Before Apocalypse what do you use?

[Wolfboy1]

So just as the title says, if you end up putting an Apocalypse IO set into a power at 50, what do you normally put into it before you hit max level?  I've got several builds  but I never really am sure what to slot into the powerset before purples come into play.

[MoonSheep]

decimation usually, still a good set even once i’ve hit lvl 50

[Troo]

I like to use Thunderstrikes. They are pretty cheap.

The recovery and accuracy bonus from 4 slotting 3 or 4 powers adds up.

A good bit of damage going (acc/dam), (acc/dam/rech), (acc/dam/end), (dam/end)

[Sovera]

Decimation (without the proc) is my goto as well. Just like the sheep from the moon said I too tend to keep that set even once at 50 since it is chock-full of good bonuses.

[tidge]

1 hour ago, Wolfboy1 said:

So just as the title says, if you end up putting an Apocalypse IO set into a power at 50, what do you normally put into it before you hit max level?  I've got several builds  but I never really am sure what to slot into the powerset before purples come into play.

 

It is typical of my characters that will eventually end up using the Apocalypse set in a single-target ranged attack, I rarely have more than three slots in that attack before level 50. This is just the way things shake out for different ATs, and the various other options they have (for slots, for enhancement sets). There is some balancing of considerations of course.

 

Now to answer the question: I typically grab pieces from an attuned set from the SG base, either Overwhelming Force or Gladiator's Javelin. These become 'slot-and-forget' options that get recycled back into SG storage at level 50.

[Ukase]

Short answer: Devastation or Gladiator Javelin. Usually Glad Javelin. 



A lot depends on the character. Usually, my blasters will spend a fair amount of time using secondary attacks in melee. On those characters, I'll want to look specifically for more Hitpoints. The Devastation set gives a bit of HP, 2.25%. Not the 3% that apoc will, but that's as close as I can get. The plan is to use unslotters to take the Devastations out and replace with apocs when I ding 50. 

If the character is a particularly greedy for endurance type, I'll use the Glad Javelin set, which is really got a lot of bonuses I like - but it's just a shame the proc is not very good in a power that recharges in 4 seconds. 
 

[Uun]

Devastation or Thunderstrike. Decimation if I need the recharge bonus.

[Yomo Kimyata]

Great question!  I have a pattern that works well for me and my play style (usually solo, play organically as I level, not fearing the respec, having inf to burn):

 

For a single target ranged attack:

 

Step 1:  SOs early and often, usually starting around level 5.  I will start with accuracy, damage, then recharge or damage or endurance as most needed.  I will usually end up with four or five slots in on a power I use frequently pretty early on.  And I keep them all in the green as often as I can, which is not cheap for a new character.

 

Step 2:  Adding IO procs, specifically one-off things like Steadfast Protection +def or Panacea proc.

 

Step 3:  At lvl 17 I'll move into sets with good bonuses, like Unbreakable Guard.  I don't have any sets I really like for ranged damage this early since I feel I am better off with SOs still at this point.

 

Step 4:  I will start removing SOs and moving into sets piecemeal in my 20s.  ATOs, WOs primarily, and I'll split them for 2-3 piece set bonuses.  Maybe I'll move into attuned Decimation at this point.

 

Step 5:  I'll start to fill in empty slots with things like attuned Thunderstrike to get myself into ED levels on damage or accuracy or recharge.

 

After that, I'll clean things up but usually keep this frankenslot going until 50 before respec.

[Snarky]

in my opinion ranged ST sets are.... not enough.  the choices for a truly fine build rapidly evaporate.  of course you use ARMAGEDDON.  with so other few good choices.... yeah

 

If you are building for ranged defense.  THUNDERSTRIKE...  But I have went years on ranged defense Blasters.  Let me tell you.... Killing everything in a room is way better than trying to have defense.  You want big hard hitting AoEs, with enough CC to give you time to keep cycling more AoE DPS.

 

GLADIATORS JAVELIN.  A nice set.  That offers little for me in set bonuses.  I think ONCE have I found a way to get two +3 PvP set knockback protections on that I actually wanted.  Saving me from throwing KB prot in fly, generally getting Winters Gift then.  BUT it just does not happen.  The PvP sets dont "sit well" in Blaster builds.  They offer very good set bonuses that synergize with absolutely nothing.  

 

WINTERS BITE  Lets just start with the PROC, which is near useless. -speed?-recharge? if you are ST shotting something, it needs to die.  fast.  Anything that stays up long (AV/GM) will shrug off the stupid effect.  The set bonuses synergize well if you are building all around high defenses.  On...a Blaster?  See notes on Thunderstrike.

