Focused Feedback: Travel Power Updates (Build 1)

[Taboo]

On 3/13/2021 at 5:26 AM, GM Arcanum said:

 Super Speed +  Ninja Run

Some of these changes are wonderful.

 

On 3/13/2021 at 5:26 AM, GM Arcanum said:

Now a timed toggle with a 30 second duration and a 60 second cooldown

Seems to be a nerf.

 

On 3/13/2021 at 5:26 AM, GM Arcanum said:

 Stealth

• Stealth radius increased to match the numbers Invisibility had before this patch
  • PvE radius has increased from 36ft to 55ft
  • PvP radius has increased from 389ft to 611ft
• Out of combat defence increased from 3.5% to 7%

Nice boost  it's out of combat.. and defense is spelled with an 's'

 

On 3/13/2021 at 5:26 AM, GM Arcanum said:

 Speed Phase

• New secondary (server tray) power

Wow.. nope it's that lame popup tray guess won't be using this.

 

[Taboo]

4 hours ago, Jimmy said:

No longer applies Only Affect Self or any other effects - Evasive Maneuvers has inherited most of Afterburner's old defensive effects

Misleading.

Removed one thing and added something different. Out of Combat is not equal to Only Affecting Self.

[ninja surprise]

7 minutes ago, Taboo said:

Seems to be a nerf.

 

Nope, it's a bonus buff. 

New Fly is as fast as old Fly + old Afterburner.

New Afterburner is a brief turbo-boost on top of that.

So with just one power pick you're going as fast as you used to with two picks, and the bonus speed boost has you going even faster still.

[Tigraine]

2 minutes ago, ninja surprise said:

Nope, it's a bonus buff. 

New Fly is as fast as old Fly + old Afterburner.

New Afterburner is a brief turbo-boost on top of that.

So with just one power pick you're going as fast as you used to with two picks, and the bonus speed boost has you going even faster still.

By numbers, it's a buff.

By mechanics, it's a nerf.

People clearly have different priorities and preferences here, and we need to recognize that we're each coming at it from different angles and stop speaking in absolutes that dismiss the other point of view.

[Taboo]

2 minutes ago, ninja surprise said:

Nope, it's a bonus buff. 

New Fly is as fast as old Fly + old Afterburner.

New Afterburner is a brief turbo-boost on top of that.

So with just one power pick you're going as fast as you used to with two picks, and the bonus speed boost has you going even faster still.

That is helpful. More than some comments.

Still can't go as fast as possible until endurance runs out. Nerfed

[SwitchFade]

Hmm. First, thanks for all the hard work.

 

Some considerations,

 

Now that 2 similar travel powers that are not mutually exclusive, this presents a problem. Before, I have alt tray slot 9 and 10 keybound to 2 side mouse buttons under my thumb. I put CJ in 9 and SJ in 10. I hit one Button and CJ is togged on, I hit thebother and it toggles on SJ, while toggling off CJ, because they are mutually exclusive. I switch back and forth, in and out of combat. Now, I will be running with both on, as they don't "toggle" between each other. To rectify this, I could create 2 macros, each an inversion of the other, where one turns on cj and one SJ, both turning off their counterpart. Unfortunately, now the icon is macro icon, not the original icon. If I don't monitor this or make macro, I could accidentally be running both, which is a much higher end drain. All my travel powers on all toons are like this, those two specific mouse buttons are the two travel powers using alttray9 and 10, under my thumb, instinct to switch back and forth.

 

 

[Infinitum]

I just ran an interesting test on Evasive maneuvers

 

Setup: Kat Nin Scrapper 60% def to AOE MELEE RANGED

EvM boosts that to ~75%

 

Running Sprint, Ath Run and EvM

 

Maria Jenkins Infernal Mission +4/8

 

When you attack the defense bonus drops, same as when you are attacked.

 

If you evade you will regain the bonus back on average in 3 seconds - so unless you hang around - you will retain the EvM defense bonus as long as you keep moving - literally a few yards away from the engagement.

