Kinetic Melee: Talk to me

[One IV All]

Who has played this on a Tanker? I know it can have  a bad rep, but has anyone found ways for it to shine?

 

It’s T1-T3 attacks seem snappy. Seems to have decent crowd control with Burst and Repulsing Torrent (which is actually ranged and kind of act as taunt).

 

The -Dmg it does can help lower the damage done to your team passively, even though it’s minor.

 

Are there any specific primaries on a Tanker you feel works really well with Kinetic Melee? My reason for looking at a Tanker is I could probably proc out more of KM’s attacks on them, in order to help with the middling damage.

[Spaghetti Betty]

I am unfortunately an avid Kinetic Melee hater. It serves pretty well on Stalkers, but every other AT has to work insanely hard to get the same output as nearly any other Melee available.

 

You will pretty much be doing the first 3 attacks over and over again, save for if you feel like adding Gloom and an epic hold for utility shenanigans. Focused Burst is fun. but is not optimal. Definitely do take it if you like it! I know I did.

 

If you're intent on this, my ideal pairings would be Bio, Rad, or Elec. Pretty much anything that will allow you to have a nice amount of mitigation, while also adding something to your damage.

 

Again, just if you're looking for something efficient. You should focus on what's fun for you at the end of the day.

 

This was my best shot at making a fun /KM Tanker. Yes, I do play it.

Tanker (Bio Armor - Kinetic Melee).mbd

Edited April 28 by Spaghetti Betty

[Sovera]

I've tried it on all ATs. Definitely go Stalker as you will be spamming your first three attacks and the ST will never feel great outside of AS. Then pair it with perhaps Stone for all the goodies including recharge. The BU of Stalkers' Kinetic Melee is unlike the BU the other ATs get from KM as it is a regular 90 second, 1.3 activation power that grants 80% damage and 20% ToHit for 10 seconds.

 

All the other ATs get the 2.1 activation, 120 seconds recharge that gives 25% damage and 7.5% ToHit that then stacks for 5 times as you hit for the next 20 seconds.

 

Between the normal BU, Assassin's Strike, and the proc to reset BU, it is, IMO, the best version of KM.

 

 

It works for all other ATs though, it's just slow. Can't really have good damage when spamming T1 and T2, then the slow animation of Power Siphon, then the ramp up, then the mediocre AoE (though it can slot in an FF).

[Erratic1]

Kinetic Melee is something you should avoid unless you accept up front it will never give you the functionality of some other offensive set.

 

I say that as someone who, for some unknown reason, is levelling a Willpower/KM Tanker. What can I say? I like challenges.

Edited April 28 by Erratic1

[One IV All]

Thanks all. I guess I was just hoping there was something that could help make KM more optimal on a Tanker 😂😂😂 I guess it needs the Fiery/Energy/Battle Axe adjustments.

[Infinitum]

1 hour ago, One IV All said:

Thanks all. I guess I was just hoping there was something that could help make KM more optimal on a Tanker 😂😂😂 I guess it needs the Fiery/Energy/Battle Axe adjustments.

 

Yep, there's no way to make it optimal, lol   but it still can be fun - but you have to tune the meta out of your head to go there with KM.

 

Definitely needs a boost.

[Warboss]

So, my opinion is a bit different than everyone's else. There does need to be some Dev love, but the set isn't really designed for "Max Damage", the set is set up for soft control with KB (a mistake for Melee toons). The solution is to slot with KB>KD IOs. Is that optimal, no, is a practical... probably not, but it does make the set useful for mitigation' and keeping the mobs on their backsides. You won't be a Fiery Melee blast furnace, but you will have some ranged control that other sets don't provide. I find KM useful when running with new players, or not vary advanced players. You can add procs if you want to up damage potential, but you'll likely be disappointed. If you want damage choose something else, if you want a set that allows a different kind of control, give it a shot.

 

 

[Spaghetti Betty]

48 minutes ago, Warboss said:

So, my opinion is a bit different than everyone's else. There does need to be some Dev love, but the set isn't really designed for "Max Damage", the set is set up for soft control with KB (a mistake for Melee toons). The solution is to slot with KB>KD IOs. Is that optimal, no, is a practical... probably not, but it does make the set useful for mitigation' and keeping the mobs on their backsides. You won't be a Fiery Melee blast furnace, but you will have some ranged control that other sets don't provide. I find KM useful when running with new players, or not vary advanced players. You can add procs if you want to up damage potential, but you'll likely be disappointed. If you want damage choose something else, if you want a set that allows a different kind of control, give it a shot.

 

 

Good point!

Stone, Axe, SS, Ice, MA, Staff, and even Claws with slotting can do this better with much higher damage output on all fronts. ❤️ 

[Yomo Kimyata]

Another factor behind the original design of Kinetic Melee (in my opinion, I wasn't there) was that it adds an extra layer of protection in the form of -damage debuff on enemies.  This has the approximate effect of additional damage resistance, which would enhance survivability.

 

Unfortunately in this iteration, survivability is pretty much a given, especially for tankers with their ATOs.  And so, players don't notice they are surviving more, since they have no problem surviving, and players then focus on why isn't my damage higher.