 

DEVASTATION  Another decent set with bonuses that dont synergize well and a useless PROC

 

DECIMATION.  Tops out at 40, but has a build up and a global recharge.  situationally useful.  

 

OVERWHELMING FORCE A pretty good set.  But will almost always be prioritized to an AoE with KB, netting good set bonuses and getting a CC knockdown.  

 

That leaves your Archetype Enhancers, which one set might go in one ST blast and make sense, but generally that is not answering the main question, just putting it off.

 

 

 

[Wolfboy1]

Wow, there are a lot of good answers here and I thank each and every one of you for your input!  As I figured there are some differences here and there when it comes to the AT.  This is for a Sentinel by the way.  Gods I love that AT. 🙂

 

Thank you all for the thoughts and advice.  Now to sift through all of this and decided which one I need to go with with it pertaining to what I am looking for.  Again great advice from everyone!

[Snarky]

7 minutes ago, Wolfboy1 said:

Wow, there are a lot of good answers here and I thank each and every one of you for your input!  As I figured there are some differences here and there when it comes to the AT.  This is for a Sentinel by the way.  Gods I love that AT. 🙂

 

Thank you all for the thoughts and advice.  Now to sift through all of this and decided which one I need to go with with it pertaining to what I am looking for.  Again great advice from everyone!

The sets with Defenses (may...depending on your primary/secondary) be more useful if Defense helps get to a goal.  Sentinels do a different job than most using Blast sets.  With their secondary armor, inherent to weaken targets, and shorter range/less AoE they are definitely in a different spot than most ATs using ranged ST.

[Wolfboy1]

Just now, Snarky said:

The sets with Defenses (may...depending on your primary/secondary) be more useful if Defense helps get to a goal.  Sentinels do a different job than most using Blast sets.  With their secondary armor, inherent to weaken targets, and shorter range/less AoE they are definitely in a different spot than most ATs using ranged ST.

Currently its for a Rad/Regen Sent.  It meshes well with the Apocalypse set but not having access to it yet had me ask the question of course.  I wasnt sure if there was a "weaker" set that would do most of the things as Apocalypse or not.

 

At any rate there were two builds I was looking at for this character but...something is off with mids on the second one and its not calculating the resistances correctly...not sure what is causing it myself but the second one does not have Apocalypse slotted in it.  Version 2 though I think would be more my style of play more so than v1 though I think with the power choices and such.  I'll link the two builds and maybe someone can offer some advice (or tell me what is going on with the insane v2 resistances being in the negatives)

Gamma Hawk v1 - Sentinel (Radiation Blast - Regeneration).mbd Gamma-Hawk v2.mbd

[Snarky]

9 minutes ago, Wolfboy1 said:

Currently its for a Rad/Regen Sent.  It meshes well with the Apocalypse set but not having access to it yet had me ask the question of course.  I wasnt sure if there was a "weaker" set that would do most of the things as Apocalypse or not.

 

At any rate there were two builds I was looking at for this character but...something is off with mids on the second one and its not calculating the resistances correctly...not sure what is causing it myself but the second one does not have Apocalypse slotted in it.  Version 2 though I think would be more my style of play more so than v1 though I think with the power choices and such.  I'll link the two builds and maybe someone can offer some advice (or tell me what is going on with the insane v2 resistances being in the negatives)

Gamma Hawk v1 - Sentinel (Radiation Blast - Regeneration).mbd 41.2 kB · 0 downloads Gamma-Hawk v2.mbd 41.73 kB · 0 downloads

looking at your build,  you have "Rest" clicked on.  at bottom.  shut it off it kills you.  in game andin mids

[Snarky]

19 minutes ago, Wolfboy1 said:

Currently its for a Rad/Regen Sent.  It meshes well with the Apocalypse set but not having access to it yet had me ask the question of course.  I wasnt sure if there was a "weaker" set that would do most of the things as Apocalypse or not.

 

At any rate there were two builds I was looking at for this character but...something is off with mids on the second one and its not calculating the resistances correctly...not sure what is causing it myself but the second one does not have Apocalypse slotted in it.  Version 2 though I think would be more my style of play more so than v1 though I think with the power choices and such.  I'll link the two builds and maybe someone can offer some advice (or tell me what is going on with the insane v2 resistances being in the negatives)

Gamma Hawk v1 - Sentinel (Radiation Blast - Regeneration).mbd 41.2 kB · 0 downloads Gamma-Hawk v2.mbd 41.73 kB · 0 downloads

i am not great at Sentinels.

