"Toxic" Community?.. My thoughts, feel free to add your own!

[Solarverse]

1 hour ago, jubakumbi said:

 

What I see in COH is a bunch of humans that might be old enough to be (and possibly are) parents and grandparents, still acting like elemetary school children, because they have not progressed emotionally past the point of the playground, with cliches and secret groups and deranged outlooks.

 

Even funnier, I hardly ever run across a toxic player. Extremely rare, and my favorite thing to do in this game is PUG.  I don't think there are anywhere near as many of these toxic players as some are lead to believe. And this whole tribal thing...I don't see much of that either.

[Coyotedancer]

The insular-group thing definitely happens... But that was as true back in the live days as it is now, and isn't in any way limited to the City world.

 

Humans are troupe primates. Like every other related species, we're all about hierarchies and the boundaries between in-groups ("us") and out-groups ("them"). It's just a part of who and what we are, so the behavior and social constructs are damned near universal. So... no way a multiplayer video game was ever going to be free of that. No human group interaction ever really is. 

[jubakumbi]

29 minutes ago, Solarverse said:

Even funnier, I hardly ever run across a toxic player. Extremely rare, and my favorite thing to do in this game is PUG.  I don't think there are anywhere near as many of these toxic players as some are lead to believe. And this whole tribal thing...I don't see much of that either.

 

I have not encountered a single HC player that ruined my fun.

I don't PUG much beyond DFB to get started and the ToT groups though and I turn off all Global chats.

 

I only see these arguments in online discussions.

 

There are always people that are out to troll other players, but that's just life.

 

So when I say 'see in COH' I probably should say 'see in the commentary around COH' to be clear.

In-game, I have nothing but fun because it's so easy to avoind the trolls and toxic players because of the base code design.

[Solarverse]

12 minutes ago, jubakumbi said:

 

 

So when I say 'see in COH' I probably should say 'see in the commentary around COH' to be clear.

In-game, I have nothing but fun because it's so easy to avoind the trolls and toxic players because of the base code design.

Exactly!

[Sovera]

In a game with the ignore function 'toxic' people have exactly as much power as we are willing to give it to them. This includes refusing to use the teleport prompt function.

[DawL]

On 10/12/2020 at 3:56 PM, Solarverse said:

Just to be clear, for anyone unfamiliar with Twixt, he conducted a social experiment using CoH as his subjects for his experiment and then wrote a thesis on the subject of how players form their own rules, and then expect others to abide by those rules, even if they are not any real rules or restrictions of the game. Just so everyone knows, this was not a call out against the player known as Twixt, it was simply relevant. As far as I know, Twixt is not currently playing this server and it is questionable as to whether or not he is even still alive, as he was in his 60's I believe when he played during live and if memory serves, he quit playing the game long before it shut down.

If you wish to read up on his work, all you need to do is cross reference CoH with Twixt and the information is an easy find. Even if you do not agree with his views and how he conducted his experiments (the way he went about it stirred quite the controversy) the read is quite interesting nonetheless.

I just wanted to clear that up in case anyone unfamiliar with Twixt felt that I was calling out players. That was not the intent.

Wow!  I did a quick search and yeah, this Twixt guy fits the definition of toxic. I daresay his calling his behaviour "research" or "experiments" is about the weakest excuse I have ever heard anyone use for being a complete and utter jerk (and griefing). I don't know how I missed this back then, as I was a pretty hardcore player at that time. Anyone know what server he played on? I played a lot in Warburg on my ill/emp (loved launching those rockets!). I have a lot of screenshots of her (Azazela) and my main, DawL, having fun in Siren's Call as well. Yeah, we did chat a lot with the villains, and team with them. I remember a certain stalker who was getting jumped repeatedly by a small group of heroes (I don't recall anyone named Twixt though) and Az promptly TP-Foe'd him into the hero hospital next to the rezzers, and told him to wait....after all, revenge is best served cold... *evil grin*.  (Somewhere I have screenshots of a group of villains throwing a party in the hero hospital in Siren's, LOL.) But it was all in fun and we were never mean about it. From what the Reddit thread (of 11 years ago) shows, the guy knew what he was doing and talked smack to those he was doing it to.  😞

