LFG protocol

[Ukase]

I'm just going to say this - and candidly, you're entitled to do things the way you wish - just know if you don't adhere to this protocol, I think you're in the wrong. 

When you recruit for something, and you get a reply via tell (assuming you didn't ask for a shout in broadcast), if you fill up right before that you get that reply, you simply hit backspace and reply, "sorry, full". 

You don't say anything in LFG. And "Why not?!" you may ask. 

It's a fair question. After all, the player that sent you the tell was clearly monitoring that channel. 

But are they monitoring that channel after they've sent you a tell? 
No. They're not. 

When you recruit - it's like putting an ad in the paper, or Craigslist, or one of the on-line job boards. 
They never take out another ad to specifically state the job's been filled. 

Telling the world in LFG that you've filled is like putting an ad in the paper saying the job's been filled. 

It's common courtesy. I completely understand that sometimes - you get 10-20 tells for a given recruitment effort. Guess what - back space works. You can and should reply to all of those people who were kind enough to reply to your plea for assistance. 

If you can't find a way to do that - it's my  opinion that you're just wrong. 

That concludes my soap box rant for the moment. You've been a great audience, even if you disagree. 

[cranebump]

14 minutes ago, Ukase said:

But are they monitoring that channel after they've sent you a tell? 
No. They're not. 

I am. 

[The_Warpact]

8 minutes ago, Ukase said:

it's my  opinion 

 

I don't have a horse in this race, I don't pug, and my lfg is closed on every toon. But, as you pointed out it is your "opinion".

 

Don't expect people to do what you want.

 

In their opinion you're wrong.

 

There is no guide on channel etiquette, at least not that I know of, and really how would everyone get a copy or even read it.

 

So in conclusion everyone is different and do not expect it, you'll get most of the results you desire and the rest well thats why you're here.

 

[justicebeliever]

I think both are proper.  I get replies sometimes up to 10 minutes after I post, meaning some people are just scrolling thru to see what’s going on.  I think it’s courteous to close the loop so those people don’t waste their time if you are full.  However that bring said, you should always respond to that tell personally as well.

[Luminara]

15 minutes ago, Ukase said:

Telling the world in LFG that you've filled is like putting an ad in the paper saying the job's been filled. 

 

Thereby informing other interested parties that they no longer need to inquire.  You might not be in the channel afterward, but other people are, and unless the recruiter says something, they have no way of knowing if there's still room on the team.

[Without_Pause]

Until you say in LFG that you are full, I assume you aren't.

[Yomo Kimyata]

Why not do both?  I announce in LFG that the team is full, and I respond to anyone who sends me a tell as well.  Seems like common courtesy?

[Veracor]

Saying your team/league is full in LFG is not to respond to people that already sent you tells, it is to not waste others' time who see your LFM message after you've filled or even launched.  You can still use backspace to respond to people who shot you tells before you filled.

[Aurora_Girl]

What is this "paper" you speak of?

 

Do you think most people close whatever tab holds their LFG channel as soon as they send a tell?

 

I *try* to reply to over-fill people, because yeah that's polite. Do I take 5 minutes to reply to 10 over-fill people individually after I've taken the time to tell the assembled team what I'm doing (on the rare occasion that happens)? 

 

Probably not. Just the other day I think it was not a full minute between tells of "inv" to "oh f*ck you you f*cking puppy kicking sh*thead welcome to ignore you duckf*cker" so. 

 

People gonna people. 

Edited December 31, 2021 by Aurora_Girl
Apparently this is a "family show."

[Luminara]

4 minutes ago, Aurora_Girl said:

What is this "paper" you speak of?

 

Pulped wood fiber material, sometimes reinforced with pulped fabric, laid or extruded in sheets or rolls and cut to specified sizes.  Ink, a substance which semi-permanently or permanently penetrates the material, is then impressed in patterns of letters and numbers (alphanumeric characters), creating what is known as "printed text".

It was a bit before your time.  You can probably see one in a museum, or something.

 

😁

[PeregrineFalcon]

/Noranger!

 

I put the invite out in LFG and I'll inform everyone that the team's full in LFG. You can't tell me what to do! You're not my real father!

