Non-melee ATs that can afford to have mobs in melee range

[Prof Evbof]

I am relatively new to CoH, but have played mmorpgs for awhile. I almost always play a melee toon. Mostly  because I cannot kite. So I am wondering what other ATs in this game can work without kiting. I prioritize survivability, but I don't mind toons that kill really, really fast and I don;t mind toons that stun and knock mobs away (the animation to get up is a time span where they aren't attacking).

Note that I solo most of the time.
I know that Sentinels have the same defense secondary sets as brutes, so that is something I need more insight on.
I also know that several Blaster secondaries are designed to dish out damage at melee range in addition to ranged primary attacks such that you literally deal damage as fast as you can press the whole bunch of buttons. Again I would like more insight.
I have dabbled with Mastermind, letting my pets blast or pound away at mobs close to me, I don't mind using the GoTo command to concentrate my pets on my spot. I could use more insight here as well.

Lastly I know that SoA and Widow can be tailored for melee.
I have absolutely no clue on Corrupter, Defender, Controller, or Dominator. Which of these can keep mobs off me?
I dabbled with the Speed Pool power Whirlwind, but I would prefer more insight on the ATs from a primary/secondary POV.

[Ghost]

Oh boy.

Fans of every AT will tell you that anything can be made strong enough to stand in a mob.

🙂
Prepare to be amazed with stories of people pushing tanks out of the way on 4x8 ITFs, and soloing Hami

 

In all seriousness, you can build out any AT to do anything you want. 

Edited June 14, 2022 by Ghost

[Bill Z Bubba]

3 minutes ago, Prof Evbof said:

I know that Sentinels have the same defense secondary sets as brutes, so that is something I need more insight on.

 

Not quite. All the Sentinel armors were tweaked so none of them are a straight 1 to 1 comparison and Sents have vastly less base HP. That said, being able to hover-blast with an armor set at all means Sentinels are tough as fuckin nails and built in mez protection means you don't suffer the pain every other ranged character feels for the majority of its life from 1 to 50.

 

I honestly have no insight on the other topics other than this: My time/fire defender continues to surprise me with her survivability in melee or otherwise. She's a damn monster. I'll also give a nod to anything earth control, either controller or dominator but those are very late bloomers unlike sentinels.

[Luminara]

My Grav/TA controller only uses one ranged power.  Wormhole.  Bring everything into melee range, Cross Punch/Fissure/Cross Punch/Seismic Smash/repeat.  Zero risk, everything is Stunned.  Leveraging controllers' strength, control, neuters almost all enemies in the game, and doubles the character's damage output.  I prefer Gravity for that, because I'm lazy, but it works for every control primary.

 

My Dark/Martial Dominator has 32+% Defense to all damage types and uses Fearsome Stare to bring her to the soft cap, then goes straight into melee and unloads kicks and Trick Shots.  Dominators can also leverage control to neuter enemies, I just decided to take a different approach and focus on Defense/ToHit Debuffing instead.  I prefer controllers to dominators for this play style, as they have access to strong -Res, but I had an itch and /Martial was the only thing that would scratch it.

 

All of my sentinels play in melee range.  Ranged attacks don't stop working if you're closer than X to the enemy, and sentinel *PPs have some nice PBAoE attacks, plus Cross Punch is just a damn nice attack for any melee chain.

 

Human form Peacebringer plays well in melee, once Light Form is permanent.

 

Any well built defender or corruptor can survive in melee by coupling as much Defense as they can muster in concert with -ToHit, or frequent and strong heals/+Regeneration with -Damage applied to foes, but they have lower melee damage modifiers, so they're a bit slow.  Resistance debuffs help speed things up a bit, but, again, I'm lazy, so I just make melee controllers instead.

[KaizenSoze]

Important note to keep in mind about knock back.

 

One of the most popular task forces in the game is the Imperious Task Force (ITF).

 

Knock back against a lot of the mobs does not work. Only the nictus dwarfs are weak, but all the Romans are resistant. And they will tear you up in melee. I have had this issue with several chars that rely on knock back.

 

One way I have found around this with my blasters is end drain and slows. Use to the slows to kite then till their end is gone. It does not take that long. One Thunderstrike plus short circuit will zero out most +3 mobs. Then you can live in melee safely.

