Focused Feedback: Energy Melee Revamp

[Super Atom]

Just now, Infinitum said:

Thats kinda what a tanks role is though - melee controller.

 

I take barrage, WH, TF, and ET on my tanks - while EP wouldn't be a bad option smh wise - I want the - regen on my tankers.

People out here sleeping on the implications of that -regen but it's pretty good for a T1 ability.

[Tsuko]

Just now, Super Atom said:

Boppers idea for a freedom of choice is a good one, i just wish it was able to be made so they could pick either one at the start and not try and force either having both T1/T2 or no mechanic. On my tank, I'd rather not have T1/T2 using up two power choices. As we've learned from the post before, don't think its possible sadly 😞

 

Just now, Infinitum said:

Thats kinda what a tanks role is though - melee controller.

 

I take barrage, WH, TF, and ET on my tanks - while EP wouldn't be a bad option smh wise - I want the - regen on my tankers.

 

[Infinitum]

Just now, Haijinx said:

Nerf Regen

A person would have to have great willpower to do that.....

 

.......

 

Get it??

 

;-)

[Bopper]

2 minutes ago, Infinitum said:

Thats kinda what a tanks role is though - melee controller.

 

I take barrage, WH, TF, and ET on my tanks - while EP wouldn't be a bad option smh wise - I want the - regen on my tankers.

It can be a melee controller, but I believe everyone should design and play their way. The suggestion wasn't to remove Barrage doing -regen, -special, +stun either. You can always take the power at level 2. Granted, you will be waiting for its special effects until Total Focus is unlocked

[Infinitum]

1 minute ago, Bopper said:

It can be a melee controller, but I believe everyone should design and play their way. The suggestion wasn't to remove Barrage doing -regen, -special, +stun either. You can always take the power at level 2. Granted, you will be waiting for its special effects until Total Focus is unlocked

Not if my build doesn't have room for it.

 

Its forcing 2 power picks instead of 1.  That doesnt favor tankers then.

Edited October 31, 2020 by Infinitum

[Infinitum]

Like I said earlier, stalker and scrapper get the benefit of dbl focus, I think barrage being inherant is a good benefit for some tanker love - without having to sacrifice to get it.

Edited October 31, 2020 by Infinitum

[Tsuko]

1 minute ago, Infinitum said:

Like I said earlier, stalker and scrapper get the benefit of dbl focus, I think barrage being inherant is a good benefit for some tanker love - without having to sacrifice to get it.

omg @Infinitum and me are ok with something about tankers Oo

 

it s a sign !

 

 

[Tsuko]

3 minutes ago, Bopper said:

I can prove with math, the new EM is far superior to old EM. Don't forget, although you get back your permanent 1s ET, that comes with a 20s recharge, a 3.3s cast time on TF, a 1.5s cast time on BS, and EP being reverted to a 4s recharge with 1.0 scale damage.

and Master Bopper arrive out of nowhere ...!!!

 

[ForeverLaxx]

6 hours ago, Myrmidon said:

Every game change isn’t made around optimized DPS chains.

And frankly, I wouldn't want Energy Melee to be both the ST Burst and ST DPS king. Burst King is where I wanted it, and while these changes do that (I still hate being forced to open every fight with TF whether I want to or not), it's much more palatable that I can use Bonesmasher without restriction like before.

[Gobbledigook]

It really isn't hard to hit TF then ET lol. As far as combo mechanics go, this one is really easy.

 

It is a very smooth rotation really.

 

The playability of EM now is very nice. Power crash isn't so good though.

[Wavicle]

I still think it would be good if Whirling Hands triggered Energy Focus if it successfully hit a certain minimum number of guys. Feels bad having to use a long single target attack to access our best AoE.

[GM Tempest]

Please maintain civility. I've had to hide a number of posts here. Please remember this is for feedback, arguments are not necessary and conflict is not constructive.

[Jimmy]

I just had to hide 49 posts.

 

If someone is being a tool, please just report them and move on. It's much easier if we only have to hide their posts and not dozens of replies.