[Aurora_Girl]

39 minutes ago, Luminara said:

 

Pulped wood fiber material, sometimes reinforced with pulped fabric, laid or extruded in sheets or rolls and cut to specified sizes.  Ink, a substance which semi-permanently or permanently penetrates the material, is then impressed in patterns of letters and numbers (alphanumeric characters), creating what is known as "printed text".

It was a bit before your time.  You can probably see one in a museum, or something.

 

😁

 

See, this is the kind of well-researched, good-natured and reasonable snark I think we all need more of as this dogshit year ends. 

[Aurora_Girl]

4 minutes ago, PeregrineFalcon said:

/Noranger!

 

Is this the official one now? I haven't gotten my newsletter yet. 

[Ironblade]

4 hours ago, Ukase said:

When you recruit for something, and you get a reply via tell (assuming you didn't ask for a shout in broadcast), if you fill up right before that you get that reply, you simply hit backspace and reply, "sorry, full". 

You don't say anything in LFG. And "Why not?!" you may ask.

I think you're wrong on the second part.  You send them a tell *AND* you post in LFG that you are full, otherwise you are likely to keep getting tells and disappointing more people.

[Ukase]

3 hours ago, Ironblade said:

I think you're wrong on the second part.  You send them a tell *AND* you post in LFG that you are full, otherwise you are likely to keep getting tells and disappointing more people.

You and several others are quite correct. I had my panties in a bunch and wasn't thinking clearly. 

[The_Warpact]

6 hours ago, Aurora_Girl said:

dogshit year

 

But wait! There's more! 2022 is here!

[Oklahoman]

51 minutes ago, Ukase said:

You and several others are quite correct. I had my panties in a bunch and wasn't thinking clearly. 

 

I've said before that LFG needs some rethinking, at least on Excelsior where there is non-stop traffic on the channel. I think the core of what you were suggesting is good - reduce chatter on LFG that doesn't really help people find a team or league.

 

I suggested once before that maybe no one should be able to post to LFG more than once every 30 seconds or so, and that idea was shut down mainly because it would have potentially prevented team/league leaders from posting right away that their team/league was full. I guess some think that's pretty important.

[MHertz]

If I’m leading a group, I have to set the mission, adjust settings for new team composition, and (depending on my AT) hand out buffs or summon pets. I have to keep communicating with the team so they don’t go in the door early. I really don’t want to have to constantly answer tells for 15 minutes while the mission is going on. I’ll gladly post to LFG that the team is full, as well as answer any stragglers that make it through before I get that message posted.

[biostem]

9 hours ago, Ukase said:

It's common courtesy. I completely understand that sometimes - you get 10-20 tells for a given recruitment effort. Guess what - back space works. You can and should reply to all of those people who were kind enough to reply to your plea for assistance. 

 

If you get multiple tells in quick succession, it can be rather troublesome to scroll back through your chat history and send personalized tells to each and every person to tell them that you are full.  One single "full, ty" in broadcast of lfg accomplishes the same with much less effort.  Plus, if a person is looking for a team, but can't bother checking the lfg or broadcast chats for anything other than their own request, then maybe they aren't paying the degree of attention that you want to see from a teammate, anyway... 

[Andreah]

I appreciate seeing the post to LFG letting us all know the team filled.

 

Sometimes the person who was advertising goes the extra mile, and posts something like "Sorry everyone I couldn't add - there were lots of tells and there's probably enough of you to make another team"

 

It's not always about getting the most for one team in the least public typing.

[LiquidBandage]

This is what I did on Live, what I have done here the past few years, what I have done in all other games:

 

• I post a LFM style message in a global channel.
• When The team fills, I post a message in those global channel(s) that the team has filled or is no longer looking or has been canceled. I try to do this in a timely manner to stave off more needless tells to join the team. The UP arrow is useful for this if communicating in more than one channel.
• If I receive more tells than spots available, I also try to send tells to those people if it is just a couple people. If it is more than that, I try to do my best to respond, but there comes a point where trying to keep track of who you talked to is more effort than is worth your time (just let the "full" message you posted in the global channel do the work). If I plan to run the content more than once, I try to let the ones who did not get on the team know of my intentions (so they know to look for my recruitment message again relatively soon). 
• If I get a tell minutes after the team has started doing whatever it is I recruited them for, I let it slide until there is a lull in the action to fire off a quick "sorry, full".