[Captain Powerhouse]

Note:

Currently Evasive Maneuvers defense cancels under the following conditions:

User attacks

User interacts with mission objective

User is hit by enemy

 

In the next patch, Evasive Maneuvers defense will cancel under the following conditions only:

User attacks

User interacts with mission objective

 

With the change, should the user be mid fight, not attacking for 10 seconds will restore that defense even if you are being hit.

[Infinitum]

3 minutes ago, Captain Powerhouse said:

Note:

Currently Evasive Maneuvers defense cancels under the following conditions:

User attacks

User interacts with mission objective

User is hit by enemy

 

In the next patch, Evasive Maneuvers defense will cancel under the following conditions only:

User attacks

User interacts with mission objective

 

With the change, should the user be mid fight, not attacking for 10 seconds will restore that defense even if you are being hit.

so what i am seeing now with it restoring if evading the fight in around 3 seconds will not be the norm?

[Captain Powerhouse]

8 minutes ago, Infinitum said:

so what i am seeing now with it restoring if evading the fight in around 3 seconds will not be the norm?

 

It was 4s but no. We will still be in testing for a while longer and things might be adjusted further, but the goal of the suppression was to allow players to attack without de-toggling the power, but retain the save-travel aspect.

 

Not dropping defense when being hit seems important to retain that utility.

 

Even if the "defense remains when hit" aspect was not there, 4s was too generously short.

[Troo]

5 minutes ago, Captain Powerhouse said:

Note:

Currently Evasive Maneuvers defense cancels under the following conditions:

User attacks

User interacts with mission objective

User is hit by enemy

 

In the next patch, Evasive Maneuvers defense will cancel under the following conditions only:

User attacks

User interacts with mission objective

 

With the change, should the user be mid fight, not attacking for 10 seconds will restore that defense even if you are being hit

 

I think what you'll find is folks like the on/off aspect of live Afterburner for the defense numbers AND for increase flight speed cap increase.

Only Affecting Self was the downside before and is being reduced further to Outside of Combat with Evasive Maneuvers.

 

Outside of Combat could turn off at any moment by external or even accidental means. For a tier 5 pool power it seems dependability should be paramount.

[Infinitum]

1 minute ago, Captain Powerhouse said:

 

It was 4s but no. We will still be in testing for a while longer and things might be adjusted further, but the goal of the suppression was to allow players to attack without de-toggling the power, but retain the save-travel aspect.

 

Not dropping defense when being hit seems important to retain that utility.

 

Even if the "defense remains when hit" aspect was not there, 4s was too generously short.

I agree, plus it makes sense that if you are evading you wouldnt be noticed until you interact anyway - then you have 10 seconds to create distance - evasion to regain the bonus - seems fair to me.

[Apparition]

4 hours ago, Coldshock said:

With i7p2, does this mean there is no accuracy penalty if shooting while flying (with fly/hover on at the same time)?

 

There hasn't been an accuracy penalty in a long, long, long time.  Since well before sunset.

[Tigraine]

13 minutes ago, Captain Powerhouse said:

 

It was 4s but no. We will still be in testing for a while longer and things might be adjusted further, but the goal of the suppression was to allow players to attack without de-toggling the power, but retain the save-travel aspect.

(boldface added for emphasis)

 

27 minutes ago, Captain Powerhouse said:

In the next patch, Evasive Maneuvers defense will cancel under the following conditions only:

User attacks

 

Color me confused.

 

[Troo]

Just now, Infinitum said:

read what he just said - it will only be if you interact - so if you dont kick the hornets nest you will retain the bonus. and even then you can create enough space in 10 seconds to regain the bonus.

So lava, fire, falling, buffing teammate OR Damage-Over-Time will have no impact?

Current Afterburner = on-demand performance.

Proposed Evasive Maneuvers = could be negated at any moment.

 

For anyone who uses the +def to get in or out of combat, they'll now only be able to use 1/2 of that functionality sometimes. It is a departure.

It could definitely work if allowed +def on activation no matter what so long as the player does not attack and it only got cancelled when the player attacks.

