Would you rather have your character be effective or feel effective?

[DougGraves]

My favorite AT is controllers.  I now love arsenal and mind control.  And FF and Thermal.  Keep in mind I stop my characters at level 21, so these comments only apply to low levels.

 

Arsenal has great AoE controls.  But you fire those off and then don't do a lot.

 

Mind control has good single target controls but not very good aoe controls.

 

I find that I prefer mind control for being active and feeling like I am doing something rather than just placing an aoe control field with arsenla.

 

Likewise FF has great protections with 3 powers.  Thermal uses 4 powers (2 shields, 2 heals) to be about as effective.  But healing with thermal feels like I am doing something.  Whereas putting on the FF's doesn't feel effective.

 

So I could play arsenal/FF and have great aoe control and support but not be very active with powers and not feel powerful - or use mind/thermal and be a lot more active but probably a lot less effective overall.

 

Do you tend to favor active powers that make you feel like you are doing something or powers that you know are more effective even if you can't see it or feel it?

[Oubliette_Red]

For me, it depends on the character. Some, I've looked up and used build guides for while other's I just play as is, especially if the recommended build guides takes away or removes abilities that I regularly use with said character and it's really an integrated part of their personality.

 

An example is Illusion, I've seen builds that leave out Flash when it's a go-to on a couple of my characters for reasons.

 

I play quite a few support class characters, some provide support through debuffs and buffs like Poison and Kinetics and if I can debuff an enemy through the floor but not doing any real damage, leaving all the grunt work to my teammates, I still like I'm being effective.

 

[Snakebit]

I love elec/shield scrapping. The impact of the set is tremendous even though it's actually very lackluster in sustained ST fights.  I use the telenukes with spring attack -recharge and crosspunch -recharge so I can drop them about every 16-17 seconds. It's terrible against AV's and EBs, but at least it's fun to watch. And squashing entire spawns is just always worth it. 

I liked stone/ice tanking back in the day for the same reason. Incredible at making everything gather around and flop, but it takes minutes to clear a spawn. Feelz over reelz.  

 

Also, storm/storm blasting on a corruptor. That is seriously fun even though it trades burst damage for sustained dot. I love that combo though. It's hard not to feel powerful when you pin a whole spawn into a corner and just melt it. 

Edited April 29 by Snakebit

[Herotu]

Quote

Would you rather have your character be effective or feel effective?

I think the question is wrong.

 

IMHO,  Controllers are boring but OPAF. You're trading "interesting" for "powerful".

[Worm_Kalpa]

3 hours ago, DougGraves said:

Do you tend to favor active powers that make you feel like you are doing something or powers that you know are more effective even if you can't see it or feel it?

I bolded the part that makes this a more interesting question to me than the thread title.  I'm assuming that 'favors active powers' means that you can be effective or ineffective.  But those powers aren't always 'optimal' and there might be a group of less active powers that are more effective and closer to optimal.

 

Anyways, I prefer having active powers even if there are more effective but less active choices, as long as I'm above some 'good enough' threshold.  I have a dual blades/ninjitsu stalker that I find a lot of fun to play because of the building assassin's focus in combat, the combo system, and ninjitsu's utility powers.  It's an active combination of powersets that is still fun to play even though it deals one of the most resisted damage types in the game and waiting for the click mez power to activate might mean losing a combo. 

 

I also have a storm/storm corruptor that's a lot of fun against large mobs for the the exact reasons that @Snakebit mentioned.  It's a great feeling seeing scourge kick in with AoE DoTs.

 

Finally, I've recently been playing an ice/ice blaster that is very active and (I think) is very effective compared to most other powersets.  The character deals cold damage (one of the least resisted damage types), has two ST holds, two location AoE DoTs, a knockdown patch, and all of these slow your targets.  And I'm always clicking away to get the next power lined up.  Slows feel like I'm being effective because you can actually see the debuff take effect in how slow the enemies are in getting within melee range or out of the damage patch.

[Crysis]

Storm/Storm Corruptors look amazing.  Too bad the team is already three spawns ahead of me by the time I get the maelstrom finally going!  Only toon less effective is a Petless MM.

[biostem]

4 hours ago, DougGraves said:

Do you tend to favor active powers that make you feel like you are doing something or powers that you know are more effective even if you can't see it or feel it?

