Focused Feedback: Electrical Affinity - Name

[nzer]

1 minute ago, Super Atom said:

The concept of this power set is no more exciting than Electric Control or Electric Melee and both of those are have super generic names.

Let's be honest though, both of those names are terrible. Naming an electricity-based set Electric Category is as low effort as you can get without actually failing to communicate the purpose of the set, and they're both still better Electric Affinity, which fails to even clear that bar.

 

7 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

The only real power set names have been things like Electrical Conduction or Electric Support and spoilers those are as generic as affinity.

Electrical Conduction is way better than Electrical Affinity IMO, as it plays into both the theme of electricity and the set's focus on arcing powers. Electrical Support is conceptually just as generic, but it at least communicates the purpose of the set, and it fits better with Electric Control and Electric Melee in that it's fundamentally Electric Category (not that fitting in with the other bad names should be a goal).

[Super Atom]

Just now, nzer said:

Let's be honest though, both of those names are terrible. Naming an electricity-based set Electric Category is as low effort as you can get without actually failing to communicate the purpose of the set, and they're both still better Electric Affinity, which fails to even clear that bar.

 

Electrical Conduction is way better than Electrical Affinity IMO, as it plays into both the theme of electricity and the set's focus on arcing powers. Electrical Support is conceptually just as generic, but it at least communicates the purpose of the set, and it fits better with Electric Control and Electric Melee in that it's fundamentally Electric Category (not that fitting in with the other bad names should be a goal).

Which again brings us to the problem of randomly naming things and it getting weird. "Man, I can't wait to make a boom boom pow melee". If you like the more generic names that you feel suit it better then cool but naming it something flashy for the sake of it being flashy is equally as dumb as naming it Electrical Buffs.

[Troo]

1 hour ago, Super Atom said:

Why does everyone think power set names need to be exciting? I mean, i guess they could be but at that rate we have a tremendous amount of things to rename.

 

I'd like to throw out some suggestions for Archery

 

Turbo Speed Pointy Stick.

Big ouch rainy hurt

Green Arrow's fast paced lightning speed flying poker.

Those are clearly individual power names not Set names.

[Super Atom]

1 minute ago, Troo said:

Those are clearly individual power names not Set names.

 

Are you telling me you wouldn't make a Big ouch rainy hurt blaster?

 

its almost like overly specific flashy names don't work as power set names.

Edited March 3, 2020 by Super Atom

[Troo]

maybe.. it is inspiring.

[Super Atom]

but hey, there's no real rules to any of this. There is literally nothing stopping HC from naming it whatever they feel is best be it something flashy or otherwise. If they so chose they could name it "Big electrical good touch" and we'd all just have to deal with it. Luckily they probably wouldn't do that, so i guess we'll see what they feel the best name for their (first?) set will be.

 

My repeated disdain for flashy power-like names is entirely just my opinion. I Like Electrical Affinity because it gets the point across enough that It's support and has Electric powers and isn't gonna cause a red-hot debate about politics. 10/10 does the job move on to making it not be DOA.

 

Besides, It's gonna end up being shortened to Elec/(set) defender anyway in any conversation in game.

Edited March 3, 2020 by Super Atom

[nzer]

1 minute ago, Super Atom said:

Which again brings us to the problem of randomly naming things and it getting weird. "Man, I can't wait to make a boom boom pow melee". If you like the more generic names that you feel suit it better then cool but naming it something flashy for the sake of it being flashy is equally as dumb as naming it Electrical Buffs.

"Completely generic to the point of not communicating what the set does" and "so specific I can't pick it without feeling like I have to build my entire character concept around it" are not the only options here. Quite the contrary, many of the game's best names manage to capture the best of both worlds, evoking surprisingly specific imagery while remaining generic enough that they aren't prescriptive toward your character concept.

 

Titan Weapons. Big weapons. Weapons used by titans, which could mean big strong fighters, or ancient mythological figures, or just important figures in general. Captain America's shield could be a titan weapon, as could his devotion to justice. Evokes pantheonic themes - heroes of ancient times, great powers working in far away places, pillars of things beyond our immediate reach. Or maybe it just means big weapons. Generic, but exciting.

