Misconceptions about a tank

[Diantane]

Players seem to think that a tank does incredible damage. I see players with several low tier, weak secondary attacks up front. Made an Invul tank one day and a player asked me if I had Super Strength. That is a very popular cookie cutter build. Does it do a lot of damage? Not compared to a scrapper or brute where those same attacks are their primary powers.

 

A tanks main job is not doing damage. There are lots of others on your team that do way more. Your job is to protect your teammates from taking damage. To attract and absorb, deflect or mitigate those attacks. The more damage you take from others, the better. When I make a tank the first attack I train is taunt (the main power of a tank). You see a boss headed for a no defense blaster? Taunt them away towards you. Sure, those attacks have taunt built in, but do players slot them for taunt? Nope... damage. They are misled. 

 

So when starting a new tank your focus should be on your defenses and only your defenses (your PRIMARY powers). Also add the fighting pool powers tough and possible weave if you are not resistance based. When a team first sees a large mob, they always hesitate (waiting for someone else to make the first attack - the alpha). This is when the tank is supposed to just jump into that mob and pull all of that damage to your TANK. Then the others can safely go in and eliminate those foes. Of course a healer's primary focus should be healing the tank. If the tank dies, the rest of the team will lose their main defense.

 

The best team will also have a "defensive" built tank,  a dedicated healer (no blasts), and controller or defender with lots of debuffs/buffs (no blasts). The remaining team should be your DPS. Unfortunately you rarely see this. 

[Zect]

[Uun]

2 hours ago, Diantane said:

The best team will also have a "defensive" built tank,  a dedicated healer (no blasts), and controller or defender with lots of debuffs/buffs (no blasts). The remaining team should be your DPS. Unfortunately you rarely see this. 

Feel free to recruit who you want to your teams. You don't get to tell everyone else how to have fun.

[InvaderStych]

[Spaghetti Betty]

 

[Warboss]

10 hours ago, Diantane said:

Players seem to think that a tank does incredible damage. I see players with several low tier, weak secondary attacks up front. Made an Invul tank one day and a player asked me if I had Super Strength. That is a very popular cookie cutter build. Does it do a lot of damage? Not compared to a scrapper or brute where those same attacks are their primary powers.

 

A tanks main job is not doing damage. There are lots of others on your team that do way more. Your job is to protect your teammates from taking damage. To attract and absorb, deflect or mitigate those attacks. The more damage you take from others, the better. When I make a tank the first attack I train is taunt (the main power of a tank). You see a boss headed for a no defense blaster? Taunt them away towards you. Sure, those attacks have taunt built in, but do players slot them for taunt? Nope... damage. They are misled. 

 

So when starting a new tank your focus should be on your defenses and only your defenses (your PRIMARY powers). Also add the fighting pool powers tough and possible weave if you are not resistance based. When a team first sees a large mob, they always hesitate (waiting for someone else to make the first attack - the alpha). This is when the tank is supposed to just jump into that mob and pull all of that damage to your TANK. Then the others can safely go in and eliminate those foes. Of course a healer's primary focus should be healing the tank. If the tank dies, the rest of the team will lose their main defense.

 

The best team will also have a "defensive" built tank,  a dedicated healer (no blasts), and controller or defender with lots of debuffs/buffs (no blasts). The remaining team should be your DPS. Unfortunately you rarely see this. 

 

I'm sure your post reflects your opinion on the various ATs to the tee (yours), but seriously, have you checked out Tanks since the AoE changes (not that they were lightweights before). Or have you ever stopped by a Tanker Tuesday and watch a team/league of Tanks take out AVs, GMs, TFs or Hami or an MSR? If not, you might want to. Although Tanks may not be at the other AT levels of damage, they don't suck or really come in secondary to their melee siblings...

