issue 27 Patch Notes for April 20th, 2021 - Issue 27, Page 2

[LQT]

  On 4/22/2021 at 6:17 PM, UberGuy said:

I don't see why it's either so terrible a change or so hard to grok the reasoning

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Because so far no reasoning has been given by the devs despite this being originally asked all the way back during the test notes on the 13th of March. That's the problem. There's been no official word on it despite it being asked several times now and repeated posts by multiple devs after those very questions meaning it's being skipped over as a topic which causes even more frustration.

[LQT]

  On 4/22/2021 at 7:18 PM, PeregrineFalcon said:

Agreed.

 

Also, I'm always amazed when a big patch goes live and people suddenly show up to complain about stuff like this. My question is always "We were testing stuff on the test server and talking about this for weeks, why didn't you mention this then?"

 

This is why it's important to test stuff and discuss it while it's still on the test server and more likely to be changed. Good luck getting the developers to change it now.

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This was asked over a month ago back in Build 1 of the Power changes. There was no reply.

 

[arcane]

  On 4/22/2021 at 7:11 PM, TalonBlue said:

In regards to the changes Rune of Protection, all I have to say is please take a look at Poison now sooner please.

 

Being able to cycle between Melee Hybrid and RoP made Poison’s play style playable. Venomous Gas can be turned off from enemy mezzes and requires the player to be in melee range as well as Poison Trap, on a squishy AT. 

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Between poison’s massive -tohit and options like defense bonuses, melee, clarion, break frees, etc., I promise you poison is still more than playable. Give it a try.

[Wavicle]

  On 4/22/2021 at 8:38 PM, arcane said:

Between poison’s massive -tohit and options like defense bonuses, melee, clarion, break frees, etc., I promise you poison is still more than playable. Give it a try.

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and the -Special from Weaken.

[Wavicle]

  On 4/22/2021 at 8:25 PM, LQT said:

 

This was asked over a month ago back in Build 1 of the Power changes. There was no reply.

 

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I would guess that the devs want to see it in action before deciding if it should preserve a little range. However, I am in favor of this change, as it raises the value of CC powers for containing runners.

[Arbegla]

I mean, having the fast animation have a lower range actually makes a ton of sense, as its not really a 'snipe' at that point, its just another blast (with an insanely high DPA)

The interruptible snipe still has the higher range, so I'm really not sure what the issue is. 80ft is still a pretty long distance, I remember the era of 40ft Blaze...

[UberGuy]

  On 4/22/2021 at 7:00 PM, Uun said:

 

I understand what it's doing, but I'm not sure it makes sense. Combat Jumping and Ninja Run previously stacked with Sprint and Hurdle but couldn't be run together. Now they can be run together, but nothing stacks (including Sprint and Hurdle, which stacked before). Per CoD, travel powers now have a "highest value suppresses others" flag.

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  On 4/22/2021 at 7:03 PM, Arbegla said:

 

I'd like some confirmation that Swift, Hurdle, and Sprint aren't stacking with the existing travel powers, as those had all previous stacked (being Automatic powers and stackable powers in every regard).

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Um, no, that's not correct.

 

This is from the JumpSpeed attribmod in Combat Jumping

 

 

That means that powers with the "TravelBuff" stacking key will stack in a way where the highest value wins.

 

This is the JumpSpeed attrbmod from Hurdle

 

 

That's regular vanilla stacking almost every power in the game has. It means it stacks with other stuff that's not the same power cast by the same caster.

 

So Hurdle stacks with whatever wins from  the "TravelBuff" overlapping winner, as do other sources of +jumpspeed like Inertial Reduction.

 

[June]

Wow a lot of updates. I need to fix up my travel powers now, but getting another power for free is never a bad thing. Just would likely want it out of the tray.

 

And the thing that always annoyed me and made me feel vonourable. I can now finally use rocket board and skif and still keep my powers and toogles.

[Arbegla]

  On 4/22/2021 at 9:11 PM, June said:

Wow a lot of updates. I need to fix up my travel powers now, but getting another power for free is never a bad thing. Just would likely want it out of the tray.

 

And the thing that always annoyed me and made me feel vonourable. I can now finally use rocket board and skif and still keep my powers and toogles.

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You can talk to null the gull to remove the extra tray, and then drag the power to your normal tray 🙂

[Replacement]

  On 4/22/2021 at 6:58 PM, Jimmy said:

I was thinking something along the lines of:

• "Although [Super Jump] can be used at the same time as other jumping toggles, only the strongest jump buff will apply."
• "Although [Ninja Run] can be used at the same time as other running and jumping toggles, only the strongest run buff and strongest jump buff will apply."
• "[Sprint]'s movement buff stacks with other travel powers." 

Sprint is actually the exception now so it needs to be noted as such.

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I would suggest dropping "although" at the start, and adding a "but" after the commas. 

 

This would [subjectively, American english] make it seem less like the wording is addressing the past, and more like it's explaining the present.

 

As an example of what I mean, if Blaster Defiance was worded as "no matter your current health..." People who never experienced 1.0 would be scratching their heads.

