Increase recipe drop rates please

[TheSpiritFox]

With the influence nerf, the thing I am currently worried about is if it drives some farmers off, there will be fewer incoming recipes onto the market. Already, there are times when it's hard to find certain very commonly desired recipes on the market, forcing you to use lots of converters to obtain the recipes you want for a build if you want a high end IO build on a character. With alts being essentially the "end game" of this game, I don't have a problem with closing the influence gap between farmers and non farmers but I DO worry about the availability of recipes if farming activity drops, because not only was that generating tons of influence but also forcing drop rates to be higher than they typically are in regular play, as a fire farmer can eat through more kills and thus more drop chances on a per capita basis than any mission running of any kind ever does. 

 

If farming declines, recipe supplies can potentially decline. While there will always (thankfully) be market players who do the converter roundup, I think it would not be game breaking to tweak drop rates up a bit to make recipes more available and ensure that prices stay lower, because prices are not going to drop just because there's less influence flowing around the economy if supply also dips. 

[MTeague]

Admittedly, this isnt' a voting matter as such, it's a decision for the GM's / Developers to make. 

But if it were a voting matter, I would say hard no on a pre-emptive change.

First lets see how it all pans out.  We don't actually KNOW that there's going to be a massive shortage yet.

 

I can commonly buy 50 or more uncommon recipes (frequently Taunt or Stun or Pet Damage) for 3,500 to 5,000 inf (each) on a given night, craft them, convert them, and post enhancements that sell well. 

Edited March 31, 2020 by MTeague

[Greycat]

Too early to say what needs changing. Give it three months at least, let the devs get the data, then they can adjust as needed.

 

Meanwhile, sit at home and dream of purple rain... 🙂

[Grouchybeast]

I don't think that it would be wise to make changes based on purely hypothetical outcomes.

 

You could just as easily argue that because farmers will need to make more map runs to get the same inf, more recipes will come onto the market and therefor prices will crash.  The only way to know if this change will increase prices, decrease them or have substantially zero effect is to wait and see.

[Display Name]

This is a panic request.  Breathe!  It will all be ok!

[WindDemon21]

No I 100% agree cause I had the exact same thoughts. Especially since it drives down the farming, that means less recipes on the market. It also means that less farmers rolling the ato/winter IO lottery packs and those are going to be driven up as well.

 

In addition, it also doesn't give any incentive to exemplar, I would propose that they offer more threads/shards when exemplaring as well.

[TheSpiritFox]

46 minutes ago, Display Name said:

This is a panic request.  Breathe!  It will all be ok!

Honestly no it's not I already think that recipes are too hard to come by and that the expense of them is as driven by the fact that they are a very limited supply as the price farmers are capable of paying for things. There are lots of people who make builds that never even use a purple because of the pricing and availability, I would like to see IOs become more accessible and less of a grind and the influence nerf directly affects IO grinding rates. As this is a free MMO there's a solid argument for evening out influence gain between farmers and not does not have to affect the IO aquisition rate and that there's plenty of reason to make higher end IOs more accessible to people to enable altitis which is alot of what fuels this game. 

 

TLDR: It's not a panic request, I've wanted higher drop rates for a long time this is an excuse to ask for it. 

Edited April 1, 2020 by TheSpiritFox

[TheSpiritFox]

15 minutes ago, WindDemon21 said:

No I 100% agree cause I had the exact same thoughts. Especially since it drives down the farming, that means less recipes on the market. It also means that less farmers rolling the ato/winter IO lottery packs and those are going to be driven up as well.

 

In addition, it also doesn't give any incentive to exemplar, I would propose that they offer more threads/shards when exemplaring as well.

Fuck threads and shards. Incarnates are an easy as fuck grind if thats what you wanna do. Make exemplared characters get extra private rolls on recipe drops!

[RCU7115]

2 hours ago, TheSpiritFox said:

With the influence nerf, the thing I am currently worried about is if it drives some farmers off, there will be fewer incoming recipes onto the market. Already, there are times when it's hard to find certain very commonly desired recipes on the market, forcing you to use lots of converters to obtain the recipes you want for a build if you want a high end IO build on a character. With alts being essentially the "end game" of this game, I don't have a problem with closing the influence gap between farmers and non farmers but I DO worry about the availability of recipes if farming activity drops, because not only was that generating tons of influence but also forcing drop rates to be higher than they typically are in regular play, as a fire farmer can eat through more kills and thus more drop chances on a per capita basis than any mission running of any kind ever does. 