The bottom line was, we KNEW we weren't really HEROES, and we also understood that those we played *with* weren't really VILLAINS. Repeatedly feeding someone to the drones, or the NPCs is frustrating and NOT good for the community and thus the game. The goal is for players to enjoy playing together and keep coming back, not rage-quit and uninstall the game. I think that's why this game has for YEARS had the best gaming community I have ever witnessed - because most of the players are more into teaming than anything and we enjoy helping each other. And that just feels good!

I am really surprised that this person's "research" was published (if indeed it was published as actual research) when he apparently didn't bother to let his subjects know they were participating. At least in medicine and psych, informed consent is a requirement. Highly unethical to do otherwise. I can't imagine going online and agitating people on purpose then authoring a paper on how they reacted. Bad form, bad ethics, and IMHO, bad person. I guess I am glad I either didn't know or don't remember this guy.

[DawL]

On 5/30/2019 at 12:53 AM, Healix said:

" You must remember that this game is nothing more than an electronic version of an elementary school playground; it is full of good kids, bad kids, bullies, cheaters, and whiners."

That could apply to just the Internet at large.

[Solarverse]

24 minutes ago, DawL said:

 Anyone know what server he played on?

He played on 3 different servers, and pulled the same crap on each one. I can't remember what servers he started on, but he landed himself on Freedom server...and that is when the real hell broke lose, because that was the unoffocial PvP server, and we weren't having it.  lol.

[DawL]

4 minutes ago, Solarverse said:

He played on 3 different servers, and pulled the same crap on each one. I can't remember what servers he started on, but he landed himself on Freedom server...and that is when the real hell broke lose, because that was the unoffocial PvP server, and we weren't having it.  lol.

Ahh. I was on Liberty. Wasn't ever a serious PvPer.  But good on the folks of Freedom for not putting up with him.

[Solarverse]

1 hour ago, DawL said:

Ahh. I was on Liberty. Wasn't ever a serious PvPer.  But good on the folks of Freedom for not putting up with him.

Oh, he dealt the same antics to Freedom as well, but they did manage to catch him out and recorded him once. I think there is a video of some people on Freedom laying it to him somewhere online. I wasn't there. I just stayed clear of the hero base when he came around. It was a no win situation since I lost my droning resist shield somewhere, lol. If I seen his name I jsut kept out of his TP distance.

[UltraAlt]

I see some problem players, but ignore seems to clear that up pretty quick.

I don't like to over use it. I used to have to use it on gold farmers all the time.

 

I don't know the kind of game exposure that others have run into.

The /shout chat in DCUO is out-of-hand. I have never run into such toxic chat in all my years of online gaming (starting way back with text-chat gaming RPGs on Compuserve). What politics, racism, gender phobia, etc? They have it all over there out in the open on chat.

Want to argue about if the Earth is flat or not? You'll love the chat over there.

 

THE CITY is a special place and there are a lot of haters out there. I honestly think that they have to throw hate on it because of how great we really get along with each other.

 

If  you are looking for grief in THE CITY,  you must be going out of your way to look for or you are the kind of person that is a magnet for it (probably due to your behavior).

Good people do get in bad positions, but it is so easy in this game to avoid those that you don't want to interact with .. and there as so many people that are positive to interact with.

 

I am so glad that THE CITY is back.

I honestly think it is better now than when I stopped subscribing a year before the Sunset because I didn't like the direction the game was going.

