Proc Monsters - Controller Edition

[Damoklese]

So im looking over this gravity/time build.. and im intrigued.. however, I was wondering how I might fit Propel in the build?  Is it possible without screwing everything up?

 

Honestly I just love the power and want to use it.  I dont mind if I am a little weaker for having it, but I dont understand the nuances of these proc builds well enough to figure out how to add it in without screwing everything up.

[Sir Myshkin]

7 hours ago, Damoklese said:

So im looking over this gravity/time build.. and im intrigued.. however, I was wondering how I might fit Propel in the build?  Is it possible without screwing everything up?

If it’s the build that has Crush in it, then just swap that out for Propel and you’ll be fine 🙂 There should even be a propel-inclusive build in my post specifically about testing Gravity as I used it in my testing for performance.

[r0y]

I have a plant/nature controller that I'm switching over to a proc'd-out build (Strangler, Seeds, Carrion) and was wondering how Overgrowth (13s off perma w/o incarnate) effects Carrion Creepers (or psuedopets in general).  Guess it'd be a similar question for things like Mindlink and Farsight.  PBAoE clickies that buff.

 

I know it buffs actual pets, but what about pseudo pets?  I suppose with Overgrowth and Carrion Creepers, if it did buff them, it only buffs the ones that are up/out at the time Overgrowth is clicked.  Any new spawns would not be buffed...

 

Curious if anyone's done testing on this.  Nature is an amazing set, basically due to Wild Growth and Overgrowth.  Perma those bad-boys ASAP.

[drdread]

On 8/12/2019 at 11:54 PM, Sir Myshkin said:

Electric

• Procs have the ability to bend some of this sets AoE centered focus into strong ST capabilities. Jolting Chain is, *ahem* off the chain.

Thank you for this guide.

 

I had started an Electric/Poison controller, which I was struggling with. I couldn't understand how jolting chain could be useful. Now I can take on mobs of 20+ and come out with full health and end.

[Zinnar]

Alright, I have a brand-new Elec/Pain controller I want to figure out thanks to this thread. Concept-wise, I'm digging into the Experimentation pool, and I was wondering if an Idea I had had any legs.

 

Specifically, realizing that Corrosive Vial and Anguishing Cry can both take Lady Grey, Achilles Heel, and Shieldbreaker (among other things).

 

I know that Corrosive Vial spawns a "pseudo-pet", and thus has an initial proc chance at cast and then another chance every 10s. The power lasts for 15s, so that's two chances to proc.

 

Corrosive Vial can also take a lot of pure damage procs that Anguishing cry can't.

So what I want to know is whether or not Corrosive Vial could be another candidate for a proc-heavy power, especially if your secondary (Pain in my case) doesn't have a lot of proc-able powers. I was also curious whether it would be overly redundant or whether it would be a Good Idea to have Corrosive Vial AND Anguishing Cry both slotted with Achilles at the least.

 

I guess I have one more question- A lot of the "proc" builds for Electricity control don't take Static field. What am I missing? That's one of my favorite powers in the set, and it can even take a few procs if you don't want to "one-slot wonder" the power.

 

Thanks, and sorry if these are dumb questions, I'm kind of bad at this game.

[Sir Myshkin]

11 hours ago, Zinnar said:

I know that Corrosive Vial spawns a "pseudo-pet", and thus has an initial proc chance at cast and then another chance every 10s.

I did do some light testing with the power a couple months ago just to see what would come of it. The power will do "okay" for its effectiveness with procs, but it wasn't something that was significantly impressive given that the Vial doesn't dramatically do anything else that screams "take me!" The power at best really only has value on tough targets (EB/AV/GM) where it might balance out long-term to some worthwhile damage, however I doubt that considering I couldn't even get two applications of it to kill a -6 group of Malta.

 

Is it neat? Sure. Do procs help give it some better utility? Considerably. Would I go out of my way to put it into a build? Probably not.

 

11 hours ago, Zinnar said:

A lot of the "proc" builds for Electricity control don't take Static field. What am I missing?

