Blaster Knockback powers

[Solarverse]

6 minutes ago, Erratic1 said:

 

Repulsing Torrent in Kinetic Melee wonders how how it does not qualify.

 

You clearly misunderstood my meaning. Repulsing Torrent has Knock Back. Now name a different secondary affect from a power other than Knock Back that people hate with a passion. However, I edited that post for clarity to prevent further confusion.

 

 

Edited December 15, 2021 by Solarverse

[A Cat]

9 minutes ago, Solarverse said:

Also, that meteor didn't come from space at thousands of miles per hour, they are created out of thin air about 100 feet or so above your targeted location. So I am not buying, "But meh meteor comes from Mars!" explanation, lol. (Sorry, Luminara, but I had to, hehe)

It's brought over by a stork when a mommy and a daddy love each other very much. 

[Yellowjacket]

3 hours ago, 0th Power said:

I'm just ticked the name of the T9 power is scientifically inaccurate...

MISSED Gravedigger brawler!! Your Meteor power had a 0.00% chance to hit, you rolled a 0.01

[Aurora_Girl]

QUIT BULLYING ENERGY BLASTERS Y'ALL

[Erratic1]

25 minutes ago, Solarverse said:

Also, that meteor didn't come from space at thousands of miles per hour, they are created out of thin air about 100 feet or so above your targeted location. So I am not buying, "But muh meteor comes from Mars!" explanation, lol. (Sorry, Luminara, but I had to, hehe)

 

So you buy that our characters can teleport groups of people to them but the teleporting a speeding chunk of rock from space 100 feet above a target is a bridge too far?

 

And my character with Meteor is a magician. Anything goes when magic is involved.

[UltraAlt]

We can all play this game the way we want.

It's good to be responsible and try to work with other players.

Often times other players don't worry about coordinating and just do their own thing.

If there are times that you just want to knock people all over the place, go for it as long as you aren't wiping the hole team or the player with the star complains.

 

[Albion]

Congrats on the hot topic @Snarky! Diantane has nothing on you! :P

[Cancrusher]

Haven't played the set yet.  You're throwing boulders at people, though.  At least 2 or 3 powers in the set should deliver knockback (from a logic perspective, I mean).  I don't think it would feel right if they didn't.

[Spaghetti Betty]

If you hate knockback so much, just play a controller. And use your aoe root as an opener so there's no chance anything will get knocked back. This will surely be regarded as a good move and you'll be thanked by your team.

[roleki]

3 hours ago, Snarky said:

It's the nuke.....  You get a choice of a nuke you can only 5 slot so you can throw a nerf proc in it (reports are that does not work perfectly) or you get a nuke Energy Blasters (long shunned by fast teams) would be jealous of the knockback on....

 

I gotta tell you, as an En/En blaster from Day One, Meteor feels like a half-brother I didn't know about.

[Snarky]

8 minutes ago, Cancrusher said:

Haven't played the set yet.  You're throwing boulders at people, though.  At least 2 or 3 powers in the set should deliver knockback (from a logic perspective, I mean).  I don't think it would feel right if they didn't.

Will not play the set.  It is 1) ugly.  2) not efficient.  3). I have no earth power stories to tell.  This set does not inspire me to look for any either

 

take an ice/cold Corruptor.  Not my favorite type of nuke.  Not a concept (ice) i have a lot of ideas for.  But so danged efficient I worked to create one.  
 

give me an ugly set with a tier 9 that launches mobs in all directions and can barely be tamed by sacrificing a enhancer slot…..hard pass

[Peacemoon]

35 minutes ago, Albion said:

Congrats on the hot topic @Snarky! Diantane has nothing on you! 😛

Knock back is always a topic that will forever cause disagreement. Some people hate it, others love it. 

Personally I think the compromise is AoE powers should always knockdown in groups. Single target knockback is rarely a problem, and when solo can be very beneficial over knockdown defensively.

[Albion]

7 minutes ago, Peacemoon said:

Knock back is always a topic that will forever cause disagreement. Some people hate it, others love it. 

Personally I think the compromise is AoE powers should always knockdown in groups. Single target knockback is rarely a problem, and when solo can be very beneficial over knockdown defensively.

Indeed, and by now, even if in group, even if not turned to KD, it can be done strategically and bring good advantages to everyone. Can also be used to mess around, but the same can be said of almost every power that affects mobs, don't get me started on phasing...

