Should folks who contribute get something extra?

[Troo]

Should folks who contribute get something?

 

I have no problem with the current system. This is merely a question/suggestion/discussion topic.

We all get to play. Not everyone donates, remembers to, or can donate. Again, I have no problem with the current funding system.

 

When putting $$ into a kickstarter there is often something extra provided.

 

One could suggest those donating to Homecoming are helping keep the lights on and funding ongoing development.

Yes, it is a donation with no expectation.

However, I would guess if we shutdown the day after a donation window, a good faith effort would be made to return unused funds.

 

[Rudra]

1 minute ago, Troo said:

Should folks who contribute get something?

No. And a very good reason why is 1 you give. Because not everyone that wants to donate gets to, often because the donation window closes from reaching their target before that person can do so. It's a donation driven system. Players give because they want the game to stay available. Adding rewards for doing so changes the reason for doing so. And lends itself to players expecting to be able to dictate how the game develops even if explicitly stated that is not and will never be the case.

[Ghost]

1 hour ago, Troo said:

Should folks who contribute get something?

 

I have no problem with the current system. This is merely a question/suggestion/discussion topic.

We all get to play. Not everyone donates, remembers to, or can donate. Again, I have no problem with the current funding system.

 

When putting $$ into a kickstarter there is often something extra provided.

 

One could suggest those donating to Homecoming are helping keep the lights on and funding ongoing development.

Yes, it is a donation with no expectation.

However, I would guess if we shutdown the day after a donation window, a good faith effort would be made to return unused funds.

 

Like what are you thinking?

A badge? I’d have no issue with this.

 

Actual say in development?  Heck no.

[Frozen Burn]

1 hour ago, Troo said:

Should folks who contribute get something?

 

I have no problem with the current system. This is merely a question/suggestion/discussion topic.

We all get to play. Not everyone donates, remembers to, or can donate. Again, I have no problem with the current funding system.

 

When putting $$ into a kickstarter there is often something extra provided.

 

One could suggest those donating to Homecoming are helping keep the lights on and funding ongoing development.

Yes, it is a donation with no expectation.

However, I would guess if we shutdown the day after a donation window, a good faith effort would be made to return unused funds.

 

 

No.  We are already being given the game for our donations.  Without the donations, there is no game. 

 

Also, this is not really a kickstarter - it's already up and running and is now more of a non-profit model.  We donate to keep the lights on and game alive, with no other expectations.  Yes, sometimes non-profits will give donors swag or such to honor their donation, but it's also generally an easy and cheap way to market the org to bring awareness to the cause and hopefully get more donations.  But I do not believe we should be getting tee shirts, hats, pens, or such.  A one-time in game account-wide badge is all I believe might be okay - but even then, as much as I love badges, I am not a fan of this as this isn't something that would help market / bring awareness to the public about the game (and thusly more new players), and is only for internal bragging rights - which I despise.  

 

Additionally, as any non-profit, any funds over the monthly donation goal go into a pot to be used for those times when donations are lighter than expected to make up for the deficit, or for building the game out more.  Perhaps our volunteer devs need a new bit of software that would improve the game, or they need to hire a temp coder / animator for a specific project to move the game forward - the surplus funds could go to that too.  

 

But you seem to know all this already.  However, even if there is a surplus of funds, non-profits do not give funding back.  It is saved and used for its intended purpose or for expanding/growing, which I think we all want that with this game.  The only time a non-profit may give funds back is when the org shuts down / closes for good - only then would they give funding back.

 

Honestly, I'm quite offended and embarrassed by your post and ask.  I am sure you didn't mean any harm, but having spent most of my career in the non-profit sector, this hurts my heart to see someone asking for something more in return for their donation.  💔 

[Lunar Ronin]

As someone who has donated a substantial amount of money to Homecoming... No thank you.  I got what I paid for, just by Homecoming continuing to exist.

[Laucianna]

What about those who donate their time when it comes to running things in game? I can't donate real money due to IRL money issues and one of the biggest draws to Homecoming is the fact it's free, in exchange I donate a lot of my time to run content in the game to keep it alive that way and this suggestion would feel to me like Homecoming stating "This person is more important to keeping the game active and running."

