There's Farming and Farming.

[Wavicle]

I have absolutely no issues with people running fire farms.

But this:

"Doing a Free Fire farm(all i ask is any orange/purple Recipes) Last spot"

is ridiculous.

I guess it's not against any rules but it's stupid.

DON'T FALL FOR THIS CRAP PEOPLE! YOU DON'T NEED TO DO THIS!

[DZKFire]

To be fair, it is easy to dupe people like these.

 

A lot of orange recipe drops sell badly now and how can someone tell if you got a purple recipe ? I PL'ed my Arachnos Soldier straight to 50 because I didn't want the crabpack on a Huntsman, and both my farmer and main account got 0 purples.

 

[ivanhedgehog]

1 hour ago, Wavicle said:

I have absolutely no issues with people running fire farms.

But this:

"Doing a Free Fire farm(all i ask is any orange/purple Recipes) Last spot"

is ridiculous.

I guess it's not against any rules but it's stupid.

DON'T FALL FOR THIS CRAP PEOPLE! YOU DON'T NEED TO DO THIS!

Thats when you advertise a free fire farm and say you dont expect anything..it will drive them crazy

 

[Greycat]

If someone's assuming you're going to get one sitting on their farm, they'll be disappointed. *shrug*

 

People can ask whatever they want. Doesn't mean people have to honor it. Or even join those farms. At least it's not the old "Farm available, 1m (or 2m or 10m) inf to join!" I have to imagine those were some pretty lonely farms....

[Black Zot]

49 minutes ago, Greycat said:

If someone's assuming you're going to get one sitting on their farm, they'll be disappointed. *shrug*

 

People can ask whatever they want. Doesn't mean people have to honor it. Or even join those farms. At least it's not the old "Farm available, 1m (or 2m or 10m) inf to join!" I have to imagine those were some pretty lonely farms....

 

Now I wanna level up my rad/fire brute so I can advertise a farm with an admission fee of 1 inf.  Just to be goofy.

[Myrmidon]

For a second there, I read orange or purple inspirations.

Edited January 20, 2021 by Myrmidon

[ivanhedgehog]

2 hours ago, Black Zot said:

 

Now I wanna level up my rad/fire brute so I can advertise a farm with an admission fee of 1 inf.  Just to be goofy.

Thumbs up from me!!! Its not like ive seen any purples in a long time.

[Rishidian]

I wonder if I could get away with requiring 1M inf for providing the opportunity to Street Sweep Council and 5th Column in Independence Port...

[SwitchFade]

Hmm.

 

Pie>cake.

[Scofflaw]

Unleash the Piecaken!

[ivanhedgehog]

6 hours ago, SwitchFade said:

Hmm.

 

Pie>cake.

not all cake is meant to be eaten.

[AureumError]

On 1/20/2021 at 3:21 AM, Greycat said:

People can ask whatever they want. Doesn't mean people have to honor it. Or even join those farms. At least it's not the old "Farm available, 1m (or 2m or 10m) inf to join!" I have to imagine those were some pretty lonely farms....

Not entirely certain which Servers people were playing on back on live, but paying for farm runs was the status quo for a very long time on Freedom, and they were fairly full.
Having a secondary account with a farmer on it wasn't the norm on live, some people had one but many didn't want to pay two subscriptions each month.
It changed a little bit when the game went F2P, but not as drastically.

Add the free accounts to the vastly different game climate HC has in general and you have a lot more people offering farms for nothing in return than you used to.
As a basic concept though there is nothing wrong with offering a farm slot in exchange for influence (or recipes as it were in this case), as long as both parties are in agreement.
It's the definition of a free market, you don't have to pay anyone for something you don't want, and are welcome to look for someone who will do it cheaper or for free if you do want it.

My only real point of contention though has been the fact that people are ready condemn farmers for asking for any kind of remuneration, yet seeing the point be made that the farmer wouldn't know whether or not you had received a purple, so you wouldn't need to honor it.
Seems to me that advocating for dishonesty seems like more of a problem than asking for a recipe in return for services rendered in the off chance one should drop.

[Guardia]

8 hours ago, ivanhedgehog said:

not all cake is meant to be eaten.

Well, there's Uranium Yellowcake.

 

You might get superpowers if you eat it. 

 

Or die.

 

One or the other.

 

(Plz don't eat it)

 

-g

[tidge]

I have never joined an AE farm to get XP, but here are my thoughts:

• Lvl 50 Orange (rare) recipes have relatively little value compared to Common recipes. There are very few Rare recipes that are worth crafting, as opposed to crafting Uncommon recipes and converting. Presumably the request is being made about PVP recipes, see next bullet.
• The request for PVP/Purple recipe drops I could almost understand, but I don't have much sympathy.