[_NOPE_]

11 hours ago, DawL said:

Ahh. I was on Liberty. Wasn't ever a serious PvPer.  But good on the folks of Freedom for not putting up with him.

lolPvP

[Llewellyn Blackwell]

I am actually surprised so many in here seem to think the community so friendly. I mean have you seen the kind of vitriol that gets directed at users of KB power sets? I mean hell when I am on my PB or my energy blaster, I can literally be standing around semi afk adn get random tells saying I should delete those toons and never use any KB sets unless I want to only solo and end up on everyones ignore list. Like seriously I get random tells from the anti kb faction in game like that literally while not actively playing or even being familiar with the names of the toons /global rando PMing me. Ive heard some similar things from MM friends who say they frequently get told things like just quit the game if you need the game to play itself while you watch, and other such trash talk simply for playing a minion using class.

[Twisted Toon]

26 minutes ago, Llewellyn Blackwell said:

I am actually surprised so many in here seem to think the community so friendly. I mean have you seen the kind of vitriol that gets directed at users of KB power sets? I mean hell when I am on my PB or my energy blaster, I can literally be standing around semi afk adn get random tells saying I should delete those toons and never use any KB sets unless I want to only solo and end up on everyones ignore list. Like seriously I get random tells from the anti kb faction in game like that literally while not actively playing or even being familiar with the names of the toons /global rando PMing me. Ive heard some similar things from MM friends who say they frequently get told things like just quit the game if you need the game to play itself while you watch, and other such trash talk simply for playing a minion using class.

Are you sure its not because you're wearing plaid with bright orange pants or something?

[Llewellyn Blackwell]

23 hours ago, Coyotedancer said:

The insular-group thing definitely happens... But that was as true back in the live days as it is now, and isn't in any way limited to the City world.

 

Humans are troupe primates. Like every other related species, we're all about hierarchies and the boundaries between in-groups ("us") and out-groups ("them"). It's just a part of who and what we are, so the behavior and social constructs are damned near universal. So... no way a multiplayer video game was ever going to be free of that. No human group interaction ever really is. 

Uhm you know that is in no way considered the soul theory among the anthropological and social anthropological communities right? In fact I tend to lean towards the views and theories that humans are as atypical as we are in the world because we dont follow the same social behaviors we see in animals closely akin to us. This is actually somewhat supported just by our physical form. The way male and female stand, and expose aspects of ourselves when nude, are very very different in form and function compared with every single primate we know of, and now days when the old term "missing link " gets used, that is actually what they are talking about mainly, the mysterious and very difficult to explain transition from male primates that keep hunched over to help protect their private bits, and human females by walking upright are well obviously far less exposed and accessible for mating purposes when compared to well how female chimps, baboons, etc are when in heat basically flashing a come and get it sign for potential mates.

 

It has lead to no few theories( as in actual science rated theory) that what we think of as unique human traits like language, complex society, and possibly many other things we tend to think of as part of the human animals soul domain, may well be the tools proto humanoid primates are the first developers of, and it was that which lead to our evolution into this strange animal so unlike all others on our world in form and function.

 

In the fields that study human education, and development, no few suggest that those who tend to gather up and follow others are simply a product of poor education. That the more someone knows, and is empowered by that knowledge, the less likely they are to follow someone who shows less ability and knowledge. We can actually see this kind of example of social behavior in all sorts of childrens groups like the boy scouts. I myself recall as a wee lad in such a group, that because of my family being very active campers and outdoorsfolk I was the kind of 5 year old parents trusted to carry a proper fixed blade bush knife( practically a short sword when your a wee lad) and waterproof matches when we went camping just in case. So naturally as someone very familiar with camping etc, when my scout group went on its first camping group, I instead of sitting around watching and listening to the scout leader went off and found a good spot I cleared of stones etc, laid down a light plastic tarp then set up my small tent , and then while still being basically on my own because the scout leader never noticed I had gone off on my own, I then built a small camp fire a few feet from my tent by first digging a small pit using my knife as my war vet father had taught me when I was like 3 or 4, pulled out my home made tinder kit my mom a girl scout from the state of washington had taught me to make using simple cotton balls and vaseline, to get even the damp kindling I had gathered to stay burning long enough to dry out and then kept feeding small bits to.