[Replacement]

Mechanics lesson:

 

Toggles have activation time.  They do not have deactivation time (usually).  This means if you pair two "powexecname" commands in the same bind, only one toggle can activate.

 

I am trying to figure out why this has failed for others in the past but...

 

If you were able to get this command to work on Live:
 

/bind x "powexecname fly$$powexecname hover"

 

...Then you will be unaffected by the exclusivity changes.  Even with it being possible to run both toggles at the same time now, this bind can only activate one toggle at a time, but can deactivate many.

 

Let's run through some scenarios!

• You have neither toggle active:
  -- Hover will activate (it's at the end of the list so it wins).
• You have both active:
  -- Both will deactivate.
• You have Fly active:
  -- Fly will deactivate (it takes no action so it can process in parallel) and Hover will activate.

This means you can go from having neither active (such as standing up from dead) to activating JUST hover, and then from there it will automatically become a toggle switch.

 

Frankly, it's impossible for a bind like this to force you to be stuck hovering and flying.

[Captain Powerhouse]

2 minutes ago, Troo said:

So lava, fire, falling, buffing teammate OR Damage-Over-Time will have no impact?

 

No, only thing that will cancel the defense will be the user himself attacking or activating a mission objective (glowies.)

If the player does not attack, the defense buff remains.

[GM Lines]

4 minutes ago, Tigraine said:

(boldface added for emphasis)

 

 

Color me confused.

 

 

Not sure if this clarifies the confusion:

The power itself won't detoggle if a player uses an attack, but the defence buff (and only the defence buff) will be supressed. This is the same as how it currently works on beta, except that currently it also suppresses if an enemy hits the player.

 

Components of the power like -fly and immob resist and the flight control will remain active whether in combat or not.

 

[Troo]

2 minutes ago, Captain Powerhouse said:

 

No, only thing that will cancel the defense will be the user himself attacking or activating a mission objective (glowies.)

If the player does not attack, the defense buff remains.

 

But if we were attacking. No on-demand functionality, have to wait 10 seconds.

 

Thanks for the replies and participation CP

[Troo]

18 minutes ago, Captain Powerhouse said:

No, only thing that will cancel the defense will be the user himself attacking or activating a mission objective (glowies.)

If the player does not attack, the defense buff remains.

 

This sounds like a 'must have' power for support characters looking for defense.

[ninja surprise]

1 minute ago, Troo said:

 

This sounds like a 'must have' power for support characters looking for defense.

 

Or for people who want the defense IO mule they previously used Afterburner for.

[Sovera]

3 minutes ago, ninja surprise said:

 

Or for people who want the defense IO mule they previously used Afterburner for.

True, but since I do want the LotG I'll pick it, but it's no different from me picking Vengeance. It's not for a pressing desire to actually use it on dead team members. That said I prefered picking and slotting Afterburner. I'm not yet sure I will actually use Evasive with its 'modest' cost of 0.52, AKA twice the cost of a regular toggle.

[Captain Powerhouse]

8 minutes ago, Troo said:

This sounds like a 'must have' power for support characters looking for defense.

 

Good point, and will look into options to prevent that.

[Bopper]

2 hours ago, Sovera said:

True, but since I do want the LotG I'll pick it, but it's no different from me picking Vengeance. It's not for a pressing desire to actually use it on dead team members. That said I prefered picking and slotting Afterburner. I'm not yet sure I will actually use Evasive with its 'modest' cost of 0.52, AKA twice the cost of a regular toggle.

If I recall, I believe afterburner costs more to use. 0.65/sec.

 

I will have Evasive on all my squishies. It's a hover blaster's wet dream to move as freely/quickly in combat. Plus the Immob protection and KB resistance, yes please.

Edited March 14, 2021 by Bopper

[Bopper]

4 minutes ago, Captain Powerhouse said:

 

Good point, and will look into options to prevent that.

 Would ActivateOnAttackClick work? I never could tell what the distinction between that and what Attacked is