 

Storm Summoning. Using storms to destroy things. Controlling forces ordinarily beyond our reach. Awesome destructive power. Duality; sometimes wrathful, sometimes indifferent; sometimes terrifyingly sudden, sometimes slow but inexorable; sometimes serene, sometimes catastrophic. Evokes images of power, reverence, humility. And the mechanical design of the set reflects all these concepts: a high damage set with strong soft control that ramps up over time, for which all the offensive capability is directed only broadly.

 

Willpower. Fortifying oneself through sheer force of will. Shrugging off pain, defying unfavorable odds and coming out on top, not through luck or anger but through sheer determination. Evokes a very clear character profile, but isn't prescriptive about the details; maybe the character is exceptionally disciplined; maybe they're ideologically driven; maybe they're too stupid to recognize when things don't go how they expected.

 

These are all excellent names that manage to be both generic and evocative at the same time, and I'm sorry, but Electrical Affinity doesn't stand next to them. Neither do Electric Melee and Electric Control, but at least those convey the literal function of the power set, and while I don't think they're good names for a super hero game I can at least respect that they adhere to a coherent naming philosophy. But Electrical Affinity? All you can really pull from that is "something doing things with electricity." I assume it's supposed to be inspired by Nature Affinity since they're both support sets, but Nature Affinity stands on its own conceptually by virtue of affinity with nature already being a thing. Electrical Affinity not so much; I don't think I've ever heard anything described as having an affinity with electricity.

 

None of this is meant to disparage whoever though of the name Electrical Affinity - names are very, very hard. I trust the team to come up with something good, I just don't think it's there yet.

[Super Atom]

To be clear, the name has nothing to do with how you make a character. You can use it sure but the name has no bearing. My willpower is a power armor fueled by thermal energy. It has nothing to do with willpower. I'm not telling you that you cant dislike affinity I'm just disagreeing with your reasons as to why it's bad.  

 

I also appreciate your point of view and see where you're coming from. 

Edited March 3, 2020 by Super Atom

[nzer]

1 minute ago, Super Atom said:

To be clear, the name has nothing to do with how you make a character. You can use it sure but the name has no bearing. My willpower is a power armor fueled by thermal energy. It has nothing to do with willpower. I'm not telling you that you cant dislike affinity I'm just disagreeing with your reasons as to why it's bad.

I can't really tell whether you're arguing that power set names should be purely literal or that they don't matter at all. I want to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume the former, but the fact that you don't see a difference between Electrical Support and Electrical Affinity makes me think it's the latter. And since you've made convention a meaningful part of your argument, I'll point out that with support sets the convention is for names that are evocative, not literal. Both Electric Affinity and Electric Support would stick out like a sore thumb among the support sets, as they're all very uniquely named.

[Super Atom]

2 minutes ago, nzer said:

I can't really tell whether you're arguing that power set names should be purely literal or that they don't matter at all. I want to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume the former, but the fact that you don't see a difference between Electrical Support and Electrical Affinity makes me think it's the latter. And since you've made convention a meaningful part of your argument, I'll point out that with support sets the convention is for names that are evocative, not literal. Both Electric Affinity and Electric Support would stick out like a sore thumb among the support sets, as they're all very uniquely named.

I don't think they matter to a characters design. I don't think they need to be literal either but uh... to say they aren't is disregarding force field, traps, poison, storm summoning and trick arrow.

[Super Atom]

All I mean by convention is they don't sound like a power. Not that they literally need to be domination, emission etc

[nzer]

22 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

I don't think they matter to a characters design. I don't think they need to be literal either but uh... to say they aren't is disregarding force field, traps, poison, storm summoning and trick arrow.

Okay, well lots of people do think they matter to character design. And when I say "literal," I'm referring to names like Electric Melee, for which the underlying concept is just "this is a melee set that uses electricity." Force Field, Traps, Poison, Storm Summoning, and Trick Arrow don't fit that mold.

