"Toxic" Community?.. My thoughts, feel free to add your own!

[Lines]

I'm sorry that you've had a rough time, ZeeHero.

 

It is very difficult to know how to respond here, though. Knowing only your side of the story, especially in vague terms, makes it difficult to know how we can be helpful.

 

If you just want to vent about your experiences, that's fine and this isn't necessarily a bad place to do that, within a tolerance.

[Haijinx]

On 5/29/2019 at 3:30 PM, Vanden said:

There's a small portion of the community that seems bound and determined to see Leandro and the Homecoming team as the bad guys no matter what. I see their posts on the discord and reddit on occasion. Naturally they don't show up much on these forums or any Homecoming servers.

I think every MMO will have a segment of the playerbase and ex-playerbase that hates the "Devs" or the Company that runs the game.  

 

the Irony of course is that without them there is no game.  

 

It makes sense that that would also exist here, even if its not a MMO product in the more traditional sense. 

[_NOPE_]

1 minute ago, Lines said:

I'm sorry that you've had a rough time, ZeeHero.

 

It is very difficult to know how to respond here, though. Knowing only your side of the story, especially in vague terms, makes it difficult to know how we can be helpful.

 

If you just want to vent about your experiences, that's fine and this isn't necessarily a bad place to do that, within a tolerance.

Oh YES, I concur with this completely. Vent, absolutely. Get it out of your system, but then stop and let it go.

 

Because the only real "power" in this game lies in the hands of the ones running the server. That's it. Don't give a bully any more sway over you than the sway it takes to type "/gignore @JerkyPlayer

[Bill Z Bubba]

10 minutes ago, Haijinx said:

This kind of stuff is why I put the general chat into a tab then turn that tab off.

General is removed completely. LFG and Help are on their own tab that I'll occasionally look at if I feel like pugging.

I pretty much only read the Pinnacle badges channel and my parent SG's channel.

I have yet to have toxic behavior directed at me in game.

Here on the forums? Once or twice but overall? I hang out on the forums because the vast majority of those I converse with are anything but toxic.

Which... of course, may mean that I'm the toxic one.

Edited October 4, 2020 by Bill Z Bubba

[EmmySky]

Friend:  a person whom one knows and with whom one has a bond of mutual affection, typically exclusive of sexual or family relations.

 

In my experience, a friend is someone who needs your attention, and who's attention you need, and you feed each others needs and build each other up with understanding and common interests, making you each excited to see the other next time.  If you are a drain on someone's emotional reserves, or if they are a drain on your emotional reserves, that is not friendship.  Merely reaching out your hand in an offer of friendship does not mean you will automatically be accepted by any- and everyone you meet.   The best approach, when your friendship is rejected, is to move on.  Accept that you will not be friends with everyone on the planet and go find other people who may find you exactly their cup of tea.  Telling someone why they are wrong for not wanting you as a friend is, inadvisable.

 

Also, PK has an excellent point, nobody has the power.  There is a LFG channel you can use to join and create teams.  Knock yourself out!

 

'Leaving the game' every month or so comes across as a very 'boy who cried wolf' move, so I would advise a change in that tactic.

 

Happy Hunting!

[Alchemystic]

General is a great channel

It filters most of the nonsense out of LFG and Help

[Jimmy]

Posts have been hidden.

 

Please refrain from calling specific players out publicly. That's what reports are for.

[Starforge]

6 minutes ago, EmmySky said:

‘Leaving the game' every month or so comes across as a very 'boy who cried wolf' move, so I would advise a change in that tactic.

Couldn’t have summed it up any better.

[Ruin Mage]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.

All I wanted to do was give people advice to take a post with a grain of salt. That there are two sides to a story.

[_NOPE_]

I see you throwing shade, @Shadeknight 🤪

[Ruin Mage]

I also throw frisbees.

[gourdhead]

21 minutes ago, Haijinx said:

This kind of stuff is why I put the general chat into a tab then turn that tab off. 

 

 

I have a series of actions I take as soon as a new character zones into Outbreak.  One of them is removing the General channel from all tabs.