 

I don't like Kinetic Melee enough to play it on a tanker or a brute, but I'll get some use out of it on stalkers or scrappers.  Scrappers get a recharge of Power Siphon when Concentrated Strike crits (20% chance) but unfortunately that chance is not enhanced by either of the scrapper ATO procs.

 

[BrandX]

Is Kinetic Melee the lowest in terms of ST DPS?  Generally, yes.  Though only dead last on Brutes it seems, with second to last for Tankers.

However, the difference between Tanker's top ST DPS and Kinetic Melee is roughly 90 seconds, going by @Ston's DPS charts.  So, imo, the difference just gets blown out of proportion.

 

I would personally like to see some real work done on Focused Burst to help it's ST DPS.  This attack is so nice looking, and it's such a shame that it's better to take an Epic Blast.  This attack needs to be reworked into snipe/gloom level imo, so people will want to take it instead.

 

Sadly for Tanker's Concentrated Strike doesn't reset Power Siphon, so right now, I'm not so sure it's worth taking on Tankers.  I only use the attack once on my Scrapper, as a chance to reset Power Siphon.  If it doesn't do it, I don't use it again until the next Power Siphon window.  Sadly, it's chance to trigger PS reset seems to be low.

If you want the best out of Kinetic Melee, go Bio Armor for sure.  That armor set is going to make EVERYTHING Melee Set nice, in terms of damage 🙂

[Erratic1]

1 hour ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

Another factor behind the original design of Kinetic Melee (in my opinion, I wasn't there) was that it adds an extra layer of protection in the form of -damage debuff on enemies.  This has the approximate effect of additional damage resistance, which would enhance survivability.

 

 

It is a pretty minimal enhancement when dealing with groups as the only means of area application is Burst, though it does debuff 14% for 7 seconds. If the debuff stacks against single targets though, it would be a plus against bosses/AVs.

 

40 minutes ago, BrandX said:

Sadly for Tanker's Concentrated Strike doesn't reset Power Siphon, so right now, I'm not so sure it's worth taking on Tankers.  I only use the attack once on my Scrapper, as a chance to reset Power Siphon.  If it doesn't do it, I don't use it again until the next Power Siphon window.  Sadly, it's chance to trigger PS reset seems to be low.

 

It does boost your damage over five hits and the power lasts for 20 seconds. You should have time to max it and then make attacks at full value. Its as worth it as Build Up. The downside is it only grants 7.5% To-Hit.

[BrandX]

1 hour ago, Erratic1 said:

 

It is a pretty minimal enhancement when dealing with groups as the only means of area application is Burst, though it does debuff 14% for 7 seconds. If the debuff stacks against single targets though, it would be a plus against bosses/AVs.

 

 

It does boost your damage over five hits and the power lasts for 20 seconds. You should have time to max it and then make attacks at full value. Its as worth it as Build Up. The downside is it only grants 7.5% To-Hit.

 

Power Siphon is worth it, what I was saying was Concentrated Strike not being able to reset Power Siphon (like it can for Scrappers) doesn't seem to make CS worth taking.

[Erratic1]

7 minutes ago, BrandX said:

 

Power Siphon is worth it, what I was saying was Concentrated Strike not being able to reset Power Siphon (like it can for Scrappers) doesn't seem to make CS worth taking.

 

Ahh. Misread. It is one of your highest damage/animation time abilities according to Mid's. It also gives you 8s on damage debuff, which beats out everything but Burst. And you might disorient your target.

 

 

Edited April 30 by Erratic1

[BrandX]

3 hours ago, Erratic1 said:

 

Ahh. Misread. It is one of your highest damage/animation time abilities according to Mid's. It also gives you 8s on damage debuff, which beats out everything but Burst. And you might disorient your target.

 

 

 

It's DPS comes out lower on my build.  And 2 DMG IOs at +5 with 3 procs each, put it last in DPS too. 😞

[Snarky]

I played it as Invul/KM Tank.  No Tank is bad.  The whole concept was Tank Mage, I made a magic themed/costumed and the big movements look like spell casting.  Then a lot of the stuff is ranged.  Short range but still.  Again, no Tank is bad.  Yawn…uh, what was I saying?   

[nihilii]

I have not found a way to make KM work on Tankers. My Elec/KM Tanker is a tragedy of a character. Weak damage, weak survivability. KM is an old flame and I really wanted this to happen. The +RES meshed with -DAM synergy exists on paper (I even went Void Judgement to stack some more), but falls flat in real gameplay. It's rare I find no redeeming feature to love about a powerset combo, especially a melee powerset combo, but this one really was eye-opening in that I could not squeeze any performance out of it.

[Warboss]

Yeah, in game to performance doesn't transfer. It's a better set for mitigation than damage. But, as @Spaghetti Betty pointed out other sets give you better damage and mitigation as well (Axe probably being the best of both). I'm not sure what KM really needs to get it going in a better direction. My first thought would be to reduce the recharge times and maybe pair down the animation and cast times, then re-evaluate the set. Seems like it was meant to feel fast, but in play it seems slow.

Edited May 1 by Warboss
clearly unable to post at times...