Cheap And Expensive..

[damnimgood]

When it comes to just Inf., GENERALLY SPEAKING, which builds are the most expensive and which builds are the cheapest? 

Edited August 23, 2021 by damnimgood

[ScrewlooseCohh]

I think you can spend as much or as little as you want on any build.

 

One of my friends has one character with 9 purple sets slotted, not sure it is actually the most effective, but it is his prime character so he wanted to spend the Inf.

 

Most ATs and power set combos can be improved by judicious IO Set slotting, but I think the point of diminishing returns is around 400 to 500 mil.

 

regards, Screwloose.

"I am not young enough to know everything."

[Miss Magical]

I am not an experienced player but I love tinkering with builds!

 

In my experience, the most expensive builds are melee builds because they easily slot all 4 of the expensive purples: hecatomb, armageddon, ragnarok, apocalypse. Melee builds relying heavily on winter IO's to cap defense are the priciest of all (i.e. AFK farming brutes).

 

The cheapest builds are defender builds and certain controller/corruptor builds relying heavily on procs:

• These often do not have melee attacks, so no expensive hecatomb/armageddon.
• They often cap positional defense, and many purples do not give that.
• Builds relying on procs for damage will not slot full sets in the primary attacks, and may forego some purples.
• Defenders and corruptor superior ATIO's uniquely have +10% recharge as the 3rd slot bonus. So they can double up on it, i.e. slot 3x ATIO in two powers and there is less reliance on purples for +10% recharge.

My cheapest build that still had everything it wanted was my Kinetics/pistols defender that came in under 200 million.

 

 

[huang3721]

There are 23(24?) powers and 67 additional slots. Let's assume each purple cost 25 millions, and you fill all those slots with purple, then you will need around 2.2 billions for a single build. 

 

On the other hand, some people slots their build with random drops only. In this case, their build will cost 0 inf.

 

Edit 

 

It depends on your difficulty level, I guess. A 50 mil build is most likely too expensive for -1x0 difficulty, but too cheap and inadequate for +4x8 solo AV. 

 

Edited August 23, 2021 by huang3721
Adding dificulty

[aethereal]

1 hour ago, ScrewlooseCohh said:

I think you can spend as much or as little as you want on any build.

 

One of my friends has one character with 9 purple sets slotted, not sure it is actually the most effective, but it is his prime character so he wanted to spend the Inf.

Definitely not effective, he's almost certainly getting few or no set bonuses from about half of those purples due to the rule of five.

[Snarky]

I build a bit.  I shop really good builders products like i am planning for Black Friday months in advance

 

A top notch Farmer tends to be expensive due to use of Winter sets

 

A Dominator tends to be expensive due to use of Purple Sets chasing Global Recharge

 

after that it depends on AT/build goals etc.  Hyperstrike built me a SS/Invul Brute when I found Homecoming.  It is bulletproof.  It uses a LOT of really expensive pieces to achieve a nearly seamless build.  It is great.  You could achieve 75% of the effect pretty cheap because SS/Invul doesnt have a lot of seams right out of the box

 

Most builds are a mix of expensive and cheaper sets.  I slap cheap sets in about 50% of most of my builds because they work best at what i am trying to do.  

[laudwic]

I generally solo a character up rather than farming so earlier characters fund later characters.  Also, I generally avoid purples as I generally move on to other characters once all the incarnates are unlocked. I do IO set everything.

 

That being said, the most expensive are either Dominators due to the need to get certain IO sets to chase permadom.  Otherwise, any of the characters with a lot of defense or resistance sets as those IOs always seem to be more expensive.

[Mopery]

The most effective "cheap" build I've made is an AR/MM/Force Mastery, Ranged Defense soft-capped, Hover-Blaster.

 

Thunderstrike and Artillery sets give huge bonuses to Ranged Defense and can be picked up for less than 1mil inf each. I slotted 4 full sets of each set(8 * 6 * 1mil <= 48mil inf). Also a set of Stupefy in Beanbag which are dirt cheap(<4mil for the whole set iirc).

 

Using a set of Contagious Confusion(WoC), a set of Overwhelming force(M30) for even more Ranged Defense gives ~57% Ranged and ~53% Energy Defense (with an AH value around 200mil for both sets). Without these it wouldn't have near-incarnate cap Defense, but would be much cheaper and nearly as effective in most situations.