[Super Atom]

37 minutes ago, Wavicle said:

I still think it would be good if Whirling Hands triggered Energy Focus if it successfully hit a certain minimum number of guys. Feels bad having to use a long single target attack to access our best AoE.

I think if it was a % i could see that squeaking by, but I'm not sure about it being 100%. Getting too much EF would make it too strong. Maybe if they added a small chance for EF on WH on only tanker/brute? Could see it being nice.

 

and i mean we're talking last minute little QOL here

Edited November 1, 2020 by Super Atom

[BrandX]

3 hours ago, Super Atom said:

won't this just force tankers who do want it to have to take BA AND EP? Usually, T1/T2 is a one or the other choice, not both.

 

This is primarily why i don't like it in T1/T2 in any AT. Solve one problem by creating another. While before BS was just a "Use the power better", We've created forcing people to take barrage.

No, it doesn't.  Because that's been the problem with all powersets for all ATs from the start.  Taking a power, they may not want.

 

I wouldn't even say they've forced people to take the power.  DPS wise, it sounds like people are saying EP is better still.

 

I am however, all for them only have the two spenders, however, I liked the idea of giving those with EM as a Primary a reason to decide between T1 or T2.

[Super Atom]

4 minutes ago, BrandX said:

No, it doesn't.  Because that's been the problem with all powersets for all ATs from the start.  Taking a power, they may not want.

 

I wouldn't even say they've forced people to take the power.  DPS wise, it sounds like people are saying EP is better still.

 

I am however, all for them only have the two spenders, however, I liked the idea of giving those with EM as a Primary a reason to decide between T1 or T2.

I like it too, though my only real hangup was a personal like of EP but my eclipsing desire for the utility(honestly thinking about it, it's even more well done because that is such a hard choice for me now). Small potatoes on the grand scheme and something I'm more than willing to part with. Like i said before, barrage is a solid middle ground for everyone given that you can't give tanks the choice of T1/T2 at start.

 

Edit; my hangup with tankers specifically is if you don't have the spender in the T1, they literally don't get the choice and have to make an extra power pick outside of what the other same EM's do, which is why I was saying it should stay T1 barrage.

Edited November 1, 2020 by Super Atom

[siolfir]

2 hours ago, Super Atom said:

People out here sleeping on the implications of that -regen but it's pretty good for a T1 ability.

I'm not sleeping on the -100% regen, but the places that it are actually useful aren't common and the extra damage you can fit in from the faster ET overwhelms it. I personally think the -special is just as valuable in more situations than the -regen is, but have no qualms about forcing it to be a conscious decision to use a power that provides it which usually isn't going to be attack chain filler.

 

@Taboo: Look, I didn't want a combo or gimmick either. But I personally think this is a good compromise. If you haven't already, give it a spin and see if you still feel the same way about how obtrusive it is. If you have tried it, provide specifics about what problems you're having and which AT you're playing it on, rather than just saying "it has a gimmick and that needs to go away."

 

I tried it and reported that I felt penalized for using Bone Smasher when it used up my Energy Focus charges and that I felt the reduced critical damage on Total Focus wasn't made up for with the extra stack like the heal-on-critical instead of no-damage-on-critical for Energy Transfer did. It shifts around how you have to attack (yes, you are forced to behave differently and can't do everything you could with an all-the-time fast ET) but for the most part you can now ignore that the Energy Focus mechanic exists if you remember to use Total Focus before Energy Transfer. If you were (like me) one who rarely used Total Focus before it'll be a change, but the faster animation is tolerable.

 

Edit:

17 minutes ago, Jimmy said:

I just had to hide 49 posts.

 

If someone is being a tool, please just report them and move on. It's much easier if we only have to hide their posts and not dozens of replies.

Oops. I was replying to two of those posts and had them quoted while you were pruning. I removed those as part of this edit and just added in a callout to one (the other was a minor point not worth rehashing). The post that wasn't cleaned is still quoted.

 

Edited November 1, 2020 by siolfir
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[GM Tock]

And I just hid a few more posts.  Please stop discussing topics except the Focused Feedback prompt in the original post.

