Trapdoor Test Results - the other half of Pylon testing?

[ScarySai]

Everyone alive? Quiet week.

 

Quick run on my ice/fire, and dusting off my old main to test a respec on brainstorm.

 

I'm missing a lot of my macros/binds on the shade, so I'm pretty happy with the time.

 

 

 

 

 

Slight note: Warshade is amped from a previous test, but it shouldn't swing things too much, as I took out two LOTGs to compensate.

Edited June 8, 2022 by ScarySai

[Sovera]

13 hours ago, ScarySai said:

Everyone alive? Quiet week.

 

Quick run on my ice/fire, and dusting off my old main to test a respec on brainstorm.

 

I'm missing a lot of my macros/binds on the shade, so I'm pretty happy with the time.

 

 

 

 

 

Slight note: Warshade is amped from a previous test, but it shouldn't swing things too much, as I took out two LOTGs to compensate.

 

 

Could I tempt you into a pylon test with the Ice/Fire, Sai?

[ScarySai]

9 hours ago, Sovera said:

Could I tempt you into a pylon test with the Ice/Fire, Sai?

 

Around the two minute range with some very brief testing. Could probably get it lower, but I don't really care for pylon times on that character.

[KaizenSoze]

elec/ice/mace blaster

 

6:00-6:15 Trapdoor

Maybe every 10 runs I die. Clarion drops just as I jump into two Tarantula Mistresses. That kind of stuff. No defensive amps.

The EB can be drain in 3-4 slots, which makes that a safe fight to melee.

 

3:45 Pylon

[Voltak]

Treated the last fight as if it was an AV (this toon was made for that) - meaning, I set up spirit tree, mez then attacks. 
No inspirations used at all
NO JUDGEMENT
No pylon testing build
No competitive trapdoor build
Using only a team oriented build for doing Master ITF runs or 54 x8 ITF, no inspirations, or other Task Forces (end game) with no inspirations. 
 

 

[Sovera]

Tested a Contaminated Strike replacing Devastating Blow build. Despite the loss of ST damage (Devastating build does pylon times between 2:30 to three minutes where the Contaminated Strike swings betwen 3:20 - 3:30) in terms of actual gameplay there was either no loss or an improvement. Previous best with a DB build that did not have Atom Smasher was 5:55 then improved to 4:42 with Atom Smasher.

 

The Contaminated Strike managed a best 5:02 run -without- Atom Smasher and at worst simply kept up with the DB build with a 5:50 run (there will always be a bit of RNG involved in this so please don't look at it as a omg so much better version).

 

 

Spoiler

Despite this with both at pretty much neck to neck then why go with the CS build if DB has better single target damage?

 

IMO here are the reasons why it can be a valid choice:

 

- Greater healing output. With DB the use of Radiation Siphon comes out at 2.9 + 1.7 + 2.4 = 7 seconds when combat initiates and then 1.7 + 2.9 + 1.7 + 2.4 = 8.7 for the rest of the fight. With the CS build Radiation Siphon is used every 2.4 + 1 + 1.7 + 1 = 6.1 seconds each time. While it does depend on receiving the irradiated mechanic we can force three heals every 30 seconds or less with FF procs which (barring misses) makes a staggering 60% heal every 30 seconds. As someone who soloed both AVs at the end of Manticore with the CS build let me say that the extra healing was noticeable.

- Better leveling and better exemplaring. It's not gapless down to Posi 1 but Contaminated Strike recharges fast enough to be used between each attack.

- Better endurance. Two runs of Trapdoor required one use of Consume and that one time it was because I let one of the Mu survive to the end of a pack. Toggling FA off was enough to run the pylon tests.

-  No 2.9 second animation locks and corpse blasting. 'Nuff said.

- Despite Contaminated being the weak link it can be played around. The simple rotation above does not include Burn who rears up its head every 8 seconds. Each time it comes up two Contaminated Strikes can be removed for someone who wants to be more min maxy instead of just pushing buttons.