 

This build is a Cone King, lays waste to groups from a distance(Full Auto, Psi Scream, Flamethrower, Buckshot) and is safe from all but flying melee enemies.

 

I would bet these sets could used to make a similar build using say, Fire instead of AR, and/or a different Secondary for less than 100mil.

Edited August 23, 2021 by Mopery
Forgot and had M30 in my group of Cone attacks.

[Shred Monkey]

I see 2 general trends of high end builds as it applies to cost.

 

1.  High recharge builds cost more then low recharge builds.

2.  Typed defense builds cost more then positional defense builds (maybe because positional powers tend to get you closer to soft-cap to start with)

 

Also, if you do a proc builds with two level 53 DAM/ACC HOs in each attack (ahem, *guilty*), this can get expensive quickly. 

[catsi563]

Any Defense or Resistance build ie Tanks most of those will run a low end 65-80 mil inf easy

 

 

[Luminara]

16 hours ago, huang3721 said:

There are 23(24?) powers and 67 additional slots. Let's assume each purple cost 25 millions, and you fill all those slots with purple, then you will need around 2.2 billions for a single build. 

 

There are only ten purple sets, there isn't a purple set for every enhancement category, and every purple IO is unique.  Even if you include Winter sets and ATOs, you couldn't spend 2.2 billion this way even if you made a concerted effort.

[huang3721]

17 hours ago, Luminara said:

Even if you include Winter sets and ATOs, you couldn't spend 2.2 billion this way even if you made a concerted effort

 

That's a great idea! Archetype Enhancements and Winter Packs are also worth 25 mill, aren't they? They could bridge the gap. Then, I could use PvP Enhancement (10 mill each) to drive up the cost. Nice!

edit New build for my Electric/Electric/Blaze(?) Mastery

 

Powers	code	Enhancement	# slot	Cost (mil)	Purple	ATO	Winter Pack	PvP	IO
Charged Brawl	CS6	Superior Critical Strikes	6	150		1
Havoc Punch	BC6	Superior Blistering Cold	6	150			1
Jacobs Ladder	FH6	Fortunata Hypnosis	6	150	1
Build Up	n/a	To Hit Buff IO	1	2					1
Thunderstrike	SS6	Superior Scrapper's Strike	6	150		1
Confront	n/a	Taunt IO	1	2					1
Chain Lightning	H6	Hecatomb	6	150	1
Lightning Clap	AA6	Absolute Amazement	6	150	1
Lightning Rod	Ar6	Armageddon	6	150	1
Charged Armor	n/a	(PvP) Gladiator Armor	1	10				1
Lightning Field	Av6	Superior Avalanche	6	150			1
Conductive Shield	n/a	(PvP) Gladiator Armor	1	10				1
Static Shield	n/a	(PvP) Gladiator Armor	1	10				1
Grounded	n/a	(PvP) Gladiator Armor	1	10				1
Energize	n/a	(PVP) Panacea	1	10				1
Lightning Reflex	n/a	Run/Fly Speed IO	1	2					1
Power Sink	n/a	Endurance Modif IO	1	2					1
Power Surge	E6	Superior Entomb	6	150			1
Char	UC6	Unbreakable Constraint	6	150	1
Fireball	R6	Ragnarok	6	150	1
Fireblast	Ap6	Apocalypse	6	150	1
Ring of Fire	WB6	Superior Winter's Bite	6	150			1
Pool Power(?)	n/a	Random IO, whatever	3	6					1
		TOTAL	90	2014	7	2	4	5	5

 

Usually, I try to minimize the cost instead of maximizing it. Well, I'll call this build "I Need Additional Donors".

I never thought that my half-assed guess would hit close enough. By the way, I haven't validated this plan since I can't log in to Beta Server.  I'll post its combat attributes screenshot sometime in the future. 

Edited August 24, 2021 by huang3721
Adding AT

[roleki]

Not that I pay for enhancements, but ranged/support characters seem to use the cheapest components.  Artillery and Thunderstrike are dirt cheap and before you know it, you're capped for ranged and nearing it for energy/neg energy.  No need for billion dollar builds EVERYWHERE.

[huang3721]

I mean, that's the joke. Come on, look at it! Two billions and I have no idea what that build is trying to achieve (aside from being expensive as heck). 