[Troo]

On 10/24/2020 at 5:33 AM, Jimmy said:

Power Changes

•  Barrage
  • If used with Energy Focus: 100% chance for stun and applies a weakening (-special and -regen) effect to the target
    • This effect has been moved from Bone Smasher to Barrage

Pro: Nice bonus utility for Tankers on a power they are stuck with.

Con: Tankers don't get any benefit until they have Total Focus.. are they really using it at higher levels? are folks even slotting it for use?

Con: It is likely the second most skipped power. This could add a power that needs to fit into existing builds.

 

Comment: I'll likely just skip this power if it went live as is. Stuns can be had else where. Not much survives long enough to try and fit it in a build just for the -special -regen. I'll grab a temp if needed.

 

[Troo]

On 10/24/2020 at 5:33 AM, Jimmy said:

 Energy Punch

• Recharge increased from 4s to 5s
• End cost increased from 5.2 to 6.032
• Damage increased from scale 1 to scale 1.16

Switching the order for Tankers and all sets seems appropriate. There will never be a better time.

[Infinitum]

8 minutes ago, Troo said:

Switching the order for Tankers and all sets seems appropriate. There will never be a better time.

switching barrage though to T2 would make it a 2 power pick to get it, it is more equitable for tankers if it remains a 1 power pick as the inherant T1

 

You arent in any danger of consuming focus with it as a tanker because you dont get crits or double focus, so its always a strategic choice which is how i play my tankers anyway.

[Troo]

On 10/24/2020 at 5:33 AM, Jimmy said:

 Bone Smasher

• Cast time reduced from 1.5s to 1.27s
• No longer consumes Energy Focus, allowing it to be more freely used in attack chains
  • This effect has been moved to Barrage

Pro: The reduction in cast time was a nice surprise.

Pro: Removing the Energy Focus allows it to be used on demand and without restriction. This is especially true for those who will be ignoring the Energy Focus stun.

 

Comment: This is an excellent power to stack stun/disorients on top of the other strong stun/disorients in the set. (60% mag 3, 9+ sec) 

 

[Mystic_Cross]

I’ll be keeping Barrage as my T1 on Tankers, please and thanks.
 

 

 

[Troo]

On 10/24/2020 at 5:33 AM, Jimmy said:

 Power Crash (Replaces Stun)

• Power Crash is now a minor cone that can hit up to 5 targets (10 for Tankers)
• No longer takes melee damage sets, now takes PBAoE damage sets (any existing enhancements will remain slotted until the character respecs)
• If used with Energy Focus: Target cap increased to 10 targets (16 for Tankers)
• If you previously had Stun in your build, you'll now have Power Crash
• Stalkers only:
  • This power has a 16s recharge (instead of a 9s recharge for other ATs), with proportional damage and endurance cost increases per the standard damage formulas
    • Lowered recharge from 18s to 16s
  • As Stalkers do not have Whirling Hands, they rely entirely on Power Crash for AoE damage
• Fixed some timing issues
• Fixed a typo in the description

Pro: Adds a surprising amount of AoE to the set.

Pro: With EF 20% mag 3 for 10 or 16 targets

Con: Without EF 20% mag 3 for 5 targets.. meh..

Con: Adding this AoE required balancing (removing something from somewhere else)

 

Comment: Maybe increasing the chance for is a reasonable request for the randomness.

Comment: I think the language across sets will get cleaned up once this power stays as is.

Comment: This or a version of could have been added without the combo mechanic.

 

Forgot: A ground punch AoE sounded cooler than what's there currently (is it the Stun animation still?).

  Could still be a cone but different anime that says AoE rather than a single target anime hitting multiple targets.

 

Edited November 1, 2020 by Troo

[Troo]

On 10/24/2020 at 5:33 AM, Jimmy said:

 Whirling Hands

•  Damage increased from scale 1 to scale 1.1819 (it was slightly below what the damage formula dictated)

Pro: Finally!

 

Comment: This was a nice change that was likely over due.