Zone Travel Updates in Issue 27

[Glacier Peak]

20 minutes ago, EmperorSteele said:

 

For what it's worth, I've been playing missions solo, and 10 minutes is fine. I get in, do the mission, and by the time I'm done, LRTP is usually back up. And if it's not, I still have two portable base portals, two mission teleports, and an Ouro Portal to get from place to place. Or, I can just use my travel powers to get to a train in about a minute or two.

 

That's just been my experience though, YMMV.

This is my experience as well. Doing flashback missions is even easier now with so many ways to return to contact at the beginning of the arc.

[Blackbird71]

30 minutes ago, EmperorSteele said:

 

For what it's worth, I've been playing missions solo, and 10 minutes is fine. I get in, do the mission, and by the time I'm done, LRTP is usually back up. And if it's not, I still have two portable base portals, two mission teleports, and an Ouro Portal to get from place to place. Or, I can just use my travel powers to get to a train in about a minute or two.

 

That's just been my experience though, YMMV.

"YMMV" is the important part here.  I'm often jumping locations three times in under five minutes.  Needing to juggle more than one power to do this is an unnecessary inconvenience.

[Replacement]

9 hours ago, Infinitum said:

My turkey is not dull, in fact there is a better than average chance it would change your life.

 

Its a long process that starts with a 24 hr brine of wine, kosher salt and texas pete - next you dry the turkey - then have this rub thats made of flour texas pete and seasonings till it becomes a paste coating the turkey - lastly I fry it till crispy on the outside and juicy on the inside....  Like i said - change... your... life....

Now imagine all of this effort spent on something that already has taste.

[Flintlock Burnfur]

26 minutes ago, Glacier Peak said:

It's not a hassle at all. You're making it sound harder than it is. Just like you said though, not everyone plays the way you do so this shouldn't be a concern for the larger community right?

 

You say this update (which gave players more teleporter beacons and made zone base portals closer to other zone transportation hubs) gave players a reason to not use bases as hubs, which is incorrect and misleading. Players have more accessibility than ever before. How are you not seeing that?

I do exactly this.  And now with base portals in hazard zones like the Hollows or Perez Park, I can get to my base with ease so I can go to a contact in Peregrine Island without having to zone to Steel Canyon, take the tram to Talos and hit the ferry to Peregrine.  Or even zone to Steel, hit the base portal and then onto Peregrine.  Now there's one step less (two steps if you go by the first example).  It's awesome, and make for quick travel from one place to another, as opposed to what we had before.  Not all zones are hard to get to, but this will definitely make it easier, plus you don't have to activate the Teleport to Base power in a hazard zone anymore.

14 minutes ago, Blackbird71 said:

"YMMV" is the important part here.  I'm often jumping locations three times in under five minutes.  Needing to juggle more than one power to do this is an unnecessary inconvenience.

But you're not juggling more than one power.  It's just one power, with a context menu.  Whereas before the changes, it was several different powers that ended up cluttering you trays.  With Ouro, Pocket D, the Base Teleporter all taking up their own slot in the tray, it meant juggling powers around just to make those teleporters fit.  Now, there's one power, and you not only have access to Ouro, Pocket D and your base with convenience, but you've also got access to every zone in the game, which we did not have before.

Edited November 27, 2020 by Flintlock Burnfur

[Infinitum]

15 minutes ago, Replacement said:

Now imagine all of this effort spent on something that already has taste.

Its kinda like willpower - once GB learned to slot it - it was good then.

 

Foods like slotting takes skill to make good :-)

 

Except regen, no amount of seasoning makes it good.

Edited November 27, 2020 by Infinitum

[SuperBear]

First, let me say again, I really do appreciate all the hard work you guys have put into this game.

That being said - maybe I'm just misunderstanding... when I use ANY teleportation power (base, team, mission, etc.) are they ALL supposed to go into a cooldown timer? If not, then I have a bug OR if that's working as intended, then yes it's a PITA. Help ?? 😢

 

[Jimmy]

Some posts have been hidden.

