What Can Be Done to Recruit Players?

[Ghost]

3 hours ago, JacksonRooks said:

The only thing that would solve the game's population problem is to add more post 50 content. No amount of slowing leveling or nerfing powers is going to help at this point: Those horses have left the barn.

 

If the team was serious about actually getting people to play the game, they'd have spent 100% of their efforts on new zones, new story arcs, new missions, etc. Instead they create or proliferate a few mediocre power sets and waste time "rebalancing" things like TW and then make a shocked Pikachu face when people lose interest and leave. 

 

 

Do you think the small team of devs we have would be able to pump out new content fast enough to keep the players who left, from leaving?

 

There are some who experienced all the storylines/missions/TFs/arc on every alt imaginable, and then left.

I believe the majority who left due to lack of content, worked there way to 50 and said “done!”  These are the same people who go through 12-15 games a year because there only goal is to complete it.  It’s impossible to keep up with these types of individuals.

 

 

 

 

 

[Snarky]

2 hours ago, Ghost said:

 

 

Do you think the small team of devs we have would be able to pump out new content fast enough to keep the players who left, from leaving?

 

There are some who experienced all the storylines/missions/TFs/arc on every alt imaginable, and then left.

I believe the majority who left due to lack of content, worked there way to 50 and said “done!”  These are the same people who go through 12-15 games a year because there only goal is to complete it.  It’s impossible to keep up with these types of individuals.

 

 

 

 

 

I went to a museum with friends a few times.  I have studied art and done a few doodles and canvases.  I enjoy being in a museum. Being inspired, imagining what the artist was thinking as they created, beholding intricate techniques used to express concepts.  A lot of people just look at the stuff and want to go somewhere else.  I had one friend (a rather overweight fellow) who almost sprinted through the museum (with stairs!) reading off each artist and title he passed. I tediously kept up. glum at seeing a Picasso race past me like it was on a conveyor belt. 

 

Many folks treat the game the same way my friend thinking of the bar awaiting him outside treated the museum. They race through "all the content"  Bullshit, I have a completionist toon I am working, all 1-35 content done...still need 35-50, 40-50, and 45-50, and erm 50-50 to go.  I spent months doing the 1-35. Now a 50 he still has access to all the rest that 'needs' to be done.  That is a LOT.  People do some series of things they think are "enough" racing past the stuff, yelling out the names or badges, then say "Done!" as they exit.  Just Bullshit.  

 

But it is not how much content the game has.  There is a good amount.  It is whether the game meets the players needs.  For creativity, social interaction, problem solving, etc.  With a declining population we are always going to be on the downside of social possibilities.  But from a character creator and game content and mini games we do very well.  Especially the character design.  From costume to playstyle to powersets.  Always been top notch.

[Darmian]

8 hours ago, JacksonRooks said:

If the team was serious about actually getting people to play the game, they'd have spent 100% of their efforts on new zones, new story arcs, new missions, etc. Instead they create or proliferate a few mediocre power sets and waste time "rebalancing" things like TW and then make a shocked Pikachu face when people lose interest and leave. 

 

As anyone who has read any of my posts can verify I'm usually calm and restrained, but frankly this is nonsense.

[Neiska]

9 hours ago, JacksonRooks said:

If the team was serious about actually getting people to play the game, they'd have spent 100% of their efforts on new zones, new story arcs, new missions, etc. Instead they create or proliferate a few mediocre power sets and waste time "rebalancing" things like TW and then make a shocked Pikachu face when people lose interest and leave. 

 

Pretty callous attitude toward a small group of people who work solely for the pure joy of the game and sharing that joy with thousands of random strangers, entirely on their own time and entirely for free without so much as a dime in personal profit. Personally, I am ecstatic we get updates at all under such circumstances. Not sure who is making a shocked Pikachu face about people coming and going. I would say that is the normal state of affairs. 

[Ironblade]

9 hours ago, JacksonRooks said:

If the team was serious about actually getting people to play the game, they'd have spent 100% of their efforts on new zones, new story arcs, new missions, etc. Instead they create or proliferate a few mediocre power sets and waste time "rebalancing" things like TW and then make a shocked Pikachu face when people lose interest and leave. 

Well, if the team was being paid, maybe that would get prioritized.

And if they were being paid by YOU, they'd prioritize things according to your questionable wisdom.

But neither of those situations applies.

[Ruin Mage]

10 hours ago, JacksonRooks said:

The only thing that would solve the game's population problem is to add more post 50 content. No amount of slowing leveling or nerfing powers is going to help at this point: Those horses have left the barn.