[Lines]

2 minutes ago, gourdhead said:

I have a series of actions I take as soon as a new character zones into Outbreak.  One of them is removing the General channel from all tabs.

You can save your chat settings as default, so all your new characters will have it the way you want it automatically. 🙂

[Haijinx]

I was not even aware there was some sort of established community clique in Everlasting to alienate for example. 

 

And that's the server I inhabit. 

[Ruin Mage]

It's a much much bigger story than just a "clique" and alienating, Haijinx. But the GMs do not wish it to be aired out in public. Which I will abide by after the forum warning I just received.

[gourdhead]

2 minutes ago, Lines said:

You can save your chat settings as default, so all your new characters will have it the way you want it automatically. 🙂

[Coyotedancer]

34 minutes ago, FoulVileTerror said:

So . . . putting this out there for everyone to consider, and potentially discuss (although I do wish to encourage everyone to be gentle with their replies, as it's easily delicate subject matter):

What is our duty of care in situations where a player is having serious difficulty fitting in with the community or any of the sub-communities which exist within this game's playerbase?  What lines do we draw, and why?  

 

Obviously, no one is legally obligated to do anything, except (in some jurisdictions) avoid bullying another player.  Within the Code of Conduct, we definitely have clear lines we're not supposed to cross, and some lines which are less clear, but GMs act as the mediators in those more ambiguous situations.

 

But outside of those limits, as a community, what is the extent that we feel we need to help other members have an enjoyable experience?  Is it simply a matter of playing the game the way we enjoy it, and if we stumble across like-minded players, that's it?  Or should we attempt to step outside our personal comfort zones from time to time in an effort to let different players know they're welcome too?

 

Since no one else has addressed VT's post...

 

This is probably going to sound harsh, but the happiness and feeling of inclusion of other players is not my responsibility, to put it bluntly. Nor is my happiness or feeling of inclusion theirs.

 

Finding your niche, or your tribe, or your "pod" or whatever term you want to use is something we each have to do on our own... It's just not reasonable to expect other people to take you by the hand and structure a play-group around you, your individual level of comfort or your personal preferences.

 

If, after looking around, you find a group that suits you? Fabulous! You got lucky. Enjoy it.

 

If you don't find a group that suits you? It's probably not some grand conspiracy. The community likely *isn't* out to get you... It's just life. Not everyone is right for every activity or every group. Try another shard. Try another part of the community. Try another server, or even another game. 

[Andreah]

I think it can be a very healthy thing for players to take breaks from games. I've done it several times here, just since last spring. It helps me remember it is just a game, and we're all here, in our own ways, trying to have fun and share community. If taking breaks is something that helps a person, doing it more frequently, and for shorter periods can be good too.  I wouldn't want to let stress push me to the edge before doing so. 

[FoulVileTerror]

Often times there are even three or more sides to a story.  Ambiguity sucks, since "dropping hints" isn't terribly helpful in a wide swath of contexts.  Still, one can be both general and specific enough to speak their mind on an experience they've had without naming anybody who was involved.

 

ie:

"I'd like to encourage people to consider the possibility that (in situations like the one described earlier today in this thread) whatever moderation actions took place were entirely justified."

 

For the record:  I (VileTerror) don't know what the details were in these event(s).  The above quote is not necessarily my personal opinion.  Just offering what I believe might be a more acceptable means of communicating a sentiment which appears to have been pruned specifically due to the use of a player's screen name.

 

 

 

Also, yeah:  The use of /chatsave and /chatload is SUPER useful!  I even have a little text string I keep handy whenever I roll a new character:

/showbind lctrl+lshift$$chatloadfile chat$$bindloadfile bind$$optionloadfile opt$$wdwloadfile wdw$$macro ! beginchat /bind lctrl+lshift e 

[Ruin Mage]

I'm terrible with my words, but my goal is to merely point out that there's more to the tale than meets the eye.

I've genuinely been trying to cut back on my open disdain for things and people, and trying to be a better individual overall - but it does agitate the old noggin when things are painted the wrong way.

