Has anyone actually taken Boxing/Kick/Cross Punch?

[Marshal_General]

The important question is do they work for containment double damage? I have been wanting to hold a Tsoo Sorcerer and beat him like a red headed step child.

[Vanden]

The important question is do they work for containment double damage? I have been wanting to hold a Tsoo Sorcerer and beat him like a red headed step child.

 

They do, although Cross Punch doesn’t do the full double damage, I guess because it’s an AoE.

[Microcosm]

I use Cross Punch on both flavors of Kheldian. The extra damage from having boxing/kick makes its dpa decent, and the +rech is also a nice bonus. I also used it on an SS Brute while leveling up for AoE, but got rid of it at 50 when I had footstomp and patron AoEs available and slotted.

[Coyote]

Worth noting that the recharge boost from Cross Punch is 10% per mob hit, if you have the other 2 attacks. It's not hard to hit 3 and keep up a 30% boost during combat.

 

You can also put a FF +Recharge IO in there for extra Recharge boosts. This works best for a melee Controller, since they often have nice control powers on long timers.

[Williwaw]

I am going to try out a build with all of the Fighting Pool attacks and Brawl, I just haven’t yet decided on powersets.

 

I've been considering doing that myself, on a /WP Scrapper or Brute.  Doesn't matter what the primary is, I don't plan to use it except maybe in the lowest of low levels before I get Punch or Kick.  (Do the Fighting Pool attacks get the chance to Crit on a Scrapper?  I don't think they get Pokevoke on a Brute)

 

Probably throw in Air Superiority for the extra knockdown fun.

[LiquidBandage]

I took all three on my Fire/Thermal Controller to help with soloing while leveling up, and it’s... actually kind of awesome? He’s no Scrapper, to be sure, but I can definitely get the ol’ Scrapperlock.

I have a controller that regularly Controllerlocks himself out of endurance. It is a great deal of fun because it looks and feels 'right'. And I have backup controls to keep mobs in place so I can rip off a chain of melee attacks. Cross Punch was the first melee power in the character's progression that convinced me that I was doing the right thing.

 

As a tank goes in, I leap in and mid-flight throw a Sonic Siphon (waiting for the mobs to get in a little closer). Then apply a Crushing Field to glue a bunch in place. Whatever isn't immobilized usually gets knocked down by Fissure. Then I go to town with Cross Punches and Seismic Smashes. Things melt quickly, adding to the "this feels good" aspect of the fight (Disruption Field on a melee + whatever purple you hit with Sonic Siphon).

 

Gravity / Sonic Res

(1) Crush

(1) Sonic Siphon

(2) Lift

(4) Gravity Distortion

(6) Propel

(8) Crushing Field

(10) Combat Jumping

(12) Super Jump

(14) Acrobatics

(16) Disruption Field

(18) Gravity Distortion Field

(20) Sonic Dispersion

(22) Boxing

(24) Kick

(26) Cross Punch

(28) Weave

(30) Sonic Haven

(32) Singularity

(35) Fissure

(38) Liquefy

(41) Seismic Smash

(44) Hurl Boulder

(49) Sonic Barrier

 

[Oneirohero]

The Fighting Pool revamp is the hallmark of how all Power pools should function, or at least how it should make the player feel when picking powers from it.

 

Even when you don't use/slot a power, it still benefits the ones you do use because the 'Synergy' mechanic gives you reason to invest in the pool powers instead of just picking something useless to get the power(s) you do want to use COUGHMedicinePresenceCOUGH. Fighting as a Pool is good enough that it's become the new 'Fitness' except it feels good to take the powers and doesn't force you to have to take them like Fitness used to.

[Replacement]

I see I should have, back on page 1, really clarified that I meant "Punch and Kick and nothing else" Because I understand their value.

 

It's so 2004 to have to purchase an intentionally-bad power in order to get to the decent stuff, just because it's a pool that everyone can grab.

 

If Punch and Kick didn't seem good for a scrapper (with their insane melee multiplier), how good can they possibly be on the other ATs?  I see the spiffy additional effects, but they're hodgepodge, with no single effect strong enough to realistically have an effect. 

 

There, that's my setup.  I'm open to having my mind changed.

But I'd be even more open to seeing Kick get its damage, recharge, and additional effects doubled.

[Williwaw]

On 7/12/2019 at 1:55 PM, Williwaw said:

 

I've been considering doing that myself, on a /WP Scrapper or Brute.  Doesn't matter what the primary is, I don't plan to use it except maybe in the lowest of low levels before I get Punch or Kick.  (Do the Fighting Pool attacks get the chance to Crit on a Scrapper?  I don't think they get Pokevoke on a Brute)

 

Probably throw in Air Superiority for the extra knockdown fun.

