Activating all Armor Toggles

[GGamerGirl]

I am pretty new to this game, and I am fine with the "need to click icons one-by-one" thing.  I have to worry about remembering to re-toggle them after I bite off more than I can chew and get blown back to the hospital, but that is related to having less game experience.  If I need to toggle them on by clicking them one-by-one then it is not a problem as the powers activate once you click their icons. I just leave the macros to linking powers such as "Fly" and "Hover" because they are exclusive to each other.

 

Once again, clicking the armors one-by-one is not a problem, and what you are suggesting is, in my opinion, not necessary. 

[Viscountexx]

11 minutes ago, Haijinx said:

unless you are a Kheld maybe

Was about to bring up playing a kheld. We basically avoid all the defense buff toggles on our warshade specifically because of the lack of this feature making us need to repeatedly tap a bind every time we shapeshift.

[Haijinx]

2 minutes ago, Fidgetcetera said:

Was about to bring up playing a kheld. We basically avoid all the defense buff toggles on our warshade specifically because of the lack of this feature making us need to repeatedly tap a bind every time we shapeshift.

Yeah I see this as three different "problems" 

 

1 - For general use, when you die and Hospital or are exemplared or whatever - there is the inconvenience factor 

2 - Combat detoggling from END issues or dying in combat - there is an actual combat factor 

3 - For Khelds it basically makes shapeshifting hell, and a whole series of their human form powers mostly useless in multiform builds

 

I see the #3 issue as something that should be definitely addressed, the other two as maybes.  

 

 

[MsSmart]

I love the idea, but not just armor toggles, all toggles, some of my alts go around with 10 toggles, would be nice to have the hot toggle choice :<)

 

So I am all for it, it sure makes my life easier to get going when my endurance drops, and need to re-toggle

 

hugs

 

Sue

[summers]

Remove all animations and activation times for armours: they are pointless handwaving for no value. If someone is terribly opposed to this, feel free to emote a few things in your own time.

 

This would also make self rezzes better.

[SwitchFade]

1 hour ago, Haijinx said:

Yeah I see this as three different "problems" 

 

1 - For general use, when you die and Hospital or are exemplared or whatever - there is the inconvenience factor 

2 - Combat detoggling from END issues or dying in combat - there is an actual combat factor 

3 - For Khelds it basically makes shapeshifting hell, and a whole series of their human form powers mostly useless in multiform builds

 

I see the #3 issue as something that should be definitely addressed, the other two as maybes.  

 

 

More of a "toggles stay on and suppressed while form shifted" vs a let's change how all toggles work.

 

Kheldians need to be able to keep them on.

[SwitchFade]

Just now, summers said:

Remove all animations and activation times for armours: they are pointless handwaving for no value. If someone is terribly opposed to this, feel free to emote a few things in your own time.

 

This would also make self rezzes better.

No vote.

[Haijinx]

Just now, SwitchFade said:

More of a "toggles stay on and suppressed while form shifted" vs a let's change how all toggles work.

 

Kheldians need to be able to keep them on.

that would work

[SwitchFade]

1 hour ago, MsSmart said:

I love the idea, but not just armor toggles, all toggles, some of my alts go around with 10 toggles, would be nice to have the hot toggle choice :<)

 

So I am all for it, it sure makes my life easier to get going when my endurance drops, and need to re-toggle

 

hugs

 

Sue

Wholesale alterations to game design like allowing powers to bypass animations, allowing powers to fire simultaneously, allowing macros or binds to fire multiple powers automatically with one press...

 

No thanks. That's not what the game is, now should it be. Not to mention how much it would break.

 

End management is part of the game.

[Galaxy Brain]

21 hours ago, Haijinx said:

Yeah I see this as three different "problems" 

 

1 - For general use, when you die and Hospital or are exemplared or whatever - there is the inconvenience factor 

2 - Combat detoggling from END issues or dying in combat - there is an actual combat factor 

3 - For Khelds it basically makes shapeshifting hell, and a whole series of their human form powers mostly useless in multiform builds

 

I see the #3 issue as something that should be definitely addressed, the other two as maybes.  

 

 

For number two, that would be a really cool thing for Revive Powers SPECIFICALLY to do.