 

Two people arguing about each other drowning out the thread is, to one's surprise, drowning out the thread. So let's try to avoid doing that. Stick to new feedback, questions, and answers please.

[Jimmy]

11 minutes ago, damienray said:

First, let me say again, I really do appreciate all the hard work you guys have put into this game.

That being said - maybe I'm just misunderstanding... when I use ANY teleportation power (base, team, mission, etc.) are they ALL supposed to go into a cooldown timer? If not, then I have a bug OR if that's working as intended, then yes it's a PITA. Help ?? 😢

 

That definitely doesn't sound like it's working as intended.

 

Could you post an exact step-by-step of what you're experiencing in the bug forum? Ideally with screenshots.

[Blackbird71]

44 minutes ago, Flintlock Burnfur said:

But you're not juggling more than one power.  It's just one power, with a context menu.  Whereas before the changes, it was several different powers that ended up cluttering you trays.  With Ouro, Pocket D, the Base Teleporter all taking up their own slot in the tray, it meant juggling powers around just to make those teleporters fit.  Now, there's one power, and you not only have access to Ouro, Pocket D and your base with convenience, but you've also got access to every zone in the game, which we did not have before.

That's an oversimplification to the point of absurdity.  Yes, it is more than one power.  They are each acquired separately and through different means and with different costs, and they have different activations, cooldowns, and effects. 

[Flintlock Burnfur]

How is that oversimplifying?  That's exactly what entails with the power.  Yes, you have to get the Ouro portal, the Pocket D portal and the Base one.  That hasn't changed.  No one's handing them out like candy.  But you can get Ouro at level 1 now instead of level 14.  And once you get it, everything is in one power and a context menu.  Each of your portals is listed in the context menu.  And once you've collected badges from zones, those zones are accessible in the LRT.  Everything on the context menu is pretty clear as to what it's used for.  Don't have team teleport?  That's fine, you had to buy one at the P2W before anyway, and you're buying one now which gets added to the context menu.  Get an Ouro portal, that's on the context menu.  Pocket D, on the context menu with all the other zones under LRT.  Everything is pretty much spelled out in the context menu.

[Blackbird71]

4 minutes ago, Flintlock Burnfur said:

How is that oversimplifying?  That's exactly what entails with the power.  Yes, you have to get the Ouro portal, the Pocket D portal and the Base one.  That hasn't changed.  No one's handing them out like candy.  But you can get Ouro at level 1 now instead of level 14.  And once you get it, everything is in one power and a context menu.  Each of your portals is listed in the context menu.  And once you've collected badges from zones, those zones are accessible in the LRT.  Everything on the context menu is pretty clear as to what it's used for.  Don't have team teleport?  That's fine, you had to buy one at the P2W before anyway, and you're buying one now which gets added to the context menu.  Get an Ouro portal, that's on the context menu.  Pocket D, on the context menu with all the other zones under LRT.  Everything is pretty much spelled out in the context menu.

Claiming several separate and distinct powers are only one power with a "context" menu is oversimplifying.  Scratch that; it's a denial of reality.  Not even the devs are claiming they are all one power.

[Flintlock Burnfur]

But it is ONE BUTTON on the tray.  And there's a context menu!  That's what it is!

[Coyotedancer]

2 hours ago, EmperorSteele said:

 

For what it's worth, I've been playing missions solo, and 10 minutes is fine. I get in, do the mission, and by the time I'm done, LRTP is usually back up. And if it's not, I still have two portable base portals, two mission teleports, and an Ouro Portal to get from place to place. Or, I can just use my travel powers to get to a train in about a minute or two.

 

That's just been my experience though, YMMV.

 

After playing around with it for a couple of days now, I still think 5 minutes would be a sound compromise... 10 feels a little long given the number of "FedEx run"-style missions we have in the game. (Mid-level content on the hero-side, I'm looking at you. <_<)

 

It doesn't need to be super-fast recharging, but matching the Ouro portal's recharge seems reasonable.  

