issue 27 Focused Feedback: Temporal Warrior, Instant Level 50 PvP Characters

[The Curator]

Temporal Warrior, Instant Level 50 PvP Characters.

• At character creation, new Primal characters can now tick a box called "Temporal Warrior (PVP only)". This is not available for existing characters or Praetorians.
• Characters created with this box ticked will spawn on Recluse's Victory and can only access the four PVP zones (Bloody Bay, Siren's Call, Warburg, Recluse's Victory), Pocket D (for access to the various vendors), the Arena and Supergroup Bases.
• These characters cannot travel to any other zones, enter trials or teleport via LFG, get missions from contacts, or enter mission doors from other players.
• In return, they start at Level 50 with all Incarnate slots unlocked, Incarnate powers can be crafted at no cost, and Patron Powers don't require the Patron badges.
• Those characters count as level 1 for the name reservation system, you can't create a PVP character just to lock a name.
• They still need to provide their own enhancements, there's no easy mode for that. Because their own ability to get rewards is so limited (the only available source of rewards is critters in PVP zones) the expectation is that those characters will receive influence and enhancements from other characters that are PVE enabled.
• The goal here is to remove the barrier of entry for players that are curious about PVP, but don't want to spend the time leveling up a new character that would be useful under the PVP rules.

[Ruin Mage]

I like this idea, if only to open more opportunities for PVP to be jumped into.

[Ston]

Thank you for this one!! Will be awesome to remove a barrier to get into PVP.

[EdgeOfDreams]

Will these characters have any way to obtain Accolade powers?

[GM Impervium]

There are PvP copies of Accolades powers available from Arena Vendors, which you can find in Pocket D!

[The_Warpact]

Well shit...going to have to try this.

[Ironblade]

Huh.  Did not see this coming.  Seems like a good way to let people check out PvP without a big up-front time investment to see if it's something they want to get into.  Not seeing any downside at the moment (although someone may come up with one).

[TheZag]

I like this idea.  Now we just need to convince players to hit these zones at the same time.  Perhaps bonus rewards for an hour that rotate through each zone to get people into the same zone at the same time.  But 24 hours is divisible by 4 so it would be the same zone at the same times each day.  Throw in the arena as bonus for an hour as well in the rotation and it will ensure that each zone will eventually be on bonus during someones regular playtime.

 

[Glacier Peak]

This is a great idea and glad to see it hit the beta shard for testing. Hopefully we can get some testing done to ensure no unintended shenanigans can be had.

[TotalThunder]

 

Quote

 

• They still need to provide their own enhancements, there's no easy mode for that. Because their own ability to get rewards is so limited (the only available source of rewards is critters in PVP zones) the expectation is that those characters will receive influence and enhancements from other characters that are PVE enabled.
• The goal here is to remove the barrier of entry for players that are curious about PVP, but don't want to spend the time leveling up a new character that would be useful under the PVP rules.

 

 

These two lines are... kind of contradictory? Having a level 50 character, even with full incarnates, but no enhancements is just going to get bullied by normal hybrid pve/pvp characters. It removes one barrier, but will just lead to people who are 'curious' just getting ganked and not liking PvP because they don't understand what's going on. This seems like it's mainly just beneficial to people who already PvP.

 

I feel like this could be... slightly mitigated by giving these PvP only characters access to a vendor that gives them SOs, or untradable base IOs.

Edited July 19, 2022 by TotalThunder

[Glacier Peak]

2 hours ago, EdgeOfDreams said:

Will these characters have any way to obtain Accolade powers?

There are PvP equivalent accolade powers as GM Impervium correctly pointed out, but there is also equivalent factional powers (Hero, Rogue, Villain, Vigilante) as well. These can be purchased at any Arena Vendor or in any PvP zone. Their purchase is permanent as well and only cost 10,000 inf per accolade if I remember correctly. 

