction of Combat Teleport. Easy to stay just far enough ahead of the main wave to AS a boss right as the aggro sponge is arriving.  Wasn't impossible before that, but now it is easier/smoother. They're great on TF missions that can be sped; stealth the glowies, or find the Big Bad and ATT everyone in.

 

On 3/28/2023 at 6:08 PM, honoroit said:

+3/+4 groups you can feel them more, as you can still delete bosses and lieutenants.  proper delete. 

 

This. They're durable enough to go toe to toe with hard targets, and ST damage is their specialty. Running a stalker on a team is all about target selection.

 

On 3/28/2023 at 6:08 PM, honoroit said:

you're right though, stalkers seem rarer.

 

Lack of AoE makes them a little slower to solo than a similar Scrapper, and the myth that they're "no good" on teams doesn't help.

 

Ran my Fire/Stone/Blaze on teams throughout the TFC series (in level for each, for the sticklers out there) and probably about 50/50 overall while leveling it. No one complained, lol.

Edited March 31 by InvaderStych

[honoroit]

weirdly, ran a posi 1 today on excelsior.  half the group were melee, and we managed a time of 31m with only 1x tt available. which is reasonable.

 

it cant be overstated that you are proper invisible. if you put celerity stealth in sprint, itll only be a venganced up guy-with-brass-rifle type that can see you, so you can go to objectives and att (p2w power, dont spend power slots in tp pool that deep unless crazy).  

 

also, if you like or want to try pvp, you have a big upper hand.

 

but ya, half of us were melee, and a matrial arts stalker was there with my en/en. ST stuff everywhere. horrid monsters popping from full health to dead.

 

and um, moonbeam, and  shadow meld, when your a big kid, if you like soul mastery.  pew. 

[brasilgringo]

I think Elec/Shield on stalker is pretty team-friendly, as you have good AOE plus good ST and obviously the team benefits of Shield (and teams to help overcome some of Shield's weaknesses).

[ZemX]

On 3/28/2023 at 5:41 PM, 00Troy00 said:

I asked because some have told me stalkers were useless on a team (and to be honest,, I don't see them on teams much).

 

Depends on the team and the mission.  If you're on a team that's just steamrolling content, sure, it doesn't matter much.  But that makes a lot more than just Stalkers feeling not very useful.  If the team IS more well matched to the content, then the value of a Stalker is similar to a Scrapper.  You are a boss killer.  Bosses have 6x the hit points of minions, better resistances, and are more dangerous to squishies.   Taking them down fast is valuable.  And they aren't dying to an AoE barrage unless the team is just way overpowered compared to the difficulty.

 

That said, if I'm answering the question I think is actually being asked, a Stalker I've played that has a lot of team utility outside of the primary damage dealing... is Ice/Shield.  I play this one as off-tank (or if the team is really desperate... tank).  I even have Provoke (which btw is useful even solo to help control runners).  Keep an eye on the outskirts of the battle and intercept anything either running away or towards any of the squishier teammates.  Block ambushes or choke-points with Ice Patch.  Add a little hold mag to deadlier enemies with Freezing Touch.  Attacks slow enemies a little bit, contributing to less incoming damage a little bit.  Ice Patch is also great on lower level teams where the tank or brute can use a little help surviving.  Really cuts down incoming damage.

[Random Axis]

In my opinion, stalkers are there to take down the tougher mobs that don't evaporate when the rest of the team dumps their AOE on the group of enemies, so speeding up killing bosses and AVs is your team contribution. 

 

For a more general meaning of support, I like my ice/ice stalker. I've got frost and chilling embrace to apply a slow, ice patch for knockdown zone, and freezing touch for powerful hold on a quick recharge.

[Riot Siren]

For the secondary shield for sure providing up to 13% def for teammates and -7.5% damage to enemies, which has a pretty good effect on team survivabilty at all levels.  A few other sets have some useful de-buffs like ice or Bio, or unique stuff like rads heal or EA and Dark control auras, but I feel nothing comes close to that 13% def in terms of usefulness. For reference against a base 50% hit rate, 13% added def lowers that to 37% which lowers damage by roughly 25% and it's value only goes up if they already have def buffs, up to the soft cap around 45% (higher though if in incarnate or 4* content). Now if that soft cap is already reached normally more def wouldn't help much, however this ALSO is one of very few powers that can grant Defense debuff resist to other players. Def debuff being one of the worst debuffs for a player to get hit, as getting hit quickly increases the chance of getting hit more and getting debuffed even more. While it's not enough to really protect from it, it increases the chance for a player to react to it and mitigate it. Needless to say, it's a good power. On top of that Shield also grants you alot of extra damage and a amazing AoE, making it very good for offense as well. It's biggest weakness is it's lack of self sustain, but that also suits team play well as almost every support set has a heal in it and can take care of that for you. The set was entirely designed with team play in mind.

 

In terms of primary it's alot harder to figure out. I would say Ice would probably be the best for team play. It has a great control skill in ice patch which can keep enemies slipping forever while also having some really solid AoE in frost and frozen aura, and a very solid single target damage rotation which includes a stack-able hold in it, all with one of the least resisted damage types in the game and slows on everything. I could also see a argument for any other high tier set though but I think ice is the best all around package specifically just for team play.

 

So I would say Ice/Shield would be the best team stalker.