Edited June 14, 2022 by KaizenSoze

[Bill Z Bubba]

34 minutes ago, KaizenSoze said:

Knock back against a lot of the mobs does not work. Only the nictus dwarfs are weak, but all the Romans are resistant. And they will tear you up in melee. I have had this issue with several chars that rely on knock back.

 

My earth/earth dom suffered heavily at any attempt to solo the ITF until I was told to spam earthquake and quicksand. Doing so was game changing for me.

[Mezmera]

1 hour ago, Ghost said:

and soloing Hami

 

Why would you want to solo Hami when you can confuse him to raid the Rikti Mothership for you?

[Doomguide2005]

50 minutes ago, Ghost said:

Fans of every AT will tell you that anything can be made strong enough to stand in a mob.

This ^

Some just require more knowledge and experience to do so in what most would consider a timely manner.  Usually it involves IO builds to do at max difficulty.  

[SeraphimKensai]

1 hour ago, Ghost said:

Oh boy.

Fans of every AT will tell you that anything can be made strong enough to stand in a mob.

🙂
Prepare to be amazed with stories of people pushing tanks out of the way on 4x8 ITFs, and soloing Hami

 

In all seriousness, you can build out any AT to do anything you want. 

Well the time I was soloing Hami...I was on a spines/regen scrapper had cleared a few mitos and not died. By this time the onlookers standing from a safe distance thinking I was crazy decided whoa we might as well jump in as somehow he's immortal so we get kill credit.

 

Instant Healing got nerfed the following Tuesday.

[arcane]

Time Defender

[Psyonico]

I would suggest a sentinel. They aren't particularly strong, but they've got decent damage mitigation and more importantly mez protection out of the box, and they get ranged attacks as their primary.

 

Alternately, as others have mentioned, time defenders are quite powerful.  They live in melee thanks to Time's Junction and Farsight makes them very hard to hit.

 

That being said, they don't have any built in mez protection.

[GM Impervium]

So, this is more of a question about archetypes rather than a general topic, so I'll be moving the thread to the appropriate place 😃

But yeah, welcome to the game! I know you'll find a good build or three that delivers exactly what you want!

[Mezmera]

56 minutes ago, SeraphimKensai said:

Well the time I was soloing Hami...I was on a spines/regen scrapper had cleared a few mitos and not died. By this time the onlookers standing from a safe distance thinking I was crazy decided whoa we might as well jump in as somehow he's immortal so we get kill credit.

 

Instant Healing got nerfed the following Tuesday.

 

Oh that was you?  Not sure I want to ruin your fond memories but I had confused a Mito to be your pocket healer so the others were fooled into seeing how well you were doing that way they would jump into the pool too so I could hurry up and leach the reward.  Instant Healing just took the blame for it, sorry about getting Regen nerfed all!

 

If its any consolation I got an Accuracy/Mez Hami O.   

[Techwright]

1 hour ago, Prof Evbof said:

I am relatively new to CoH, but have played mmorpgs for awhile. I almost always play a melee toon. Mostly  because I cannot kite. So I am wondering what other ATs in this game can work without kiting. I prioritize survivability, but I don't mind toons that kill really, really fast and I don;t mind toons that stun and knock mobs away (the animation to get up is a time span where they aren't attacking).

Note that I solo most of the time.
I know that Sentinels have the same defense secondary sets as brutes, so that is something I need more insight on.
I also know that several Blaster secondaries are designed to dish out damage at melee range in addition to ranged primary attacks such that you literally deal damage as fast as you can press the whole bunch of buttons. Again I would like more insight.

Blaster Energy Secondary is mostly a series of punches and can be set up to hit like a ton of bricks.  More like scrappers rather than brutes, but I've surprised many an opponent (can an NPC be surprised?) and dropped them in a punch or two when they get too close.  This secondary also has 3 buffs, one of which can heal.

Blaster Ice Secondary (Ice Manipulation) is a medley of abilities: 4 can harm (and two of those are ranged abilities), 5 can slow/hold/immobilize/sleep, 1 controls by aoe knockdown, 1 is a toggled healing ability.  I use this mostly with a fire/ice blaster, and I mostly focus on 4 of the 5 slow/hold/immobilize/sleep ability.  The ice patch is small, and close to you as you lay it, but is marvelous control in choke point scenarios, like cave tunnels.