Sleep abilities are ... well, they're pretty much useless. Unless you solo and can actually take proper advantage of the effect to help you mitigate/balance a crowd on command, there's not really any greater circumstance in a team that the sleep won't just get cancelled by someone else's AoE the moment you cast it. A crowd control bent on not attacking has never flowed well in CoH. On top of complications with Sleep, there's also the added aspect that several other abilities in Electric Control are just better crowd maintenance abilities that can be reduced to relatively low cooldowns. Jolting Chain causes KD, and Synaptic Overload is group confusion, both refresh pretty quickly, and the confusion effect lasts a considerable length of time.

 

That being said, you don't have to skip the power, you can take it if it suits your play style, you just have to be mindful that it is somewhat situational utility.

[xl8]

On 6/20/2020 at 12:39 PM, Zinnar said:

Specifically, realizing that Corrosive Vial and Anguishing Cry can both take Lady Grey, Achilles Heel, and Shieldbreaker (among other things).

I have the same troller and it's a joy to play. I'll post my build at a later date because I can't export running Mids through Wineskin, but I wanted to advise you specifically on Anguishing Cry. On my build it refreshes around every 30s. It's duration is 30s, so the effect is pretty much perma, but slotting this with anything but an Achilles Heel is a waste. Mine has 2x rch and 1 Achilles. With 2 force feedback in the build it can come up quicker but not by much. Point being, any power you use every 30s shouldn't take up too many of your slots assigned for process enhs.

[ThatsFatal]

Are these builds still viable? Was considering the Grav/Time and a Plant/Dark. Which of the Plant/Dark builds have the highest damage potential for some solo but mostly groups?

[Sir Myshkin]

On 6/29/2020 at 10:20 PM, ThatsFatal said:

Are these builds still viable? Was considering the Grav/Time and a Plant/Dark. Which of the Plant/Dark builds have the highest damage potential for some solo but mostly groups?

For the most part, yes. Specifically to Dark Miasma on Controller's, Fade is no longer impacted by Power Boost, however most (I think all) of the builds I posted still technically fell within the "effective Soft Cap" zone (as in Defense plus -ToHit together will give effectively the same result as having 45% Defense). Past that the rest is up to you! Any build I personally posted is capable of Solo play, but all of them are good for team use as well. I would just make sure you differentiate between "preliminary test" builds and "refined" builds. There are many preliminary builds that were just cramming effects for testing, you'll want the refined options for viable play.

 

 

[Aeolius]

The discussion on Carrion Creepers in here was incredibly helpful, thanks.

 

Just how important is saving one slot for Dam/Acc (and, relatedly, do the creepers benefit from my global acc boosts)? 

 

E.g., if I slot the procs from Positron's Blast, Bombardment, Javelin Volley, Annihilation, Trap of the Hunter, and Ragnarok, how much am I really missing out on?

 

Edit: the build in question has +54% global accuracy, if that helps

 

e2: hm. my own meager diggings seem to suggest it does not

Edited July 17, 2020 by Aeolius

[Clave Dark 5]

Maybe it's been in another thread, but has anyone talked much about Proc Monstering out the new Trick Arrow for controllers?

[Carnifax]

4 hours ago, Clave Dark 5 said:

Maybe it's been in another thread, but has anyone talked much about Proc Monstering out the new Trick Arrow for controllers?

I've tried a small bit on Beta with my reborn Grav/TA. Acid Arrows new improved AOE and the fact it can take 6 procs makes it a bit of a monster and (with Bombardment and Posi's Blast procs) a decent Oil Slick lighter. So this is definitely worth proccing up if you take it (in fact without them I'd probably skip Acid altogether). 

 

Ice Arrow is like most holds, you can get a lot of procs in there if you want to. 

