This ain't workin out...

[Bill Z Bubba]

Lvl 50 kat/inv stalker with the build below. Aggroing 2 spawns of +4/x8 arachnos and the poor girl just folds. Granted, it's a slow death but it's inevitable due to the horrific AoE output from only being able to use Flashing Steel and MAYBE Golder Dragonfly for hitting multiple foes.

 

I see the gorgeous ST damage output. I'm sure it'll have a fine sub-3 min pylon time. Maybe sub-2 min. But, wow, the clear all speed at max diff sucks a whole lot. Please explain to me why stalkers are remotely worthwhile. This is well past my 5th attempt to have a stalker in my stable of characters. Maybe past my 10th. I'd rather be able to survive everything and eventually kill the +4 AV than get stomped on the way to getting to said AV.

 

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[Bill Z Bubba]

On a +4 kill 'em all ITF right now. Doin great, slaughtering hard targets, feel's like it's working as described. Melee Blaster. Safe as can be. Kicking ass. Still sucks solo at max diff due to boredom not ability. There's no way around this perception is there?

[SuperPlyx]

Personally I play my stalkers as an assassin. Stealth to the end kill boss . Now sometimes you get stuck with kill all maps, which I agree sucks. I will use whatever temp summon powers I have to help speed things up a bit.

 

 

[The_Warpact]

Bill I think you're viewing stalkers as scrappers, I typically use my stalkers in zone pvp, speed running accolade TFs, merit farming arcs, and helping with specific missions that make use of their abilities. 

You sound like you're trying to use it as a scrapper trying to go at +4×8 content solo.

While specific stalker builds can be like that, its finding that balance.

[Mezmera]

Invuln stalkers are tanky as all get out.  You must not be thinking creative with your build.  The Unbreakable Guard 4 slotted nets you 3.13% melee defense plus the two resist uniques will net you another 6% defense on top of taking the defense powers in Invuln and tough/weave.   Plus there's things like Unleash Potential and Shadow Meld.  I prefer UP, Shadow Meld is short bursts of added defense but the animation time eats a bit into your attack chain and the 15s of defense it nets you.  

 

My Invuln stalker caps all my resists (except psi) by just taking about every resistance power available to you in the set.  With that checked off I go for defense bonuses which about caps all of my defenses except for only pretty good ranged and psi defense.  Then you have the hp capping heal.  Invuln stalkers should be eating those pesky romans lunch on any itf, how are you doing this so wrong?

Edited February 28, 2021 by Mezmera

[Bill Z Bubba]

4 hours ago, Mezmera said:

Invuln stalkers should be eating those pesky romans lunch on any itf, how are you doing this so wrong?

Guess you didn't bother looking at the build. Survivability isn't the problem. The problem is the ridiculously boring clear map speed due to lack of AoE. I can give up Body Mastery for something else but I'll be giving up a lot of mitigation to do so.

[Bill Z Bubba]

5 hours ago, The_Warpact said:

Bill I think you're viewing stalkers as scrappers, I typically use my stalkers in zone pvp, speed running accolade TFs, merit farming arcs, and helping with specific missions that make use of their abilities. 

You sound like you're trying to use it as a scrapper trying to go at +4×8 content solo.

While specific stalker builds can be like that, its finding that balance.

Yea, I am. I'll keep this one to have one but I don't see getting much use out of her.

[Yomo Kimyata]

I've gotten great use out of my Staff/Bio stalker.  I haven't run a 4/8 ITF yet, admittedly.  But staff gets you two AoEs and automatic form of the Body and all of bio's goodness to help with the damage.  It is not, however, a charge in and aggro two or three groups at once kind of build.  I believe you have a like/hate relationship with bio, and my builds tend to sacrifice tankiness for offense.

[Troo]

Elec/SD/Elec is likely your style stalker.

Maybe dark/ or even spines/ or another tier 9 aoe

 

I like the single target focused sets and find it more interesting.

 

Attached is a possible starting point, maybe squeeze in ball lightning.

