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Why so long for game evolvement?


josewales

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I have been bouncing between TSpy and HC for the past few months and came to appreciate the the dedication and transparency of TSpy's team compared to here. I do not get involved with the server politics where I strictly compare products for what best serves my entertainment. But the positive weekly changes small or big has me playing on TSpy more. Which brings me to ask...where is and what is HC's GM team doing? An issue a year? HC indeed has the population. Is that the reason why regarding the team's hibernation? Honest questions.

 

If I am wrong, I suggest checking out TSpy's discord and compare. The transparency and feedback is there.

 

Cheers.

Edited by josewales
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https://forums.homecomingservers.com/discover/53/

https://forums.homecomingservers.com/discover/54/

 

If you're actually interested in the development of the game on these servers, there are the Dev Digest (development team) and Staff Digest (GMs, community representatives and some members of the development team) links, which answer all of your questions.  Or join the developer Discord channel and speak with them directly.

 

No drama today, kids.  Lumi has a headache.

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1 hour ago, josewales said:

 

If I am wrong, I suggest checking out TSpy's discord and compare. The transparency and feedback is there.

Most of that discussion goes on in the closed beta discord, which is very active.

 

Instructions for joining can be found by searching the forums and entry is done in cycles but there's a "no spoilers on the main forums" rule that is pretty well kept.

 

Basically, the discussions do happen and it's interesting being part of the testing process and seeing ideas that didn't work out etc, but they happen in an environment that doesn't take up space in the main forums.

 

Edited by Gulbasaur
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Yeah... so if what you're looking for is a constantly evolving game with new updates and features constantly being released, you can probably rule out all games/servers that were originally released 20 years ago, then shutdown 10 years ago, and are only being kept alive by volunteer GMs.  But that's just common sense.  I mean we all knew that already, right? 

 

So, I'm going to go out on a limb here and say, the desire for a constantly evolving game is probably not why we're all here.

 

 

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I'm probably in the minority, I don't know...but I actually do not want ANY changes.  I want the same game I played years ago.  When I get max level, and get all my incarnate stuff, I just make another alt, and do it all again.  I don't need anything more than the current game to keep me excited about playing, or entertained.  If there were weekly changes to the game, I'd likely quit.  When the new releases happen with the Homecoming updates, I just go with it and adapt to it, but I'm not looking for anything more than the base game that ended years ago to be able to be played again.  Sometimes with too many changes the game becomes unrecognizable from what it was.  It's not always a good thing.  Classic World of Warcraft, and Wrath of the Lich King Classic are good examples of people willing to play a previous version of the game they love, and are happy with it. 

 

I appreciate the Homecoming team seems more concerned with preserving the base games stability, and taking a long time between new issues...taking into account feedback, and making changes that are more Quality of Life, rebalancing things that are known problems etc than drastic ones like making a new archetype or powers weekly.  

 

And again, HC is run by volunteers in their free time, so just being able to play this game is a dream come true for me.  I'm not expecting anything more than that, personally.

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3 hours ago, josewales said:

I have been bouncing between TSpy and HC for the past few months and came to appreciate the the dedication and transparency of TSpy's team compared to here. I do not get involved with the server politics where I strictly compare products for what best serves my entertainment. But the positive weekly changes small or big has me playing on TSpy more.

 

I'm very happy that you've found a server that provides the experience you personally enjoy.  That's the beauty of having multiple projects running their own servers these days: more player choice!  In the Live days we were stuck with one game and one dev team, and our only choice was to play or not.

Edited by Grouchybeast
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New shiny stuff is nice

But, I value the fixes they do during updates more than any new content.

I have only 85 alts to work on.

That is on the low end for some players.

And two bases to maintain ... ugh...cobwebs

 

Maybe...

Hear me out...

Go be where you are happiest.

 

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"Weekly changes?"