 

I actually ended up being kicked out of the scouts for all this, because I wasnt being a good little scout following the scout leader. I learned then at that young age, that those who see themselves as leaders due to false authority hate and cast out even children who wont fall into line for them. Lucky for me I had only joined them to hang out with my best friend who was in them, and not because it was anything close to my only outdoors outlet. Hell where I lived in Oregon growing up, my back yard was a literal forest with the odd bear and wolf pack calling them home, and the only rule my folks had for me going out alone was to wear a bright orange hoody, and carry a whistle around my neck on a string to blow in response to my folks whistle to signal I heard and was heading home.

 

Its likely why I really am blown away and baffled by how incapable so many children at that age seem to me. I tend to gravitate towards a very eastern view of children, which is that by the age of 8 or so, they should basically be mini adults when it comes to looking after themselves.

[Llewellyn Blackwell]

4 minutes ago, Twisted Toon said:

Are you sure its not because you're wearing plaid with bright orange pants or something?

Well I did once have a big biker looking furry in the D trash talk my guy for wearing a black dress shirt and black slacks, like I guess he didnt like I was chatting it up with a cute fox girl at the time and just was trying to start trouble to be disruptive, but that is literally the only time I can think of I had the appearance of any of my toons trash talked.

 

More often then not I get compliments, not like CC winning levels, but for example my PB skylord is RPed as being part of Vanguard, so he has several outfits with a t shirt or tank top in vanguard colors with the logo on the short, and we are talking literally that simple, t shirt, pants/jeans black/purple/grey color schemes and the vanguard logo and that somehow gets me a complimentary tell or two when I am afking at atlas almost every time I do it.  Or my main llew who generally gets compared to either as in my display pic Paul Rudd, or John Wick, usually in a positive tone.

[tidge]

51 minutes ago, Llewellyn Blackwell said:

I am actually surprised so many in here seem to think the community so friendly. I mean have you seen the kind of vitriol that gets directed at users of KB power sets? I mean hell when I am on my PB or my energy blaster, I can literally be standing around semi afk adn get random tells saying I should delete those toons and never use any KB sets unless I want to only solo and end up on everyones ignore list. Like seriously I get random tells from the anti kb faction in game like that literally while not actively playing or even being familiar with the names of the toons /global rando PMing me. Ive heard some similar things from MM friends who say they frequently get told things like just quit the game if you need the game to play itself while you watch, and other such trash talk simply for playing a minion using class.

The best that you can do is demonstrate to other players that you can use powers with KB that don't necessarily detract from their play. I've had many non-KB toons specifically take the P2W Plasmatic Taser attack (with KB) and use in in PUG to demonstrate how an AoE KB can be used to group enemies.

 

I've seen a LOT of hate directed at users of Group Fly, and if no one else says it I'll be the one to point out that a trip to Null the Gull can address that specific issue.

[Grouchybeast]

1 hour ago, Llewellyn Blackwell said:

I am actually surprised so many in here seem to think the community so friendly. I mean have you seen the kind of vitriol that gets directed at users of KB power sets? I mean hell when I am on my PB or my energy blaster, I can literally be standing around semi afk adn get random tells saying I should delete those toons and never use any KB sets unless I want to only solo and end up on everyones ignore list. Like seriously I get random tells from the anti kb faction in game like that literally while not actively playing or even being familiar with the names of the toons /global rando PMing me.

So, my duo partner and I have a new pair of characters, my Ill/Storm controller and their Storm/Energy defender.  We've been spending a lot of time hanging around in Atlas, running tip missions.  My character's bio literally says 'I slot for Knockback'.  Would you like to guess how many random tells about KB we've accumulated between us?  I'll give you a clue: it's somewhere between nought and zero.