 

If the team was serious about actually getting people to play the game, they'd have spent 100% of their efforts on new zones, new story arcs, new missions, etc. Instead they create or proliferate a few mediocre power sets and waste time "rebalancing" things like TW and then make a shocked Pikachu face when people lose interest and leave. 

The Aeon Strike Force + Challenge Settings say hello.

On the note of balance, creation, and proliferation; That is something even live did. All games have power balancing as part of their games. Things get buffed, tweaked, and even nerfed. WoW does it, GW2 does it, and I could go on. Even in single player games things can get changed. They can't commit an entire small team to a large task like new zones/arcs - that's not how you do things at all. But then again, you are an armchair developer who has no idea how this works.

I have doubts that HC is concerned majorly about population drops. They'll keep going no matter how small, and they seem to just hope that people enjoy what they do. A lot of this is wrangling spahgetti code & working with what tools they have on an ancient game. A reminder is due that CoH suddenly stopped in 2012, and its age really shows the more you look at things. 

Just because they're not developing content that you want does not mean they're lacking seriousness. You sound like an entitled child by spouting that.

[Troo]

6 hours ago, Ghost said:

There are some who experienced all the storylines/missions/TFs/arc on every alt imaginable, and then left.

 

I agree with your point. I disagree just with the above.. I would concede they played until they were bored or tried everything they wanted to.

 

10 hours ago, JacksonRooks said:

The only thing that would solve the game's population problem is to add more post 50 content. No amount of slowing leveling or nerfing powers is going to help at this point: Those horses have left the barn.

 

If the team was serious about actually getting people to play the game, they'd have spent 100% of their efforts on new zones, new story arcs, new missions, etc. Instead they create or proliferate a few mediocre power sets and waste time "rebalancing" things like TW and then make a shocked Pikachu face when people lose interest and leave. 

 

Hi.

You're not totally wrong.

There is an 'endgame' perspective that will never be rewarded by City of Heroes/Villains.

CoX is a story game, any content added at 50 or for incarnates is merely a continuation of the story.

See Veracor.. last count - 1581 badges, vet level 14,000 or something I don't even know anymore.

[The_Warpact]

I'll let you in on a secret, its people. They do what they want, they play what they want, etc.

I still have yet to do any content on blueside(other accolade related tfs) I went through once on gold, and I spend most of my time farming and trying different builds to tinker with.

So that being said I have a ton of stuff to do and I've been here since what I5? It falls to people, it might be too much to learn, or not what they thought, or a myriad of reasons. 

 

If there was company backing, paid staff, marketing, etc then yes, but, I will be here till the final bell tolls and then I will be.

 

 

[Troo]

8 minutes ago, The_Warpact said:

I'll let you in on a secret, its people. They do what they want, they play what they want, etc.

 

Agreed with the following caveat.

Folks only know what they know.

If all folks hear about are afk Mother Ship Raids are the best way to level. That's what they are going to do.

The game also has a puzzle aspect where we are challenged to come up with effective ways to do things. This leads to solutions that get shared and soon many are following.. FOTM-ism.

[Bionic_Flea]

8 minutes ago, Troo said:

The game also has a puzzle aspect where we are challenged to come up with effective ways to do things. This leads to solutions that get shared and soon many are following.. FOTM-ism.

This is very true, but it's also dependent on people's personalities.  I really like figuring out puzzles in the game, like how to run the newest TF, Trial, or Raid.  Others don't want to run the content until someone else has figured it out and told them how to do it.

[Neiska]

3 hours ago, Troo said:

The game also has a puzzle aspect where we are challenged to come up with effective ways to do things. This leads to solutions that get shared and soon many are following.. FOTM-ism.

 

I agree to a point. While there are certainly people who care not for theme, flavor, "fun", and only go for what is .0024% the most numerically superior in the majority of content, I would bet there are just as many people who use builds that are purely for fun, theme, how they look, or even how they play, or whatever other reason they happen to like a sub-optiomal build. Heck I have met a handfull of people who picked their AT's/Powers based entirely on how they looked visually. After some discussion they explained they are sort of a "story teller" for their SG, and run their own little roleplay in AEs/Bases and the like. And so they would take powers that gave them visual tools for that. Their choices weren't combat oriented at all, which I thought was a pretty awesome thing to see.

[Troo]

6 hours ago, Neiska said:

I agree to a point.

 

Sure.

I would include costume creation as a form of puzzle. Power customization could be. Anytime we are trying to dial in an aspect of the game it could be considered a puzzle. This is part of what makes the game engaging. We can self impose caring about some parts and not others.