Okay, so I actually made a character along these lines.  Shield/SS Tanker, with the only attack from the secondary being Jab.

It's not bad, but it's not very good.  (It got better once I got and six-slotted Shield Charge and six-slotted Cross Punch with Obliteration, but it's still not great)

That said, Weave and Combat Jumping stack with the SD toggles beautifully, but the whole thing is just an End hog and actually beating enemies is slow-going, even moreso than usual for a Tanker.  Maybe if I'd taken a Brute or Scrapper instead it would feel stronger (but Tanker just fit the concept otherwise).

 

Edit a couple of days later: After getting them to the mid-40s, and adding Foot Stomp and KO Blow to the mix, they feel better (in fact, the character is starting to feel downright awesome, especially for a Tanker), but most of their damage isn't coming from the Fighting Pool powers, though Cross Punch is still pretty good.

Edited July 26, 2019 by Williwaw
I didn't notice that I'd left a sentence unfinished.

[n00baka]

After reading this thread, I went ahead and grabbed it for my Stalker. They were already getting Punch, Tough, and Weave, so Cross Punch wasn't a stretch. After using it a bit as an extra AoE attack, I picked up Kick, and it's been over all a pretty solid benefit to the build. I even adjusted what levels I grab things so my attack chain was smoother with Punch and Cross Punch (depending on if I was Exemped down far enough or not). 

 

I've been very impressed so far, and I've been considering making a "ScrapperMind" character using the Fighting Pool and the Whip. Probably a build to Respec into, but hey, fun times ahead!

[wjrasmussen]

On 7/9/2019 at 10:00 AM, SlimPickens said:

I take boxing or kick on plenty of characters to get to tough and weave, but all three attacks from fighting? cant say i have.

 

I do enjoy kicking a mob to death when its on that last sliver of health though.

I get an odd satisfaction from that as well.

 

[KnightSoul]

I have the oddest urge to make a Sentinel that only takes one primary power all of a sudden.

[Marshal_General]

I have been thinking about making someone with kinetics so I can start hitting someone so fast it breaks the game.

[Omnicron]

I've got the whole fighting pool on my dual pistols/mental manipulation blapper. His survival depends on having drain psyche up 100% of the time, so having an attack that gives me a consistent bonus to global recharge is a no brainier. Of course I also slot it (and every other attack power) with the force feedback proc.

[Crashen]

I am leveling a merc/rad mastermind and have taken all the fighting attacks in place of MM attacks. It is actually really fun debuffing an enemy, then running in and just beating the hell out of them. The only problem I have run into is that I tend to get so absorbed in the fisticuffs I forget to keep my mercs healed.

 

I have actually thought about doing a necro/fire/fighting mm. Most of the Thermal Radiation powers are set and forget, shielding up my pets and then healing as needed. And since necromancy has melee heavy pets, they would be close to me, while the lich can toss out some cc.

 

Demons are another okay idea, except they tend to be more mixed range. But the demons do have some group buffs and heals, and two out of three demon attacks are melee so it might go well.

[Marshal_General]

Kinetics would also work as far as healing goes. Speed boosted zombies!

[AerialAssault]

I've found that Cross Punch can be effective for building Opportunity on Sentinels. I've also been rolling with Fighting on a Huntsman Arachnos Soldier for thematic reasons. Coupled with the Soldier's base attacks (Bayonet etc.) they can certainly throw out the punches.

 

I think it's really one of those Pools where you need the full assortment to really take advantage of it, because on their own, without any of the other powers to buff their strength, they're pretty much just a gimmick, but together they can actually lay out some respectable damage. Not enough to start clearing +4/x8 mind you, although if anyone wants a challenge, there you go.

[Flashtoo]

Absolutely. The planned build for my main, a Grav/Kin controller, has the entire Fighting pool in it - stylistically, it matches his concept that was established in the book he's in; mechanically, he's a freaking Grav/Kin controller and benefits both from being in melee a lot and having decent damaging attacks. My MA stalker has it too, because without Cross Punch, she has ZERO attacks that aren't single-target.

Edited July 30, 2019 by Flashtoo

[drbuzzard]

On 7/10/2019 at 10:38 PM, chigiabelo said:

 

The problem with Brawl is it's really the weakest. On a level 35 MM I tested, 4 slotted (1ACC 3Dmg SOs) Boxing and Kick were 5.42 and 5.96 times the strength of unslotted brawl against an even level Crey Infiltrator. Cross Punch was 9.02 times better than unslotted Brawl.

Ahh, this brings me back to the old days before the devs gave out numbers for power performance we used to measure attack strength in brawl index (the multiplier of the powers damage above that of brawl, both unslotted). 