 

I'm honestly shocked you put Storm Summoning in there given that I just explained its thematic underpinnings. Like... did you even bother to read that?

18 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

All I mean by convention is they don't sound like a power. Not that they literally need to be domination, emission etc

Force Field sounds a lot like a power to me, as does Dark Miasma. But they're not, they're support sets. Convention dictates that support sets be given unique, evocative names. Neither Electrical Affinity nor Electrical Support would fit; the former because it's too similar to Nature Affinity and the latter because it's too literal.

 

Edit: To elaborate a bit more directly (in case any of the HC folks see this), Electrical Affinity actually breaks the naming convention of the support sets because of its similarity with (or rather derivation from) Nature Affinity. Support set names aren't derivative like control sets (Fire Control, Electric Control, Plant Control, etc.), they're unique, though several are named with the convention of Element Noun, where the noun is related to the element.

 

Affinity for nature -> Nature Affinity

Heat radiates -> Thermal Radiation

Sound resonates -> Sonic Resonance

 

If following convention is the goal, the new set should be named:

 

Electricity conducts -> Electrical Conduction

 

Or something similar. But not Electrical Affinity.

Edited March 3, 2020 by nzer

[Super Atom]

18 minutes ago, nzer said:

Okay, well lots of people do think they matter to character design. And when I say "literal," I'm referring to names like Electric Melee, for which the underlying concept is just "this is a melee set that uses electricity." Force Field, Traps, Poison, Storm Summoning, and Trick Arrow don't fit that mold.

 

I'm honestly shocked you put Storm Summoning in there given that I just explained its thematic underpinnings. Like... did you even bother to read that?

Force Field sounds a lot like a power to me, as does Dark Miasma. But they're not, they're support sets. Convention dictates that support sets be given unique, evocative names. Neither Electrical Affinity nor Electrical Support would fit; the former because it's too similar to Nature Affinity and the latter because it's too literal.

That's good for randomly generated lots of people. "This is a set that uses traps/force fields/bows" yes I read your roleplay but its generic and unspecific as a name. Case in point, color it green and you've got a radiation storm. Imaginations are fun.

 

You can drop the nature argument, darkness affinity exists. Force field sounds like a description of your abilities not so much a power. You don't use force field you use force fields, what kind of force fields? Insert power name of specific field.

 

We can disagree all we want but eventually a gm is gonna tell again so it's probably best we acknowledge we disagree and move on.

 

 

I don't disagree there's probably a better name. I don't think we've found one yet.

 

Edited March 3, 2020 by Super Atom

[nzer]

5 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

You can drop the nature argument, darkness affinity exists. Force field sounds like a description of your abilities not so much a power. You don't use force field you use force fields, what kind of force fields? Insert power name of specific field.

As does Cold Domination, but neither are good names; Cold Domination sounds like it should be a control set (and probably would have been if the control sets were named properly), and Darkness Affinity shouldn't have been named differently than its defender counterpart. And Force Field only sounds like a power set because it is a power set, it could just as easily have been a power in Devices or Traps. It would actually sound significantly more like a power set if it was called Force Fields, but it's not.

 

14 minutes ago, Super Atom said:

We can disagree all we want but eventually a gm is gonna tell again so it's probably best we acknowledge we disagree and move on.

This is a perfectly civil conversation, but we don't have to keep having it if you don't want.

[Super Atom]

3 minutes ago, nzer said:

As does Cold Domination, but neither are good names; Cold Domination sounds like it should be a control set (and probably would have been if the control sets were named properly), and Darkness Affinity shouldn't have been named differently than its defender counterpart. And Force Field only sounds like a power set because it is a power set, it could just as easily have been a power in Devices or Traps. It would actually sound significantly more like a power set if it was called Force Fields, but it's not.

 

This is a perfectly civil conversation, but we don't have to keep having it if you don't want.

It really should be force fields. Silly 2004.

[biostem]

The answer is obvious:  "Electrical Engineering"  🤗

[siolfir]

So that's a no on Click Bait, then? 😝

[Dark Current]

Titan Weapons or Large Stick Affinity?

