Mids' Reborn Unofficial (MRBU)

[Caulderone]

What I did.  Extract the zip to its own folder.  There are two folders included that matter, Data and Images.  I opened Data, selected all, copy.

Then, I opened my Mids folder, went into the Data folder and pasted.  Any "replace" options, select yes.

Then, I did the same process for the Images folder.

 

Worked fine for me.  Maybe it will for you.

[Felis Noctu]

2 hours ago, Xandyr said:

For the life of me, I can't get this to work. I have the Mids Reborn folder on my desktop. When I want to launch it, I click on that folder, then scroll down to Hero Designer.exe, then the builder launches. I followed this :

• Click Download Weekly Release

• Click "Source code (zip)" under "Assets" section of most recent Weekly

• Open downloaded file

• Extract contents of "MRB-Updates-######" to Mids install folder, overwriting as prompted

  • For a clean install, only extract the "Data" and "Images" folders

However, after I open the downloaded file, it'll extract the files to the "Mids Reborn" folder on my desktop. But, when I launch Mids Reborn, it is not updated.

 

Do I need to delete everything associated with Mids, and start all over? I guess I'm an idiot... 🤬

56 minutes ago, Caulderone said:

What I did.  Extract the zip to its own folder.  There are two folders included that matter, Data and Images.  I opened Data, selected all, copy.

Then, I opened my Mids folder, went into the Data folder and pasted.  Any "replace" options, select yes.

Then, I did the same process for the Images folder.

 

Worked fine for me.  Maybe it will for you.

 

Try what Caulderone said.

 

They key here is that the Mids Reborn folder, where you installed it in the first place, has two folders within it named "Data" and "Images". The MRBU release also has two folders named "Data" and "Images".

 

First, make sure Mids (the program) is closed. Then, you want to copy the MRBU folders into your Mids install folder, where you'll be asked if you want to overwrite/replace some files. You'll say yes to everything. The next time you run Mids, you should have our updates.

Edited March 27, 2020 by Felis Noctu

[Felis Noctu]

6 hours ago, Caulderone said:

Another very minor issue that has been going on for a good while that we run into periodically in the Tanker forum:

Superior Might of the Tanker's resistance buff is enhanced by Musculature (not in game, but in the planner).

 

I haven't figured out a way to self-tweak the database to correct for that.

So back to this one: Oddly enough, the damage bonus of Musculature is what's improving the damage resistance.

 

I need to find my big stick. This deserves some extra serious poking!

[Felis Noctu]

And fixed. Not as complicated as it originally seemed. It was calling a GrantPower which was set to ignore buffs and enhancements, but you don't buff a GrantPower, you buff an Attribute. Applying the buff ignore to the granted power's effects resolved the problem. I couldn't tell you why a damage bonus was affecting a resistance bonus, but it's probably not worth losing sanity over. 😛

 

---

 

Release update!

 

Major changes:
- Electrical Affinity is now available for Controllers, Corruptors, Defenders, and Masterminds. Another review pass is due, so please feel free to report any issues!

- Aegis proc's effect text was modified to actually resemble the bonus it provides. This will likely get overhauled in the future anyway, so it's a quick band-aid for readability.

- Might of the Tanker (+Superior) changed to no longer be affected by buffs such as Musculature Alpha. As above, enhancements are likely to see a large overhaul in the future, and yes we know that you can't make Might's effect stack. We're working on that! It's a little trickier than you might think, but I believe I found a method that'll probably be included in the overhaul.

Edited March 27, 2020 by Felis Noctu

[Rooster Gold]

Defender damage values are scoring higher than Corrupters or are unlisted.

Almost as if they've been swapped.

 

Here's 3 for comparison.

 

Ball Lightning Defender Damage is: 36.87

Ball Lightning Corruptor Damage is: 30.66

 

Inferno Defender Damage is: 237.4

Inferno Corruptor Damage is: 184

 

Blizzard Defender Damage is: Not Listed

Blizzard Corruptor Damage is: 287.8

[Bopper]

2 hours ago, Rooster Gold said:

Defender damage values are scoring higher than Corrupters or are unlisted.

Almost as if they've been swapped.

 

Here's 3 for comparison.

 

Ball Lightning Defender Damage is: 36.87

Ball Lightning Corruptor Damage is: 30.66

 

Inferno Defender Damage is: 237.4

Inferno Corruptor Damage is: 184

 

Blizzard Defender Damage is: Not Listed

Blizzard Corruptor Damage is: 287.8

Do you have Vigilance active?

[Caulderone]

Oddball interaction for you.  Using the Tanker->Energy Mastery power Physical Perfection.

Add Regen.Tissue + Regen, works normally.  Add Power Transfer: Chance to Heal to 2nd slot, RT:Regen works normally.

 

Add PT:CtH to first slot and RT:Regen to 2nd slot, RT:Regen does nothing in calculations now.

 

Very odd.