 

OK, so think about it. We have issues coming out slowly. We have test servers where the issues are run through pretty thoroughly and debated before release. The only times we really have "rapid changes" are right *after* release, when bugs that get missed during testing pop up.

 

Even during live, where there were *paid developers* doing this day in and day out *as their job,* changes weren't done weekly - or even monthly. Changes were done thoughtfully, they were planned out and tested. Which means one of two things:

 

1. Thunderspy secretly has hundreds of developers and artists and an insanely robust versioning system that would be the envy of any top-tier international programming house, or

2. Development is "throw stuff at the wall and see what sticks, screw completeness or stability."

 

If I saw *any* game with "weekly" changes that was more than, oh, three months old? I'd steer *well* clear of it. Even monthly changes - and I mean actual changes, not "event turned on/event turned off" - would have me pretty leery if they were constant.

 

If you enjoy it? Great, have fun, it's great that we have choice now. Me, I'll stick with stability and consistency even if it means slow issue release.

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4 hours ago, josewales said:

I have been bouncing between TSpy and HC for the past few months and came to appreciate the the dedication and transparency of TSpy's team compared to here. I do not get involved with the server politics where I strictly compare products for what best serves my entertainment. But the positive weekly changes small or big has me playing on TSpy more. Which brings me to ask...where is and what is HC's GM team doing? An issue a year? HC indeed has the population. Is that the reason why regarding the team's hibernation? Honest questions.

 

If I am wrong, I suggest checking out TSpy's discord and compare. The transparency and feedback is there.

 

Cheers.

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4 hours ago, Luminara said:

No drama today, kids.  Lumi has a headache.

This response is EXACTLY to the point of the poster's comments. This wasn't drama or a "kid" unless you've personally verified the poster's age. Instead what this is is a complete lack of caring and obvious minimalization of a well thought out post.

 

So typical and unsurprising. How's that for drama ? Helping your headache any? You would've been better off just waiting to post after a couple aspirin or something.

Edited by Top Gear
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  • Lead Game Master

At risk of "taking bait", there is valid reason for concern or criticism. Going months without game updates, or even communication, can be a bit worrying, if these are things that you value.

Development is ongoing, but was temporarily slowed for reasons out of our control. Given how professionally we try to run things otherwise, it's easy to forget that, at the end of the day, our devs have lives, families, and jobs that are their first priority.

Also, when we release an update, we want to release an entire package. Not just a number adjustment here, a new costume piece there, a reworked set for good measure a week later... We want each update to include bug fixes, a new story arc or TF, new power sets or wholesale updates to existing ones, base items/costume pieces/weapon skins, QoL features, the whole nine yards, all at once. The downside of that, is then you need QA and bug testing on DOZENS or HUNDREDS of items, instead of just one or two. And sometimes, the work is too much, so some stuff (or even the entire update) gets pushed back, as we don't want to release anything unfinished or that comes with game-breaking bugs.

That said, the next page IS being worked on. While I can't begin to speculate when the next Open Beta will be... well, "Soon (tm)" is kind of a tired meme by this point, but maybe it applies?

 

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1 hour ago, Greycat said:

If you enjoy it? Great, have fun, it's great that we have choice now. Me, I'll stick with stability and consistency even if it means slow issue release.

Very well thought out response. Thank you for taking the time to clarify all these things for the original poster.

 

2 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

Sounds like a troll baiting the community for some drama to me!

... only if your only interest is hearing exactly the same thing that you already think. Otherwise the post isn't trolling or drama, just questions someone would like answered - troll.

 

2 hours ago, drdread said:

 

What a transparent shill.

What a sophmoric response.

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6 hours ago, josewales said:

I do not get involved with the server politics where I strictly compare products for what best serves my entertainment.

I only play here, but I do occasionally look at other servers' forums or Discord.  I have to admit that some of the changes taking place elsewhere sound like they would be fun. 