Blaster fire secondary has one hold at range, but is mostly close range incineration.  It does have a toggle ability that provides some healing and endurance recharge while damaging enemies in melee range, but it is not dependent on enemies being present in order to heal. As blasters tend towards squishiness, having a toggle healing running is fantastic.
I have dabbled with Mastermind, letting my pets blast or pound away at mobs close to me, I don't mind using the GoTo command to concentrate my pets on my spot. I could use more insight here as well.

Lastly I know that SoA and Widow can be tailored for melee.
I have absolutely no clue on Corrupter, Defender, Controller, or Dominator. Which of these can keep mobs off me?

Corruptor ice secondary (Cold Domination) is control & defense  You're trying to slow your opponent or cause them to trip on ice to keep them off-balance allowing you more time to use your primary set to drop them.  It also has a few powers you can cast on other player characters to aid in their defense and recovery.  One ability, Arctic Fog, provides some defense for yourself as well.

Corruptor dark secondary turns you into a mini-controller, with several powers causing fear/slow/hold.  You gain a condition ability to rez a fallen comrade while stunning enemies around them, and you gain a pet that, although it doesn't dish out damage, it does provide healing and additional control abilities.

Controller Storm Summoning is easily my favorite secondary.  There's a lot of damaged to be dished out from this set if set up correctly.  Note that it is not about punches, it is about using conical and aoe abilities to deal out damage while keeping the enemy slowed or knocked down.  Hurricane is very useful for pushing enemy out of melee range while debuffing them. Gale tends to annoy teammates with its powerful knockback, but use a conversion to knockdown and teammates love it.  It can strike often and for damage this way.  Freezing rain is a large ice slick with damaging rains to tear up a large swath of opponents while keeping them on their posteriors, and lightning storm is just a heap of a lot of fun to toss up if they get too close.  Combined with a primary like illusion which has a lot of fighters with effective distractions and attacks, and a well designed controller is terror unleashed. 

NOTE that controllers are normally not much of solo artists until they get their pets, at least level 22, depending on the pets.  Once they get over that hurdle, controllers really come into their own.  A good duo or team is recommended until then.  Others opinions may vary and there might be one out there who has found a way to make them formidable soloists before level 22.
I dabbled with the Speed Pool power Whirlwind, but I would prefer more insight on the ATs from a primary/secondary POV.

Comments in orange.

[SeraphimKensai]

1 hour ago, Mezmera said:

 

Oh that was you?  Not sure I want to ruin your fond memories but I had confused a Mito to be your pocket healer so the others were fooled into seeing how well you were doing that way they would jump into the pool too so I could hurry up and leach the reward.  Instant Healing just took the blame for it, sorry about getting Regen nerfed all!

 

If its any consolation I got an Accuracy/Mez Hami O.   

The crazy thing is I'm not even kidding that I was solo in the bowl clearing mitos. Perma MoG and Toggle IH pre ED days with impale and throw spines their original range before getting halved. This was on Guardian way back around i1/i2. I hadn't thought to hide yet as pvp hadn't come out just yet, so a few ppl trickled into the hive then, there must of been about 30 of them before they jumped in and ruined my solo Hami attempt. By that time I had cleared maybe 3 mitos. That said I'm not sure if I would of survived a bloom or not, but I'd get hit and my health would instantly go back to full before the next hit came in.

[Shred Monkey]

Don't forget, unlike many MMORPGs... we have super powers.   You can be a ranged toon and not kite because we can FLY!... (or hover).  Hover-blasting is a quite popular playstyle.

 

[Voltak]

22 hours ago, Bill Z Bubba said:

 

My earth/earth dom suffered heavily at any attempt to solo the ITF until I was told to spam earthquake and quicksand. Doing so was game changing for me.

Hmmmmm....   
You were told ?
Hehehehe
I thought you saw this idea on video or something 😜😂

[Doomguide2005]

--> My Earth/Storm/Stone lives there.  Steamy Mist+Super Speed+stealth IO means she (or a teammate) almost invariably chooses at what distance and when the melee starts.  Usually that means I say hello with Stalagmites, Thunder Clap followed by Seismic Smash, Freezing Rain, Fissure etc., etc. while Rocky parties with everyone.