 

- Fire Armor/Rad Tanker: 6:57 (no Atom Smasher).

- Rad Melee/Stone Brute: 6:13.

- Fire/MA Tanker: 6 minutes.

- Rad/Fire Armor Brute: 5:55 (no Atom Smasher).

- Savage/Stone Brute: 5:47.

- Claws/Fire Brute (no Shockwave): 5:06

- Rad/Fire Brute (Contaminated Strike build): 5:02

- Energy Melee/Fire Brute, my main: 4:57.

- Rad/Fire Armor Brute (w/ Atom Smasher): 4:42

 

 

One thing that definitely improves times on all builds but particularly Fire Armor is not wasting time hitting anything that isn't a boss. This is because of Burn that can two shot +3 lieuts and will one shot minions. Using a skill to hit a minion then using Burn means the previous skill was pretty much wasted since the minion would have died anyway. Best thing is keeping an eye out for HP bars and switch targets to hit anyone who has a full bar because good chances are that anything other than a boss that is at half HP will die next time Burn goes off.

 

This is a reason why this test is not done at 100% capacity since the camera prevents looking around to check HP bars.

 

 

For those interested in HP bars:

 

/optionset ShowVillainName 1
/optionset ShowVillainBars 1

 

Edited June 20, 2022 by Sovera

[Sovera]

Ran an Ice/Fire Brute test with Frozen Aura.

 

Spoiler

This Villain build was built using Mids Reborn 3.2.17
https://github.com/LoadedCamel/MidsReborn

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Level 50 Magic Brute
Primary Power Set: Ice Melee
Secondary Power Set: Fiery Aura
Power Pool: Flight
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Energy Mastery

Villain Profile:
Level 1: Ice Sword -- SprBlsCol-Rchg/HoldProc(A), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx(3), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(3), SprBlsCol-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(5), SprBlsCol-Dmg/EndRdx/Acc/Rchg(5), IceMisTrmt-+ColdDmg(7)
Level 1: Fire Shield -- UnbGrd-Max HP%(A), UnbGrd-ResDam(7), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(9), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(9), StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(11), StdPrt-ResKB(11)
Level 2: Frost -- Bmbdmt-Dam(A), Bmbdmt-Acc/Rech/End(15), Bmbdmt-Dam/Rech(15), Bmbdmt-Acc/Dam/Rech(17), Bmbdmt-Acc/Dam/Rech/End(17), Bmbdmt-+FireDmg(19)
Level 4: Blazing Aura -- SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg(A), SprUnrFur-Dmg/Rchg(23), SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(25), SprUnrFur-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(25), SprUnrFur-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(27), SprUnrFur-Rchg/+Regen/+End(27)
Level 6: Healing Flames -- Prv-Heal(A), Prv-Heal/EndRdx(29), Prv-EndRdx/Rchg(29), Prv-Heal/Rchg(31), Prv-Heal/Rchg/EndRdx(31), Prv-Absorb%(31)
Level 8: Ice Patch -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 10: Fly -- WntGif-ResSlow(A)
Level 12: Hover -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Rct-Def/EndRdx(23), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(33), Rct-Def(39)
Level 14: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(33)
Level 16: Plasma Shield -- UnbGrd-ResDam(A), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(33), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(34), UnbGrd-Rchg/ResDam(34)
Level 18: Build Up -- AdjTrg-Rchg(A), AdjTrg-ToHit/Rchg(34), GssSynFr--Build%(36), AdjTrg-EndRdx/Rchg(49)
Level 20: Consume -- SynSck-EndMod(A), SynSck-Dam/Rech(36), SynSck-EndMod/Rech(37), SynSck-Dam/Rech/Acc(37), SynSck-Dam/Acc/End(37), SynSck-EndMod/+RunSpeed(39)
Level 22: Evasive Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 24: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Rct-Def(36), Rct-ResDam%(39)
Level 26: Freezing Touch -- SprBrtFur-Acc/Dmg(A), SprBrtFur-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(40), SprBrtFur-Rech/Fury%(40), Hct-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(40), UnbCns-Dam%(42), Hct-Dam%(42)
Level 28: Burn -- SprBrtFur-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(A), SprBrtFur-Dmg/Rchg(42), SprBrtFur-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(43), Obl-%Dam(43), Arm-Dam%(43), Erd-%Dam(45)
Level 30: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 32: Frozen Aura -- SprAvl-Rchg/KDProc(A), SprAvl-Dmg/EndRdx(46), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(48), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), SprAvl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(48)
Level 35: Focused Accuracy -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 38: Fiery Embrace -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(45)
Level 41: Physical Perfection -- PrfShf-End%(A)
Level 44: Tough -- TtnCtn-ResDam/EndRdx(A), TtnCtn-ResDam/Rchg(45), TtnCtn-ResDam(46), TtnCtn-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 47: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Rct-Def(47), Rct-Def/EndRdx(47)
Level 49: Temperature Protection -- GldArm-3defTpProc(A)
Level 1: Fury
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Clr-Stlth(A), Clr-RunSpd(13)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Health -- Pnc-Heal/+End(A), Mrc-Rcvry+(19), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(21)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%(A), PrfShf-EndMod(21)
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Clr-EndRdx(A), Clr-RunSpd(13)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 50: Musculature Radial Paragon
Level 50: Born In Battle
Level 50: Invader
Level 50: Marshal
Level 50: High Pain Threshold
Level 10: Afterburner
------------