[Blackbird71]

12 minutes ago, Flintlock Burnfur said:

But it is ONE BUTTON on the tray.  And there's a context menu!  That's what it is!

One button (which then leads to multiple more buttons) does not equal one power.  They have to be earned or purchased separately, they have different cool down times and timers, some require charges, etc.  There is absolutely no way to justify calling all the different powers in the travel menu "one power."

Edited November 27, 2020 by Blackbird71

[Bionic_Flea]

I get the feeling Blackbird71 doesn't like this change.

[Flintlock Burnfur]

19 minutes ago, Blackbird71 said:

One button (which then leads to multiple more buttons) does not equal one power.  They have to be earned or purchased separately, they have different cool down times and timers, some require charges, etc.  There is absolutely no way to justify calling all the different powers in the travel menu "one power."

No one said that the powers in the context menu didn't have to be earned.  They totally do have to be earned.  But once they're earned, they're on the context menu (or menu of other buttons).

[Dazl]

First I want to thank the Homecoming team for bringing this game back to us. You didn't just bring it back you have been building on it and working to make nice with NC Soft.

 

In terms of feedback on the changes to the tp powers, the biggest change I love the most was moving the zone tp destinations to the sg portals, where they should have been in the first place. I also like the added portals to the other zones.

 

Now I won't lie, I did enjoy the old ebfp but I realize it needed to change. The LRTP isn't really bad. It's really easy to get if you grab all the exploration badges in AP. A level character can do it in 10 mins or less with the jump pack and ninja run. Being able to go to other zones and not just your base is very cool, and it's really not that hard to get just one exploration badge in a zone to add that zone to the power. You really don't need any of the zones, since the power drops you at the sg portal in Pocket D, which is one click away from your portals in your base.

 

I have two suggestions to improve the power. Reduce to cool down time to 5 mins, which brings it in line with the Ouro port I believe. The other idea I saw posted was reduce the percentage of the cool down time for each exploration accolade you have. This way you don't have to have them, but there is a reward if you do. Not to mention the 5 merits you get for each one you earn.

[NewXToa]

2 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

It's not a hassle at all. You're making it sound harder than it is. Just like you said though, not everyone plays the way you do so this shouldn't be a concern for the larger community right?

 

You say this update (which gave players more teleporter beacons and made zone base portals closer to other zone transportation hubs) gave players a reason to not use bases as hubs, which is incorrect and misleading. Players have more accessibility than ever before. How are you not seeing that?

It is definitely a hassle. Just because you don't find it to be one doesn't mean everyone's experience matches yours - not everyone plays the way you do, after all.

 

What are the downsides to making LRT more accessible by removing the prerequisite to unlock? Anyone who wants the exploration accolades is still welcome to go get them, but it would mean anyone who doesn't like being forced to wander around a zone getting badges again and again and again on each new toon would be able to do things they enjoy, instead.

[Lockpick]

I've been playing with it some more since it hit Live.  I created a new character and have been gathering zone exploration badges generally while waiting for team content.  I don't find the gathering of a badge per zone to add zones to LRT to be an issue for me.  I was generally in the zone anyway, so getting a badge was relatively quick.  I did go to my base and use the beacons to hit some zones to specifically get some of the badges to add zones to LRT, but again, I was waiting for a team to fill anyway.

 

I will agree with others that I think the recharge is to long.  I find myself not using the power because I'm afraid I will use it and then need to use it within the 10 minute limit and it won't be available.  I know there are many other options, but this has been my experience.

 

I really liked another suggestion in the thread that would lower the recharge of the LRT power for getting all the exploration badges in some zones.  This aligns very well with another thread where we have been discussing adding additional rewards to content.  If there was a way to reduce the recharge time one minute for every zone where all the exploration badges have been found and cap the recharge to somewhere between 2 and 5 minutes I think that would be a win.

 

[EmperorSteele]

6 minutes ago, NewXToa said:

It is definitely a hassle. Just because you don't find it to be one doesn't mean everyone's experience matches yours - not everyone plays the way you do, after all.

