What do you think is the most even power set?

[Kung Fu Cow]

I was playing with some buddies who are not old hand COH players and it brought up some interesting discussions on ATs/powersets. Obviously all things are not created equal, though every thing is viable, some of it just blooms late. Some guys picked some pretty bad late bloom combos and decided to reroll and that got us talking. So what do you guys think the most even power set/AT to level is? 
 

I feel like a lot of dominator (not plants/ seeds is just broken silly), tank, controller builds peak late maybe? For my money it would have to be claws/Sr scrapper. Claws gets a nice satisfying attack chain by like 18. In my experience all defenses feel meh till late anyway, but SR can cap def pretty early as I remember. Staff/ scrappers and stalkers feel satisfying, though I am always unsure what secondary, WP is super fire and forget passive but again think most defenses on offensive are late blooming (into 30s) before I really notice them anyway. Stalker stealth may be the lowest level, feels good from the start power. I will also say in a team, no defender I have ever rolled felt useless, until later when buffs or heals seem redundant. 
 

let’s hear other people’s thoughts on maybe the best leveling AT/power sets, things there feel good from 1-50 vs just big bad 50 builds. 

[KaizenSoze]

Sentinel are good from 1-50. After, 50 they have issues.

 

Not exactly what I think you're asking for but it's in the spirit.

[Snarky]

Are you talking AT or powersets?  The most balanced powerset that comes to mind is Willpower Armor.  Does great, the only struggle it has is trying to overclock it to meet  uber standards.  Which argues for it being balanced

 

Balanced Archetypes?  Is that possible?  All have some deficiencies depending on content and most can be overclocked and a used. Given the right powersets and build. I could point out some of my least favorite Archetypes.  But I would say Brutes, on whole, are the most balanced Archetype if I had to choose just one.    Very solid.  Not great damage while soling, because you are almost always at the beginning of a fight.  But during team battles when Fury is pegged they do very well. 

[Kung Fu Cow]

3 minutes ago, Snarky said:

Are you talking AT or powersets?  The most balanced powerset that comes to mind is Willpower Armor.  Does great, the only struggle it has is trying to overclock it to meet  uber standards.  Which argues for it being balanced

 

Balanced Archetypes?  Is that possible?  All have some deficiencies depending on content and most can be overclocked and a used. Given the right powersets and build. I could point out some of my least favorite Archetypes.  But I would say Brutes, on whole, are the most balanced Archetype if I had to choose just one.    Very solid.  Not great damage while soling, because you are almost always at the beginning of a fight.  But during team battles when Fury is pegged they do very well. 

I think a lot of times people focus on the power of a combo or how good it can be end game, but some AT/powers just play better start to finish (like my claws example, I think claws scrappers never feel bad, always have fun buttons to press, but I’ve had some tank builds that go long stretches using brawl and prestige attacks and it feels janky) 

 

just was curious what other folks find enjoyable and powerful feeling from 1-50 vs l33t 50 Builds. 

[Dona Eis Requiem]

I thoroughly enjoy(ed) my BR/Dev blaster from 1-50.  It's when I get into the Incarnate stuff that I get bored with any character, tbh. 

Maybe it's a symptom from having played a lot before it became a thing, but I can just feel the p2w residuals in it. 

I don't really feel like I'm on any particularly meaningful part of my characters journey after a certain point, it's just MOAR POWAH! Meh...

A little too megalomaniacal for a hero, to me. Like Superman vs. Dark Superman.

[Snarky]

I used to like my Dark Dark Blaster for 1-50 and Incarnate.  The more I learn to play it the more I love it.  Great Damage and very good toolkit of utility powers

Edited September 7, 2021 by Snarky

[tidge]

I level my characters through 'regular' content, so my response is formed through that lens.

 

Defensively: I think Willpower is probably the smoothest set, although Bio's Adaptation helps to smooth out a lot of other choices. IIRC Super Reflexes has an AoE gap that can be hard to live with if difficulties are turned up. I haven't played all the other sets, but the other ones I have played rely on enhancement slots to really sing.

 

Control: I find these sets to all be very 'clunky', because of the low damage.... with the possible exception of Gravity's Propel.

 

Offensively: I don't tend to notice, unless I'm waiting for attacks to recharge. I havn't tried Titan Weapons, but I found War Mace to be a set that was "too slow" (while leveling) for my taste. At level 50, it is fine.