 

Oil Slick isn't really worth it since its a Placeable and it's on a long recharge so even the "Stick a Forced Feedback in there and it'll pop at every summon" trick which I use on Storm isn't as good here (you kind of want it in a patch / pet you invoke every ~30 seconds for a Forced Feedback 1/6th of the time). Targetted Damage set procs have always been a bit useless in Oil Slick because they'll only start once its lit and it counts as a placeable so big AOE coupled with a 10 second "recharge" for calculating the proc chance every 10 seconds = small chance overall. 

 

I skipped Glue personally on my planned Grav/TA. Has it been changed to a pure placeable (no target needed)? If so it actually loses slightly because it used to act like a single target power AND a placeable, and damage procs in wide area placeables aren't great overall (as above for Oil Slick)

 

If you proc up Flash Arrow you run the danger of it notifying things. And it'll only take one damage one anyway (Cloud Senses). The "Chance for -Recharge" in Dark Watchers is a bit poop. 

Edited November 17, 2020 by Carnifax

[Clave Dark 5]

Cool, thanks for that info.  I was kicking around the idea of an Ill for sometime now, and just made an Ill/TA.  I'll have to see what my build can hold.

[tidge]

With the exception of a few posts by @oedipus_tex and @ThrillMill, I didn't see much in the way of exploring my choices in a Mind/Poison/Primal Force Controller.

 

This started out as a pure-concept character ('flavor' over 'crunch'), but I soon got frustrated with the pitiful damage so I opted to dive into proc-monstering to try to smooth out the offensive performance. I'd played controllers before, but I had been on a run of playing DPS toons and I simply couldn't readjust my attitude completely!

 

A few comments on this build:

1. I'll show the level 50 build. While leveling (which was slow) The ATOs were in different powers, and the Purple sets were either PVP or similar sets.
2. I'm not planning on doing much, if any 50+4 content with it. I will be unlikely to play much Incarnate content. It could probably use an Accuracy/ToHit boost for tougher content.
3. I found that I was having fun playing without worrying too much about Global +Recharge. I couldn't get perma-Hasten, so I even though I kept Hasten in the build, it is something I'll only trigger occasionally. Depending on how solo play in 45+ content goes I will probably swap this out for a Global mule. Note that I'm not looking to add Force Feedback +Recharge procs in my build. YMMV.
4. I had intended to focus on Knockdown (a favorite 'soft' control), but with the 'hard' status controls it wasn't needed. YMMV.
5. I had not intended to take Rune of Protection, but with such poor defenses I found that I was getting hit with status effects (lvl 40+) at such a high frequency that the build needed it.

The Build:

Spoiler

I don't have a modern MIDS... the empty slots are:

 

Level 2 Stamina: %Self Heal

Level 26 Terrify: Bombardment %Fire

Level 41 Energy Torrent: Bombardment %Fire

 

 

Hero Plan by Hero Hero Designer 2.23
https://github.com/ImaginaryDevelopment/imaginary-hero-designer