[SaintD]

.....nothing. The game isn't even supposed to be running at all. The only reason it is, is because the lazy, uncaring suits filled with shit who closed it in the first place because it wasn't a perpetually growing exemplar of capitalist greed, also don't care enough to do much about us sitting here playing it.

You're not playing an independent functioning game, you're having lunch with a prisoner who just walks straight out a hole in the fence every day and the guards can't be bothered to deal with it because he comes back every time.

[wjrasmussen]

15 hours ago, Snarky said:

I went to a museum with friends a few times.  I have studied art and done a few doodles and canvases.  I enjoy being in a museum. Being inspired, imagining what the artist was thinking as they created, beholding intricate techniques used to express concepts.  A lot of people just look at the stuff and want to go somewhere else.  I had one friend (a rather overweight fellow) who almost sprinted through the museum (with stairs!) reading off each artist and title he passed. I tediously kept up. glum at seeing a Picasso race past me like it was on a conveyor belt. 

 

Many folks treat the game the same way my friend thinking of the bar awaiting him outside treated the museum. They race through "all the content"  Bullshit, I have a completionist toon I am working, all 1-35 content done...still need 35-50, 40-50, and 45-50, and erm 50-50 to go.  I spent months doing the 1-35. Now a 50 he still has access to all the rest that 'needs' to be done.  That is a LOT.  People do some series of things they think are "enough" racing past the stuff, yelling out the names or badges, then say "Done!" as they exit.  Just Bullshit.  

 

But it is not how much content the game has.  There is a good amount.  It is whether the game meets the players needs.  For creativity, social interaction, problem solving, etc.  With a declining population we are always going to be on the downside of social possibilities.  But from a character creator and game content and mini games we do very well.  Especially the character design.  From costume to playstyle to powersets.  Always been top notch.

Good points.

 

IMO, how about the devs release tools for us to build zones.  Then let the devs link the good zones into the game.

[Snarky]

7 hours ago, wjrasmussen said:

Good points.

 

IMO, how about the devs release tools for us to build zones.  Then let the devs link the good zones into the game.

Are bases the same as maps?  Because it would be mad cool to have dome if the best bases as backdrop for AE missions

[Pzn]

1 hour ago, Snarky said:

Are bases the same as maps?  Because it would be mad cool to have dome if the best bases as backdrop for AE missions

Ever since I saw all the cool bases people have made I've wanted this

[cranebump]

On 4/29/2022 at 12:55 AM, JacksonRooks said:

If the team was serious about actually getting people to play the game, they'd have spent 100% of their efforts on new zones, new story arcs, new missions, etc. 

 

The original post was about recruiting new players. Which means all the content would be automatically be new to them. 

 

Guess you you missed this obvious point in your rush to throw trash on the lawn for everyone else to pick up.

[Troo]

1 hour ago, cranebump said:

The original post was about recruiting new players. Which means all the content would be automatically be new to them. 

 

Bingo!

 

(I have been waiting to see this for 8-9 pages)

 

[Neiska]

11 hours ago, SaintD said:

.....nothing. The game isn't even supposed to be running at all. The only reason it is, is because the lazy, uncaring suits filled with shit who closed it in the first place because it wasn't a perpetually growing exemplar of capitalist greed, also don't care enough to do much about us sitting here playing it.

 

Have to disagree here, whole-heartedly. It was a multitude of issues at the time, not a bunch of greedy CEO bean counters as suggested. They were sued by marvel, had other side projects going on, and a whole host of other considerations.

 

Here is an older video that explains it pretty well - 

 

 

 

So please don't throw in "Capitalism BAD" into the discussion, especially when its untrue.

[Ukase]

So, let's take a step back and enter the wayback machine. 

In the old days, before the shut down, and before free to play...a new issues came ...how often? 

And let's be honest - how many of YOU left the game then, when you were paying for it every month because a full staff of paid developers couldn't keep up with your ability to go through content and new powersets, new zones, etc.? 

Can any of us actually be disappointed at the fantastic job the HC team has done? 

I will admit, I don't do well with change. Heck, when issue 4 hit, I was puzzled as to why they thought the game needed a change. They could have let it all as it was, would have been fine with me - like with no further changes to it, ever. 
You tell that to folks and they say, well, people will get tired of doing the same things over and over. And, I guess, now that I've got over 200 level 50's that are t-4'd, of which 80% of them leveled through content outside of the AE, I can see where folks would get tired of doing the same thing. 

But I have no expectations of our HC team. I sometimes wish they'd do less and not more. Badging is tedious! And when you have multiple badge characters, each time new badges are available, there's a lot to do - and some of it, it's damned tedious. But I digress. 