 

Ice/Fire is one of those pairings I like but falls a touch short for the lack of a decent third ST attack. Taking Greater Ice Sword is a 33% damage boost over Frost, but, in the end, the results of a pylon test did not budge despite the 33% (it's actually about 100 damage extra). While it's an option Frost is a needed low level AoE and the 100 damage increase from taking GIS showed no practical results.

 

The immediate hold back of Ice is the lack of -res procs anywhere which straight away robs it of one minute when pylons come to play. Then the lack of a place for FF procs.

 

But in terms of Trapdoor testing? Pretty decent. I got a 4:55 without risk and always knowing I had Ice Patch if things got a bit hairy.

 

Spoiler

- Fire Armor/Rad Tanker: 6:57 (no Atom Smasher).

- Rad Melee/Stone Brute: 6:13.

- Fire/MA Tanker: 6 minutes.

- Rad/Fire Armor Brute: 5:55 (no Atom Smasher).

- Savage/Stone Brute: 5:47.

- Claws/Fire Brute (no Shockwave): 5:06

- Rad/Fire Brute (Contaminated Strike build): 5:02

- Energy Melee/Fire Brute, my main: 4:57.

- Ice/Fire Brute: 4:55

- Rad/Fire Armor Brute (w/ Atom Smasher): 4:42

 

So it's back to the whole pylon VS gameplay testing. Actual gameplay testing and Ice is not shabby in the least despite invariably getting 3:20 - 3:30 ish.

 

To put it in perspective:

 

- Radiation Melee averages 3 minutes WITH two -res procs.

- A Claws/Rad Scrapper without a snipe and -res procs got 3:40.

- Savage/Fire gets 3:30-ish.

- Claws/Fire with two -res procs got as low as 2:15 once, but averages 2:30. But testing without the -res procs put it at 3:40. Incidentally with or without -res procs showed no difference on that build's Trapdoor test. This is something I try to bring some awareness to in regards of the overestimation -res procs have and that have put a lot of weight in certain sets while leaving others poo poo-ed just because they lack places to insert them in. Pylon tests without fancy -res procs would be a lot more in tune to actual gaming.

[ScarySai]

22 hours ago, Sovera said:

Ice/Fire is one of those pairings I like but falls a touch short for the lack of a decent third ST attack.

 

Consider fitting in cross punch. Worked wonders for mine.