 

There are many ways to have a chat window configured. Sometimes it can be way to cluttered with channels and it is hard to track what is going on in a flood. Sometimes a very restricted channel selection can remove a sense of when a message was posted (i.e. no other traffic to give context as to when a message appeared). And not everyone is paying 100% attention to chat at all times, so it is understandable when you get mis-timed responses. 

 

I am forgiving to those that recruit because they are the ones making the effort to herd the cats. Sometimes I am the cat. Other times I am the herder. I try to make no assumptions about how or why someone will respond to my request for players. If the content can accept players from both sides, I try to make it clear that the team is red or blue or to send a tell when they are in X zone. If the content is level limited, I try to list a minimum level in the request for players. I also try to use a full name for the intended content in my initial request with an abbreviation in parentheses. Then subsequent requests just use the abbreviation (this reduces chat clutter and helps inform people of what the acronyms mean). Doing these simple little things removes confusion and garners more focused responses and eliminates useless noise responses. 

[Aurora_Girl]

Turning on chat timestamps is a huge help, too. 

[Redletter]

On 12/31/2021 at 1:29 PM, PeregrineFalcon said:

I put the invite out in LFG and I'll inform everyone that the team's full in LFG. You can't tell me what to do! You're not my real father!

 

 

[Redletter]

On 12/31/2021 at 11:43 AM, Ukase said:

I'm just going to say this - and candidly, you're entitled to do things the way you wish - just know if you don't adhere to this protocol, I think you're in the wrong. 

 

When you recruit for something, and you get a reply via tell (assuming you didn't ask for a shout in broadcast), if you fill up right before that you get that reply, you simply hit backspace and reply, "sorry, full".

Ok, but what if I get ten to twenty tells? You can easily pull that when you ad for weeklies, AE farms, and other in-demand content.

On 12/31/2021 at 11:43 AM, Ukase said:

You don't say anything in LFG. And "Why not?!" you may ask. It's a fair question.

 

After all, the player that sent you the tell was clearly monitoring that channel. But are they monitoring that channel after they've sent you a tell?

Well, yeah. LFG is a tab you have open if you are infact, LFG. I dont STOP LFG just because I asked to join a G, because sometimes Gs full up quick and I need to keep LFG. It is, afterall, as easy as keeping it's tab open. You dont even need to navigate OFF the LFG tab to send a tell to someone LFG in LFG! It truly is a miracle of modern (circa: 2006) technology.

On 12/31/2021 at 11:43 AM, Ukase said:

No. They're not.

Ok but how do you know?

On 12/31/2021 at 11:43 AM, Ukase said:

When you recruit - it's like putting an ad in the paper, or Craigslist, or one of the on-line job boards. They never take out another ad to specifically state the job's been filled.

Because putting an ad in the paper requires you to pay the paper. Why are you comparing a totally free broadcast channel to an ad service requiring compensation?

On 12/31/2021 at 11:43 AM, Ukase said:

Telling the world in LFG that you've filled is like putting an ad in the paper saying the job's been filled. 

No, it's more like telling everyone who is, was, or who could be interested in joining your group that the group is full.

On 12/31/2021 at 11:43 AM, Ukase said:

It's common courtesy. I completely understand that sometimes - you get 10-20 tells for a given recruitment effort. Guess what - back space works.

Oh so you DO know you can get a parade of pms!

 

And... you feel each should get an individual response...

 

Instead of just telling them all at once, through the public channel that they're actively in...

On 12/31/2021 at 11:43 AM, Ukase said:

You can and should reply to all of those people who were kind enough to reply to your plea for assistance. 

You mean like telling them all in LFG that you're full?

On 12/31/2021 at 11:43 AM, Ukase said:

If you can't find a way to do that

You mean like telling them all in LFG that you're full?

On 12/31/2021 at 11:43 AM, Ukase said:

it's my  opinion that you're just wrong.

It's my opinion you really want people to respond to your tells personally, instead of just reading LFG, and that this is a really lukewarm hot take.

 

Or your trolling. Which is equally as likely and twice as funny.

On 12/31/2021 at 11:43 AM, Ukase said:

That concludes my soap box rant for the moment. You've been a great audience, even if you disagree. 

And you've been the best comedian I've seen in a while, thank you for the laugh.

[FuturaTrunks]

Some of you old farts got too many rules, im just tryna get loaded and be a hero