[InvaderStych]

22 minutes ago, Warboss said:

I'm sure your post reflects your opinion on the various ATs to the tee (yours), but seriously, have you checked out Tanks since the AoE changes (not that they were lightweights before). Or have you ever stopped by a Tanker Tuesday and watch a team/league of Tanks take out AVs, GMs, TFs or Hami or an MSR? If not, you might want to. Although Tanks may not be at the other AT levels of damage, they don't suck or really come in secondary to their melee siblings...

 

Trying to explain to the OP why the current state of the game is best described as City of Tanks is a lost cause, that's why Vincent thinks this thread is hilarious.

[biostem]

12 hours ago, Diantane said:

The best team will also have a "defensive" built tank,  a dedicated healer (no blasts), and controller or defender with lots of debuffs/buffs (no blasts).

This hurt my soul.

[Warboss]

2 hours ago, InvaderStych said:

 

Trying to explain to the OP why the current state of the game is best described as City of Tanks is a lost cause, that's why Vincent thinks this thread is hilarious.

 

Understood, just trying to go with inclusion vs exclusion for a way to understand the game.

[bigmarty]

You can always rely on Diantane for a good laugh.

[dtjunkie]

 

*perma-hasten engaged*

*clicks rage*

*foot stomps thread over and over and over and over*

*clicks rage again*

 

[Psyonico]

On 5/13/2023 at 1:51 AM, Diantane said:

The best team will also have a "defensive" built tank,  a dedicated healer (no blasts), and controller or defender with lots of debuffs/buffs (no blasts). The remaining team should be your DPS. Unfortunately you rarely see this. 

 

I know this is the tanker forum, but I'm going to focus in on this part for a moment.

 

Should Scrappers and stalkers ignore their armor?

Should Blasters avoid using their secondary set, where some of their most powerful attacks are? Not to mention build up and their sustain power.

Should Corruptors only focus on blasts and never (de)buff?

Should Dominators only control, even though they are a DPS class?

 

Those questions may sound absurd, and that's the point.  Why should defenders and tankers ignore their secondary when no other AT does.

[ZemX]

Thread title checks out.

[Yomo Kimyata]

I get kind of a kick when I team with one of my very small number of tanks.  Some have taunt, some don't.  I'm an awful tank, insofar as I don't run around tracking seeing which idiots are aggroing whom; I just smash and tanks have the absolute best damage to survivability ratio out there and it's not even close.  Someone actually asked me, "Why are you such a good tank?" and when I was done smashing enough to reply I asked, "What the hell are the other tanks you play with doing?"

[bigmarty]

41 minutes ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

I get kind of a kick when I team with one of my very small number of tanks.  Some have taunt, some don't.  I'm an awful tank, insofar as I don't run around tracking seeing which idiots are aggroing whom; I just smash and tanks have the absolute best damage to survivability ratio out there and it's not even close.  Someone actually asked me, "Why are you such a good tank?" and when I was done smashing enough to reply I asked, "What the hell are the other tanks you play with doing?"

They probably play with tanks that forget to turn on their toggles.

[Diantane]

Well it seems that every player that makes a tank seems to think it is a scrapper with more armor. The primary and secondary powers are split 50/50. This makes for a very low DPS AT

[FupDup]

1 minute ago, Diantane said:

Well it seems that every player that makes a tank seems to think it is a scrapper with more armor. 

Tanker damage got buffed so much that they almost are. They clear faster than Brutes in almost all cases and in some cases can even clear faster than Scrappers. 

[Sovera]

Your opinions are always interesting, Dian, but they remain opinions. You're entitled to them, but at some point you ought to decide if the world is against you and everyone is wrong, or if you are the one that is wrong.

[Xandyr]

I love being told how to play my toons.

[Obsinious]

21 minutes ago, Diantane said:

This makes for a very low DPS AT

 

No, it doesn't.  You have no idea how the mechanics of this game work and you're frankly unqualified to debate it.

[Gobbledigook]

58 minutes ago, bigmarty said:

They probably play with tanks that forget to turn on their toggles.

I have actually done that lol. Did look silly rushing in and getting held lol.

 

~To Dian. This game has evolved quite a bit where Squishy Support classes charge in and Fold space mobs in to nuke. 