[Lusiphur Malache]

I use all of the fighting pool on my sj/sr stalker as a fill in attack when my chain gets broken and my builders are on cooldown. They also come in handy when in a group and I need to turn hide off because of a rescue or I need to keep up with a blaster or sentinel who wants all the targets.

[Marshal_General]

I made this just to see what it would look like.

 

Hero Plan by Mids' Reborn : Hero Designer 2.6.0.2
https://github.com/ImaginaryDevelopment/imaginary-hero-designer

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Melee: Level 50 Magic Controller
Primary Power Set: Illusion Control
Secondary Power Set: Time Manipulation
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Speed

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Blind -- SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear(A), SprWiloft-Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/Rchg(3), SprWiloft-EndRdx/Rchg(3), SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx(5), SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx/Rchg(5), SprWiloft-Rchg/Dmg%(7)
Level 1: Time Crawl -- TmpRdn-Acc/Slow(A)
Level 2: Spectral Wounds -- Dcm-Acc/Dmg(A), Dcm-Dmg/EndRdx(7), Dcm-Dmg/Rchg(9), Dcm-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(9), Dcm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(11), Dcm-Build%(11)
Level 4: Temporal Mending -- Prv-Heal(A), Prv-Heal/EndRdx(13), Prv-EndRdx/Rchg(15), Prv-Heal/Rchg(15), Prv-Heal/Rchg/EndRdx(17), Prv-Absorb%(17)
Level 6: Boxing -- TchofDth-Acc/Dmg(A), TchofDth-Dmg/EndRdx(19), TchofDth-Dmg/Rchg(19), TchofDth-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(21), TchofDth-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(21), TchofDth-Dam%(23)
Level 8: Kick -- CrsImp-Acc/Dmg(A), CrsImp-Dmg/EndRdx(23), CrsImp-Dmg/Rchg(25), CrsImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(25), CrsImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(27), FrcFdb-Rechg%(27)
Level 10: Deceive -- CrcPrs-Conf%(A)
Level 12: Time's Juncture -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 14: Cross Punch -- Obl-Dmg(A), Obl-Acc/Rchg(29), Obl-Dmg/Rchg(29), Obl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(31), Obl-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), FrcFdb-Rechg%(31)
Level 16: Temporal Selection -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 18: Phantom Army -- CaltoArm-Acc/Rchg(A), CaltoArm-Acc/Dmg(33), CaltoArm-Dmg/EndRdx(33), CaltoArm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), CaltoArm-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(34), CaltoArm-+Def(Pets)(34)
Level 20: Combat Jumping -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), Krm-ResKB(34), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP(50), Rct-ResDam%(50)
Level 22: Distortion Field -- Lck-%Hold(A)
Level 24: Superior Invisibility -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 26: Spectral Terror -- GlmoftheA-Acc/Rchg(A), GlmoftheA-EndRdx/Fear(36), GlmoftheA-Fear/Rng(36), GlmoftheA-Acc/Fear/Rchg(36), GlmoftheA-Acc/EndRdx(37)
Level 28: Farsight -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(37), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(37), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(39), LucoftheG-EndRdx/Rchg(39)
Level 30: Flash -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 32: Phantasm -- SvrRgh-Acc/Dmg(A), SvrRgh-Dmg/EndRdx(39), SvrRgh-Acc/EndRdx(40), SvrRgh-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(40), SvrRgh-Acc(40), SvrRgh-PetResDam(42)
Level 35: Slowed Response -- ShlBrk-Acc/DefDeb(A)
Level 38: Chrono Shift -- EffAdp-EndMod(A), EffAdp-EndMod/Rchg(42), EffAdp-EndMod/Acc/Rchg(42), EffAdp-Acc/Rchg(43), EffAdp-EndMod/Acc(43), EffAdp-EndMod/EndRdx(43)
Level 41: Tough -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), GldArm-3defTpProc(45), UnbGrd-ResDam(45), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx(45), UnbGrd-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(46), UnbGrd-EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 44: Weave -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A), LucoftheG-Def(46), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx(48), LucoftheG-Def/Rchg(48), LucoftheG-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(48)
Level 47: Group Invisibility -- LucoftheG-Def/Rchg+(A)
Level 49: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(50)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Containment
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Mrc-Rcvry+(A), NmnCnv-Regen/Rcvry+(13)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- EndMod-I(A)
Level 50: Agility Radial Paragon
Level 50: Support Core Embodiment
------------

 

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One day I might actually make it.

[Hyperstrike]

I already view Punch and Kick as essentially wastes of a power pick.
I'm also not a huge fan of Cross Punch.
I just find the need to essentially select BOTH useless pre-reqs to get it wasteful.