Edited December 15, 2021 by Albion

[ArchVileTerror]

Quick question to @Snarky and @Solarverse (and everyone else in the shared camp of "what's with the Devs' hard-on for Knockback?):

If the Homecoming Team had also added another set without any Knockback, fixed the issue with Knockdown converting to Knockback on lower-level targets, and/or provided more available options to gather up scattered targets (like Fold Space) ... would any of that been sufficient mitigation to the problem in your views?

 

I solidly support any and all of those, but mostly the middle one.  Longest-standing pain in the ass related to Knock, as far as I'm personally concerned.

 

Edited December 15, 2021 by ArchVileTerror
Missed a critical "out" which totally changed the context of a sentence.

[Solarverse]

4 minutes ago, ArchVileTerror said:

Quick question to @Snarky and @Solarverse (and everyone else in the shared camp of "what's with the Devs' hard-on for Knockback?):

If the Homecoming Team had also added another set without any Knockback, fixed the issue with Knockdown converting to Knockback on lower-level targets, and/or provided more available options to gather up scattered targets (like Fold Space) ... would any of that been sufficient mitigation to the problem in your views?

 

I solidly support any and all of those, but mostly the middle one.  Longest-standing pain in the ass related to Knock, as far as I'm personally concerned.

 

 

In the very beginning when it was announced that they were adding KB to KD IOs, I specifically requested that they give us a way to do so without wasting a slot for it. I showed that no other secondary affect from any other powerset requires you to sacrifice a slot for an IO that negates its secondary affect. So until we get either a 7th slot that will ONLY take a KB to KD IO or a toggle that switches back and forth from KB to KD, I'm always going to throw shade on it. Keep in mind, my main is a EN/EM Blaster, so for me, it's personal, haha.

[Luminara]

22 minutes ago, Solarverse said:

My point is, no other secondary affect in game is hated like sets with KB. No other secondary affect has people buying IO's that cost upwards of 2 mill influence and wasting a slot just for that very reason. On my EN/EM Blaster, I have to literally waste 3 slots (4 if I took Power Push) in order to slot a KB to KD in all three powers. No other secondary affect is so unwanted that players will literally sacrifice a single slot to negate it, much less three.

 

Do you know what else no other secondary effect has?  The choice to do everything you just stated.  I can't slot an enhancement which makes the +Acc in my Archery powers do something different, I'm just stuck with a shitty secondary effect.  I can't make the -Recharge in my Ice attacks change in any way, I'm stuck with a fixed amount of -Recharge.

 

No-one puts a gun to anyone's head and orders them to create characters who use KB powers.  There's no coercion or deception being perpetuated, no information being deliberately obscured.  Attacks which deal KB state that they deal KB, and just looking at the power information at character creation or in the game proper tells players exactly how high the KB magnitude is and whether it's guaranteed or % chance.  People choose to take those attacks and use them, and if they want to, they have the additional option of converting that KB to KD.

 

Yeah, we get it, you hate KB.  But you chose to make that Energy blaster, you chose to slot those attacks with KB->KD IOs.  You're neither stupid nor ignorant about this game, so you damn well knew what you were doing when you made that character and spent those slots in that way.  You are responsible for your own choices and the consequences thereof.

 

And yes, I do, in fact, understand.  I have three KB->KD IOs on my Grav/TA controller, three more on my Grav/Fire dominator and two on my Bots/TA mastermind.  But I don't feel a need to shout at people on the forums or blow up because I used those slots for those enhancements. I made that choice on each of my characters.  I paid the price to convert KB to KD.  I weighed the pros and cons and made the decision.  And I'm grateful that they're available and happy to exercise the option to use them.  Spending those slots on those IOs allowed me to turn my Grav/TA into a melee-centric character, pulling entire spawns with Wormhole and beating the crap out of them with Sands of Mu, Seismic Smash and Fault while my Singularity keeps them exactly where I want them.  That opened up an entirely different style of play on that character.  That's the kind of change those IOs make.  They're that powerful.  They're that effective.  They're worth the price, in slots and in inf*, ten times over, because they can do that.

 

Lastly, there are a lot of secondary effects, and allowing players with KB powers to slot a single KB->KD IO and reap the benefits while all other secondaries are not given the same opportunity is bullshit, and you should damn well know it.  If we allow you to slot that way, we cannot, in fairness, deny similar opportunities to every other secondary effect in the game, and the reality is, that would just make a nightmarish mess because those opportunities just don't exist for some sets and powers.  The divisiveness created would be horrific.  If your ultimate goal is to turn this community into a slavering mass of hate and fury, that's exactly the right move.  If not, drop it, and either learn to live with using KB->KD IOs in individual powers, or delete your KB heavy characters and move on.