 

If you use a wakie, or go to hosp, GG's you gotta retoggle all your stuff. If a Regen/WP/Fiery Aura/ DARK ARMOR ESPECIALLY uses their self revive, a benefit should be it turns on any other toggles in the set you have! Same thing with Buff Set revives, give those powers some extra bite compared to just using  a wakie or hosping!

[SeraphimKensai]

As someone with arguably the best suggestions of all time according to myself, I would also State that there is a lot of other things out there that merit changing the command structure to automate the game for you. Because let's be honest here, if such a change were made it would be pretty easy to expand that to say firing out buildup/fiery embrace/burn/fences/ball lightning and the like all at the same time.

 

[SwitchFade]

47 minutes ago, SeraphimKensai said:

As someone with arguably the best suggestions of all time according to myself, I would also State that there is a lot of other things out there that merit changing the command structure to automate the game for you. Because let's be honest here, if such a change were made it would be pretty easy to expand that to say firing out buildup/fiery embrace/burn/fences/ball lightning and the like all at the same time.

Your argument is "don't do it, because also more bad..." Right?

 

Just making sure that's what you meant.

 

Which is also true, but just making sure, because the statement seemed to say that, but wording was a bit confusing.

[biostem]

On 2/21/2021 at 6:06 PM, GGamerGirl said:

I am pretty new to this game, and I am fine with the "need to click icons one-by-one" thing.  I have to worry about remembering to re-toggle them after I bite off more than I can chew and get blown back to the hospital, but that is related to having less game experience.  If I need to toggle them on by clicking them one-by-one then it is not a problem as the powers activate once you click their icons. I just leave the macros to linking powers such as "Fly" and "Hover" because they are exclusive to each other.

 

Once again, clicking the armors one-by-one is not a problem, and what you are suggesting is, in my opinion, not necessary. 

No need to click one by one, though;  Juts do /bind keynamehere "powexectoggleon powernamehere$$powexectoggleon otherpowernamehere$$powexectoggleon anotherpowernamehere"

 

Then you just need to press 1 key a few times to toggle everything on.

[SeraphimKensai]

14 hours ago, SwitchFade said:

Your argument is "don't do it, because also more bad..." Right?

 

Just making sure that's what you meant.

 

Which is also true, but just making sure, because the statement seemed to say that, but wording was a bit confusing.

Oh sorry yeah I was drinking.

 

Sum it up: we have more important things to focus on, and the potential exists if we did this it could open us up to unintended automation issues like firing off multiple powers at the same time.

 

[MsSmart]

On 2/21/2021 at 6:42 PM, SwitchFade said:

Wholesale alterations to game design like allowing powers to bypass animations, allowing powers to fire simultaneously, allowing macros or binds to fire multiple powers automatically with one press...

 

No thanks. That's not what the game is, now should it be. Not to mention how much it would break.

 

End management is part of the game.

I used endurance as an example, not the main reason. Now you brought it up, powers by-passing animations... I feel in many cases the animations are utterly ridiculous and long, I have a scrapper and there is a button that I must keep pressing in order to have Status Effect protections, without it - I am toast. So roughly every minute, in the middle of combat, I stop and do my glorious looking great clowning act, while all the mobs go , ha ha ha, free shots everyone! and they get at least 2 rounds of beating me up each while I am doing a totally stupid animation.  Frankly with buttons you press over and over again, should have no animations at all past the first time you did the dance of the idiot. Buttons like tough, and weave, the animations or the rooting that goes with them is far too long, I know they were worse, but stupid remains stupid despite that it was dumber. Frankly all buttons, should have a quick animation and be done.

 

Sue

[SwitchFade]

2 hours ago, MsSmart said:

I used endurance as an example, not the main reason. Now you brought it up, powers by-passing animations... I feel in many cases the animations are utterly ridiculous and long, I have a scrapper and there is a button that I must keep pressing in order to have Status Effect protections, without it - I am toast. So roughly every minute, in the middle of combat, I stop and do my glorious looking great clowning act, while all the mobs go , ha ha ha, free shots everyone! and they get at least 2 rounds of beating me up each while I am doing a totally stupid animation.  Frankly with buttons you press over and over again, should have no animations at all past the first time you did the dance of the idiot. Buttons like tough, and weave, the animations or the rooting that goes with them is far too long, I know they were worse, but stupid remains stupid despite that it was dumber. Frankly all buttons, should have a quick animation and be done.