 

What are the downsides to making LRT more accessible by removing the prerequisite to unlock? Anyone who wants the exploration accolades is still welcome to go get them, but it would mean anyone who doesn't like being forced to wander around a zone getting badges again and again and again on each new toon would be able to do things they enjoy, instead.

 

The "downside" is that everything is SUPPOSED to come with some kind of cost; whether it's influence, or time, or effort. That's how games work.

People enjoyed this game for ~10 years without being able to instantly teleport around to their base or to other zones. You had to run/jump/fly/TP around a little bit. And yes, things were made easier or more convenient along the way (inherent fitness, travel powers sooner, merging of train lines, Ouro and PORTAL network, etc), but having /ebfp or a no-cost "go anywhere" power just goes too far.

But, let me ask: What DO you enjoy doing? Maybe that way, we can add teleport options with a cost relating to the content that you like to do? Like, maybe completing a TF will unlock that contacts' zone as a TP destination? Or maybe doing a Bank/Paper mission for a certain zone? The Pocket D Pass is already "Spend 1 hour in Pocket D", so we already essentially have role-players covered. Give the team some ideas that aren't just "give it to me for free", which people are SAYING they're not saying, but then they balk at any suggestion of cost or effort.

LRTP and the other teleport options will have costs associated with it for EACH character. This will (probably) NOT change. The question then, is, what cost are you willing to pay?

[DoctorDitko]

I'm impressed by how much more immersive it is to have the base portal entrances and exits correspond.

It adds a surprisingly strong "sense of place" to the game.

Thanks very much!

 

I would love the implementation of recharge reduction based on investment in the LRTP power. That seems like an excellent incentive and a logical extension of the spirit of the game. Nice idea!

 

Also, can we please have /ebfp as an alias to /enterbasefromfrigginglongincantationpasscode?

 

[Glacier Peak]

49 minutes ago, NewXToa said:

It is definitely a hassle. Just because you don't find it to be one doesn't mean everyone's experience matches yours - not everyone plays the way you do, after all.

 

What are the downsides to making LRT more accessible by removing the prerequisite to unlock? Anyone who wants the exploration accolades is still welcome to go get them, but it would mean anyone who doesn't like being forced to wander around a zone getting badges again and again and again on each new toon would be able to do things they enjoy, instead.

I am not going to fall for your circular logic on players gaming experience. We can agree that players play this game differently.

 

But I just have to ask you though, what forcing mechanism exists in this game for you to have to get anything? A player can go through this entire game without using any of these travel abilities, or all of them if they so choose. Are really unable to play your character with these changes or is your gripe more about how you are personally struggling to cope with change because you don't understand the benefits of the new OPTIONAL travel abilities? I would be more than happy to communicate the benefits of the new zone travel updates.

 

Look this is how it works, if you have an existing character that you play and you WANT any of these useful abilities, you can earn them, very easily through the use of influence, time investment, or both. If you don't WANT these useful abilities, you don't have to use them or earn them at all. 

[NewXToa]

1 hour ago, EmperorSteele said:

 

The "downside" is that everything is SUPPOSED to come with some kind of cost; whether it's influence, or time, or effort. That's how games work.

People enjoyed this game for ~10 years without being able to instantly teleport around to their base or to other zones. You had to run/jump/fly/TP around a little bit. And yes, things were made easier or more convenient along the way (inherent fitness, travel powers sooner, merging of train lines, Ouro and PORTAL network, etc), but having /ebfp or a no-cost "go anywhere" power just goes too far.

 

I don't have an answer for you, because I disagree with your premise. First of, whether or not people enjoyed live without these QoL changes is irrelevant - there's all sorts of things that we have now that wouldn't have been acceptable on live, such as free XP boosters, free prestige powers, free respecs every 10 levels, etc. Everyone enjoyed Live, but I'm fairly certain that most people prefer the things HC changed (otherwise they'd be on a different server, right?). Second, if everything is supposed to have a cost associated with it, why did they make Ouro accessible from level 1? Why do we get free respecs? Why do we get effectively free XP boosters? Gating the LRT behind exploration badges and a high cooldown doesn't feel like it matches the rest of HC's tendency to make things less grindy.