[Wavicle]

IMO Stealth costs too much end. Comparing it a couple other pool powers, Hover gives the same in combat defense plus mobility and costs substantially less, Evasive Maneuvers also costs less while giving mobility and some status protection. Seems to me Stealth shouldn't cost more than Evasive Maneuvers, possibly even as little as Hover.

Edited April 23, 2021 by Wavicle

[UberGuy]

  On 4/23/2021 at 12:17 AM, Wavicle said:

IMO Stealth costs too much end. Comparing it a couple other pool powers, Hover gives the same in combat defense plus mobility and costs substantially less, Evasive Maneuvers also costs less while giving mobility and some status protection. Seems to me Stealth shouldn't cost more than Evasive Maneuvers, possibly even as little as Hover.

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Yeah. I mean it does more stuff that its base stats, but it's very fiddly about doing so. If it's intended to be impossible to get those benefits in combat, it should probably cost as though it didn't have them, or maybe a bit more.

 

(Note: I haven't run any math on its costs, so maybe the cost does somehow make sense. But based on quick mental analysis, it doesn't seem like it.)

[ForeverLaxx]

  On 4/23/2021 at 12:17 AM, Wavicle said:

Stealth costs too much end

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I've always felt that Stealth, even before it got all these changes, costs too much endurance. It often doesn't provide any more (and sometimes even less) defense in combat than Combat Jumping. Out-of-combat endurance drains aren't really an issue to worry about since you'll almost never slowly lose endurance unless you're also attacking, so giving it a high cost to run simply because you can "skip" some mobs seems like a balance point in the wrong place. It essentially punishes you for trying to use it as a combat power instead of exclusively as an out-of-combat mobility enhancement.

 

  On 4/22/2021 at 8:25 PM, LQT said:

This was asked over a month ago back in Build 1 of the Power changes. There was no reply.

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Unfortunately, it seems that when the devs are set on nerfing or buffing something, it's getting nerfed/buffed no matter what we say about it. All we really have a say in, at least as it appears to me, is the severity/form that buff/nerf gets applied (and sometimes, not even that).

 

That said, I happen to agree with the change. Part of the long windup and interruptible period was offset by the enhanced range and damage of what we now call a "slow" snipe. Getting a faster, instant version of that already does reduced damage (but still way above its expected DPA), and not having the time to "line up the shot" should be represented by having reduced range.

 

Personally, I think losing the "slow" Snipe completely when the mob you target wanders 2 pixels to the left and behind a corner is far more annoying than losing range on the instant version. I hate that Snipes check LoS both at the start and end of the attack animation.

[TalonBlue]

  On 4/22/2021 at 8:38 PM, arcane said:

Between poison’s massive -tohit and options like defense bonuses, melee, clarion, break frees, etc., I promise you poison is still more than playable. Give it a try.

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Poison's massive -to hit debuffs are dependent on being right next to your enemy. Any ranged mez that hits you breaks the Venomous Gas toggle, then everything in melee range murders you. Getting soft capped defense on a Poison Defender isn't easy, IMO, and if you could, what are sacrificing in order to do so? 

 

Inspirations run out.

 

And if you have to wait until you get TWO incarnate powers for mez protection to utilize the later end of your primary's kit in Poison Trap and Venomous Gas then your kit just sucks from the mid game until very late game.

 

I'm fine if being mezzed didn't detoggle Venomous Gas, at least everything melee is still debuffed, and I might survive. Poison's strength is being able to keep Venomous Gas up. Either that needs to be changed or the kit as a whole needs to reworked for a different play style. A play style that doesn't require a squishy to be right in the faces of the enemy to make the most out it's powers. I could just play from a distance... but then I'm not making use of Poison Trap or Venomous Gas.

Edited April 23, 2021 by TalonBlue

[arcane]

  On 4/23/2021 at 12:43 AM, TalonBlue said:

 

Poison's massive -to hit debuffs are dependent on being right next to your enemy. Any ranged mez that hits you breaks the Venomous Gas toggle, then everything in melee range murders you. Getting soft capped defense on a Poison Defender isn't easy, IMO, and if you could, what are sacrificing in order to do so? 

 

Inspirations run out.

 

And if you have to wait until you get TWO incarnate powers for mez protection to utilize the later end of your primary's kit in Poison Trap and Venomous Gas then your kit just sucks from the mid game until very late game.

 

I'm fine if being mezzed didn't detoggle Venomous Gas, at least everything melee is still debuffed, and I might survive. Poison's strength is being able to keep Venomous Gas up. Either that needs to be changed or the kit as a whole needs to reworked for a different play style. A play style that doesn't require a squishy to be right in the faces on the enemy to make the most out it's powers. I could just play from a distance... but then I'm not making use of Poison Trap or Venomous Gas.