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Mind Poison Force: Level 50 Technology Controller
Primary Power Set: Mind Control
Secondary Power Set: Poison
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Concealment
Power Pool: Sorcery
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Primal Forces Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Levitate -- GldJvl-Acc/Dmg:50(A), GldJvl-Dam/End/Rech:50(3), GldJvl-Dam%:50(3), Dcm-Build%:40(5), ExpStr-Dam%:20(5)
Level 1: Alkaloid -- Mrc-Rcvry+:40(A)
Level 2: Dominate -- HO:Nucle(A), HO:Perox(7), GhsWdwEmb-Dam%:50(7), NrnSht-Dam%:30(9), GldNet-Dam%:50(9), Apc-Dam%:50(11)
Level 4: Envenom -- AchHee-ResDeb%:20(A), TchofLadG-%Dam:50(13), ShlBrk-%Dam:30(15), ShlBrk-DefDeb:30(15), ShlBrk-Acc/DefDeb:30(17), ShlBrk-DefDeb/EndRdx/Rchg:30(17)
Level 6: Confuse -- CrcPrs-Conf:50(A), CrcPrs-Conf/Rchg:50(19), CrcPrs-Acc/Conf/Rchg:50(19), CrcPrs-Acc/Rchg:50(21), CrcPrs-Conf/EndRdx:50(21), CrcPrs-Conf%:50(23)
Level 8: Mass Hypnosis -- FrtHyp-Acc/Rchg:50(A), FrtHyp-Sleep/EndRdx:50(23), FrtHyp-Sleep/Rchg:50(25), FrtHyp-Acc/Sleep/Rchg:50(25), FrtHyp-Plct%:50(27)
Level 10: Kick -- FrcFdb-Rechg%:50(A)
Level 12: Grant Invisibility -- LucoftheG-Rchg+:50(A)
Level 14: Mystic Flight -- BlsoftheZ-ResKB:50(A)
Level 16: Elixir of Life -- GldArm-3defTpProc:50(A)
Level 18: Total Domination -- SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear:50(A), SprWiloft-Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/Rchg:50(27), SprWiloft-EndRdx/Rchg:50(29), SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx:50(29), SprWiloft-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx/Rchg:50(31), SprWiloft-Rchg/Dmg%:50(31)
Level 20: Tough -- StdPrt-ResDam/Def+:30(A)
Level 22: Invisibility -- LucoftheG-Rchg+:50(A)
Level 24: Spirit Ward -- Prv-Absorb%:50(A)
Level 26: Terrify -- HO:Centri(A), HO:Centri(31), PstBls-Dam%:50(33), Empty(33), GlmoftheA-Dam%:50(33), JvlVll-Dam%:50(34)
Level 28: Paralytic Poison -- GhsWdwEmb-Dam%:30(A), NrnSht-Dam%:30(34), UnbCns-Dam%:50(34), GldNet-Acc/Hold:50(36), GldNet-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold:50(36), GldNet-Dam%:50(36)
Level 30: Weave -- LucoftheG-Rchg+:50(A), ShlWal-ResDam/Re TP:50(37), ShlWal-Def:50(37), ShlWal-Def/EndRdx:50(37)
Level 32: Mass Confusion -- MlsIll-Dam%:50(A), Ccp-Dam%:30(39), SprOvrPrs-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear:50(39), SprOvrPrs-Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/Rchg:50(39), SprOvrPrs-EndRdx/Rchg:50(40), SprOvrPrs-Acc/Conf/Hold/Immob/Sleep/Stun/Fear/EndRdx:50(40)
Level 35: Poison Trap -- Arm-Dmg/Rchg:50(A), Arm-Dmg/EndRdx:50(40), Arm-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(42), Arm-Acc/Rchg:50(42), Arm-Dam%:50(42), GldNet-Dam%:50(43)
Level 38: Power Blast -- Apc-Dmg:50(A), Apc-Dmg/Rchg:50(43), Apc-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:50(43), Apc-Acc/Rchg:50(45), Apc-Dmg/EndRdx:50(45), GldJvl-Dam%:50(45)
Level 41: Energy Torrent -- HO:Centri(A), HO:Centri(46), PstBls-Dam%:50(46), Empty(46), JvlVll-Dam%:50(48), ExpStr-Dam%:20(48)
Level 44: Rune of Protection -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(48)
Level 47: Maneuvers -- LucoftheG-Rchg+:50(A), Rct-ResDam%:50(50), Rct-Def:50(50), Rct-Def/EndRdx:50(50)
Level 49: Temp Invulnerability -- UnbGrd-Max HP%:50(A)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Containment
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- UnbLea-Stlth:50(A)
Level 2: Rest -- IntRdx-I:50(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I:50(A)
Level 2: Health -- Pnc-Heal/+End:50(A)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I:50(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- PrfShf-End%:50(A), EndMod-I:50(11), Empty(13)
------------

 

I'm open to feedback. In particular:

 

Levitate: The Decimation %Build Up is a holdover from leveling. It feels like it is helping (occasionally with ToHit), even though I know that its proc rate is very low.