Stalker (Elec-SD) Sneaky Boom.mxd

Edited March 1, 2021 by Troo

[Mezmera]

47 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Guess you didn't bother looking at the build. Survivability isn't the problem. The problem is the ridiculously boring clear map speed due to lack of AoE. I can give up Body Mastery for something else but I'll be giving up a lot of mitigation to do so.

Ah well stalkers aren't AoE kings, even elec assault is just alright.  Stalkers are more ST oriented by design, that's just how that flows, you're there to brutalize the hard targets.  I'm fine with it there's a litany of other things to play, my EM stalker takes the aggro from tanks even constantly taunting the AVs she's so dangerous.  

[BrandX]

2 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Guess you didn't bother looking at the build. Survivability isn't the problem. The problem is the ridiculously boring clear map speed due to lack of AoE. I can give up Body Mastery for something else but I'll be giving up a lot of mitigation to do so.

Have you thought of using a different Primary?  Electric Melee has AOEs and the Assassin Strike to help with the ST.

 

 

[Machariel]

Your problem is that Ninja Blade is one of the worst primaries on Stalkers whereas Katana is one of the best primaries on Scrappers.  Ninja Blade AS is tied for the worst among stalkers so it has the least to gain from the Stalker ATOs.  Conversely, the scrapper ATOs are nutty on Katana.  Also obviously you lose Lotus Drops in the trade too.  In fact I believe literally every Stalker primary gets more/better AoE than Ninja Blade does with the exception of maybe Broad Sword, aka Slow Ninja Blade™️.

 

+4x8 Arachnos has a ton of defense debuffs and psi damage which will eventually overwhelm invuln especially if you are going out of your way to aggro multiple mobs that take forever to kill because you have zero AoE.  So IMO the real question is what are you trying to gain by playing on x8 with a character that doesn't benefit from target density? 

 

The solution to your perception is to play a different Stalker or to turn the difficulty down to something more fun like +4x2, because if you have no AoE attacks then there's not much point in fighting big mobs since it doesn't result in more rewards/time.  Some primaries have decent AoE (Elec, Staff, Dual Blades, Savage, Ice), some secondaries have decent AoE (bio, rad, shield, fire), some ancillary/patrons have decent AoE (fire, mu)... but Ninja Blade / Invuln / Body is none of those.

[Nemu]

21 hours ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

I've gotten great use out of my Staff/Bio stalker.  I haven't run a 4/8 ITF yet, admittedly.  But staff gets you two AoEs and automatic form of the Body and all of bio's goodness to help with the damage.  It is not, however, a charge in and aggro two or three groups at once kind of build.  I believe you have a like/hate relationship with bio, and my builds tend to sacrifice tankiness for offense.

Staff/bio is cool and all, but you know what's cooler? Staff/Fire.

 

Or is it hotter?

[Shred Monkey]

Play +4x2 and fly though missions collecting merits.

 

Similarly, there's a lot of cheap run speed boosts in IO sets.  I've recently started paying attention to this.  I'm surprised how much more fun it is to "race" through missions with high uninterruptable speed.  A stalker who can take out a group of 4-5 bad guys in one cycle of his attack chain just sweeps through a mission more like a screaming wraith than a creeping ninja.

 

I know 4x8 is your standard, but if you're not doing AoE damage, why not decrease the spawn size so you get more Reward Merits per enemy decapitated?

Edited March 2, 2021 by Shred Monkey

[Omega-202]

As others have said, your primary and tertiary pools are the main issue.  The only Stalker setups that are going to reliably chew through large spawns have to have some combination of Elec//, /SD/, and //Mu.  Preferably, Elec/SD/Mu, but I like Elec/Invuln/Mu better. 

 

Everything else is going to be mainly single targetting whole spawns to death.  

 

If you want an AoE god, the problem isn't the AT, it's your powerset picks. 

[Bill Z Bubba]

Ya have to sometimes enjoy when you're told "you're just doin it wrong" and it's actually the correct answer.

 

Eyeballing savage/sd/mu as my next stalker attempt. I'll probably still keep my kat/inv and respec her some to go full-tilt ST boogie.