So for that reason I am very against this idea sadly.

[Triumphant]

While I'm not against it personally (even though I am too poor to donate, myself), I worry about the optics of it.  This as a not-for-profit hobby project and it works very well that way.  I would be concerned with how it might be viewed if a rewards for donations model were to be adopted.

[seebs]

i don't know the exact terms, but i'd guess that the "you mustn't run it to bring in money" agreement with ncsoft might also cover things that look like allowing people to pay for literally anything at all. like, even the most marginal of cosmetics being given in exchange for money might be a Problem.

[Ghost]

@Troo

 

we need to have a word with you about this 

 

[Yomo Kimyata]

6 hours ago, Troo said:

Should folks who contribute get something?

 

I have no problem with the current system. This is merely a question/suggestion/discussion topic.

We all get to play. Not everyone donates, remembers to, or can donate. Again, I have no problem with the current funding system.

 

When putting $$ into a kickstarter there is often something extra provided.

 

One could suggest those donating to Homecoming are helping keep the lights on and funding ongoing development.

Yes, it is a donation with no expectation.

However, I would guess if we shutdown the day after a donation window, a good faith effort would be made to return unused funds.

 

 

I think you should shut this thought process down.

 

I do not agree with a lot of the things the current theocracy does.  And that's fine.  They kept the game hidden, and then they revealed the game, and then they made a pact with the owners of the intellectual property.  These are all things I understand, and somewhat appreciate.  And they do exactly what they want to do:  not what the majority wants, not what the strongest wants, not what the weakest wants.  They put in the sweat equity and if they want to give tankers +100% damage, that's up to them because if I don't like it I can stop playing.

 

But if you or anyone else wants to tie some sort of pay-for-play garbage into this, I will actively stop it with everything I've got.  I don't give every month, but I give a lot to the game and community.

 

So no.  I don't say that as someone who has any influence on the matter.  But I do say that as someone who knows how the system works.  Very well.

[FupDup]

The most I could see is a badge and/or different color name title in-game and/or forums. No exclusive powers or extra leverage in affecting content/balancing or such. 

 

And as Lauci said there's also non-monetary ways to contribute. Hosting stuff like Hami Raids, MSRs, etc. is a legitimately valuable service to the community. 

[Greycat]

No.

[Troo]

10 hours ago, Frozen Burn said:

Honestly, I'm quite offended and embarrassed by your post and ask.

 

You're gonna be okay.

 

6 hours ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

But if you or anyone else wants to tie some sort of pay-for-play garbage into this

 

My thoughts hadn't really gone right to pay-for-play, I can see the concern there. I was thinking more along the lines of a real badge rather than an in-game badge or a one day heads up if something was about to hit Beta or drop on live. Figuring someone might have a good idea or something fun.. you got me.

 

@Frozen Burn My ask was simply if peeps had input (ideas or concerns). So, thanks.

@Ghost Who doesn't enjoy the occasional riot..

[biostem]

Then the issue becomes "Joe donated $1 and got the same reward as me, who donated $100".  Maybe a badge that says "I donated to Homecoming and all I got was this badge".  😛

[Glacier Peak]

Bug Hunter - they already hand that badge out plenty. Do you want another?

 

There's "Beta Tester" that a player can be awarded on the beta server if that's something a player wants. 

Edited June 24 by Glacier Peak

[Bionic_Flea]

19 hours ago, Troo said:

Should folks who contribute get something?

 

No.

[Oklahoman]

16 hours ago, Laucianna said:

What about those who donate their time when it comes to running things in game? I can't donate real money due to IRL money issues and one of the biggest draws to Homecoming is the fact it's free, in exchange I donate a lot of my time to run content in the game to keep it alive that way and this suggestion would feel to me like Homecoming stating "This person is more important to keeping the game active and running."

So for that reason I am very against this idea sadly.

 

This.

 

I don't think we need to incentivize donating money - at least not yet. Seems like the donation window still closes pretty fast, and there are plenty of people who would donate if they could but they just don't get the chance. There may come a day where that needs to be revisited, but I hope not in my lifetime.