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It’s not entirely devoid of risk, especially if you’re constantly trying to solo +4x8 against harder enemy groups so no one else has mezzer aggro and you’re chewing through break frees like mad..., but I have 6 level 50 poisons that have never taken RoP, Melee, or Clarion and am always going to be that guy reminding others that no mez protection is not an instant deathwish. Team. Mez the mezzers. Nuke the mezzers. Burst the mezzers. Use break frees strategically. Pop a luck too when you can. Combine the inspiration categories you don’t need. Etc. Etc. I promise it works. 🙂
 

Oh and don’t expect that you have to be able to solo carnies or rularuu or arachnos at +4x8 with ease at all times on all characters. That one will help a lot.

Edited April 23, 2021 by arcane

[Wavicle]

Actually thinking about it more, even costing as much as Hover is too much. Stealth should cost very little, possibly as little as Combat Jumping.

[Glacier Peak]

  On 4/23/2021 at 12:39 AM, ForeverLaxx said:

Unfortunately, it seems that when the devs are set on nerfing or buffing something, it's getting nerfed/buffed no matter what we say about it. All we really have a say in, at least as it appears to me, is the severity/form that buff/nerf gets applied (and sometimes, not even that).

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Hey I can't say you're wrong about this because it's your opinion, so I'll just say I disagree. Having tested the past few pages, I can say with confidence that the Homecoming team goes out of their way to solicit feedback from players. From in game testing with players on the beta and closed beta servers, to real time discussion going back and forth on powers on Discord, to combing through sometimes mountains of subjective opinions with a few nuggets of actual empirical testing on feedback threads, to player polls, to Developer Corner threads, to taking Suggestions and Feedback posted by players, to addressing support tickets from players.... jeez that sounds like a full time job!! These volunteers are doing a heck of a good job, they listen to us players, they really do. They're players themselves, they don't want pointless nerfs or bugs to exist in this game. Even if players don't agree with some decisions on these servers, you gotta admit Homecoming is doing this game right. 

 

And again, not saying you're wrong, just providing a different perspective. 

[Myrmidon]

And all Respecs are done; back to playing. Again, thanks for the update, team.

[Wavicle]

If stealth toggles aren't going to stack (though hopefully maybe someday) then I should definitely be able to switch between Stealth and Infiltration without being at 0 stealth at any point (assuming I'm not in combat). Hopefully the upcoming fix will also address that.

[June]

  On 4/22/2021 at 10:21 PM, Arbegla said:

 

You can talk to null the gull to remove the extra tray, and then drag the power to your normal tray 🙂

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I know. Just I need to remember to do it XD

I wonder if those powers only activate while you are using travel powers now, though. But then again stuff like afterburner didn't work if you were not already flying anyway? I can't remember

[arcane]

  On 4/23/2021 at 1:02 AM, Glacier Peak said:

Hey I can't say you're wrong about this because it's your opinion, so I'll just say I disagree. Having tested the past few pages, I can say with confidence that the Homecoming team goes out of their way to solicit feedback from players. From in game testing with players on the beta and closed beta servers, to real time discussion going back and forth on powers on Discord, to combing through sometimes mountains of subjective opinions with a few nuggets of actual empirical testing on feedback threads, to player polls, to Developer Corner threads, to taking Suggestions and Feedback posted by players, to addressing support tickets from players.... jeez that sounds like a full time job!! These volunteers are doing a heck of a good job, they listen to us players, they really do. They're players themselves, they don't want pointless nerfs or bugs to exist in this game. Even if players don't agree with some decisions on these servers, you gotta admit Homecoming is doing this game right. 

 

And again, not saying you're wrong, just providing a different perspective. 

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I think it’s completely reasonable now to say that what started as a slight Sorcery nerf was feedbacked (yes I’m making that a verb) into being a nice overall Sorcery buff..

[Carnifax]

  On 4/23/2021 at 1:47 PM, arcane said:

I think it’s completely reasonable now to say that what started as a slight Sorcery nerf was feedbacked (yes I’m making that a verb) into being a nice overall Sorcery buff..

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This. I was one of the people shouting at them that Sorcery was now poop and making it was a waste of Dev resources if it was being left in that state.

 

And it got a rework. And I can only applaud that, even if I still don't agree with the original nerf.

[arcane]

To be clear, my Sorcery characters that were running this setup were indeed very slightly nerfed in net terms: Spirit Ward, not in tray, just a Preventive Medicine mule; Mystic Flight; Rune of Protection with several slots. Not significantly noticeable in practice to me, but yes - a nerf by the numbers.

Meanwhile, the build I set up to make use of changes to all 5 powers (Arcane Bolt/Enflame/Spirit Ward heavily slotted, Rune of Protection just two Res IO’s) experienced a *massive* buff overnight.

[gamingglen]

  On 4/22/2021 at 6:28 PM, Wavicle said:

Yes, having that much range on the fast version was broken.

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Broken?  How?   

 

Devs haven't given a reason because there's no good reason.  

 

[gamingglen]

  On 4/22/2021 at 8:44 PM, Wavicle said:

I would guess that the devs want to see it in action before deciding if it should preserve a little range. However, I am in favor of this change, as it raises the value of CC powers for containing runners.

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I solo. There's no CC with my playing.  That's a BS reason anyway.