 

here is a  good resource for Rad.  No one reviewed Regen.  I am not good at Regen but I would build it "balls to the wall" with decent defenses, as much +health as was easily grabbable, and F resistance and the horse it rode over on.  Oh, and take your Rez. To me, that would mean Winter sets, as they have very good all around defenses.  and Thrundertrike if you can rebuild to get 45% softcap.

 

 

Edited November 24 by Snarky

[Wolfboy1]

1 minute ago, Snarky said:

i am not great at Sentinels.

 

here is a  good resource for Rad.  No one reviewed Regen.  I am not good at Regen but I would build it "balls to the wall" with decent defenses, as much +health as was easily grabbable, and F resistance and the horse it rode over on.  Oh, and take your Rez.

 

 

 

Hahaha, noted! 

[ZorkNemesis]

Decimation or Thunderstrike are my usual go-tos.  Decimation has 6.25 recharge while Thunderstrike has that nice double ranged defense and is generally a lot more affordable.

[Sovera]

1 hour ago, Wolfboy1 said:

Currently its for a Rad/Regen Sent.  It meshes well with the Apocalypse set but not having access to it yet had me ask the question of course.  I wasnt sure if there was a "weaker" set that would do most of the things as Apocalypse or not.

 

At any rate there were two builds I was looking at for this character but...something is off with mids on the second one and its not calculating the resistances correctly...not sure what is causing it myself but the second one does not have Apocalypse slotted in it.  Version 2 though I think would be more my style of play more so than v1 though I think with the power choices and such.  I'll link the two builds and maybe someone can offer some advice (or tell me what is going on with the insane v2 resistances being in the negatives)

Gamma Hawk v1 - Sentinel (Radiation Blast - Regeneration).mbd 41.2 kB · 2 downloads Gamma-Hawk v2.mbd 41.73 kB · 3 downloads

 

Regen does not have native defenses or resistances so there is no particular need to aim for them. You've done well in aiming for healing instead but even so you have several slotting choices such as the Avalanche in Atomic Blast and Overwhelming in Neutron Bomb and even picking Maneuvers and six slotting it that will not make an appreciative difference.

 

It's not to say the build is ruined or it will not work. You can level and play and it will work just fine.

 

But, for example, you can remove Maneuvers and take Hasten to make your Atomic Blast go from 36 seconds to 29 seconds near ensuring it is up at every group. Tactics is of dubious use as well as most builds will achieve 95% against +3 enemies without its aid and Vengeance is pretty niche as people rarely die in teams and it is of no use if solo.

 

You have Stealth and Grant Invisibility as well which don't bring much to the build (they have their place if it's a theme and you want that so you can be stealthy and make others stealthy. I'm just talking numbers wise). Stealth in particular helps in mobs not noticing as you sneak in to use your PbAoE nuke on top of them. While not as good you can consider using a Celerity stealth in Sprint to achieve this partly. Mobs will notice you sooner than with Stealth, but it saves a power since you have Sprint natively.

 

Both T1 and T2 have bad chances to make procs go off and that purple damage proc from Apocalypse would have a better chance to go off in one of your stronger but slower attacks (the longer the recharge the better chance of going off). Six slotting Apocalypse is almost of no use since it grants 5% psi defence which lets you be at.. 8%. Might as well replace the damage IO for a damage proc.

 

Atomic Blast is a power that can have a 30% damage boost from having multiple procs in it. As it is right now it does 419 damage. With some tweaks it can be at 570. No point in slotting accuracy into it since Aim will be used first to boost it which will in turn boost its accuracy. With further tweaks to the build it ends being up every 26 seconds instead of the original 36.

 

Speaking of Aim it should have a Gaussian proc in it to increase that initial burst. It's another 80% on top of the native 50% of Aim itself. In Tactics as it was it would go off at random when ever it pleased it. In Aim it will go off when you use Aim, which is when you're going to open up with your big bottomed nuke.

 

Things that you could consider would be adding the other PbAoE, Irradiate, since you're already going into melee range to land Atomic Blast. While there you can use the other one too. With Hover you can be floating over their heads and out of their melee range while Irradiates still hits them.

 

There was a free slot by the time I was done and nothing that grabbed me. I took Tashibishi as a one slot wonder. It's caltrops and they make the mobs flee in fear when standing on it. But caltrops also slows the enemies. So they flee in slow motion allowing to be a good segue to landing Aim + Atomic Blast + all other AoEs and finish with Tashibishi. Instead of fighting back the survivors are slowly running away while you pick them off. It's a flex power so take what tickles your fancy here.