 

I haven't done the math and counted all the changes here vs Thunderspy or anywhere else.  But I would still bet that our evolution of New Powers, TFs, Story Arcs, Base Stuff, etc. are equal to if not better than any other server.  See Patch Notes (https://forums.homecomingservers.com/forum/58-patch-notes/)  As GM Impervium stated, here the changes tend to come in big packages all at once instead of smaller weekly changes. 

 

I'm happy here but I'm also happy there are other places for folks to go.

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4 hours ago, Glacier Peak said:

Sounds like a troll baiting the community for some drama to me!

 

which i think is quite telling of OP that they have misunderstood the HC community and what we’re about..

 

..we generate drama by ourselves just fine thanks

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1 hour ago, Top Gear said:

This response is EXACTLY to the point of the poster's comments. This wasn't drama or a "kid" unless you've personally verified the poster's age. Instead what this is is a complete lack of caring and obvious minimalization of a well thought out post.

 

So typical and unsurprising. How's that for drama ? Helping your headache any? You would've been better off just waiting to post after a couple aspirin or something.

 

No drama today, kids.  That S at the end of the last word pluralizes it, thereby indicating that the message is intended for the group, not the individual.  The sentence itself means don't start shit over the original post.

 

I think someone can dig up some links to remedial reading education websites for you to use, if you ask nicely.

 

Still want to play?  Bring it, pumpkin.

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Get busy living... or get busy dying.  That's goddamn right.

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Having previous experience running a private server for another MMO, and being a mod author for a number of other games I can tell you that there's a huge time requirement that goes into not just coming up with the idea for what new feature or asset that you want, but coding it in, making a model, textures, sound files, testing it, finding out something went wrong, going back trying to fix it and breaking something else, coming back to fix that, retesting it, then deciding to change up a core function of what you were originally trying to do and retesting, etc., only hoping at the end of the cycle you have something that you feel confident enough for a public release.

 

Then you end up having other people picking apart your efforts, maybe some good comments, or catching a big here and there, but also some trolls and such as well. Then you go back and fix it again.

 

Sometimes you're never content with it and keep adding new things year after year and so on.

 

Then you realize that you're not being paid for any of that, you're married, have a full time job, a baby, a dog, and maybe occasionally want to catch a hockey game if at the end of the day you're not ready to wrap up in blankets in the fetal position to reset and do it all again.

 

At the end of the day, we as players aren't owed anything. We're playing a dead game being resuscitated at the hospital just clinging on for a few more moments. Any changes we're given are ultimately part of the contract we accept to play on any particular server (that said I still have my hills I'm willing to die on, hello superspeed stealth exclusivity).

 

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As someone who actually likes changes even the crazy ones, I get the temptation to try different private servers but I always stop short because there's so many hoops to jump.

It feels like if you want to go on anything else, you have to join a Discord server, beg a GM in DM for an account, download specific launchers, mess with paths. So much work!

There's no forums either, so you have to guess just about everything or hunt for info in the Discord I guess.

Am I offbase? Is there actually a simpler process to try out these alternate servers?

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21 minutes ago, nihilii said:

As someone who actually likes changes even the crazy ones, I get the temptation to try different private servers but I always stop short because there's so many hoops to jump.

It feels like if you want to go on anything else, you have to join a Discord server, beg a GM in DM for an account, download specific launchers, mess with paths. So much work!

There's no forums either, so you have to guess just about everything or hunt for info in the Discord I guess.

Am I offbase? Is there actually a simpler process to try out these alternate servers?


That depends on the server.  Some require a forums account like Homecoming, others let you straight up create a game account on their website with nothing else required, and others require Discord.

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1 hour ago, nihilii said:

There's no forums either, so you have to guess just about everything or hunt for info in the Discord I guess.

 

I've said it many times before, and I'm going to keep saying it. Discord is fine as a chat client, but I cannot fathom how everyone on Earth has decided it's the best way, or even a good way, to disseminate and/or archive information someone might need to refer back to more than an hour or so after the fact.

 

Just set up a website already, people.

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