[Saikochoro]

18 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Ya have to sometimes enjoy when you're told "you're just doin it wrong" and it's actually the correct answer.

 

Eyeballing savage/sd/mu as my next stalker attempt. I'll probably still keep my kat/inv and respec her some to go full-tilt ST boogie.

I think you’ll enjoy savage/SD more if the main thing that annoyed you was slow solo clear times. Savage melee is just plain fun. Between savage leap, rending flurry, and shield charge you have pretty good AoE to clear the trash. Savage melee’s single target is fast and decent too! I hope you enjoy this one more. 

Edited March 2, 2021 by Saikochoro

[Frosticus]

1 hour ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Ya have to sometimes enjoy when you're told "you're just doin it wrong" and it's actually the correct answer.

 

Eyeballing savage/sd/mu as my next stalker attempt. I'll probably still keep my kat/inv and respec her some to go full-tilt ST boogie.

savage/sd does oodles more aoe than elec/sd and probably has more st too.

I know you like the ITF and I've done it at +4/8 no insp/temps/lore/amps on my sav/sd/mu. But you won't be afk'ing the mobs. Chasing the AV's around is fun at first, but gets old after awhile. Final romy jumping up into the mountains...sigh.

I've tried it with enemies buffed, but I triggered the ambush at the summit and got whittled down.

 

BU+ball lighting+savage leap+fast AS+(hidden) 15ft rending flurry is a lot of aoe over a pretty sizable area. You'll likely have double buildup for the rending flurry as the aoes trigger the proc constantly. 

you can throw shield charge in there too. But remember SC won't refresh buildup (psuedo pet). I imagine lightning rod doesn't work either, but savage leap does. 

[DreadShinobi]

I dont play my savage/ea very much, but I fit in the presence pool on that stalker (with speed/leaping/fighting) and the extra utility of having some aggro control can be helpful if you are looking to stop an AV from running all over the place whether you are solo or on a team without a tank/brute/scrapper. Of course the duration is not as good as primary taunts and it isn't autohit, and it is of course nicer to have your aggro control in an aura toggle where you don't have to spend your animation time on the click, but that is what stalkers habe available to them.

 

Gosh what I would give for an IO set that included a taunt proc. I feel like that is something that is sorely missing from what we have available.

[Bill Z Bubba]

1 minute ago, DreadShinobi said:

Gosh what I would give for an IO set that included a taunt proc.

That would be nice. I'd slot that on my main claws/sr in a freakin heartbeat.

[Frosticus]

The other option is weapons mastery for webnade. Physical perfection is a nice power. Exploding shruiken is a small aoe but would roll procs well if you went that route. Giving up snipe is a big sacrifice though.

 

Just depends how badly runners aggravate you.

[Bill Z Bubba]

27 minutes ago, Frosticus said:

Just depends how badly runners aggravate you.

Always a lot.

[Haijinx]

Give up a lot of AOE on the Ninja Blade Primary unfortunately 

 

This goes for a lot of stalker primaries.  

 

So you kind of either have to team and concentrate on hard targets, or play a stalker primary with the Scrapper AOE choices 

[Frosticus]

4 minutes ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

Always a lot.

Everything will try to run from a sav/sd stalker. I dunno something about breaking the mobs morale? I remember a dev talked about that in the old days.

[Omega-202]

4 minutes ago, Frosticus said:

Everything will try to run from a sav/sd stalker. I dunno something about breaking the mobs morale? I remember a dev talked about that in the old days.

Everything tries to run from all squishies, from my experience.  The problem is that Stalkers are the only non-squishy with no aggro control that is also melee focused.  

 

Personally, I ignore the runners on my Stalkers and just keep hitting what's in reach.  They come back eventually.  And for stragglers, I pop them with Zapp/Moonbeam and whatever other ranged attacks I am carrying.  

 

The Ragnarok proc in Ball Lightning and the Avalanche proc in an pbaoe also helps.  If they're on their backs, they're not running.  

 

For Romulus and other AVs...yeah, I got nothing.  They just bolt.