[Mikewho]

5 hours ago, Rooster Gold said:

Defender damage values are scoring higher than Corrupters or are unlisted.

Almost as if they've been swapped.

 

Here's 3 for comparison.

 

Ball Lightning Defender Damage is: 36.87

Ball Lightning Corruptor Damage is: 30.66

 

Inferno Defender Damage is: 237.4

Inferno Corruptor Damage is: 184

 

Blizzard Defender Damage is: Not Listed

Blizzard Corruptor Damage is: 287.8

I’ve noticed the same thing, even with vigilance deactivated.

[Redlynne]

7 hours ago, Felis Noctu said:

I couldn't tell you why a damage bonus was affecting a resistance bonus

Because game mechanically the two are linked ... they're just the inverse of each other (usually).

 

To increase damage you scale up a modifier.

To in resistance you scale down the same modifier.

 

You want to think in terms of premature optimization that Cryptic did pre-2004 for why things are structured the way they are.  This is also the reason why you can't Power Boost powers that add Resistance without bumping into weird edge cases due to this bit of premature optimization that tie damage and resistance to each other.

[Felis Noctu]

4 hours ago, Redlynne said:

Because game mechanically the two are linked ... they're just the inverse of each other (usually).

 

To increase damage you scale up a modifier.

To in resistance you scale down the same modifier.

 

You want to think in terms of premature optimization that Cryptic did pre-2004 for why things are structured the way they are.  This is also the reason why you can't Power Boost powers that add Resistance without bumping into weird edge cases due to this bit of premature optimization that tie damage and resistance to each other.

That'll do it. I was scratching my head over that when Procat and I were looking at the basic server files that are floating around out there. Damage AT-modifier tables are negative numbers instead of positive, which was throwing me for a loop. Makes more sense now.

 

Well, issues like Might of the Tanker and others will hopefully be handled when I do the enhancement pass. Mids was originally designed around importing the game's data as far as we can tell, but it had to have gone through some reformatting during the process. However that was originally handled, we no longer have access to the process. Them trying to emulate all the oddities the game operates under caused a number of implementation problems in the first place, combined with some odd choices that actually make working with Mids DB source more difficult than the game files themselves. That, along with HC adding new features that Mids doesn't currently understand, as well as needing to do things that aren't 100% faithful to the game files in order to fix certain bugs (did you know there's an "ignore import" flag for each power, probably for that reason?), means at this point there's no real reason to continue operating under the assumption that everything should perfectly mirror the game.

 

 

[Galactiman]

The flight speed total with Hover active is bugged. It shows flight speed as much higher than it should be.

[Heatstroke]

Ive tried.. i cant get this to work.. not as savvy as I thought.. I cant even find where mids is.. its in some app data roaming thing and I cant seem to extract the file to go where it needs to go.. I miss when you just clicked update in Mids and it happened..

 

[Caulderone]

12 minutes ago, Galactiman said:

The flight speed total with Hover active is bugged. It shows flight speed as much higher than it should be.

Yeah, that's been that way for quite a while now.

[Caulderone]

10 minutes ago, Heatstroke said:

Ive tried.. i cant get this to work.. not as savvy as I thought.. I cant even find where mids is.. its in some app data roaming thing

It should not be in the roaming/temp files area, nothing permanent should be.  You should do an uninstall from add/remove programs and download a fresh copy of 2.6.0.7 from the other thread, then do a fresh install, paying attention to the install location (or telling it somewhere specific to put it).  The builds should be saved to a folder in the Documents folder, so those should be unaffected.

[Heatstroke]

Yeah thanks i think this is that I am going to have to go.. its all messed up now

 

[Heatstroke]

30 minutes ago, Caulderone said:

It should not be in the roaming/temp files area, nothing permanent should be.  You should do an uninstall from add/remove programs and download a fresh copy of 2.6.0.7 from the other thread, then do a fresh install, paying attention to the install location (or telling it somewhere specific to put it).  The builds should be saved to a folder in the Documents folder, so those should be unaffected.

Thanks that did the trick had to give it a permanent location and then just copied over the old files.. Thanks

[Felis Noctu]

4 hours ago, Galactiman said:

The flight speed total with Hover active is bugged. It shows flight speed as much higher than it should be.

That one's source is right in our face but the actual mystery persists.

 

Keep in mind that the powers in Mids were pretty much imported directly from the game with very few changes. In essence, Mids was designed to emulate the powers system of the game to display the expected values to the user, and as such the powers have the same effects on them as they do in-game. If you look at both Fly and Hover in-game, you'll see a very odd series of effects, and they're two of very few powers that do something like this.

 

 

See how they're doing this weird thing where they both add and remove flight speed? That's where the trouble seems to be for Mids. Fly isn't a problem. Fly adds more speed than it's removing, so Mids has no problem working with that. However, Hover is actually removing more than it adds, lowering you below your base flight speed. I have the suspicion that Mids is choking on this math for one reason or another and ends up producing an entirely different outcome.

