Air burst conversion

[DR_Mechano]

Air burst cannot be converted within type (targeted AoE) but only as an 'uncommon'.

[Caulderone]

31 minutes ago, DR_Mechano said:

Air burst cannot be converted within type (targeted AoE) but only as an 'uncommon'.

Interesting.  Probably a glitch resulting from the new TAoE sets just implemented.

[AboveTheChemist]

What is the level of the IO you are trying to convert? Looking at the enhancement sets page, and including Annihilation (20-50) and the two new targeted AoE IOs which are 30-50, any Air Bursts in the 10-19 range won't have any other in-type conversion options.

[Bopper]

Unrelated, but I love the troubleshooting Caulderone and AboveTheChemist. Those are both great ideas for checking out what's wrong.

[DR_Mechano]

6 hours ago, AboveTheChemist said:

What is the level of the IO you are trying to convert? Looking at the enhancement sets page, and including Annihilation (20-50) and the two new targeted AoE IOs which are 30-50, any Air Bursts in the 10-19 range won't have any other in-type conversion options.

This was done using an attuned IO so it should have covered the entire level range Air burst is available, however it seems that, from my guess, the attuned one is looking at it as its lowest level and not its max level.

[GlaziusF]

A similar thing is happening with Exploit Weakness, as I found when I shrugged and converted the attuned Air Bursts into something else uncommon. I suspect it's also because they're the only level 10 example of a set that can otherwise be cross-converted.

 

I was 50 when I was doing the conversions, for reference.

[Gorgar]

On 3/31/2020 at 9:52 PM, DR_Mechano said:

This was done using an attuned IO so it should have covered the entire level range Air burst is available, however it seems that, from my guess, the attuned one is looking at it as its lowest level and not its max level.

Same thing happening to me.  I can convert attuned targeted aoe ios into any other, unless I happen to get an Air Burst, at which point all I can do is turn it into a common.

[Jacke]

I can also confirm, attuned Air Burst IOs can only be converted outside of set as Uncommon, without allowing conversion as Targeted AoE Damage.

[Jacke]

It's even worse.  Air Burst is still considered a Targeted AoE Attack set when converting other Targeted AoE Attack IOs.  So if you're trying to get a particular Targeted AoE Attack set, you could end up with Air Burst, which can't be converted as a Targeted AoE Attack but only as Uncommon.  This is very frustrating.

[LQT]

On 3/31/2020 at 9:06 PM, Caulderone said:

Interesting.  Probably a glitch resulting from the new TAoE sets just implemented.

It's not. This has been happening with the Air Burst set for months.

Edit: In fact. it's been like this for almost a year! Probably more.

 

16th of May last year.

 

https://forums.homecomingservers.com/topic/1598-attuned-io-converter-bug/?tab=comments#comment-11747

 

Mentioned again in June and July last year.

 

https://forums.homecomingservers.com/topic/4964-how-does-converting-attuned-enhancements-work/?tab=comments#comment-42429

 

https://forums.homecomingservers.com/topic/7054-conversion-tables/?tab=comments#comment-63883

And again in November.

 

https://forums.homecomingservers.com/topic/12537-converting-attuned-ios/?tab=comments#comment-128361

 

Still happening, just had 4 out of 5 attuned Posi Blast IOs I wanted to change into Bombarments turn into Air Burst instead, losing the category option.

 

Edited April 7, 2020 by LQT
Edit: More/historic info.

[Jacke]

More details, tested on a L45 character.

 

A L50 Damage/Endurance Air Burst CAN be converted as Targeted AoE Damage.

 

An Attuned Damage/Endurance Air Burst cannot be converted as Targeted AoE Damage, only as Uncommon or In Set.

Edited April 12, 2020 by Jacke

[LQT]

Still not working.

[Mr. Wallet]

I just converted into a a level 11 air burst and thought "sweet, sleep to damage? Now that's a category!" and now I can't convert and stay in-category. Interesting to know that there's no others at level 11 but it's still odd. This thing isn't attuned.

[Jacke]

This is still a bug for Issue 27 Page 1.