 

Mystic Flight: With such poor defenses, endurance issues, and limited power options I 3-slotted this for some (minor) global defense boosts. I'm on the fence if replacing Hasten with Maneuvers and then reshuffling defense IO slots/sets (to include some 50+5 Shield Wall in Weave) is worth the effort or not. I'd then have Maneuvers muling LotG and Reactive Defenses. I'd also move a 2nd slot (to Temp Invulnerability) to get the Endurance discount from Unbreakable Guard.

 

I'm a fan of slotting HO Centriole (Damage/Range) in (damaging) cones; here Terrify and Energy Torrent. I don't see many folks propose this slotting (which is fine by me, as it keeps the prices low in the Auction House). The slotting doesn't do anything to increase the maximum number of targets affected, but with larger cones I get a bigger area to hit more targets... and also I don't have to be as close to enemies to hit them. I gather than Energy Torrent isn't particularly loved, but this slotting makes it better than the temp power Plasmatic Taser. I should note that the temp power doesn't suffer from the Controller damage penalty, but that it causes Knockback.

 

Venomous Gas: I tried this power while leveling up, but the only slotting/situation where I felt this helped was when teaming with an ally who was holding melee aggro. It didn't help with personal survival. As with other toggles, the %proc chance were never observed to be worth the effort of having to stand in melee.

 

Overpowering Presence %Energy Font: I like this little guy as a something to take aggro, and had it while leveling. I didn't see a good spot to add it, since I have committed the AoE to %damage procs.

 

I'm not open to shifting the placement of Coercive Confusion %Contagious Confusion. Don't try to convince me to put this %proc in an AoE. As far as I am concerned: This belongs in a single-target confuse, and AoE click confuses are better with the %damage procs because applying damage yourself gets you in the pool for inf/drop rewards. The counter argument is to hope for +magnitude Confuse, but a single-target Confuse will recharge quick enough (and last long enough) that I'd rather chance a second to-hit roll (on a boss) than pray for a boss confuse. Besides, with bosses you can always lead with a single target confuse before casting the AoE.

Edited November 30, 2020 by tidge
fixing the build spoilers

[EmperorSteele]

 

@tidge Challenge accepted!

 

So having the CC proc in Confuse is fine. HOWEVER, the whole SET is wasted in that power. The set gives a LOT of recharge, which a) would suite MassComedy much better, and b) completely floors the chance of the proc going off in a single target, quick recharging power like Confuse.

 

If you really want the CC proc to be viable in Confuse, you'll have to make sure the power isn't enhanced for Recharge, which probably means avoiding putting any set in there at all.

[tidge]

8 hours ago, EmperorSteele said:

If you really want the CC proc to be viable in Confuse, you'll have to make sure the power isn't enhanced for Recharge, which probably means avoiding putting any set in there at all.

This is very good advice for trying to trigger the %Contagious Confusion... but honestly the rewards for getting that %proc to fire that I'd rather just have the 2-second Confuse itself, and enjoy the nice 6-piece set bonuses from the entire set. YMMV.

[Crowcus Pocus]

Thought I'd bump this a bit just to ask what is your favorite proc monster yet?

[tidge]

I should write this just to explain my PoV: I don't consider using 5 set pieces (which include a %proc) and adding an extra %proc from a different set to be "proc-monstering".

 

I generally prefer set bonuses to "proc-monstering", but I make exceptions for:

1. Builds that have terrible base damage (ehem, Controllers.)
2. Ranged Cone attacks. There are many good choices for %procs, and franken-slotting range often really improves the performance of the power.
3. PBAoE powers that otherwise don't do (much/any) damage... or could contribute an additional affect.

My category (1) favorite character is my Mind/Poison/Force build above. That Controller also hits the other categories, so I'd rank that as my build that relies on %procs the most.

 

I've been experimenting (on other ATs) with franken-slotting powers like Bio-defense's DNA Siphon; I really like it with extra %damage procs. See also Dark's Life Drain for something similar for single-target. Obviously powers like Bonfire are great with IO proc pieces.

