Patch Notes for February 25th, 2020 (Issue 26, Page 5 - Build 1)

[MagicSquid2]

You guys need to rethink dark consumption. If I'm full on endurance, which I should be if I'm firing off a power that does increased damage based on my endurance, then I don't need it to be capable of draining endurance as well.

 

Also, I don't like the way this game is going as far as tankers having increased aoe capabilities.

[Brutal Justice]

 

1 hour ago, Replacement said:

This is not how development works.

I agree but increasing damage all over the board is not healthy for the game.  If a set has great utility it shouldn’t sport equal damage to less utility sets.  

 

The reason damage is being increased acrossed the board, to try to help sets, is because it’s already completely out of control.  At this point, adding utility does nothing for sets because damage is already overwhelming and utility is more or less pointless.  

 

There are sets that are really suffering in this environment and still, increasing damage is the focus.  Increasing damage pushes those sets farther into the grave.  Oil slick arrow is awesome, except when mobs are dead before you can even light it.  

 

Incremental increases is how avalanches happen.  Eventually it hits a threshold and nothing can be done but be overwhelmed.  We are stuck in an avalanche of damage, and utility, crowd control, aggro management, anything other than damage is just debris along for the ride. 

Edited February 25, 2020 by Mr.Sinister
Had a double quote for some reason. Stupid phone

[Blackfeather]

1 minute ago, Mr.Sinister said:

Incremental increases is how avalanches happen.  Eventually it hits a threshold and nothing can be done but be overwhelmed.  We are stuck in an avalanche of damage, and utility, crowd control, aggro management, anything other than damage is just debris along for the ride.

I do kind of feel that way sometimes, especially in later stages of the game - excessive amounts of damage can make other, more supportive powers less fun to play. I know there's a joke about the best debuff being dead...but I'm sure there's a lot of people out there who'd disagree with that.

[Bolt of Purity]

3 hours ago, Captain Powerhouse said:

 

Dark melee was first because it was the easiest to adjust as it had powers that could simply be buffed for AoE. Martial Arts and Energy Melee are also due AoE buffs but those are harder since they only have one AoE power and the Stalker versions have nothing, so it will require fancier special mechanics or blurring the cottage rule a bit.

I personally like the ST nature of EM on my Stalker, we don't need all the sets to be AoE capable if they're ST focused. Sure the meta is heading towards AoE everything but I reckon make the ST sets more ST focused with slightly higher dmg and leave the AoE ones AoE focused with varying flavours in between...especially for stalkers, the ST kings.

That said, Total Focus would be nice with some splash dmg like Electric's Thunder Strike but the best improvement to EM would be to put ET back to it's old version 😉

 

Thanks for these changes BTW, loving the direction Homecoming is going in 👍

Edited February 25, 2020 by Bolt of Purity
typo's

[12thPower]

Since Shadow Maul is being given a pass, can the self-root be removed, finally? That's what really hurts it.

[ScarySai]

1 hour ago, MagicSquid2 said:

You guys need to rethink dark consumption. If I'm full on endurance, which I should be if I'm firing off a power that does increased damage based on my endurance, then I don't need it to be capable of draining endurance as well.

 

Also, I don't like the way this game is going as far as tankers having increased aoe capabilities.

You need to rethink this post: If you need endurance, you can use dark consumption to get your endurance back.

 

If you're fine on endurance but Dark Consumption is just sitting there off CD, it can now be used as a nuke. It's risk/reward, and for most high end builds, a massive damage buff.

Edited February 25, 2020 by ScarySai

[Ignatz the Insane]

3 hours ago, Mr.Sinister said:

Current dark melee is the best at its role.  

If you mean it has minor To-HIt Debuff, then yea, sure it's the best at its role.  Other than that, it's a misconception that Dark Melee was ever more than a good single target set at max level with high recharge.  Like any set, Shield helped, and Epics/Patrons could help cover its AOE deficiencies.  Overall, and especially during the leveling process, Dark Melee has always been near the bottom in performance.  

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/19VuZ9zJ_8eKN11JytgaK9mt9Fy-8pjANopb-FGh68Uw/htmlview#

[Murcielago]

3 hours ago, Jimmy said:

Please remain civil when commenting on the viewpoints of others or we’ll need to start handing out warnings.

 

Please also stick to the correct threads - Shock Therapy feedback goes in the Shock Therapy thread. General feedback about this patch goes in this thread. Unrelated suggestions go in the suggestions forum.

If the hard warnings come with a badge, can I have one?

[Brutal Justice]

1 hour ago, Ignatz the Insane said:

If you mean it has minor To-HIt Debuff, then yea, sure it's the best at its role.  Other than that, it's a misconception that Dark Melee was ever more than a good single target set at max level with high recharge.  Like any set, Shield helped, and Epics/Patrons could help cover its AOE deficiencies.  Overall, and especially during the leveling process, Dark Melee has always been near the bottom in performance.  