My observed odds of these pieces dropping (for lvl 50+ characters) are approximately 1 per hour (either PVP or Purple) of near-constant x8 content. It feels like PVP recipe drops are slightly more frequent than Purple recipe drops, but that could just be personal observation bias. Increasing the level of enemy mobs above 50 does not increase the chance of drops.

 

I have gotten Purple drops on characters below level 50, but this has only happened on characters where I could turn up the number of enemies prior to level 50 and I was running (solo) a lot of arc missions relatively close to each other (basically, Portal Corp missions from Unai Kemen or Maria Jenkins)... and running such content usually ends up with a level 50 character PDQ, so there aren't many hours of this activity below level 50.

 

So.... since AE missions aren't going to get more spawns, I can sort of understand why a farmer would "beg" for any PVP or Purple drops, because the "one lucky drop" might go to a different player. The reasons that I'm not so sympathetic are:

• "Purple drops are not guaranteed"
• Any level 50 player can run non-AE content for merits and/or a (better personal) chance a "lucky" drop
• I expect that typical AFK farmer builds are unlikely to be doing that much in an AE farm mission anyway, so just how much reward is expected for so little effort?

If the farm build is fully kitted with enhancements, why even ask for a PVP/Purple recipe drop as payment? It's not as if there is supposed to be an arbitrary limit on the amount of "paying it forward" there is by letting people door-sit for XP and/or Influence. If a newly leveling toon gets a good drop, let 'em keep it.

[Coyotedancer]

It wasn't just a Freedom-specific practice. I remember seeing broadcasts for that kind of thing back on Liberty, too, in the Live days...

 

It's always seemed silly to me to ask for any kind of payment from tag-alongs, though. As a strictly "active only" farmer (I don't AFK, solo or teamed-), when I invite other people along on my runs, it's just done as a favor.  Sure, I take an INF hit when bringing in other people. And yes, I might not be the one who happens to get any interesting recipe drops.... But if those things were really a big concern, I'd just run solo. 

 

Getting a little less of a return in exchange for having someone to chat with while I'm burning down all the goons? It's a fair trade... And not to put too fine a point on it, I already have more purples and PvPs in storage than I'll reasonably ever need. I'm a *farmer*. Eventually that just comes along with the territory. So, why not "share the  wealth" so to speak. My tag-alongs usually don't have farm characters of their own or the kind of resources that come with that, and so those potential Shiny Recipe Drops typically mean a lot more to them than they would to me.  

 

 

 

Edited January 21, 2021 by Coyotedancer

[ivanhedgehog]

4 hours ago, AureumError said:

Not entirely certain which Servers people were playing on back on live, but paying for farm runs was the status quo for a very long time on Freedom, and they were fairly full.
Having a secondary account with a farmer on it wasn't the norm on live, some people had one but many didn't want to pay two subscriptions each month.
It changed a little bit when the game went F2P, but not as drastically.

Add the free accounts to the vastly different game climate HC has in general and you have a lot more people offering farms for nothing in return than you used to.
As a basic concept though there is nothing wrong with offering a farm slot in exchange for influence (or recipes as it were in this case), as long as both parties are in agreement.
It's the definition of a free market, you don't have to pay anyone for something you don't want, and are welcome to look for someone who will do it cheaper or for free if you do want it.

My only real point of contention though has been the fact that people are ready condemn farmers for asking for any kind of remuneration, yet seeing the point be made that the farmer wouldn't know whether or not you had received a purple, so you wouldn't need to honor it.
Seems to me that advocating for dishonesty seems like more of a problem than asking for a recipe in return for services rendered in the off chance one should drop.

I made a point of offering a free farm last night, I helped a dom get a few levels

And I like discussing builds with people while mowing things down. you can meet some nice people doing that.

Edited January 21, 2021 by ivanhedgehog
reasons

[Wavicle]

If you’re running a farm you have absolutely no justification for asking for any sort of compensation whatsoever.

 

Everyone else there is also playing the game. If most of them are door sitters and not helping you, that’s your fault!

[Shred Monkey]

To be honest, to my mind, charging someone to door sit makes exactly as much sense as door sitting does.

[Ironblade]

34 minutes ago, Wavicle said:

If you’re running a farm you have absolutely no justification for asking for any sort of compensation whatsoever.

On the other hand, no justification is NEEDED.  They can do whatever they want as long as they're not breaking any rules.

[TheZag]

This is a six of one,  half dozen of the other kind of thing.  In the end, play how u want, just dont break the rules.