There are definitely powers that don't feel like they're doing anything, since they don't provide immediate feedback like a heal or damaging power does.  This comes up a lot whenever we get folks asking for damage dealt or other such leaderboards for various in-game events.  What these discussions tend to ignore is how, for instance, any extra damage that gets dealt due to you applying a damage resistance debuff, or how a player is able to keep fighting because they've been granted various buffs, is ignored in such instances.  What I think players need to focus on is determining what aspect(s) of the game they find most enjoyable, then build a character that caters to said play style.  Me, personally - I like "no nonsense powers", which do what they say on the tin, as effectively as possible.  Sure, some flash and pizzazz is nice, but after however many hours you'll be playing that character, does the wow factor fade?

[Techwright]

5 hours ago, DougGraves said:

Do you tend to favor active powers that make you feel like you are doing something or powers that you know are more effective even if you can't see it or feel it?

 

Effective.  My sole goal is to put that sucker down, preferably hard and fast.  I don't care whether that means ZOT! with a bolt of lightning or hitting him with a whiffle ball bat as hard and fast as I can.  Down and staying down is effective.  Yeeting him into the air 4 times is colorful, but if he still gets up with 1 health point left and fires more shots, I'm not really as effective as I feel. 

 

EDIT:  There is one moment when feeling takes over:  when the guy come behind me, seemingly from nowhere, and kidney-shots me.  For those, I feel a good sandpapering of the concrete walls with their skin for a bit will really make me feel good.  Then I'll get all "effective" on him.

 

 

Edited April 30 by Techwright

[Clave Dark 5]

Feel over Be.

 

I can't play Kins, for example (I've tried), they're too boring: I strike a pose, there's a glow, and... some numbers behind the curtain change.  Those are very helpful numbers, but it doesn't feel like I've done anything.  I've been bored with Illusion as well until I rolled a Dom with it; now at least I have some solid attacks to go with that. 

 

But give me a toon with Propel or X-Ray Eyes and I will six-slot that shit up because it feels so cool.

[Snarky]

6 hours ago, Herotu said:

I think the question is wrong.

 

IMHO,  Controllers are boring but OPAF. You're trading "interesting" for "powerful".

This really gets “to it”

 

last year I leveled a LOT of toons to low 40s-50.  
 

My standard was 4DFBs, then all the TF/SF/Trials in order (ranked by last level of the content). This included a dark dark and ice ice controller. These things were able to make any team safe and control the battle like the top banana at the circus.  But, … never “felt” powerful.  On fast teams they were useless. (But so are my Brutes/Blasters unless i am also racing to objectives.)   But Controllers just hang with the team, sadly usually the less effective members, because that is where the most controlling is done.  
 

Rarely do i agree with the Archetype write ups.  But the Controller one is pretty spot on

[NotsoevilDM]

If I am soloing I prefer a toon that will clear enemies fast. I also like button mashing attack powers, so will focus on my scrappers, brutes and blasters. 

 

For toons that feel less effective in play, like my defenders, controllers and even tankers, I tend to switch to these when teaming up. That way I know I am being effective in locking down enemies and helping keep my team-mates alive, even if not doing a lot of DPS or even needing to button mash. 

[Neiska]

I like characters that can solo and that "flow well". My favorite ATs are Tankers and Crabbers. I just started a new Crabber from level one, but I am leveling almost entirely through Ouros missions. Just hit level 25 last night. It's been fun, even if I had to use every p2w power available to me. But the higher I am getting the better it's getting.

[Xiaoki]

I can feel this way on my Mercs/Time MM.

 

I know I'm being very effective but it doesn't always seem like it.

[Marshal_General]

The problem with just feeling effective is that sooner or later something will drive home the fact that no, you are not.

[KC4800]

The thing about Arsenal Control, is if you only play it to lvl 21, you never get to experience the power that is Tri-Cannon. It's perma PA as soon as you take it.

 

[Troo]

Feel, and that is very subjective. For some that is being effective. For others this is survivability while for others it might be control.

 

I am happy taking on a handful of targets with a primarily single target specialist; stunning some, and placating others while dealing with a hard target. I can be the hot knife through butter one target at a time and be pleased,

I am happy using fear and slow together, while again working through a group solo or with a team.

 

The whole AoE without consequences steamrolling of huge mobs while racing to acquire the best loot gets repetitive and boring. Your mileage may vary.

[tidge]

15 hours ago, DougGraves said:

Do you tend to favor active powers that make you feel like you are doing something or powers that you know are more effective even if you can't see it or feel it?

 

I oscillate between:

1. Building characters that are effective, but not in an obvious way
2. Building characters that have defects (that may or may not be obvious) but lean into fun, demonstrative powers

The first is when I'm making sure the character has high survival skills first, and then concentrates on its "AT thing". These tend to be the sorts of characters that can be solo on a TF with little to no problem.