 

Torchblight 2022.mxd

 

-----

Decided to revisit the last character I was working on before my break from the game. Forgot how utterly disgusting it is, and thought it would be fun to time it with only the alpha slot, and without starting with dom. 4:30's pretty good, all things considered (start timer when I engage.)

 

 

Easily one of my more busted characters. The map also makes the carrion vines slower at catching up with you, and double-pulling more difficult. I may just try to push for sub-4 once I finish slotting it's incarnates out.

Edited June 26, 2022 by ScarySai

[Voltak]

On 7/8/2021 at 1:08 PM, Ratch_ said:

Running Spiritual Core alpha and a bunch of force feedback procs in the build hehe. Sitting at recharge cap for many of my powers just on my own lol. This controller is an absolute monster that starts with low damage but ramps up exponentially once you start stacking freezing rain debuffs (which comes back every 15s or less) and have out 3 lighting storms + tornados. I threw in Sorcery for arcane bolt and enflame for even more damage. Soul drain is up over half the time...sooo yeah. For an AT with only a .550 damage scale it slaps.

 Very happy to see controllers place this HIGH ON THE LIST.  

Kudos. 

[Voltak]

6:24
If I am checking the list of posts correctly and not missing anything, I think only the Fire/Storm had a better time by about 30 secs or so. 

Storm is definitely in a good place for this type of setting.  

Edited June 29, 2022 by Voltak

[SomeGuy]

I like this thread.

[ScarySai]

Has anyone gotten a good time with DB or katana yet? I've been trying for a good while to get a good one with the db/energy and the kat/regen, I really can't break 7m on either.

 

I assume it's combination of factors, including the fact most of the foes are robotic/high lethal resists like war wolves, and the limited area coverage on their aoes relative to say, claws. But I'm a little surprised by how poorly it's doing here. Though, the robotic thing does explain why the claw/bio performs worse than the energy/rad here.

 

Edit: Best time was just shy of 6:58 with a level up, trapdoor isn't great for kat. 😕

 

To vent my frustrations, I blew the place up again. 

 

 

 

Edited July 2, 2022 by ScarySai

[Cheddacheese]

14 hours ago, ScarySai said:

To vent my frustrations, I blew the place up again. 

 

 

 

Do you mind sharing this build? It looks absolutely BEAST!!

[InvaderStych]

18 hours ago, ScarySai said:

Has anyone gotten a good time with DB or katana yet? I've been trying for a good while to get a good one with the db/energy and the kat/regen, I really can't break 7m on either.

 

I don't remember the exact times, but back when I respec'd my Kat/Rad into a proc build I tried a couple runs with similar results I might have broken into the high 6 (like barely under 7) minute range on one good run where I didn't get stuck on the vents between levels.  Take that with a grain though, since that build was still >2:30 on a pylon, iirc.

 

Edit:  Pretty sure I had to scrap a couple runs from dying too.  It wasn't a great build, lol.

 

You guys would probably get better results than I did. 🤣

Edited July 2, 2022 by InvaderStych

[ScarySai]

15 hours ago, InvaderStych said:

I don't remember the exact times, but back when I respec'd my Kat/Rad into a proc build I tried a couple runs with similar results I might have broken into the high 6 (like barely under 7) minute range on one good run where I didn't get stuck on the vents between levels.  Take that with a grain though, since that build was still >2:30 on a pylon, iirc.

 

Yeah, I ran my kat/energy through since it has ball lightning and got about 6:10ish, largely because of the taunt aura and having a big source of energy damage to cycle through.

 

I could probably proc ball out and get a lot faster, but I only did it to compare with my regen averaging 7:30+ (have to take meld for it :\)

Edited July 3, 2022 by ScarySai

[Gobbledygook]

On 3/12/2022 at 9:42 PM, ScarySai said:

The Aprocalypse (1).mxd 4.95 kB · 120 downloads

 

Break the game over your knee. 🙂

 

 

@Cheddacheese

Here it is, @ScarySai had previously posted it in the tanker forums.