 

Sonic Resonance or Sound Affinity?

 

Dark Miasma or Smoke Affinity?

 

Beast Mastery or Zoological Affinity?

 

I could go on. The point is you're launching a new set. Giving it a boring affinity name isn't selling it. And if this game ever goes legit you need a creative team leading it that can do better.

 

I think the new name should have Elec- in it so it follows shorthand naming convention: elec/elec. A simple change like Electrical Conductance (while not the sexiest) is more unique than Affinity and specific to what the set does. It also sounds cooler and fits the naming theme of other sets like Radiation Emmission and Sonic Resonance.

 

And for the record Darkness Affinity is another terribly boring name. Please change.

[Vanden]

1 minute ago, Dark Current said:

I could go on. The point is you're launching a new set. Giving it a boring affinity name isn't selling it. And if this game ever goes legit you need a creative team leading it that can do better.

If they were launching a new Controller primary set, nobody would bat an eye if it was "<something> Control." Same thing if it was a new Dominator secondary called "<something> Assault." "Affinity" is the closest thing to a naming convention the admittedly scattershot Buff/Debuff sets have, so Electrical Affinity for the electric-themed Buff/Debuff set is a perfect fit.

[Burnt Toast]

You all know "affinity" means a close connection to... right? So someone who uses Electrical Affinity has... a close connection to electricity and can manipulate it to.. oh I dunno help others. But go ahead and keep "debating" something that isn't going to change (again). 

[Wild Claw]

9 hours ago, Dark Current said:

Exciting names get people to want to play them.

 

What would you rather play:

 

Street Justice or Asphalt Affinity?

FFS... now I need a Street Justice/Stone Armor toon named 'Asphalt Affinity'. Especially if I play him as faceplanting all the time...

 

[0th Power]

Can we go for an onomatopoeia?  If so, how about Zzzt!

[Coyote]

9 hours ago, Burnt Toast said:

And yet plenty of people play the simpler named powersets.... just saying. You could call it Kazoo as long as the powers are fun to play. I think Electric Affinity makes much more sense than 99.9% of the suggested ones here. 

 

I actually think that you'd have to call it Electric Kazoo 😉

[Trickshooter]

7 hours ago, nzer said:

Cold Domination sounds like it should be a control set (and probably would have been if the control sets were named properly)

Here's an interesting bit of info: At one point, the plan wasn't to have these kind of generic names that some of the Control and elemental Melee sets have now. Ice Control specifically was at some point called Ice Formation. You can see these names by looking at the internal names of the power icon graphics.

 

Earth Control > Earth Grasp
Ice Control > Ice Formation

Fire Control > Fire Trap

Illusion Control > Illusions

 

Dark Melee > Shadow Fighting

Fiery Melee > Fiery Fray

Ice Melee > Icy Onslaught

Energy Melee > Power Punch

 

I can only assume these were all eventually standardized in order to make it more obvious what they did just by reading their names.

[Coyote]

44 minutes ago, Burnt Toast said:

You all know "affinity" means a close connection to... right? So someone who uses Electrical Affinity has... a close connection to electricity and can manipulate it to.. oh I dunno help others. But go ahead and keep "debating" something that isn't going to change (again). 

 

Right. The main reason why Nature Affinity "is a thing" while "no one mentions Electrical Affinity IRL", is because we don't have superpowers in the world. But in a world where people can manipulate electricity mentally or with weird and unique gadgets, having an affinity for electricity would be a good description of what they can do. It may not be a sexy, or unique, or especially evocative name, but the argument that it's not an appropriate name for the powers seems to me to fall flat.

 

I've liked some of the other suggestions, but I like EA also, and I don't think it's an important enough argument to delay anything in putting the set out, and I doubt that the Dev team is also so interested in somehow getting just the "perfect name" that they will delay. I mean, we have dozens of suggestions already, unless many of the "Never Affinityers" can coalesce around an opposition candidate, I think that Affinity has built a commanding lead merely by being the one suggested by the Dev team.