[LordBlackhole]

Most of these games urinalists post bs for clickbait. The reason I came back to this game is the community is famous for being both welcoming to new players, easy going and the game still holds up after all these years. Good lore too. 

[Coyotedancer]

4 hours ago, Llewellyn Blackwell said:

Uhm you know that is in no way considered the soul theory among the anthropological and social anthropological communities right?

You do know that my academic background is in Anthropology, right? (Historical Ethnology specifically-)... 'Have the economically-useless university degrees and everything. 😝

 

There are no absolute universals when it comes to human behavior, but some underlying patterns are reasonably well established. The fact that we're pretty typical of troupe primates in more ways than some of us might be comfortable with hasn't really been up for debate in... well, decades, honestly. That strong preference for in-group/out-group social constructs and for forming hierarchies within and between discreet groups that I mentioned? Social Psychologists figured that one out long before the evolutionary types got in on it.

 

Anyway, a real throw down on the good, the bad and the ugly of evolutionary psychology and exactly how it relates to ourselves and our primate cousins is pretty well outside the scope of a thread about dealing with assholes and blow-hards in a superhero MMO. If anyone is really interested, there have been reams written on the subject. 

[_NOPE_]

Relevant:

 

[Coyotedancer]

Guess I should have just ignored BB's lecture instead of replying. 🤣

 

I just thought it was funny he was trying to lecture me on that particular topic, given what I spent my college days doing.  Sorry to have contributed to spamming up the thread. 

 

 

 

Edited October 14, 2020 by Coyotedancer

[_NOPE_]

3 minutes ago, Coyotedancer said:

Guess I should have just ignored BB's lecture instead of replying. 🤣

 

I just thought it was funny he was trying to lecture me on that particular topic, given what I spent my college days doing.  Sorry to have contributed to spamming up the thread. 

 

 

 

See, here's the thing though, you don't know who this person is on the other end of the keyboard. While "defending yourself", you could actually be speaking to someone that has a doctorate in the field and is active on the college lecture circuit... YOU DON'T KNOW!!! 😮

 

"Appeal to Authority" is a logical fallacy for a reason - because it doesn't matter if you're currently studying something, or even have that proposed doctorate. What matters is the truth of the statements you put out, not who you are. As soon as you jump to referencing yourself and your own "cred", you've immediately made the conversation personal. That's never a good direction to go, TRUST me.

 

That is nothing but a Path of Tears, my friend.

[Coyotedancer]

2 minutes ago, The Philotic Knight said:

See, here's the thing though, you don't know who this person is on the other end of the keyboard. While "defending yourself", you could actually be speaking to someone that has a doctorate in the field and is active on the college lecture circuit... YOU DON'T KNOW!!! 😮

 

"Appeal to Authority" is a logical fallacy for a reason - because it doesn't matter if you're currently studying something, or even have that proposed doctorate. What matters is the truth of the statements you put out, not who you are. As soon as you jump to referencing yourself and your own "cred", you've immediately made the conversation personal. That's never a good direction to go, TRUST me.

 

That is nothing but a Path of Tears, my friend.

 

Maybe so... but like I said, I thought it was funny. I thought it was worth telling him WHY.

[cranebump]

7 hours ago, Llewellyn Blackwell said:

I am actually surprised so many in here seem to think the community so friendly. I mean have you seen the kind of vitriol that gets directed at users of KB power sets? I mean hell when I am on my PB or my energy blaster, I can literally be standing around semi afk adn get random tells saying I should delete those toons and never use any KB sets unless I want to only solo and end up on everyones ignore list. Like seriously I get random tells from the anti kb faction in game like that literally while not actively playing or even being familiar with the names of the toons /global rando PMing me. Ive heard some similar things from MM friends who say they frequently get told things like just quit the game if you need the game to play itself while you watch, and other such trash talk simply for playing a minion using class.

I’ll run with any powerset, anytime. @cranebump. Hit me up if you’re on Excel ir Everlast.