I have never played Regen but here are some changes to give some slotting ideas. If you consider an alt in the future think about Bio Armor that has semi comparable regeneration but also defenses and it even adds more damage which is rare in an armor.

 

I've shuffled the powers to make more sense for exemplaring/leveling but it might not be what you'd like such as TP Target being taken late in favor of having all the accoutrements of Fly as early as possible without pushing damage powers for later, or a couple passive regen powers pushed for the 30s since doing damage early is better (IMO) as we can eat a couple inspirations if in trouble.

Gamma Hawk v1 - Sentinel (Radiation Blast - Regeneration).mbd

[Wolfboy1]

1 hour ago, Sovera said:

 

 

 

You have Stealth and Grant Invisibility as well which don't bring much to the build (they have their place if it's a theme and you want that so you can be stealthy and make others stealthy. I'm just talking numbers wise). Stealth in particular helps in mobs not noticing as you sneak in to use your PbAoE nuke on top of them. While not as good you can consider using a Celerity stealth in Sprint to achieve this partly. Mobs will notice you sooner than with Stealth, but it saves a power since you have Sprint natively.

 

Gamma Hawk v1 - Sentinel (Radiation Blast - Regeneration).mbd

 

Actually I dont mind getting rid of those two since it really isnt in theme anyway for the char.  They were mostly just mules for the LoTG enhs.

[lemming]

6 minutes ago, Wolfboy1 said:

 

Actually I dont mind getting rid of those two since it really isnt in theme anyway for the char.  They were mostly just mules for the LoTG enhs.

Yep, that's their purpose, plus the bit extra regen two slotting that comes with it.    I like seeing what others do with this.

[ZorkNemesis]

Reading over the thread again, it seems you've got a Rad/Regen Sentinel in the works.  As it so happens one of my Lv50 Sents is a Rad/Regen so I might be more help than expected.  I set mine up for PBAoE damage.  While I didn't reach any softcaps in terms of resists or defenses, any layer of resist you can squeeze out still helps since your main form of defense is healing and high regeneration.  Of course you don't want to chase bonuses that would be a drop in the bucket and offensive or recharge bonuses can be more helpful.

 

I'll leave my build here if you want to take a look though I don't consider myself a build expert.  It's not fully completed yet and mirrors what I have currently in-game, if I spent some more time playing it i'd probably put Apocalypse in Cosmic Burst and Hecatomb into Smite.  You definetly want Irradiate though, it can take a lot of procs.  Notably it accepts two different -RES procs (Achille's Heel and Fury of the Gladiator) which can add a ton of damage to any follow up AoEs, especially Atomic Blast.

 

Prisma Witch - Sentinel (Radiation Blast - Regeneration).mbd

[Seed22]

17 hours ago, Wolfboy1 said:

 

Hahaha, noted! 

Do not build defense on regen. Build for recharge and max HP. For build advice your best bet is the discord. The best builders in the game reside there and can give you the 411 on all things builds

[Etched]

My hand...

 

[Clave Dark 5]

When following a build someone else made that has purples in it, I skip them, too costly imho.  So what I then do is go to the wiki page for those IOs ("Ranged Damage" in this case) and then compare, as it turns out that most purple sets are "a lot like that other set, but with slightly bigger numbers."  Figure out what that other set is, then slot that one instead; it might not be the same +10% Recharge, maybe only 4%, but you've saved yourself a ton for only marginal returns (again, imho).  You can also look at the built and figure out what sort of bonus they were chasing (say, Recharge) and then pick the "non-purple set that amps that up.

 

And of course, if it's just your build, you just scan down the list to find the best +Something to work towards you build goal.

[Yomo Kimyata]

On 11/24/2024 at 1:55 PM, Wolfboy1 said:

Currently its for a Rad/Regen Sent.

 

I'd absolutely frankenslot with Sentinel ATOs then -- your range increase will be muy bueno.

 

[Lockpick]

On 11/24/2024 at 6:02 AM, Troo said:

I like to use Thunderstrikes. They are pretty cheap.

The recovery and accuracy bonus from 4 slotting 3 or 4 powers adds up.

A good bit of damage going (acc/dam), (acc/dam/rech), (acc/dam/end), (dam/end)

 

Agreed, I think Thunderstrike is underrated.  I usually slot it for the ranged defense but the other bonuses are all useful.