 

1 hour ago, Solarverse said:

Also, that meteor didn't come from space at thousands of miles per hour, they are created out of thin air about 100 feet or so above your targeted location. So I am not buying, "But muh meteor comes from Mars!" explanation, lol. (Sorry, Luminara, but I had to, hehe)

 

And the derelict cars my Grav/* characters send flying toward enemies don't come from between the floors of office maps, nor would it be reasonable to expect there to be a junkyard churning out beaters just for Grav/* characters to wormhole to themselves and fling at foes, or even for that many junked cars to exist in the entirety of Rhode Island.  It's called "suspension of disbelief", but you can go with "I really don't give two shits where it came from" just as easily.  Maybe the Seismic Blast user is opening a magical portal.  Or a technological portal.  Or fiddling with gravity to create a mass and move it with extreme velocity.  Or a space rock junkyard.  There are guaranteed to be as many explanations for how Meteor's projectile appears are there are players.  It doesn't have to be a perfect scientific model of an impact event, it merely has to lend a degree of verisimilitude, and it does.  Don't obsess over it.

[Yomo Kimyata]

5 hours ago, 0th Power said:

I'm just ticked the name of the T9 power is scientifically inaccurate...

 

It's only a meteor until it lands.  Then it's a meteorite.

[Aurora_Girl]

2 hours ago, Albion said:

Congrats on the hot topic @Snarky! Diantane has nothing on you! 😛

 

QUIT BULLYING RIGHT NOW

[Aurora_Girl]

1 hour ago, Solarverse said:

 

In the very beginning when it was announced that they were adding KB to KD IOs, I specifically requested that they give us a way to do so without wasting a slot for it. I showed that no other secondary affect from any other powerset requires you to sacrifice a slot for an IO that negates its secondary affect. So until we get either a 7th slot that will ONLY take a KB to KD IO or a toggle that switches back and forth from KB to KD, I'm always going to throw shade on it. Keep in mind, my main is a EN/EM Blaster, so for me, it's personal, haha.

 

My main is an always has been Energy too, so you could do what you did and shun your innate awesomeness with slotting nonsense or do what I did and enjoy the Kabooms. 

 

[Luminara]

7 minutes ago, Aurora_Girl said:

 

My main is an always has been Energy too, so you could do what you did and shun your innate awesomeness with slotting nonsense or do what I did and enjoy the Kabooms. 

 

[Black Zot]

1 hour ago, Spaghetti Betty said:

If you hate knockback so much, just play a controller. And use your aoe root as an opener so there's no chance anything will get knocked back. This will surely be regarded as a good move and you'll be thanked by your team.

 

I'd much rather move 2-3 feet to hit an immob'd target than across the room to chase down the results of some knockback griefer's handiwork.

 

Because ultimately, that's what AoE knockback is - griefing.

[Snarky]

1 hour ago, ArchVileTerror said:

Quick question to @Snarky and @Solarverse (and everyone else in the shared camp of "what's with the Devs' hard-on for Knockback?):

If the Homecoming Team had also added another set without any Knockback, fixed the issue with Knockdown converting to Knockback on lower-level targets, and/or provided more available options to gather up scattered targets (like Fold Space) ... would any of that been sufficient mitigation to the problem in your views?

 

I solidly support any and all of those, but mostly the middle one.  Longest-standing pain in the ass related to Knock, as far as I'm personally concerned.

 

If the Homecoming Team had made the special effect for the tier 9 the effect of Super Strength Knockout Blow applied to each mob hit I would be as amazed by this set as I am by the Dr Aeon Task Force and the detailed intricacy displayed in the crafting and reward structure thereof.  

 

They didn't.  I'm not.

[Albion]

37 minutes ago, Aurora_Girl said:

 

QUIT BULLYING RIGHT NOW

GOT BUSTED!

[0th Power]

1 hour ago, Yomo Kimyata said:

 

It's only a meteor until it lands.  Then it's a meteorite.

Exactly my point!

[Aurora_Girl]

33 minutes ago, Black Zot said:

Because ultimately, that's what AoE knockback is - griefing.

 

...no, no it is not. 

 

Dropping an MDC right next to the tank during a multi-AV fight? *That* is griefing.