[Glacier Peak]

1 minute ago, TotalThunder said:

These two lines are... kind of contradictory? Having a level 50 character, even with full incarnates, but no enhancements is just going to get bullied by normal hybrid pve/pvp characters. It removes one barrier, but will just lead to people who are 'curious' just getting ganked and not liking PvP because they don't understand what's going on. This seems like it's mainly just beneficial to people who already PvP.

I've tested this change out on beta and I didn't experience what you're describing. Though I'll admit I had ample capacity to fully IO out the test character however. 

 

Enhancements are necessary, absolutely. But this is a giant step in the right direction for the PvP community who have been advocating for this type of change. Lowering the barrier to entry is a great first step. 

[TheZag]

7 minutes ago, Glacier Peak said:

This is a great idea and glad to see it hit the beta shard for testing. Hopefully we can get some testing done to ensure no unintended shenanigans can be had.

 

i was attempting shenanigans but havent found a way into any PVE zones yet,  so far so good.

[Glacier Peak]

9 minutes ago, TheZag said:

I was attempting shenanigans but havent found a way into any PVE zones yet,  so far so good.

That was my first thought when I hoped on to beta - PvP Temporal Warriors gotta stay in their zones. 

[Faultline]

53 minutes ago, TotalThunder said:

I feel like this could be... slightly mitigated by giving these PvP only characters access to a vendor that gives them SOs, or untradable base IOs.

 

There's no such thing as untradable IOs. The game is not set up to mark specific items in any way, all copies of an IO just point to the same data. Attuned versions of the enhancements are completely different copies of the enhancements that just happen to have the same name and effects. In order to add 'untradeable' IOs, a third copy of every enhancement in the game would have to be made, and that's a level of data bloat and maintenance nightmare we don't want to deal with.

 

Adding a SO vendor to the Pocket D arena is trivial, not sure if it'll help the particular issue but we can drop it in the next build. They won't be free though, it'll just be a regular vendor, for the same reason as above; they are just normal tradeable and sellable SOs.

[Mythical Creature]

This change has me excited though I do have a question about the naming policy. It sounds like our pvp characters will not have their names reserved ever? 

 

I was going to suggest that if that is the case, maybe they should have a way to earn their full character status somehow in the future if they play the character enough. Maybe it could simply be when you have earned enough xp that is equivalent to level 50. Maybe it could be PVP related? That way if the PVP character really clicks it can become a full fledged character somehow, if you work hard enough. Just a thought.

 

 

[Faultline]

5 minutes ago, 723wolf said:

This change has me excited though I do have a question about the naming policy. It sounds like our pvp characters will not have their names reserved ever?

 

They get the default window of reservation, which I believe is 30 days right now. We can probably promote them to the other brackets via some achievement, but it's not a priority right now.

[Nurvus]

This a really neat idea and I'm wondering if it wouldn't hurt to just go full Guild Wars 2 with it and allow PvP characters full access to Temporal Warrior-only IOs and respecs. I think that might increase PvP participation even more if it's possible/feasible. If not, this is still a good change as-is. Just a random thought.

[Starhammer]

Could we get Echo Plaza and Orouboros added to the available zones?

[Faultline]

25 minutes ago, Starhammer said:

Could we get Echo Plaza and Orouboros added to the available zones?

 

No, because those zones come with extra complications that may break the sandbox; namely, TUNNEL and the giant crystal that teleports you to contacts. Echo Plaza / Winter Forest are a maybe for the future if TUNNEL can be secured, Ouro is probably permanently out.

[UltraAlt]

7 hours ago, The Curator said:

Characters created with this box ticked will spawn on Recluse's Victory and can only access the four PVP zones (Bloody Bay, Siren's Call, Warburg, Recluse's Victory), Pocket D (for access to the various vendors), the Arena and Supergroup Bases.

 

Okay. I can see how you can get to a supergroup base and exit into the same PVP zone, but how to you move from PVP zone to PVP zone?

 

3 hours ago, TotalThunder said:

These two lines are... kind of contradictory? Having a level 50 character, even with full incarnates, but no enhancements is just going to get bullied by normal hybrid pve/pvp characters.

 

Enhancement issues? Really. Isn't that what base storage is for?