Edited May 14, 2023 by Gobbledigook

[Seed22]

On 5/13/2023 at 3:51 AM, Diantane said:

The best team will also have a "defensive" built tank,  a dedicated healer (no blasts), and controller or defender with lots of debuffs/buffs (no blasts). The remaining team should be your DPS. Unfortunately you rarely see this.

But what if I am the Tank, DPS and support all in one? *Cough any well built defender/blaster*

Edited May 14, 2023 by Seed22

[Doomguide2005]

On 5/13/2023 at 4:51 AM, Diantane said:

The best team will also have a "defensive" built tank,  a dedicated healer (no blasts), and controller or defender with lots of debuffs/buffs (no blasts). The remaining team should be your DPS. Unfortunately you rarely see this. 

A well built and played Tanker should make the next character concept completely unnecessary except in the rarest of cases.  It seems likely you've never run or experienced something like Green Machine or even the Rad/Fire team that's been running in the Defender forums.  The best (a vague and subjective term) teams I've been on have always consisted of entirely "support" characters.  Usually defender heavy but that's just my personal preference coming through.  The fastest (i.e. best) speed running teams tend to be very Corruptor heavy from what I've read in the forums.  And I have no reason to doubt it.  Possibly the strongest 8-man team I've ever been on was 7 defenders and 1 controller back in issue 9.  IOs barely existed, set bonuses did not.  That team capped virtually (or pushed the value so high it scarcely mattered) every value you could care about.  Recovery yes, Regen yes, to hit yes, defense yes, resistances yes, damage yes,  etc., etc..

[PyroNugget]

this is just overwhelmingly BAD information!

 

nearly every single set bonus( barring the +2-4% direst dmg increases) are DEFENSIVE BASED

 

let me say that again for the OP--99% of every SINGLE SET BONUS are DEFENSIVE(general term) BASED!!

 

wish you could get to the 45% DEFENSE soft cap, better start slotting set bonus IN YOUR ATTACKS!

 

want your smash/lethal RESISTS at 90%?...  set bonuses in your attacks can get you there.

 

ACROSS the board, you have hole, fill it with set bonuses, EVERY SINGLE SET IN THE GAME--ffs i need bigger caps so he can read.

 

oh and as a by product of actually making your tank better, you also have +ACC,DMG,RECH and END REDUC!

 

just shamefully bad information,this is the COH equivalent of telling people to drink bleach for whiter teeth( DO NOT DO THIS!)

[Ashford]

1 hour ago, PyroNugget said:

this is just overwhelmingly BAD information!

 

nearly every single set bonus( barring the +2-4% direst dmg increases) are DEFENSIVE BASED

 

let me say that again for the OP--99% of every SINGLE SET BONUS are DEFENSIVE(general term) BASED!!

 

wish you could get to the 45% DEFENSE soft cap, better start slotting set bonus IN YOUR ATTACKS!

 

want your smash/lethal RESISTS at 90%?...  set bonuses in your attacks can get you there.

 

ACROSS the board, you have hole, fill it with set bonuses, EVERY SINGLE SET IN THE GAME--ffs i need bigger caps so he can read.

 

oh and as a by product of actually making your tank better, you also have +ACC,DMG,RECH and END REDUC!

 

just shamefully bad information,this is the COH equivalent of telling people to drink bleach for whiter teeth( DO NOT DO THIS!)

 

Ya he clearly hasn't been up to date on what the current balance is for Tankers. 4 years ago, maybe this guy would have had a point as Tanker damage was that abysmal to the point that at the very least, it would be helpful for a tanker to keep aggro as quite frankly they can be very hard to kill.

 

Now, no, Tankers very much outperform brutes in the AoE department and can do enough damage that the only reason a Tanker would actually need a taunt at all is if the Tanker rolled a more single target AT like Energy Melee. Even then, if a tanker can clear as fast as they pull it's not like anyone is going to care, not to mention Tanker can also just be played as a DPS as again, they do pretty nice damage now.