 

I rather like the VEATs. The forced respec is annoying, but once completed your character has new sets of powers with extra slots to place!

[Mezmera]

For control and aggro control it's just going to be an uneven feel leveling.  Tanks and control need to take their primary powers so they are of use to the team as advertised. 

 

Doms do bloom late in the 30's and 40's because this is where they get their best assaults and should already have their control situated, same with Controllers but they get more support later on.  Tanks finally can get more than jab+taunt into their repertoire. 

 

Most of the other AT's get their fun assaults in their primary so they can take what they like and then dabble in their secondary when each of those powers becomes available.  

[SomeGuy]

Gotta agree with the Claws melee sentiment. It gets everything it needs really early, feels great 1-50, and shines super bright with incarnates.

[arcane]

Willpower is the most obvious answer since you can reasonably expect to log in with your toggles on, never click a damn thing your entire session, and have basically everything neatly taken care of.

[DoctorDitko]

Agreed on the Willpower set! Once the anemic Taunt was brought up to par, WP became my favorite Tank primary.

 

I understand the Devs wanted at least some Tanks to be responding to different threats with different defenses, but in practice having to switch toggles mid-fight seems less like Tanking and more like plugging leaks and patching holes.

 

WP, once you get your END issues solved, is just more fun for me. As long as you don't accidentally hit your Stoppable button. (The self-pranking Tank strikes again!)

[Riverdusk]

Have to say my latest, a dark melee/energy aura scrapper was easy sailing from early level all the way through 50+.  It gets both good single target and aoe early (especially now with the touch of fear change).  It gets a heal early and its tohit debuffs synergize well with a powerful defense set.  Even early on bosses were whiffing after I hit them a couple of times or put a touch of fear on them.  Even the psi hole isn't as bad thanks to the extra healing and tohit debuffs.

 

It doesn't get endurance help until level 28 might be the only early issue.  But I do have to say I always make use of the P2W buffs at least through level 30 or so, and typically also pick up the SG +recovery base buff, so that wasn't a real big issue either.  Neither buff are expensive at lower levels even for newbies, just more that someone has to let them know they exist.

 

 

[Spaghetti Betty]

A lot are saying Willpower, which I agree if you're truly looking for something you just turn on and never look at again. But I gotta say Radiation Armor is up there as a set that stays reliable through progression and only gets better. Even if you're tight on inf, some smart SO slotting and a few cherry picked IOs (theft of essence in Radiation Therapy = no more end problems) will have you rolling at a nice pace. It also pairs nicely with a lot of melee sets, my favorite being Dark Melee.

[Ukase]

I think the scrapper & stalker are the most balanced across all levels of play. Often, with brutes, once a certain resist and/or defense threshold is reached, the difficulty can be increased and you can go nuts. With scrappers and stalkers and their comparatively lower HP (and thus regen), and their random crits...they seem to average out more consistently in the mid levels. 

Brutes are always great early, due to Fury. But in the middle levels, before 30, they are lacking, and pick back up in the mid-30's are then can do whatever you like with them, just about. The scrapper/stalker is more slow and steady. Less effective AoE due to a lack of taunt aura, so just not as effective - but still, with the crits and such, it's more consistent across all the levels - at least, that's my perception. 

I still would make a brute over a scrapper. Much better damage (anecdotally). Scrapper Crits often happen on the killing blow with only a sliver left, anecdotally. Combined with lower HP, they're not worth it to me. Fury is far more consistent. But that's another topic. 

[Sovera]

I find Tanks tend to suffer more with late peakness. In a MMO 90% of content is killing things. Slogging through 32-38 levels to get important powers is just bad.

 

But it would be okay if exemplaring ever was reworked (vain hope). Slogging -once- to 38 to get Footstomp and finally an AoE would be reasonable if from then on every exemplaring had it available albeit at a reduced power a la GW2 system.

 

Sets that have an early AoE and early ST work a lot better when their later powers is just something to add more spice.

 

Tanks also suffer from the sadness that is having Taunt pushing important powers for later. Swap Taunt for Rage and suddenly SS is a lot more palatable as a SS character at least has damage backing its ST to make for their bad... well... everything, starting at level 16-18. Same with Soul Drain for the same reason. Stone Melee's sole AoE at 28. Exchange places with Taunt and a Stone Melee in an AoE game like CoH can do something.