 

[Sir Myshkin]

On 11/17/2020 at 1:06 AM, Clave Dark 5 said:

Maybe it's been in another thread, but has anyone talked much about Proc Monstering out the new Trick Arrow for controllers?

A lot of what was talked about before is still relevant now. For reference I’m referring to Trick Arrow notes from the Defender version of this thread as they apply here (link in Sig).

The two more core things that have changed are Acid Arrow and PGA (and a third slightly lower relevance in EMP Arrow). Acid Arrow (in my opinion) has lost its relevance now and isn’t nearly as worthwhile, and PGA now has a significant debuff worth using. EMP’s changes also make it useful for the altered duration of its debuff and bonus features.

 

Flash Arrow is also worth slotting a bit to max out its -ToHit. None of these changes particularly cry out to the proc side of things however, and actually end up with a reduction of proc compatibility.

 

On 12/4/2020 at 5:35 AM, Falsey said:

Thought I'd bump this a bit just to ask what is your favorite proc monster yet?

Since you asked in the Controller edition: Dark or Earth Control. In general though? Storm/Energy Defender (and upon just know thinking of it, slightly curious about a Dark/Storm Controller all of a sudden).

[Clave Dark 5]

Thanks Sir M.  I have an Illusion/TA troller at about 35 who's build I really should start working on by now ha ha.  I made careful note of the Def advice from that threat earlier, so I'll combine that with this and see what looks like what.

[Carnifax]

3 hours ago, Sir Myshkin said:

Acid Arrow (in my opinion) has lost its relevance now and isn’t nearly as worthwhile, and PGA now has a significant debuff worth using

This is totally true. PGA is my 2nd cast now every time. The -Dam is gold. The Sleep is also handy enough as a bonus. 

 

Acid is pretty skippable now, except as a Proc power. I've currently 3 in it and they trigger a decent amount but as a power in itself a bit of -Def and the -SpecialResists or whatever it is (if it was -Special so it made you weaker to holds it'd be decent) is meh. Well the -Def is still slightly useful to my 20-something Grav/TA but only for the moment. 

[amendara]

7 hours ago, Sir Myshkin said:

 

 

Since you asked in the Controller edition: Dark or Earth Control. In general though? Storm/Energy Defender (and upon just know thinking of it, slightly curious about a Dark/Storm Controller all of a sudden).

 

 

I have a nice theme for a Dark/Storm Controller, so if you come up with a good proccy build I would be most interested.  Seems like something that would be very slot starved!

[Hew]

I was told to slot ff +rech in my creepers, but despite dropping it on a big group of mobs and monitoring my recharge times and recharge bonus combat attribute, i NEVER see it fire?

 

Am I missing something? 

[Coyote]

2 hours ago, Hew said:

I was told to slot ff +rech in my creepers, but despite dropping it on a big group of mobs and monitoring my recharge times and recharge bonus combat attribute, i NEVER see it fire?

 

Am I missing something? 

 

I think that was bad advice. A Knockback proc would activate if you activate a power that does knockback. I think this can work if the power you activate is a summons that can do knockback (Tornado). However, Carrion Creepers does not summon the tendrils which do knockback, but rather a patch that only Immobilizes and summons tendrils. So the patch itself doesn't do knockback, which means that when you summon it, you're not summoning a power that does knockback but rather one that will eventually summon the powers with knockback. So I don't think that it can trigger upon you from Carrion Creepers.

[Hew]

9 hours ago, Coyote said:

 

I think that was bad advice. A Knockback proc would activate if you activate a power that does knockback. I think this can work if the power you activate is a summons that can do knockback (Tornado). However, Carrion Creepers does not summon the tendrils which do knockback, but rather a patch that only Immobilizes and summons tendrils. So the patch itself doesn't do knockback, which means that when you summon it, you're not summoning a power that does knockback but rather one that will eventually summon the powers with knockback. So I don't think that it can trigger upon you from Carrion Creepers.

Thank you!