 

Attuned Air Burst IOs cannot be converted as Catagory: Ranged AoE.  They also make it near impossible to reasonably convert any Attuned Ranged AoE IO to another Ranged AoE IO set as in the process if they convert to Air Burst, can then only convert as Rarity: Uncommon.

[TemporalVileTerror]

Yup.

 

 

Yuuuuuuup.

[Greycat]

Just had this happen as well.

[UberGuy]

This is weird. The set's definition looks OK.

[TemporalVileTerror]

Could there be a typo in there?  Maybe one that's hard to spot, like a non-standard break instead of a space, or a doubled-up single quote instead of an actual double-quotation mark?  Something like that?

[UberGuy]

4 hours ago, TemporalVileTerror said:

Could there be a typo in there?  Maybe one that's hard to spot, like a non-standard break instead of a space, or a doubled-up single quote instead of an actual double-quotation mark?  Something like that?

 

I can't say for 100% sure since I'm looking at data pulled out of the client, but what I can see looks sane when I view it in a hex editor.

 

Edit: What I can see isn't the actual thing that determines the valid conversion groups. Looks like it's a display name only. Old i26 versions of the source code make the actual thing that determines this look fine, but I can't attest to the current config.

Edited March 24, 2021 by UberGuy

[Bionic_Flea]

Oh, I think I know the reason why.  The level range of Air Burst goes down to 10, no other TAoE goes down that far.  So when the game starts looking for something in the same category and in the same level range it comes up with nothing.  Try converting a level 30 (or whatever) Air Burst and you get expected results.

[UberGuy]

I think Flea wins a no-prize there. If you have one that's below level 20, an "In Set" conversion would only let you convert it to itself.

 

Air_Burst 10
Annihilation 20
Artillery 30
Bombardment 30
Detonation 20
Positrons_Blast 20
 

I bet everyone who has hit this issue is trying to convert an attuned version. Attuned versions always count as the set's lowest available level for purposes of the "internal" level of the item.

[AboveTheChemist]

28 minutes ago, UberGuy said:

I think Flea wins a no-prize there.

The explanation Bionic_Flea gave was mentioned a year ago, in the third post. In the OP's case, at least, it was indeed an attuned version they were trying to convert.

 

Edit: Looking back at some of the older threads linked above, the explanation that Bionic_Flea and I gave is mentioned as far back as July, 2019, so if anyone gets a prize it looks like it should go to Shinobu!

Edited March 24, 2021 by AboveTheChemist
peering into history

[UberGuy]

Just to be clear, I do think this is a problem that needs to be fixed, because (as mentioned in this thread) it makes converting attuned Ranged AoE sets "dead end" at Air Burst.

 

How best to fix it is less clear.

 

Probably the most correct thing to do is to make conversions of attuned IOs pick valid conversion targets based on the (mathematical) set of Sets that have overlapping level ranges with the set you're converting. That's a code change.

 

Every other solution I can think of involves modifying the internal level that attuned IOs use, which requires an change to update the level of every existing attuned IO - this is a database update and something that has to be done during server maintenance.

[Bionic_Flea]

1 hour ago, AboveTheChemist said:

The explanation Bionic_Flea gave was mentioned a year ago, in the third post. In the OP's case, at least, it was indeed an attuned version they were trying to convert.

 

Edit: Looking back at some of the older threads linked above, the explanation that Bionic_Flea and I gave is mentioned as far back as July, 2019, so if anyone gets a prize it looks like it should go to Shinobu!

I got the no prize!  You can't take it away!

 

Just kidding.  Yeah, after I posted I read upthread and saw that several had said the same thing.  But I don't think it's a bug.  It's just working as designed.

[UberGuy]

31 minutes ago, Bionic_Flea said:

But I don't think it's a bug.  It's just working as designed.

 

I agree, but I really do think that this is an unexpected and unintended side effect, caused by an understandable lack of awareness that Air Burst is special in this way. Which itself was probably not specifically intended, as such.

 

I suspect not that many people are converting attuned RAoE sets, so it just doesn't come up often. (Though even fewer of those it bites come here to report it.)