 

29 minutes ago, Glacier Peak said:

 Are really unable to play your character with these changes or is your gripe more about how you are personally struggling to cope with change because you don't understand the benefits of the new OPTIONAL travel abilities? I would be more than happy to communicate the benefits of the new zone travel updates.

 

 

Why do so many people keep acting like the change to /ebfp and LRT makes it easier to get around than before? Previously, in order to do a fedex mission, I could hit the button to pop into my base, head to the appropriate zone, deliver the package, pop back into my base, and go back to whatever zone I was doing missions in.

Now, I have to activate the LRT, but only if it goes to a zone I have an exploration badge in, and only if I'm on a toon that I've already taken the time to unlock it in. Then I deliver the package, and hope that one of my remaining teleport options can take me back to the zone I started in. And then if I need to teleport somewhere else, such as to join a PUG or TF, I have to hope my teleports have come off cooldown so I can join the group in a speedy manner. If I haven't unlocked the LRT or any of the day jobs, the team I join will have to wait for me to go unlock the teleporter, or wait for me to slowly make my way from zone to zone via flight etc. None of that was an issue with /ebfp.

 

There were beneficial changes in this patch, yes. But most of those are irrelevant to this discussion because they aren't mutually exclusive with easier LRT access. There is the minor benefit of being able to go straight to a zone, instead of stopping by the base. But that only matters if you thought that extra stop was seriously inconvenient (which to be fair, I have a decent computer so the loading times didn't inconvenience me at all, and I see why others would disagree), or if the base wasn't the destination in the first place.

 

 

29 minutes ago, Glacier Peak said:

Look this is how it works, if you have an existing character that you play and you WANT any of these useful abilities, you can earn them, very easily through the use of influence, time investment, or both. If you don't WANT these useful abilities, you don't have to use them or earn them at all. 

This is an extremely unproductive argument. Why am I forced to "take it or leave it"? Why shouldn't I express my dissatisfaction with these changes? What makes your lack of discontent with these changes more valid than my frustration? How would it hurt your gameplay experience for me not to have to go get badges I have no interest in, just so I can move conveniently around the world?

Edited November 27, 2020 by NewXToa
minor wording change for clarity

[Glacier Peak]

6 minutes ago, NewXToa said:

Why do so many people keep acting like the change to /ebfp and LRT makes it easier to get around than before? Previously, in order to do a fedex mission, I could hit the button to pop into my base, head to the appropriate zone, deliver the package, pop back into my base, and go back to whatever zone I was doing missions in.

The reason it was so easy for you to do those fedex missions as you described was because you were using an exploit. Period. 

Edited November 27, 2020 by Glacier Peak

[Jacke]

11 hours ago, NewXToa said:

I also think the LRT is too grindy to unlock, especially when you have large numbers of alts. Exploration badges aren't something I want to earn on all of my characters. I might go get accolades on some of my favorites, or once I hit 50, but it's not something I usually do. Again, forcing me to get an accolade and then exploration badges feels like the devs are saying "This is the right way to play". The point of the LRT should be to make travel convenient, not to make people jump through hoops to get places.

I usually get badges on all my toons, though have only a few who aim to get all badges.  But for the lower zones, I get them on all toons, usually doing a zone at a time, all the badges and history plaques in one pass.

 

But after i27p1 was released, I saw I had 4 toons who didn't have LRT unlocked, so they didn't have all of Atlas Park.  So I went through all the toons in succession, without using the minimap.  Got all 8 badges as well as the 7 plaques (for 6 different History badges) in under 5 minutes each.

 

It earned them a bit of Inf directly from the badges.  As well as 5 Reward Merits each.  Which I can exchange for Enhancement Converters and sell on the Auction House for Inf.  Which is what is intended for players to do to finance improving their toons.  It's the best way to do so (although at times, Enhancement Unslotters have a better return, but Converters will always sell for a good price).

Edited November 27, 2020 by Jacke