We have the game back. It may not have enough folks to suit you, but there's enough to do any content in game without waiting too long. Maybe not on your shard, but you can move shards easily and for free. You can't get any XP in an SG base, so just move to a busier shard. 

Two ways to increase player base: 
Retain the players that are here, and bring new players in. 
Some have said streaming is a way to bring in new players. Perhaps. 
Word of mouth has also been suggested. 

There's certainly not going to be any paid advertising, at least, not by the HC team. So, it is what it is. 
All any of us can do is what we're willing to do and able to do. 

I consider the matter closed, as everything else is just conjecture or opinions - which are all perfectly fine, but it's just you keeping you occupied when you could be doing something else - like playing the game. Maybe if we all spent less time typing, and more time playing, we wouldn't even be looking for more players. I dunno. Ha! Hypocritical of me with my post count! Anyways, I'm back in the game. 

Let's just give this a rest, and talk less about it and actually DO more. 

[Troo]

Streaming..

 

"Let's talk about Homecoming's City of Heroes"

 

wait "Elden Ring?!" wait "Starfield!?" "what were we talking about?"

[Cancrusher]

@Troo has it exactly right.  To the game stream junkies, City of Heroes is the old janky and the latest, greatest is the new shiny.  I'm not saying that streaming won't garner ANY interest or bring in ANY new players.  It's just that you're a little like Sisyphus trying to push his boulder up the hill here.  🤷‍♂️  

[cranebump]

I guess my contribution to this to ask a question: as I don't play the new shiny much (unless Neverwinter counts):-), I'd ask how user-friendly the game is. When I think about just all the chat tabs and menus, and other nice-to-know-but-won't-see-immediately (i.e., P2W vendors; exploration badges for quick AP merits, and such), I wonder how a new player, particularly one used to newer games, would perceive all this. I know I didn't know a damned thing about what I was doing when I first played. I took the train to KR when I was, like L3, and immediately got my ass canked by clockwork. Bounced around like a jackass trying to get away. Someone laughed in broadcast. It was a stunning display of ignorance. I rolled up another toon with a 3-slot in Sprint (bc, wtf not? I want to go faster!).:-)

 

I ended up playing through all that, and, of course, doing some research. It got better. Or rather, easier. Got to put in that time, baby. 

 

So, obviously, it takes a bit of time for the average dope like me. 

 

Which brings me to my question: what is the bar for entry right NOW? I would think, with everything unlocked early, it'd be fairly low. But things are so ingrained in me now, I can't put myself back to the moment where everything was brand-spankin' new. So...how user friendly are we? Even if we're not, is that really a barrier, at all? For me, selling points are:

 

-It's free gdit.

-Doesn't take much of a machine to run.

-A great community, overall.

-Play it how you want.

-it's free (did I mention that)

-You can fly through the damned sky at low levels. Like, just fly (friend of mine played this a little with me, before disappearing to other stuff, and that was his main comment-"wow!I can fly!").

 

Oh, yeah...it's free...(and, like, no in-game BS purchases.)

 

(pst...FREE! [and awesome]).

 

 

 

Edited April 30, 2022 by cranebump

[Bill Z Bubba]

7 hours ago, Ukase said:

And let's be honest - how many of YOU left the game then, when you were paying for it every month because a full staff of paid developers couldn't keep up with your ability to go through content and new powersets, new zones, etc.? 

 

I only quit when the devs made decisions that pissed me off. Not playing out of burnout/boredom appears to be a new thing.

 

7 hours ago, Ukase said:

Can any of us actually be disappointed at the fantastic job the HC team has done? 

 

Sure! But I can still be incredibly grateful to them all while still being annoyed at decisions they make.

 

7 hours ago, Ukase said:

Let's just give this a rest, and talk less about it and actually DO more. 

 

I don't really feel the need to do anything. I don't care about the player population. I have an SG I run with and a team of devs that are gonna do what they do as long as they want to and I can either roll with it while enjoying some good game related arguments, go elsewhere or just let it go. If the devs ever let us know that they're gonna let it go, hopefully they'll give us some tips on setting up our own instances and we'll do so or not.

[Haijinx]

I feel like we have had 20 years of being overhammered by Super Hero Movies and TV shows.  And that can't be good for COX.

 

The traditional MMO has also faded a lot.  Outside of WOW that is.  WoW basically walmarted its competition. 

 

And even WOW has declined in playrrbase.

 

Newer MMOs are different.

 

Maybe we should all move to one server and hope enough occasional log ons keep it alive for longer.