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/19VuZ9zJ_8eKN11JytgaK9mt9Fy-8pjANopb-FGh68Uw/htmlview#

You linked me a spreadsheet showing 500% recharge and that's telling me about the performance of dark melee?  Lower that recharge to 100% and tell me where dark melee ends up.  The spreadsheet also focuses entirely on damage.  Did you know Siphon life is in that attack rotation for dark melee that places it in 11th place?  That's healing and -to-hit that also comes from just using your best attacks.  Are we to discount that for more damage?  Your spreadsheet is fun, but not practical for ascertaining balance.  People who play dark melee a lot know the role that it fills.  People who just want more damage don't play dark melee.

[ScarySai]

5 minutes ago, Mr.Sinister said:

You linked me a spreadsheet showing 500% recharge and that's telling me about the performance of dark melee?  Lower that recharge to 100% and tell me where dark melee ends up.  The spreadsheet also focuses entirely on damage.  Did you know Siphon life is in that attack rotation for dark melee that places it in 11th place?  That's healing and -to-hit that also comes from just using your best attacks.  Are we to discount that for more damage?  Your spreadsheet is fun, but not practical for ascertaining balance.  People who play dark melee a lot know the role that it fills.  People who just want more damage don't play dark melee.

The spreadsheet has value when it comes to measuring max potential under some crazy buff situations and some fulcrum shift spam.

 

It has little to zero value in estimating most real world/solo performance in the game, however.

 

Fortunately, there's a slightly better option for scrappers. DM will be a lot higher following these changes, at least on AOE.

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1av2vWL9UVgGw183BbjFNweJze7N5P3Tn8tYSppdFQgE/edit#gid=647164741

Edited February 26, 2020 by ScarySai

[WindDemon21]

Dark melee needs an actual aoe. Dark consumption should be made a 20s recharging aoe with the first enemy giving the most end of 15, and then it and the subsequent enemies granting 2 end, unenhanceable. That way it gives good endurance but not op, and forces it to be slotted and used as an actual aoe attack with the benefit of the endurance gain.

[AlienMafia]

My main grip is the targeted AoE Set. I feel like one of the /Recharge IOs need to be changed to a +endredux. Obliteration is an amazing set but its downside is how crappy it reduces the endurance cost of the power and i hope that this set can be changed to have a little more Endredux by switching the Damage/recharge or accuracy/damage/recharge to /endredux.

 

 Bombardment (Targeted AoE, Rare, 30-50)

• Enhancements: 
  • Damage
  • Accuracy / Recharge
  • Damage / Recharge
  • Accuracy / Damage / Recharge
  • Accuracy / Damage / Recharge / Endurance Reduction
  • Chance for Fire Damage (3 PPM)

[WindDemon21]

6 minutes ago, AlienMafia said:

My main grip is the targeted AoE Set. I feel like one of the /Recharge IOs need to be changed to a +endredux. Obliteration is an amazing set but its downside is how crappy it reduces the endurance cost of the power and i hope that this set can be changed to have a little more Endredux by switching the Damage/recharge or accuracy/damage/recharge to /endredux.

 

 Bombardment (Targeted AoE, Rare, 30-50)

• Enhancements: 
  • Damage
  • Accuracy / Recharge
  • Damage / Recharge
  • Accuracy / Damage / Recharge
  • Accuracy / Damage / Recharge / Endurance Reduction
  • Chance for Fire Damage (3 PPM)

The damage should be damage/endurance. The acc/tech should be the first one too. I know it's only an OCD thing but I have to slot sets in order so it would be nice to have the acc be the first thing/s lol

[TraumaTrain]

Shock Therapy (please change the name) looks like it will be a great set. It is Defenders only now, but it will eventually port to, what, Corruptor secondary, Controller secondary, and Mastermind secondary?

[GM Korvin]

18 hours ago, The Curator said:

New Support Powerset: Shock Therapy (Feedback Thread)

"You are able to control and manipulate electricity to aid your allies and weaken your enemies. Some Shock Therapy powers build Static, which increases the number of targets your Circuit powers can chain to. Others consume Static to increase their effectiveness while also restoring a small amount of your health and endurance."

• A shocking new support powerset brought to you by @Cipher, @Jimmy, @GuyPerfect and our resident powers guru @Captain Powerhouse.
• The set has been built around chaining powers and a stacking / combo system that's similar to those found in many of the more modern melee and ranged damage sets, with a focus on wide variety of buffs for the whole team as well as damage and endurance debuffs for your enemies.
• Shock Therapy also introduces and makes use of a brand new mechanic which allows powers to dynamically change the number of targets they can hit - in this case, the four Circuit powers hit more targets for every stack of Static that you currently have.
• The set is currently available only as a Defender Primary. It will be ported to other support ATs after testing and feedback.

@TraumaTrain

[TraumaTrain]

I got that part. I'm just trying to reason out where all it will port to once it is portable.

[Widower]

4 minutes ago, TraumaTrain said:

I got that part. I'm just trying to reason out where all it will port to once it is portable.

As GMs, we make no promises, but I would suspect it'll end up as a secondary for all the /Support ATs eventually. And if not, you'll know about it!

[WindDemon21]

13 minutes ago, TraumaTrain said:

Shock Therapy (please change the name) looks like it will be a great set. It is Defenders only now, but it will eventually port to, what, Corruptor secondary, Controller secondary, and Mastermind secondary?