Use your PvE Characters to put gear in your base for your PvP characters.

 

7 hours ago, The Curator said:

They still need to provide their own enhancements, there's no easy mode for that. Because their own ability to get rewards is so limited (the only available source of rewards is critters in PVP zones) the expectation is that those characters will receive influence and enhancements from other characters that are PVE enabled.

 

Seems pretty obvious, but...

 

3 hours ago, TotalThunder said:

It removes one barrier,

 

Funny how development is one step at a time ...

 

3 hours ago, TotalThunder said:

but will just lead to people who are 'curious' just getting ganked and not liking PvP because they don't understand what's going on. This seems like it's mainly just beneficial to people who already PvP.

 

So how do we resolve this?

Most PVP zones have a safe/starting/staging area.

Add a supergroup portal in the PVP zone safe areas so characters can travel to bases?

What about the players that don't have a supergroup base? (Trident?)

 

I'm assuming you have to "level up" through the normal process to pick powers and slotting, or would it work more like a respec?

I would think that since this is level 50 PVP that it should work like a respec. Pick your powers and then pick all slots.

Do you need to talk to a trainer to do this? will there be one in the PVP zone starting areas?

Will there be insp vendors in the PVP starting areas?

 

7 hours ago, The Curator said:

The goal here is to remove the barrier of entry for players that are curious about PVP, but don't want to spend the time leveling up a new character that would be useful under the PVP rules.

 

.... because people power-leveling to level 50 isn't a thing?

I mean, I'm glad that this bypasses doorsitters and, hopefully, reduces farming .... wait, you can get into the Pocket D and there is AE there, so.... a PvP flagged character can't go into AE missions, is that correct?

 

7 hours ago, The Curator said:

Temporal Warrior, Instant Level 50 PvP Characters.

 

Let's cut to the chase.

At this point, this should be heading towards having cookie-cutter template PVP characters that can be picked that are already slotted up and enhanced, etc. (everything is locked in. You can look at the enhancements, but can't change any of the build.

The only things that a player does with those prebuilt PvP characters is name them, costume them, and move the powers around in the trays.

 

You can still make your own "Temporal Warrior" but the option for a pre-built character gets the player into PVP faster and .... I mean ... that is the intent for this ...to get characters prepared for PvP faster in order to try to promote PvP, is that correct?

[Troo]

9 hours ago, The Curator said:

The goal here is to remove the barrier of entry for players that are curious about PVP, but don't want to spend the time leveling up a new character that would be useful under the PVP rules.

 

This merely increases the distance between PVE & PVP while using open zones shared by the two.

 

It might actually increase the barrier to entry as the highest level characters are easily acquired, tuned and specialized.

 

Putting a level 32 in the same zone as what this makes comically easy.. well, that is not a step toward parity.

[TheZag]

Make a character on the test server and at least half of the questions would have been answered.

 

There was a trainer in RV (Castle) and there is one in PD.  You have to level up to 50 with the trainer.  You get the free respecs when you train each 10 levels,  same as a regular character.  

 

I ran out of time but i think the transit in RV goes to the other pvp zones since it had a marker on the minimap.  There was already transit from RV to PD from before this addition.

[Troo]

The expectation is an existing player who is PvP curious will level up, selecting powers they may not be familiar with under very different PvP rules, spend significantly to IO a build out, and then experience tremendous success.. I'll echo the likelihood of a bad experience is high.

 

Insta Highest Level possible. Come PvP on Homecoming! (what could possibly go wrong?)

 

Why isn't this available for those who only want to do endgame content?

 

[Glacier Peak]

29 minutes ago, Troo said:

The expectation is an existing player who is PvP curious will level up, selecting powers they may not be familiar with under very different PvP rules, spend significantly to IO a build out, and then experience tremendous success.. I'll echo the likelihood of a bad experience is high.

 

Insta Highest Level possible. Come PvP on Homecoming! (what could possibly go wrong?)

 

Why isn't this available for those who only want to do endgame content?

 

Based on testing....?