[Ukase]

5 hours ago, tidge said:

I have never joined an AE farm to get XP, but here are my thoughts:

• Lvl 50 Orange (rare) recipes have relatively little value compared to Common recipes. There are very few Rare recipes that are worth crafting, as opposed to crafting Uncommon recipes and converting. Presumably the request is being made about PVP recipes, see next bullet.
• The request for PVP/Purple recipe drops I could almost understand, but I don't have much sympathy.

My observed odds of these pieces dropping (for lvl 50+ characters) are approximately 1 per hour (either PVP or Purple) of near-constant x8 content. It feels like PVP recipe drops are slightly more frequent than Purple recipe drops, but that could just be personal observation bias. Increasing the level of enemy mobs above 50 does not increase the chance of drops.

 

I have gotten Purple drops on characters below level 50, but this has only happened on characters where I could turn up the number of enemies prior to level 50 and I was running (solo) a lot of arc missions relatively close to each other (basically, Portal Corp missions from Unai Kemen or Maria Jenkins)... and running such content usually ends up with a level 50 character PDQ, so there aren't many hours of this activity below level 50.

 

So.... since AE missions aren't going to get more spawns, I can sort of understand why a farmer would "beg" for any PVP or Purple drops, because the "one lucky drop" might go to a different player. The reasons that I'm not so sympathetic are:

• "Purple drops are not guaranteed"
• Any level 50 player can run non-AE content for merits and/or a (better personal) chance a "lucky" drop
• I expect that typical AFK farmer builds are unlikely to be doing that much in an AE farm mission anyway, so just how much reward is expected for so little effort?

If the farm build is fully kitted with enhancements, why even ask for a PVP/Purple recipe drop as payment? It's not as if there is supposed to be an arbitrary limit on the amount of "paying it forward" there is by letting people door-sit for XP and/or Influence. If a newly leveling toon gets a good drop, let 'em keep it.

I think you are underestimating the value of a rare (orange) recipe. 
Sure, they vend/sell for only 10k at level 50, and they cost 490,400k to craft. But they are worth far more than the piddly 100k you get for a common. They are worth essentially as much as someone is willing to pay for them. 
In my experience, once I convert them from uncommon to rare, then to a better selling one. 
(Thunderstrike: Accuracy/Damage/Recharge successfully converted to Devastation: Damage/Recharge) and then from
 Devastation: Damage/Recharge successfully converted to Performance Shifter: Endurance Modification
Performance Shifter: Endurance Modification successfully converted to Performance Shifter: Chance for +Endurance. (sells for about 3m)

My farmer does this for every uncommon drop. And for every rare drop that doesn't sell well. Yes, it "costs" me converters, but converters are free for any farmer, as emp merits drop freely. When you hit a vet level where they don't drop in high enough numbers to keep up, you re-roll a farmer. Very simple. (1 emp merit = 30 converters - can get 400 emp merits from vet level 3 to 99 = 12k converters) 

That said, it sure isn't for everyone. It's not even for most farmers. Most just vendor/sell that stuff, and go on the next map. To each their own. 
When I do "recycle" a farmer, they all get a couple of purples in their run to level 50. I can just about guarantee it. 

So to me - it's why I don't share a farm. But if I were, I think handing over the good drops is a fair deal, even though I would never charge it, as there'd be no way to definitively know if they got anything. And it is kind of a cheesy thing to do. Certainly doesn't seem heroic. But, it's not like I'm under the delusion that my thoughts are typical. 

 

 

[Hedgefund]

Let me use this as a farmer AMA opportunity...

 

Why would a farmer restrict who sits based on level?  I've seen people look for sitters less than level 20, for example.  If you're one of these farmers, I ask of you why do you care about their level?

[SwitchFade]

Hmm. Does it strike anyone as ironic that the debate bout this is just about as silly as the practice itself?

 

Being actually offended or defending it is like yelling at the rain for falling on your newly cleaned car.

 

I mean really, this is where memes come from.

[tidge]

40 minutes ago, Ukase said:

I think you are underestimating the value of a rare (orange) recipe. 
Sure, they vend/sell for only 10k at level 50, and they cost 490,400k to craft. But they are worth far more than the piddly 100k you get for a common. They are worth essentially as much as someone is willing to pay for them. 
In my experience, once I convert them from uncommon to rare, then to a better selling one. 
(Thunderstrike: Accuracy/Damage/Recharge successfully converted to Devastation: Damage/Recharge) and then from
 Devastation: Damage/Recharge successfully converted to Performance Shifter: Endurance Modification
Performance Shifter: Endurance Modification successfully converted to Performance Shifter: Chance for +Endurance. (sells for about 3m)

Thunderstrike is an Uncommon recipe, so I don't think your example is proving that it was worth consuming Rare Salvage to craft Rare recipes.

[DoctorDitko]

"Will pay 1 million inf for you to entertain me while I farm. PST!"