 

On a more serious note, I relies on enhancement drops, so my build is cheap, but it packs enough power to fight +2.

[Aeroprism]

The question is unfortunately too vague to have one single true answer.

 

How do you acquire your stuff? 

• Do you outbid everyone to get EVERYTHING NAO NAO NAO?  Then yeah, 25M for a purple sounds right.
• Can you shop with a little patience? 
• Do you buy recipes instead and craft them yourself? 
• Do you plan to use the purple recipes you got on your own as you play?
• Do you buy super packs to get your own ATOs and Winters?  Because Super Packs are not a flat cost, there is opportunity for market in there.

And the world doesn't revolve exclusively around purples.  People want defense cap and perma haste, so that's a lot of defense IO sets. those can be 6-7M a pop, or a lot less if you plan and play smart.

 

And then when you're REALLY into things, there's Hami-Os.

 

You know, I could go on the AH right now and bid 50M on every single thing I need.  I'd have a full build in 10 mins and it would cost me 4.5 Bil.  Or I could plan it, gather stuff, craft, shop wisely, market whatever I get on the side and in the end, the very same build would cost me less than 200 M.

 

So the question isn't "what's the cheapest build and the most expensive one".  The question is "How much planning and effort are you willing to put in there?" 

[Miss Magical]

If your goal is to drive up cost without regard to practicality, you have to use exotic things like level 53 membranes; that's the only way you can realistically break a billion.

[Ger]

You could always pick all travel powers and 6-slot everything with lvl 53 cytos.

[Yomo Kimyata]

1 minute ago, Ger said:

You could always pick all travel powers and 6-slot everything with lvl 53 cytos.

 

Lvl 53 hamis in general are your most expensive enhancements.

 

Also, don't forget you can boost many things for an extra 5mm+ per enhancement!

[Black Ice]

I think with the new ATO sets it is very easy to soft cap s/l now with most toons and still have great recharge or whatever you are building for. I myself have a topped out corruptor that cost probably 800 mil if you go right now and buy the IO'S, but he can farm a +4/8 fire farm fairly well. My new brute I'm still finishing and he will cost about the same. 

So 2 completely different archetypes and cost around the same for great recharge, soft capped defenses and overall great damage. So I see no reason to break the bank and hit a billion on one specific character. Heck if you want shoot me you character idea and I will build a mids build for you. And it won't be no 2 billion.

Edited August 24, 2021 by Black Ice
Autocorrected IO's to IT'S

[Outrider_01]

Made a dominator, Dark/Ice.  It's not a power house, decent single target range attacks but only 1 melee as its built around flight.  Soft cap defense, perma hasten at 180%, perma domination with key bind to auto fire Domination or Hasten.  Went Ice epic for theme, enough recharge that Hoarfrost near perma until Incarnate; autofires off right key.  Hibernate to recover hitpoints and endurance when dominate hasn't triggered.Sleet, Ice Storm, Chilling Embrace, Fearsome stare; debuffs the shit out of stuff with slows, -tohit, and some -resist.

 

About 400m for enhancements, another 80m for boosters, and 120m to attune for why the f@&* not.

 

Already looking at another dominator pair build, with only 125% passive recharge to achieve perma domination. 

[huang3721]

On 8/24/2021 at 6:54 PM, huang3721 said:

I haven't validated this plan since I can't log in to Beta Server.

 

I checked my previous plan on Beta Server and found the build is possible. It's dumb but possible.

 

 

On 8/24/2021 at 1:02 AM, Luminara said:

Even if you include Winter sets and ATOs, you couldn't spend 2.2 billion this way even if you made a concerted effort.

Spending 2.2 billion using Purples, Winter Sets, and ATOs is impossible. However, spending 1.95 billion is possible and doesn't take too much effort. With only one constraint (number of available slots) and a few decision variables, my solver takes less than 10 minutes to find a solution. Said solution has 7 Purples, 2 ATOs, and 4 Winter Sets.

 

Still, @aethereal pointed out another problem for using too many Purples. Here is what I've found:

 

The table below counts the number of set bonuses by type and value.  As long as the number is less than or equal to 5, it won't suffer the rule of five.