 

Some sets show a lack of understanding of the game. Tanks got Martial Art's sole AoE down to 20. I applaud this. But looking at a Brute version of the Martial Arts/Fire Armor build I never even desired to play it since my first AoE comes at 26 and the next at 28 Have fun leveling with only a P2W attack for AoE. Which again, would be okay, if from then on that 'danger' did not loom if exemplaring lower than that happened.

 

It's why I wax poetic over things like Fire Armor/Ice with early AoE at level 4, Build-up at 16, Burn at 18, Ice Patch at 20, Fiery Embrace at 26 and Freezing Touch at 28. Everything else is just filling.

[Without_Pause]

Street Justice is just smooth for me. Even better on a Stalker, but it has a nice combination of ST and AOE attacks with mitigation and no real long animation times. If not for already having a Claws/wp character, I could easily see playing a ton on a SJ/wp build.

[vibal]

I think VEATs would be my pick for general "good" balance. Much like willpower they start good and can easily slot to great. They're great on a team and solo content well. Solid AoE damage, great utility, and reasonable control on the fort side.

[Black Talon]

Rather interesting topic and subject analysis!  The variety of comments and viewpoints submitted thus far indicate, from my perspective, that there's a heck of a lot of independent "from my experience" input on this, and I believe this prevents any definitive "one true answer".  While I certainly don't have any huge variety of archetypes to draw from, let alone individual power sets, I do support the contention that Claws has got a heck of a lot of what I would call linear progression, rather than relative leveling out and taking big leaps with the acquisition of a new power and its successful use (e.g., and this one is from personal experience, Eagle's Claw; Back In The Day, my MA/SR Scrapper virtually one-shotted an elite boss when getting a critical early on in the fight).

 

I would argue that, whatever the benefits of a "smooth" development, there are always those players and mindsets that are going to be perfectly happy with, and in fact revel in, the possibly uneven results of certain powers/power set progression.  I would further contend that the existence of such differing viewpoints contributes to the longevity of the game, rather than turning things into a "Harrison Bergeron" experience where, because enforced mediocrity results in a perfectly level landscape, there's no choice except to be a happy warrior in the Army of Conformity.

[Riverdusk]

6 hours ago, Ukase said:

 Less effective AoE due to a lack of taunt aura, so just not as effective -

 

Unless you choose one of the 5 out of 13 scrapper secondary's that do have a taunt aura.

[Kung Fu Cow]

On 9/7/2021 at 9:46 AM, Snarky said:

 

Edited September 8, 2021 by Bolshevik
Mobile error

[Yomo Kimyata]

I've always thought that something like Katana/Willpower on a Scrapper was just about the middle of the road.

 

Disclaimer:  I do not have a Katana/Willpower scrapper.  Yet.

[cohRock]

For protective sets, there has been a lot of Willpower love here.  I'll agree that it is a great set.  However, I'm going to side with the original poster about Super Reflexes (SR).  While his example is a scrapper, my favorite SR experience is with tanks.

1. very high positional defenses (damage type is almost always irrelevant)
2. very high resistance to defense debuffs (you remain well defended even when foes are trying to lower your defenses)
3. scaling resistance -- the lower your health, the higher your global resistance to damage

If the tank doubles down on his protection with Tough, Weave, and Maneuvers, he becomes very hard to kill -- I rate it as close to the survivability of a stone tank in Granite form fighting non-psychic enemies.  Well, except without the weakness to psi, the lowered damage, and recharge penalty.  The downside for SR is the sheer number of toggles, causing end problems that aren't fully solved until your character has incarnate power(s) helping his end reduction.  Energy Mastery: Physical Perfection is a big help too.

 

One thing I particularly like is if your SR tank farms, you aren't limited to fire farms.  Since you handle any damage type equally, you can choose any foe.  Of course, people you recruit to help you tend to complain that the foes are doing non-fire damage...

[DoctorDitko]

Ah! You remind me of one of my favorite aspects of a WP Tank: No PSI-hole!

 

OK, I'll never be the guy tanking Hami, but being able to seek out Rularuu, Psychic Clock King, Carnies, and Rikti -- where many tanks are too busy farming Council to bother -- is a sheer joy.

 

"What can I say? I guess my mind is too small a target for your psi powers!"

[MHertz]

Technically, uniformly bad from 1 through 50 is also "even."

[Carnifax]

If we're talking "Interesting power picks from 1 through to 9" then Darkness Affinity for Controllers probably fits. 

 

The only "bad" power is at 35. Which is perfect since you can start your Epic Pool then.