Edited July 2, 2022 by Gobbledygook
Formatting error

[ScarySai]

I missed their post, thanks for that.

 

Main things I changed since are moving cross punch to fourteen and some light experimentation with rage's slotting (like moving two to obliteration), but the build in the video is a beta character that should be exactly the same.

[ScarySai]

Ran some sword characters, despite having the worst trapdoor time, I like the regen the most, lol.

 

Next two will probably be kat/regen and DB/energy. You do notice the lack of ball lightning and a taunt aura with the regen, though.

 

 

 

[Bill Z Bubba]

19 minutes ago, ScarySai said:

Ran some sword characters, despite having the worst trapdoor time, I like the regen the most, lol.

 

You liked the regen the most even though it was 1.5mins slower than the db/nrg?

[ScarySai]

It's more fun, for one, and the survival is generally better.

 

Missing ball lightning is less noticable in less robot-intensive maps, as well as better positioning in a more open map. Running no ball-lightning leads to pretty similar times on the katana/energy. A one minute difference when not rocking a procced ball lightning is pretty good to me.

 

I also make it a point to not make redundant characters. I'd rather have a db/energy and a kat/regen than make both rock energy armor.

 

Regen needs buffs, especially for stalkers/scrappers - anyone who denies that is a fool, but I thought it'd be nice to show that you can make it work rather well without leaning hard on insps. Amps were active for consistency's sake with the others, but you'll have to take my word that they aren't a large swing factor.

Edited July 7, 2022 by ScarySai

[SomeGuy]

2 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

You liked the regen the most even though it was 1.5mins slower than the db/nrg?

 

I gotta really respect this one. Fun > optimal(?).

 

I'm with you Bill. I think regen is a freaking absolutely horrible set (I catch up on that thread some times and laugh and laugh and laugh...). But if someone is enjoying it out the wazoo despite what I would consider annoying? More power to them.

 

That's why I love this game. People ask "what should I bring?" and I go "whatever you want to play". I might cringe when I see it's a mind/emp controller, but hey. Wevs. As long as they are having a good time.

 

Also, @ScarySai, thanks for the DB/ENA run. Now I don't have to 😄

Edited July 7, 2022 by SomeGuy

[ScarySai]

If my goal was to uberstomp the game, I could just play my tank or the fire blaster, the former is surprisingly fine even without procs and will endure a proc rework unless tanks are nerfed.

 

Fun characters break the monotony...also it's good in pvp if I ever feel like kicking you or Bill's ass. :3

Edited July 7, 2022 by ScarySai

[SomeGuy]

1 minute ago, ScarySai said:

If my goal was to uberstomp the game, I could just play my tank or the fire blaster, the former is surprisingly fine even without procs and will endure a proc rework unless tanks are nerfed.

 

Fun characters break the monotony.

 

 

lol they will never nerf tankers. They'll set this game on fire and change defense mechanics and run everyone off before they nerf tankers. Funny you say that though, I feel the game gets wayyyyy to easy when I play the tanker. No fun that way to me.

[Troo]

9 hours ago, ScarySai said:

It's more fun, for one, and the survival is generally better.

 

Kudos

[Ston]

Here's a couple fun tests I've done recently.

Water/Fire Blaster (4:17) - Had to use barrier since I skipped the fighting pool and didn't really slot for any defense. Super fun build. Would be better as fire/fire but whirlpool helps slow enemies down in this environment.

 

Rad/Invuln Scrapper (5:15) - This one was a little harder. Really wanted to test how gaussian's would perform in invincibility on a scrapper. It does go off pretty often, but I'm not sure it's worth it for how squishy you are outside of t9. Was getting killed on the first few runs so had to swap to using Diamagnetic for the -tohit. All around it's a pretty fun combo, but I would rate invuln on the lower end of scrapper secondaries.