--> Electric/Fire blaster ... given the number of potential PBAoEs (~7) anything outside of melee range would hardly make sense except while closing with next set of targets.

--> Empathy/Rad/Dark originally created pre IO for Green Machine.  IOs mostly mean she can continue to charge large mobs with minimal concern even while solo.  Very few things are harder to kill than a GM Empath teamed with other GM Empaths.  Its just much easier to get there solo or on a PuG because of IOs and Incarnates.

--> Fire/Kinetics.  Another that generally thrived in melee long before IOs.  Just gotten vastly easier to do so safely because of IOs.

--> RadEm/ or /RadEm teamed with FFoF you're looking to die in the right spot.  Hello Vengeance+Fallout+Mutation.  Yes, I dare you to kill me!

--> anything Traps if toe bombing and poison gas are your thing.  Nevermind all the other tools and the other set, pools and epic.

 

Lunch is about over but yes with IOs, Incarnates and all the rest anything can survive and thrive at melee distances.

[Hjarki]

City of Heroes is a bit different because the game runs completely off the rails at the high end. The sheer power of stacking buffs/debuffs means that even a full team is often far more powerful than anything the game can bring to bear against them - and a full league focused on a target is slammed up against every cap there is. Incarnate powers, temporary powers and inspirations can all utterly trivialize the hardest challenges in the game.

 

So before anyone can really answer the question you're asking, they first need to know what arbitrary restrictions you'll be putting on your play.

[Icono04]

A storm/anything defender or an anything/storm corruptor or controller will be happy in melee range. My personal suggestion would be storm/Water defender for the added knockdown from /water attacks, but anything with storm involved is fine.

From what I understand, Hurricane is not KB but Repel - are the Cimerorans resistant to that as well?

 

A Fortunata Widow has ranged attacks but is quite survivable in melee range. As a side bonus, you can build it as a hybrid widow-fortunata and have good melee and ranged attacks on the same character, meaning that you can change up your playstyle on the fly.

 

[Mr. Vee]

I play everything in melee, it's a fun.

[Six-Six]

I don't think it's a matter of AT, but more of power sets. Dual Pistols, for example is a ranged power, but it forces you to go into melee range a lot of times. Same with a lot of Corruptor secondaries like Dark, Rad and Poison. Ice and Fire also have some short ranged and quite a lot of PBAoEs that again make you get into the thick of things for them to be truly effective. Having a ranged attack but fighting melee style just means less chasing buggers around.

As for not being squishy enough to be in the middle of everything, def and res are not the definitive stat. You can go dominator (which have a nice mix of range and melee attacks) and use your controls to limit attacks on you. You don't need def and res if your enemy is held and can't attack you. My /elec dom can nonchalantly walk into enemy mobs because he drains end so fast that they can't attack even if they're not held or under any status ailment.

[Marshal_General]

On 6/21/2022 at 5:58 AM, Icono04 said:

A storm/anything defender or an anything/storm corruptor or controller will be happy in melee range. My personal suggestion would be storm/Water defender for the added knockdown from /water attacks, but anything with storm involved is fine.

From what I understand, Hurricane is not KB but Repel - are the Cimerorans resistant to that as well?

 

A Fortunata Widow has ranged attacks but is quite survivable in melee range. As a side bonus, you can build it as a hybrid widow-fortunata and have good melee and ranged attacks on the same character, meaning that you can change up your playstyle on the fly.

 

The problem with storm  and fortunata is the you have less staying power than a 16 year boy on his first data.

[Rejolt]

I think I read a Discord post of devs disussing how costly it is to run a Widow vs other ATs. I think I ran Cardiac on mine forever.

[Doomguide2005]

On 6/21/2022 at 6:58 AM, Icono04 said:

A storm/anything defender or an anything/storm corruptor or controller will be happy in melee range. My personal suggestion would be storm/Water defender for the added knockdown from /water attacks, but anything with storm involved is fine.

From what I understand, Hurricane is not KB but Repel - are the Cimerorans resistant to that as well?

I don't believe they are particularly resistant to Repel (and yes Repel not kb is Hurricane's main effect plus the strong To Hit debuff and range debuff).  My Earth/Storm, on Live anyway, shoved them around regularly in repeatables.  And as I recall a recent video of @Voltakshows his build using Hurricane's Repel to push and debuff Cimerorans.