 

Sue

that's a great deal of hyperbole. I'm sure we can refrain from resorting to calling things stupid that we dislike, strictly out of preference. I do understand that you don't like animation length on many powers, yet that does not make them stupid. The game is built and balanced wonderfully well, with art and animations that are second to none.

 

Wholesale changes to animations that are apart of design is a hard no vote. It would be a completely different game. Perhaps that's what you're looking for? A completely different game?

 

When I see people play first person shooting games I think they're ridiculous, who runs with their hands up, jerking a rifle back and forth 4 inches from their face? No one, it's at waist height, human biomechanics. They are popular though and I know it's not the game, it's me: that's not a game I would enjoy.

 

The animations are apart and parcel, a core game feature.

 

[Hyperstrike]

On 2/21/2021 at 4:11 PM, arthurh35353 said:

And so we should all be playing on Rebirth with no Quality of Life improvements? Why are you here then?

 

That is an assumption that it would break the code. It may not be simple of feasible, but saying any change breaks the code is just kind of lazy in argument.

 

If you want a complete auto-pilot game, look at Raid Shadow Legends.

And simply because YOU, personally, are in favor of something doesn't mean it's a QOL "improvement".

As to why we're here, we're here to play CoH.  As CoH.
Not to bastardize it into an RSL clone.

[arcane]

4 hours ago, MsSmart said:

I used endurance as an example, not the main reason. Now you brought it up, powers by-passing animations... I feel in many cases the animations are utterly ridiculous and long, I have a scrapper and there is a button that I must keep pressing in order to have Status Effect protections, without it - I am toast. So roughly every minute, in the middle of combat, I stop and do my glorious looking great clowning act, while all the mobs go , ha ha ha, free shots everyone! and they get at least 2 rounds of beating me up each while I am doing a totally stupid animation.  Frankly with buttons you press over and over again, should have no animations at all past the first time you did the dance of the idiot. Buttons like tough, and weave, the animations or the rooting that goes with them is far too long, I know they were worse, but stupid remains stupid despite that it was dumber. Frankly all buttons, should have a quick animation and be done.

 

Sue

Yeah if you have such fundamental problems with the game’s most basic mechanisms this might not be the game for you. It sounds like you’re in a world of problems the second you log in.

[lemming]

I have a few characters with a bunch of toggles.  I wouldn't mind a button to toggle on all of them, but you'd have to figure out a way to configure which ones and which order, and probably have it just turn on powers skipping ones already on.  (Say after you get end drained and pop a blue)

Low priority though

[Nerio72]

It would be much easier to hit one button for my combos also, can we do that too?  I don't really want that, just trying to show how once you start doing things like this where we're headed. Pretty soon we just log in and all the enemies fall over "arrested"? I have toggle heavy toons and yes it's a pain sometimes but I'm my opinion, I don't think it should be that easy, that's the trade off for having those powers. Again, just my opinion...

[Replacement]

On 2/21/2021 at 4:58 PM, SwitchFade said:

More afkarena, simplified, no tactics required, no consequences, no thought game mechanics are definitely no benefit.

Activating a train of boring toggles is not playing the game for you, it does not require tactics, it has no consequences outside of time sink, and it is already no-thought.

 

I'm not really on board with this suggestion*, but I don't think you're being reasonable to tell @arthurh35353 not to be hyperbolic in response to calling out your hyperbole.  You claiming this makes the game any of what you claimed is no better than saying "find a server that hates QoL."

 

*Standard Code Rant pending, I think I'd be on board with an intermediate of ignoring animations when flagged out of combat.  My understanding of the power files though, tells me this would require 3 separate power entries per armor toggle (base entry with 2 conditional redirects), so this isn't a realistic suggestion.

[SwitchFade]

23 minutes ago, Replacement said:

Activating a train of boring toggles is not playing the game for you, it does not require tactics, it has no consequences outside of time sink, and it is already no-thought.

 

I'm not really on board with this suggestion*, but I don't think you're being reasonable to tell @arthurh35353 not to be hyperbolic in response to calling out your hyperbole.  You claiming this makes the game any of what you claimed is no better than saying "find a server that hates QoL."

 

*Standard Code Rant pending, I think I'd be on board with an intermediate of ignoring animations when flagged out of combat.  My understanding of the power files though, tells me this would require 3 separate power entries per armor toggle (base entry with 2 conditional redirects), so this isn't a realistic suggestion.