 

Type \ Percent	2.5	3	4	5	6	10	15	16	Total
Psionic Defense				1					1
Accuracy							7		7
AoE Defense	5			2					7
Damage			3						3
Energy/Negative Energy Defense				2					2
Fire/Cold Defense	2			5					7
Fire/Cold Resistance					11				11
Health		2							2
Melee Defense	2			1					3
Ranged Defense	2								2
Recharge Time						9			9
Recovery			12						12
Regeneration								1	1
Smashing/Lethal Defense	1			2					3
Smashing/Lethal Resistance					1				1
Status Resistance						18			18
Toxic/Psionic Resistance					6				6

 

Sadly, 8 of 18 bonus types exceed that number. Result: I don't get what I've paid for. 

 

Bonus	I paid for this	But, I got this instead	loss
Psionic Defense	5	5	0.00%
Accuracy	105	75	28.57%
AoE Defense	22.5	15	33.33%
Damage	12	12	0.00%
Energy/Negative Energy Defense	10	10	0.00%
Fire/Cold Defense	30	22.5	25.00%
Fire/Cold Resistance	66	30	54.55%
Health	6	6	0.00%
Melee Defense	10	10	0.00%
Ranged Defense	5	5	0.00%
Recharge Time	90	50	44.44%
Recovery	48	20	58.33%
Regeneration	16	16	0.00%
Smashing/Lethal Defense	12.5	12.5	0.00%
Smashing/Lethal Resistance	6	6	0.00%
Status Resistance	180	50	72.22%
Toxic/Psionic Resistance	36	30	16.67%
		average	19.60%

 

[Ukase]

On 8/22/2021 at 7:26 PM, damnimgood said:

When it comes to just Inf., GENERALLY SPEAKING, which builds are the most expensive and which builds are the cheapest? 

 

In general, a fire farm brute is the most expensive build due to winter sets that give nice fire defense bonuses. 

In general, the builds that are the cheapest are the ones that don't use the AH. For example, you can forgo the 2xp buff and slot what drops, and in a pinch, visit the store and buy the enhancements that haven't dropped until level 25 or 30. Then start using the common IO recipes, and craft those as you get the salvage needed. Buy SOs for recipes that didn't drop on you. Keep doing that, you may never need the AH at all - but you won't have any set bonuses. But, you'll have the cheapest build because you will be buying very little and relying on the RNG a lot. 

Anecdotally, I've made countless characters that started with zero influence, got nothing from my alts or my storage bins, but self-funded every build by using converters wisely. Some folks hate marketing. I don't, so I use the market to fund my characters. In fact, none of my builds have EVER cost me anything. They're all free, made with influence from sales of items I've crafted, or catalyzed.  


But, if you're looking for a budget AT/Powerset combo, one isn't going to be any cheaper than another. You could make the case for a soldier of arachnos, or maybe a kheldian, simply because their ATOs are generally cheaper than other ATOs. But, if you're using ATOs, you're probably using Purples and perhaps winter-Os when you reach 50 as well, and other IO sets. And since all ATs that use IOs tend to all use a heal set, maybe a defense or resist set (or three), some damage sets, etc...they're all gonna run about the same. 
 

[nebber]

Kinetics is a powerful and cheap-to-slot powerset.  Most of its powers are still highly effective with just generic IOs.

[Carnifax]

I don't use Purples or Winters usually so most of my builds end up reasonably cheap. Certainly within the "I can earn this with 2-3 20 minute Marketeering sessions" range I like. Somewhere around 200-250 million. 

 

My Water/Temporal Blaster was possibly my cheapest just because the Ranged Def IO sets (Artillery and Thunderstrikes) are cheaper than things like Obliteration, Kinetic Combats or the Resist set that gives a nice chunk of melee def. Only has the one purple converted from the one you get from completing the Market Crash TF and no Winters. 

 

My most expensive is undoubtly my Fire/Claws tank because of the Winters sets used. Although technically those were 8-10 million a pop rather than 20+ because I bought a glut of them during the Winter Event. I wanted him to be heavily resistant to Slows after the +4 Lobster Party on ITF 1 ground him to a crawl one time. Even he just uses 3 purples though. 

 

I think the only time I've actually slotted a full set of Purples is for Confuse powers because the bonuses are excellent as is the proc (but Malaises Illusions isn't far off set bonus-wise)

[Snarky]

You could spend a bit more if you boost all the purples to +5

 

This thread topic reminds me of a Dolly Parton quote.  "It costs a lot of money to look this cheap."