 

The second is when I go hard-concept, sacrificing the sorts of things that I think of as "collective wisdom". For example, not taking the Fighting pool for Tough/Weave even though it offers some obvious survival benefits. Sometimes these characters end up almost as able to survive crazy situations by leaning into the crazy concept.

 

I enjoy the second more, but these can be sometimes frustrating. One example comes to mind: I have a Defender who is designed to be a force-multiplier. It can survive a +4x8 onslaught solo... but it has to be quick, and a second simultaneous onslaught is not something it can stand toe-to-toe with. It may look glorious while this is happening, but that character performs much better with an ally close by doing their thing. I honestly don't know if teammates for that character realize what the debuffs and buffs are doing!

 

 

[Clave Dark 5]

2 hours ago, Marshal_General said:

The problem with just feeling effective is that sooner or later something will drive home the fact that no, you are not.

Feeling fun though is worth it, always.  I don't start questioning my life choices when I get defeated or anything ha ha, I don't have to be able to do everything.

[cranebump]

As in real life, I would like my characters to feel they're being effective (even when they're totally not). 

 

Some level of delusion is just a necessity.:-)

[DougGraves]

2 hours ago, KC4800 said:

The thing about Arsenal Control, is if you only play it to lvl 21, you never get to experience the power that is Tri-Cannon. It's perma PA as soon as you take it.

 

And that's why I don't play above level 21.  The game is so easy after that I don't find it fun.  

[Duckbutler]

I don't think I could separate "feel" and "be" effective because I measure that by watching how quickly the team is progressing through missions and clearing spawns as well as how stable everyone's health is. If I am buffing defense via force field and nobody is taking damage then mission accomplished! Unless it's a team full of tankers who are probably already defense capped, I will take credit for keeping everyone alive.

 

Assuming the real question is whether people prefer an active vs passive playstyle, I will also not tolerate sitting around idly. If there is a button I could be hitting that could be doing something more, however small, I will probably hit it. My masterminds go ahead and take a single target attack and the AoE in their primary. My force fielder takes the single target knockback for the res debuff. Brawl doesn't get removed from my hot bar on melee until I have enough attacks to make a full, gapless attack chain without Temp powers. Things like that.

[Duckbutler]

8 hours ago, Clave Dark 5 said:

Feel over Be.

 

I can't play Kins, for example (I've tried), they're too boring: I strike a pose, there's a glow, and... some numbers behind the curtain change.  Those are very helpful numbers, but it doesn't feel like I've done anything.  I've been bored with Illusion as well until I rolled a Dom with it; now at least I have some solid attacks to go with that. 

 

But give me a toon with Propel or X-Ray Eyes and I will six-slot that shit up because it feels so cool.

 

Monitoring damage boost helps, as well as playing it on a corruptor where you get greater participation in the damage boost when it's time to hit things. Watching the damage boost and seeing how often you can cap it is just a fun little minigame. Sorta on topic for this thread, I also found that relying on Transference to help with endurance management seems great in theory but in practice it's a two second cast and that's a long cast time to fix something and that should be mostly automatic.

[UltraAlt]

18 hours ago, DougGraves said:

Do you tend to favor active powers that make you feel like you are doing something or powers that you know are more effective even if you can't see it or feel it?

 

Regardless of archetype or power set, I try to watch what my teammates are doing and then use my powers in a way to augment what they are doing and/or to help the survivability of the team. My goal isn't maximizing damage output or trying to show how bad-ass my character is.

 

I don't know how to set the options to feel my powers in-game nor the hardware to translate feeling too me. I don't have rumble features on my Logitech game controller.

 

The times that I can't see my powers is when I have the VFX turned off as much as possible because of too much power VFX spam or overly bright powers/costumes on player characters (seriously, picking all white costuming and power VFX is like poking your teammates in the eye with a stick - you aren't being a good teammate if you do it).

 

In the end, I tend to "favor active powers" that fit my character conception of the character. Then, based on that, I figure out the tactics that work best when using those powers.

 

[srmalloy]

14 hours ago, Crysis said:

Only toon less effective is a Petless MM.

Or look at all the powers that become ineffective in a fast-moving team with a /Traps controller. "Yeah, I've put down the Trip Mines, the acid mortar, and the Poison Gas Trap."  "Well, we're three spawns down the map, so..."

[Bionic_Flea]

I want to feel effective AND be effective.  But there are certainly sets, or set combos more appropriately, that are set and forget and you feel like you aren't doing anything.

 

For example, Bots/FF is pretty effective as long as you aren't at +4.  But it's boring, summon, buff, take a nap.  But Bots/Traps or Bots/Electric are just as effective but a lot more active.

 

I've recently leveled an Elec/Elec defender and that is approaching too busy.  Fun, but I have to pay attention.