Really? Looking at it it seems pretty crappy to me actually. All it has is an ally heal, and aoe -damage. And a pbaoe status (not protection) and slow/end resist power. Everything else is a single target ally power, which jumps but loses effectiveness and the benefit doesn't sound that high, or a foe end drain without -recovery to even make it useful.

[ScarySai]

57 minutes ago, AlienMafia said:

My main grip is the targeted AoE Set. I feel like one of the /Recharge IOs need to be changed to a +endredux. Obliteration is an amazing set but its downside is how crappy it reduces the endurance cost of the power and i hope that this set can be changed to have a little more Endredux by switching the Damage/recharge or accuracy/damage/recharge to /endredux.

 

 Bombardment (Targeted AoE, Rare, 30-50)

• Enhancements: 
  • Damage
  • Accuracy / Recharge
  • Damage / Recharge
  • Accuracy / Damage / Recharge
  • Accuracy / Damage / Recharge / Endurance Reduction
  • Chance for Fire Damage (3 PPM)

If anything is to be swapped, it should be the one that's just pure damage. Make that a dam/end/rech and this set will have no flaws at all.

 

Unless that's supposed to be the drawback, of course.

Edited February 26, 2020 by ScarySai

[mattwo]

18 hours ago, InfamousBrad said:

With the circuit powers, where only one target gets the full effect, is there a way to determine which target that is? Or is it random?

IMO, the buffs should prioritize like tanks>DPS>Support>CC with the future MM version prioritizing tanks>casting MM's own pets>DPS>Support>CC and the heal should prioritize low health.

Edited February 26, 2020 by mattwo

[siolfir]

5 hours ago, Mr.Sinister said:

Both are big issues overall because they both exist in the same set.  However, the set was a beloved set before the changes to energy transfer.  I am sure it had even worse aoe before the energy transfer changes and people still loved it.  They loved it because it was good at what it did.  It filled its role as a single target hunter.  It had flavor.  Some people like tea, others like lemonade, some want both at the same time.  Just because you like an Arnold Palmer doesn’t mean it’s a good idea to mix all of the tea and lemonade.  

It didn't have worse AoE - Whirling Hands wasn't touched. You could argue that it had better AoE simply because you could swap targets faster with Energy Transfer - which I did to simulate AoE damage - but that's just being technical. As another note: per the design formulas posted in the Developer's Corner it's underperforming - a 14 sec recharge AoE with an 8' radius should do scale 1.1818 damage, and it does scale 1. If it were bumped to a 10' radius it should do scale 1.04.

 

While we're looking at those formulas, the new Shadow Maul is underperforming also: a 14 second recharge, 7' radius 120 degree cone should do scale 1.8131 damage, but it was reduced to scale 1.588 per the patch notes. Shadow Maul used to actually be better than scaled as a single-target attack (should be scale 1.64 at 8 seconds) because it seems like a lot of things were thrown out the window for pure DoT attacks.

[Peerless Girl]

19 hours ago, Phoenix' said:

 

* I don't mind having more pool powers, the more the better, but there is no originality when it comes to travel powers. I know that you have a long road ahead in adding new content in the game but we get same travel powers with an extra one ( like mystic flight) plus buffs debuffs while the old ones lack of potential.

Remember that these origin pools were began under Paragon, not Homecoming. All they're doing is fleshing them out and finishing the work right now. I expect any original content (like Shock Therapy) to be fairly much more...uh...original.

 

Edit: Ninja'd by Jimmy. That'll teach me to reply before I've read the entire thread.

Edited February 26, 2020 by Peerless Girl
Jimmy is a Ninja.

[AlienMafia]

1 hour ago, ScarySai said:

If anything is to be swapped, it should be the one that's just pure damage. Make that a dam/end/rech and this set will have no flaws at all.

 

Unless that's supposed to be the drawback, of course.

 

2 hours ago, WindDemon21 said:

The damage should be damage/endurance. The acc/tech should be the first one too. I know it's only an OCD thing but I have to slot sets in order so it would be nice to have the acc be the first thing/s lol

Which ever. Something to make the set well rounded vs utter crap on endredux

[ScarySai]

1 hour ago, AlienMafia said:

 

Which ever. Something to make the set well rounded vs utter crap on endredux

It'll be a good set either way, I like the damage and recharge values, so just reducing the pure damage one (since it's overkill) to slip some endurance in there would be perfect.

 

Either way, it's a much better set than the endurance ones.

Edited February 26, 2020 by ScarySai

[Novacat]

8 hours ago, MagicSquid2 said:

You guys need to rethink dark consumption. If I'm full on endurance, which I should be if I'm firing off a power that does increased damage based on my endurance, then I don't need it to be capable of draining endurance as well.

 

Also, I don't like the way this game is going as far as tankers having increased aoe capabilities.

It's quite worrisome for the squishies.

When the thing with an easier time reaching the defense cap and easily 2-3 times your resistances plus full mez immunity does *at absolute worst* 71% of your damage (tanker ranged vs blaster ranged) while also having at least 1.6x the health pool and higher regeneration...