 

This sort of thing is why I'm strongly pushing for us to just drop the "mirror the game" mentality that's persisted up until this point and do a manual cleaning up of the database. While the game may need all of this information in order to do what's expected above, I feel like we can get the desired effect on our end without as much complication.

 

Actually, tell you what. Usually I check out on weekends to do my own thing (I'm retired on disability, so modding projects and such are effectively my job at this point), but I'll take some time tomorrow to mess around with these and see if I can get them to play nice.

Edited March 28, 2020 by Felis Noctu

[Bopper]

The Fly and Hover stuff is definitely weird in Mids. It's funny, if you look at the Info of Hover/Fly, the calculated FlySpd is wrong, but if you click the Effects tab, the FlySpd is correct. I can't tell exactly what is wrong with each, but it seems for Hover the FlySpd on the Info tab is not doing what it should be:

FlySpd = 50% * (1+Enh)+50%-101%

But instead I think it's doing this:

FlySpd = 50% * (1+Enh) + 50% + 50%*(-101%) = 50% * (1+Enh) - 0.5%

So instead of adding everything together, the last debuff is multiplying with the middle buff.

 

Then with Fly, it gets even weirder. It should be doing this:

FlySpd = 136.5% * (1+Enh) + 80% + 100% - 101%

But instead I THINK IT MIGHT be doing this:

FlySpd = 136.5% * (1+Enh) + 80% * (100%-101%) * (-101%) =  136.5% * (1+Enh) + 0.808%

 

I very likely am wrong on some of that. But looking at the numbers, it seemed like the only thing that fit. There seemed to be some interaction between the unenhanceable fly buffs/debuffs that seemed multiplicative instead of additive.

 

And I won't even get started with how the actual fly speed is calculated on the View Totals window. Those numbers are bonkers.

[Caulderone]

The old version I kept around, the one edited by Khy, seems to calculate hover and fly closer to expected value except Afterburner doesn't touch hover.

 

 

Lots got updated and tweaked in the background, so not sure what needs fixed.

[Rooster Gold]

On 3/27/2020 at 5:29 PM, Bopper said:

Do you have Vigilance active?

No

[r0y]

As always, great work keeping the database updated and as close to the game as humanly possible!

 

Is there any plans to completely re-vamp the interface?  I mean, ground-up type re-invention / re-imagining level stuff?  This (theoretically) can be done separate from the database / numbers stuff, by a separate team...?

 

Just curious.

[Redlynne]

The best possible UI refresh would be to move to a webpage architecture and do everything online.  That way there's no fiddling around with who has what version downloaded to which OS and all the disparities of outcomes that result from having an app saved on your computer.  Update the webpage to update everything for everybody.

[Apparition]

3 minutes ago, Redlynne said:

The best possible UI refresh would be to move to a webpage architecture and do everything online.  That way there's no fiddling around with who has what version downloaded to which OS and all the disparities of outcomes that result from having an app saved on your computer.  Update the webpage to update everything for everybody.

 

I look forward to seeing your web planner!

[Redlynne]

Just now, Apparition said:

I look forward to seeing your web planner!

I lack the skills to realize the dream.  I just know what the dream IS ...

[Felis Noctu]

5 hours ago, r0y said:

As always, great work keeping the database updated and as close to the game as humanly possible!

 

Is there any plans to completely re-vamp the interface?  I mean, ground-up type re-invention / re-imagining level stuff?  This (theoretically) can be done separate from the database / numbers stuff, by a separate team...?

 

Just curious.

2 hours ago, Apparition said:

I look forward to seeing your web planner!

 

There are options, but nothing strictly set in place yet.

• @Cipher has been working on a more "official" web-app planner for HC, but he has plenty of things to do so we don't really know how far along that is.
• @The Philotic Knight is also working on a build planner that's intended to have an online component, and he's got all of the sweet sexy datas, but it's only at interface construction right now
• MRBU won't make any significant updates to the UI in its current state (we have some minor changes to our private dev build that make it easier to find data, thanks to @Procat), BUT there's hesitant whispers on the wind that HC may possibly maybe no promises provide options for data access that would allow for making a planner that could effectively poke at the server directly to get information. If that does happen, we've discussed the possibility of starting a new planner ourselves that uses this mythical API in various ways.

My general opinion on these matters is that there's no real logical reason to have multiple tools for the same purpose floating around when we could pool our resources and work together, but it's also nice to have safeties and backups just in case. If I were to pick one project at the moment my money would be on Cipher's simply due to it being built by someone on the HC team for HC.

 

Another angle to consider though is that all of this work is being done with HC in mind. We don't know the future of CoH as a whole yet, and other servers out there are being left behind. Unfortunately, it's difficult to consider all of the changes out there, but I've tossed the idea around personally of taking a look at one or two other larger servers and maybe adding their stuff as well. Who knows?

Edited March 28, 2020 by Felis Noctu