Here's my general take;

The community isn't toxic. The community is fine. It is individual people who are often the most vocal that get things going.
There are certainly a handful of people who make thing seem like the entirety of the community is toxic, but its not as simple as that.
It's always best to hear out all sides of the story somehow.

[I Dream of Greeny]

Ambiguous accusations like this seem very sus to me. Didn't go over well in high school, don't go over well here.

 

Honestly, there are five shards, each with their own distinct culture. If I don't like one, or it doesn't like me, I try one of the others.

Not everyone is going to like you, no matter where you go, and any expectation otherwise is unfortunately a misplaced sense of entitlement.

 

Everyone who does their own thing eventually finds like minded people to play with, or not if they prefer to solo.

 

Now if there was actual harassment, write a report and deal with the GMs.

Edited October 4, 2020 by Insanity's Peak

[Davy]

As someone who used to main a Katana/Ninja Sword character, I felt pretty alienated by the invisible katana bug.

[CitizenThirteen]

6 minutes ago, Coyotedancer said:

Finding your niche, or your tribe, or your "pod" or whatever term you want to use is something we each have to do on our own... It's just not reasonable to expect other people to take you by the hand and structure a play-group around you, your individual level of comfort or your personal preferences.

This is spot on.  

[Andreah]

People will occasionally "take us by the hand", and when they do, it's a wonderful thing we should encourage and appreciate. Sometimes it's the same few people, trying their best to create community and organizations. It's hard work and often goes in contrary directions to the individual desires of others. But in those cases, if we others can't find the serenity to appreciate what we do like, we should strive to build upon those parts, and not try to take other parts we may not, down.

Edited October 4, 2020 by Andreah

[Ruin Mage]

I'm going to get into a potentially long-winded reply here as something has come to mind.

If you wanted toxic, you need look no further than Virtue on Live. That place was the height of MMO community toxicity for me. Take myself as an example: I made the simple mistake of getting caught ERPing in the Arena when I was pretty new to the game - and the game was still all the hot rage. This group of friends saw this and took it into their own hands to harass and belittle me. On Live, that was pretty much my go-to experience - harassment over the slightest littlest mistake and getting mocked into oblivion. Of course, I lashed back and like so many others at the time period I was pretty rash and stupid. This was when a majority of the players were in their teens / early 20s. This sort of stuff is what I'd consider toxic - harassment over a simple newbie mistake that lasted for about five years on-off. This sort of stuff just isn't okay.

Now we flash forward to today. The community is older, different, and filled with newer faces for a lot of us. People are generally adults and know better now. So the tolerance for things has dampened or changed. So, for example, Everlasting had a community channel called Everlasting TFs and a related Discord that I run - and the Raid Leaders (Veracor, myself, Chi, Mojo, etc and so on) have met hundreds of different people. All of us are adults in this circle of raid leading, and us leading puts us at the forefront of seeing all sorts of different attitudes. Victim complexes, just want to watch the world burn types, and more. We see it all, and we kind of get a bigger insight into how people are. Things are generally pleasant, but occasionally we get that one or two players who just don't mesh well with a community. When we act on it, its not to alienate people but for the sanity and safety of the other people who come to our scheduled content. But we keep that usually (for the most part) to ourselves - we don't out people, and we try to make reports where possible. This paragraph was more for insight into Everlasting's side of things.

I myself have experienced different sorts of toxicity over the course of Virtue and Everlasting. Grudges are a real deal it seems - people seem to hold eight+ years worth of old information over your head, or perhaps that's just my bad luck. I'm not the only one going through it - but I've experienced personally the brunt of being slandered and having my name dragged through the dirt. That in itself is the real toxicity that people need to be more aware of.  The sort of stuff I go through / went through is the sort of stuff I don't wish on anyone - no matter who they are. I don't condone that sort of stuff at all - and no one should have to go through it at all. Not a singular soul at all.

I love City of Heroes and I adore the community built on HC - both the RP side of things and the general broad community. I've personally found great friends and people to relax with through persevering and remaining flexible to what's around me.

Word jumble aside:
I agree with what some folks are saying. There's a way to go about it, and there is a group of people out there for you. Somewhere.

Over the rainbow.

 

Edited October 4, 2020 by Shadeknight