 

Plus, we are theoretically a non-profit. If there are "goods or services" given in exchange for a monetary donation (beyond just keeping the lights on) I wonder how that would impact us. I'm not sure how the non-profit laws would apply wherever we happen be registered.

 

I *do* think there would be a benefit to the community to incentivize the leading of groups. Badges are the easy place to go with that - you lead 10 successful BAFs and you get "Conqueror of BAF" or something like that. There are maybe other ways to incentivize leading such as bonus XP/inf/other rewards upon completion for the leader. Something along those lines would be something I would support.

[lemming]

Definitely in the "Heck No" category.

 

I used to develop and moderate for a free game that took in donations for operating expenses.     A couple of the "big" donors got upset with a few of the other players and demanded I ban them because they paid money.  The other players had figured out some legal game ways to do some stuff that was a surprising strategy, but only worked if you assumed it didn't exist...

 

Let's just say the amount of abuse heaped on the developers for not doing what they were told was quite something.

[Captain Fabulous]

/powercreep

[Troo]

12 hours ago, biostem said:

Maybe a badge that says "I donated to Homecoming and all I got was this badge".  😛

 

I've had worst ideas.

[Jack Spanky]

On 6/23/2024 at 1:26 PM, Troo said:

Should folks who contribute get something?

 

They are getting something -- the satisfaction of knowing they're helping to keep alive a wonderful communal game that, by all rights, should have gone extinct twelve years ago. What else is required, or desired?

[agentx5]

Uh... No... Sorry @Troo This is a strong NO to this idea from me as well.  I'm not sure why you thought this would be a good suggestion when you wrote it up on this past Sunday afternoon.

Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it, as the saying goes.  Putting people pedestals never turns out well, even if they are good people that are resistant to prideful corruption.  I can only emphasize for what @lemming must have went through with that, as I've experienced similar stuff myself decades ago (omg has it really been that long ago?  ugh I feel old now...)

I also 100% agree with @Laucianna.  I feel that what you get out of a game community is what you put into it, and no that doesn't necessarily have to be money.  We can each contribute in our own way whether that's helping teach a newcomer the ropes, running raids or leagues regularly, building bases, running costume contests, serving as a community rep or game master, etc etc etc... It's all done for the love of the game.  And that's really amazing and precious when you think about it!  Financial donations is one of many ways somebody can step up for the community. 
 

I've see plenty of game servers out there in all sorts of games (Minecraft especially comes to mind) that just sit empty almost all of the time until somebody eventually pulls the plug to put the ghost town server out of its misery.  There's money sure, but no players to play with.  So yeah, people who can maybe on ever afford small amounts to donate can still make a big impact on the community's activeness and quality; just as much as those who do donate various financial amounts to keep the servers online.

 

What we have going here is like breath a fresh air in the current status quo of much of the gaming industry out there.  So please don't fart in the breeze! 😜

[Troo]

23 hours ago, agentx5 said:

I'm not sure why you thought this would be a good suggestion when you wrote it up on this past Sunday afternoon.

 

Hey, I am pretty sure I distanced myself from the suggestion from the get go. I definitely was not committed to it being a 'good suggestion'.

C'est la vie

 

I do believe recognition is important, so the idea resonated with me. I don't mind putting an idea out there and getting feedback.

Motivational stuff can be tricky. Not all folks are motivated in the same way. Recognition can bring teams or groups together, it can elevate participation, it can also divide and isolate.

 

On 6/23/2024 at 4:31 PM, Laucianna said:

What about those who donate their time when it comes to running things in game?

 

If there was some form of recognition for running things in game would that be okay?

I'm not bothered if folks got some recognition.

[Laucianna]

2 hours ago, Troo said:

If there was some form of recognition for running things in game would that be okay?

I would say no personally, this whole server, community, and game is one big passion project to keep it running, from both the homecoming team and the players keeping it alive and because of that it has one of the best communities I have ever experienced in gaming, once you start gifting special rewards (Be it in titles or perks) it takes away from that community as you have the two tiers of people who have donated money/time, and those who haven't. Personally I like the game having it's one tier of player base as no one is higher up then others (Despite what some may claim)

[Ghost]

+4x8 km ITF forming.  Must have “Donators” Badge.  Hit me up 🙂