If toggle dropping has no consequences, by way of mass retoggling, tactical gameplay that is observant of that is eliminated. I no longer am I as mindful of end issues or stacked status effects. I am not penelized for allowing my toggles to crash. If end drained by malta, for example, shall I continue to fight and then execute limited retoggling? punch 3 purple insps and roll on? Fall back and hit blues or break LoS? Entire factions are built around their ability to negate your toggles. I must manage this process tactically, which I have done. Another facet, End crash powers now have less penalty associated with use. There are numerous scenarios that highlight the balance and functionally integrated mechanic the animation represents.

 

Altering basecode to allow the requested function would have drastic consequences. None of this is hyperbole, it's based in actual case evidence.

 

An example/analogy of how the request is not QoL: a certain person at my work is immaculately stubborn when demanding system changes to a specific portion of New Product Introduction, furiously and vociferously declaring that their simple change to datasheet generation, distribution, revision and dissemination has nothing to do with NPI and is just a simple QoL improvement... Not realizing that the entire system architecture is integrated, and a single change breaks system logic for projects, valuation, general ledger, PAC, dashboards, alerts, supply chain, resource procurement... The list is endless.

 

Really... It's not hyperbole, I spend countless hours as a system architect and analyst... This is not a good idea.

[Herotu]

On 2/21/2021 at 3:22 AM, Shenanigunner said:

It's trivial to write a bind or macro that will bring up multiple toggles with multiple taps.

ohh... 

...is it?

 

  

1 hour ago, Replacement said:

Activating a train of boring toggles is not playing the game for you, it does not require tactics, it has no consequences outside of time sink, and it is already no-thought.

 

I'm not really on board with this suggestion*, but I don't think you're being reasonable to tell @arthurh35353 not to be hyperbolic in response to calling out your hyperbole.  You claiming this makes the game any of what you claimed is no better than saying "find a server that hates QoL."

 

*Standard Code Rant pending, I think I'd be on board with an intermediate of ignoring animations when flagged out of combat.  My understanding of the power files though, tells me this would require 3 separate power entries per armor toggle (base entry with 2 conditional redirects), so this isn't a realistic suggestion.

It's interesting, I liken this suggestion to the, "I want more powers that can be set to Autocast".

 

I guess it's convenience, but back in the day it was core gameplay to keep casting hasten or whatever as soon as it was off cooldown.

 

This is the difference between strategy (casting it because it will be useful in the current circumstance) and convenience (casting it because either it's useful all the time or it has a cooldown shorter than it's duration).

Edited February 23, 2021 by Herotu

[Replacement]

1 hour ago, SwitchFade said:

If toggle dropping has no consequences, by way of mass retoggling, tactical gameplay that is observant of that is eliminated. I no longer am I as mindful of end issues or stacked status effects. I am not penelized for allowing my toggles to crash. If end drained by malta, for example, shall I continue to fight and then execute limited retoggling? punch 3 purple insps and roll on? Fall back and hit blues or break LoS? Entire factions are built around their ability to negate your toggles. I must manage this process tactically, which I have done. Another facet, End crash powers now have less penalty associated with use. There are numerous scenarios that highlight the balance and functionally integrated mechanic the animation represents.

 

Altering basecode to allow the requested function would have drastic consequences. None of this is hyperbole, it's based in actual case evidence.

 

An example/analogy of how the request is not QoL: a certain person at my work is immaculately stubborn when demanding system changes to a specific portion of New Product Introduction, furiously and vociferously declaring that their simple change to datasheet generation, distribution, revision and dissemination has nothing to do with NPI and is just a simple QoL improvement... Not realizing that the entire system architecture is integrated, and a single change breaks system logic for projects, valuation, general ledger, PAC, dashboards, alerts, supply chain, resource procurement... The list is endless.

 

Really... It's not hyperbole, I spend countless hours as a system architect and analyst... This is not a good idea.

Thank you. I accept and respect this response.

[Shenanigunner]

3 hours ago, Herotu said:

ohh... 

...is it?

 

Short answer: see the Guide. Sectons on both multiple powers per bind, and the newer, kewler, pseudo-auto-fire binds.

 

Also some threads on this in General Discussion.