 

If farming declines, recipe supplies can potentially decline. While there will always (thankfully) be market players who do the converter roundup, I think it would not be game breaking to tweak drop rates up a bit to make recipes more available and ensure that prices stay lower, because prices are not going to drop just because there's less influence flowing around the economy if supply also dips. 

I see the Very Rare Purple recipes and all of the Winter Event IO's increasing as farmers rage quit and no one has the money to buy them. People will then have to eat the AH fees that they paid to take the purple recipe off the market to repost and cutting into their Ferengi profit margins.

[RCU7115]

1 hour ago, WindDemon21 said:

No I 100% agree cause I had the exact same thoughts. Especially since it drives down the farming, that means less recipes on the market. It also means that less farmers rolling the ato/winter IO lottery packs and those are going to be driven up as well.

 

In addition, it also doesn't give any incentive to exemplar, I would propose that they offer more threads/shards when exemplaring as well.

Yep.

[TheSpiritFox]

Just now, RCU7115 said:

I see the Very Rare Purple recipes and all of the Winter Event IO's increasing as farmers rage quit and no one has the money to buy them. People will then have to eat the AH fees that they paid to take the purple recipe off the market to repost and cutting into their Ferengi profit margins.

Would you like to buy a copy of The Rules of Acquisition?  Yours for a mere 2 billion influence, you'll make it back in days!

[Indystruck]

Recipes are already more common than on live, though. It'll be fine.

[nihilii]

This change is highly misunderstood. Less inf will be generated, but the same amount of recipes will be produced. Ergo the people who farm for inf will farm somewhere between what they are doing now and twice as much, and the recipes they will generate will be somewhere between what they are doing now and twice as much.

 

Any recipe you buy from the market was earned by a player. Corollary, because the rate of earning recipes is the same no matter what, people who used double inf were generating less recipes proportionally to their game activity than other people; AND, worsening inflation, because they had all that inf to spend relative to other players.

 

(I've seen naive arguments along the line of "I farmed so I could give massive inf gifts to other players". Where do you think that inf ends up, once given? Spent, likely on the market. So the net effect is the same, hiking up the prices for everyone else.)

 

-

 

For what it's worth, I haven't bothered to use double inf for a long time while in AE farms. I still delete most of my yellow and orange recipes and all of my white/yellow salvage.

 

Influence gain without double inf is still way too good in AE, to the point even the 5 seconds per recipe it takes to list for 1 inf on the market is a pointless loss of time. When AFK farming you find yourself with 80/80 recipes faster than you know it. Your time investment to earn inf is near 0, while your inventory management takes some time. Influence generation in AE would have to be slashed another 75% (that is, 1/8 of what is currently is) for me to actually bother feeding the market.
 

[Parabola]

1 minute ago, nihilii said:

This change is highly misunderstood. Less inf will be generated, but the same amount of recipes will be produced. Ergo the people who farm for inf will farm somewhere between what they are doing now and twice as much, and the recipes they will generate will be somewhere between what they are doing now and twice as much.

 

Any recipe you buy from the market was earned by a player. Corollary, because the rate of earning recipes is the same no matter what, people who used double inf were generating less recipes proportionally to their game activity than other people; AND, worsening inflation, because they had all that inf to spend relative to other players.

 

(I've seen naive arguments along the line of "I farmed so I could give massive inf gifts to other players". Where do you think that inf ends up, once given? Spent, likely on the market. So the net effect is the same, hiking up the prices for everyone else.)

 

-

 

For what it's worth, I haven't bothered to use double inf for a long time while in AE farms. I still delete most of my yellow and orange recipes and all of my white/yellow salvage.

 

Influence gain without double inf is still way too good in AE, to the point even the 5 seconds per recipe it takes to list for 1 inf on the market is a pointless loss of time. When AFK farming you find yourself with 80/80 recipes faster than you know it. Your time investment to earn inf is near 0, while your inventory management takes some time. Influence generation in AE would have to be slashed another 75% (that is, 1/8 of what is currently is) for me to actually bother feeding the market.
 

Beat me to it. People are really failing to see the wider picture with this change. Ultimately all it is chaging is the ratio of inf to drops that are being added to the market, and that will limit inflation. Printing money does not help the economy, it doesn't work like that in the real world and neither does it in the game.

 

Farmers will either continue farming, do some other content more often or rage quit. Any of those outcomes is the same for the economy: less inf is being added to the economy per drop and that will limit inflation.

[Burnt Toast]

I think you are blowing this "farmers quitting" way out of proportion. Aside from a few loud mouths on the forums I do not know one person who has remotely suggested they are quitting over the influence change...then again I mainly associate with level headed people and avoid the overly dramatic. Market prices will increase over the next week and then drop some due to the uptick in new Electrical Affinity toons, but this market is WAY more stable than ther one on Live. 

[reib]

No more double Infl but with empyrean you drop with levelling can buy the recipes you want. Only different way, maybe slower but not so bad.

[Haijinx]

17 hours ago, Burnt Toast said:

I think you are blowing this "farmers quitting" way out of proportion. Aside from a few loud mouths on the forums I do not know one person who has remotely suggested they are quitting over the influence change...then again I mainly associate with level headed people and avoid the overly dramatic. Market prices will increase over the next week and then drop some due to the uptick in new Electrical Affinity toons, but this market is WAY more stable than ther one on Live. 

I am not sure this line of reasoning has been thoroughly explored ... 

 

I will quit a game that makes it harder to earn money in ... 

Money I only wanted for the game I want to quit. 

 

[Burnt Toast]

10 hours ago, Haijinx said:

I am not sure this line of reasoning has been thoroughly explored ... 

 

I will quit a game that makes it harder to earn money in ... 

Money I only wanted for the game I want to quit. 

 

Cool - can I have your stuff?

 

[Yomo Kimyata]

Is the problem that you can't find enough recipes in the AH (presumably recipes that you want to craft for yourself)?  Or is the problem that you can't find enough IOs that you want in the AH?  Or is the problem that you can'r find recipes/IOs at the price you want them?

 

Anecdotally, there are still shit tons of recipes of all shapes and sizes being offered, but I'll admit that I almost always only bid on the yellow ones. 

[Haijinx]

5 hours ago, Burnt Toast said:

Cool - can I have your stuff?

 

I didn't mean me as opposed to "me" the hypothetical influence farmer.

 

But hypothetical me is confused since the influence was only usuable by me anyway.   And only in this game. 

 

 

[Haijinx]

You can have my hypothetical stuff though. 

[Yomo Kimyata]

39 minutes ago, Haijinx said:

You can have my hypothetical stuff though. 

Hypothetically.

[thunderforce]

On 3/31/2020 at 11:08 PM, TheSpiritFox said:

With the influence nerf, the thing I am currently worried about is if it drives some farmers off, there will be fewer incoming recipes onto the market. Already, there are times when it's hard to find certain very commonly desired recipes on the market, forcing you to use lots of converters to obtain the recipes you want for a build if you want a high end IO build on a character.

I think it's hard to find recipes you want because many people buy crafted IOs (because that's how you get attuned). That means many people craft all their recipes - all the demand's for crafted IOs, so they sell faster that way. That means even people who want unattuned level-50 IOs shop for crafted IOs, because that's where the supply is. Try buying crafted IOs, not recipes.

[TheSpiritFox]

8 hours ago, thunderforce said:

I think it's hard to find recipes you want because many people buy crafted IOs (because that's how you get attuned). That means many people craft all their recipes - all the demand's for crafted IOs, so they sell faster that way. That means even people who want unattuned level-50 IOs shop for crafted IOs, because that's where the supply is. Try buying crafted IOs, not recipes.

The crafted IO supply is also low, especially for certain purple sets. And I am someone who builds expensive builds, every character I bother to take all the way to 50 gets an "ideal" build as I set it up and to do what I want it to do and I buy as many purples as is required to achieve that ideal build and such. Like I do alot of things that require high recharge and I'm counting recharge bonuses to make sure I don't get more than 5 of a type (usually only necesary watching the 7.5s cause luck of the gambler bonuses overlap with some set bonuses) 

 

 

[Mr. Vee]

2 minutes ago, TheSpiritFox said:

The crafted IO supply is also low, especially for certain purple sets. And I am someone who builds expensive builds, every character I bother to take all the way to 50 gets an "ideal" build as I set it up and to do what I want it to do and I buy as many purples as is required to achieve that ideal build and such. Like I do alot of things that require high recharge and I'm counting recharge bonuses to make sure I don't get more than 5 of a type (usually only necesary watching the 7.5s cause luck of the gambler bonuses overlap with some set bonuses) 

 

 

to your first point about 'certain purple sets' - that's what converters are for.

as to your last bit - check your set bonuses in-game and you'll see that luck of the gambler's 7.5 is listed differently than any other 7.5. can have 5x of both.